russianDude

2.0T for a base model is not a bad idea. Given that RDX produces 272hp, you could get 280+ hp on TLX since it weights less than RDX. For 3.0T, you can get 330-340hp

CollinR4

I don't understand where you are getting 330-340. Do you really think an all-new 3.0T engine is going to be significantly less efficient than the current 2.0T they have been producing for a few years?
272 = 136 hp/liter
340 = 113~ hp/liter

Like I said previously, the 2.0T should be the baseline for how we estimate what the 3.0T is going to produce. It is also much closer to the cars that the TLX is being performance tested against (S4 349/369 and C43 385/384). Again, let's keep in mind that these are still just stated numbers from the Germans and we all know they tend to underrate the output.

Speed_Racer

It's just how Acura does things. They'll take the conservative route usually. Hoping to be proven wrong. I still think it will be around 375hp but won't be surprised if it comes in under 350hp. Still annoyed they couldn't etch out 10 more hp for an even 300 in the current gen TLX.

CollinR4

You're saying you think 375, he's saying 330-340, I'd say those are very different estimates. I think your number is spot on and right in line with what they are testing against. Also, the 290 made sense when in 2015, at the time, the top of the line RLX was only at 310 but is no longer in the picture with the low volume and unknown future of the model.

russianDude

Yes, I think Acura will under tune 3.0T, its typically what acura does. Sadly.

Tony Pac

so true! Just 10 more ponies would have sound so much better. Just to say 300 HP. But of course acura went with 290 smh!

i have a feeling with Type S, Acura will do the same we will see 345 lol!

Jiten Patel

I'm more concerned about the options that come in the trim levels. I know this car is going to great to drive no matter the drive train. However, the features is what I got my eyes on. I don't want them cheaping out on the A-Spec variant. I wanna have a Platinum Elite A-spec. All features with a good look.

Shadow2056

Wouldn't be surprising. I don't know why they couldn't just do the 10hp.

One thing that bothered me about the 2018+ TLX is you can't change the color of the menus. That bothers me. I know its small but to me, I'm not a fan of the blue. I know it'll bother me every time I go to use the touch screen. Need them to change that. IT's something so small but if it's so small, they can fix that. Lol.

fiatlux

Maybe they figured their average TLX buyer would see 300 and think "oh my, that's too much power, I don't need that much power, it's be irresponsible to get it".

dopeboy1

Ruthless!

BGR

Let's say this car has 375hp. What's the price Acura could realistically charge for a Type S compared to an Audi S4, C43 or M340i etc.

Considering you have several other players in this market. The IS, Q50 and C-Class will all be new models for 2021.

Speed_Racer

I'd say $55k at most. And even that's a stretch. Should be closer to $50k. Anything above that is just too close to the other brands where people would justify the smaller gap in pricing and just go to Audi, Mercedes or BMW. S4 starts at $50k, C43 starts at $55k. . .

Speed_Racer

By no means scientific. I just tried to price a C43, S4 and a M340i with similiar features Acura usually is throwing into it's top level trims and even lower trims:

C43: $63,120
S4: $61,295
M340i: $61,145

I didn't check every option, just tried to spec them the same as a comparable TLX and what I think they'll include on the 2021.





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fiatlux

It'd have to be under $50K, because the more powerful (and let's be honest, more luxurious) M340i and C43 both start at $55K. Given what we've seen with the RDX interior, the TLX is not going to be as luxurious or well built as those two German cars.

BGR

I did some research and it seems most of the S4, M340i and C43 are going for $52-55K with discounts. There are a couple deals over $55K, but the main m340i trim is no more than $63/$64K even though the M340i gets up close to $70K.

russianDude

just be happy if you get 330-350HP you get from type S, dont expect Acura to do anything crazy. Acura will not do anything crazy with HP

BGR

I can already tell you the horsepower will not be that low and it's not lower than 350. Not even close.

russianDude

How do you know?

russianDude

BTW, I am Acura fan, not trying to sound negative, just setting realistic expectations from what I've seen from Acura from late 90s and up.

MIKEYDRED

Possible insider, many are reporting the target is close to 400hp. If Infiniti and Lincoln or Volvo with a 4cylc can do it, I see no reason why Acura cant. Why are people assuming that bc it has more HP it needs to be priced high. Type S will be one trim likely and will start around 52 to 55k which will be 7to 10k over the 4cyl top model and thats not bad considering your getting a V6. Also the engine will be shared with the MDX and possible RDX RDX Type S to help with economy of scales. Does anyone think Acura will design a new engine from ground up to get only 50 hp over a 4cyl version that with one reflash they would already be a match HP wise. The V6 turbo will be atleast 380hp with matching torque, my concern is will they be able to beef up the SHAWD system (hopefully rear bias) and the 10 AT to handle the extra power.

fiatlux

I'm not convinced that the MDX will have a turbo V6. All signs point to it using the current 2.0T. If Honda replaced the J35 in both the Accord and RDX with the 2.0T, why should we expect them to do otherwise with the J35 in the MDX?

F23A4

Probably more to do with 300hp being a little too close to the as advertised 310hp offered in the base RLX. Lord knows, the brand can't tolerate another factor which would further hurt RLX sales. (Still unclear as to why the Y4 is rated at +20hp/+5lb-ft over the Y6.)

jjsC5

If all they want is to keep the “average TLX buyer” we are all wasting our time on this thread. This is why I have had zero interest in an Acura car the past few years. I’ve owned four going back to 1990. I’m here based upon the promise of a true sport sedan that competes with the Germans but with Acura quality and value.

jhb31

He doesn't know. It's just a guess since Acura has not put anythig out regarding HP. My guess, like others, is in the 330 to 350 range (enough to make it a very fun and reliable daily driver but not insanely fast). This isn't the first type S Acura has put out and in the past the HP increase was a modest bump. Thinking they are going to add about 100 more HP to the Type S model is wishful thinking and way out of line with what they have done in the past. It's possible but history suggests that's not what Acura does. I think Acura would be fine with enough power to get close a 5 second 0-60 time.

russianDude

Agree, in 2001, TL type S vs regular was 225HP and 260HP. Thats like ~15% bump. Seems logical they will do something similar. It might be under tuned 3.0T engine, which is a good news for all Hondata and Ktune fans.

jhb31

Yes, and the 07/08 Type S was a bump from 258 to 286hp with the motor going from 3.5 to 3.7L. Changes to the throttle mapping, suspension, brakes and steering feel among other stuff also helped to noticably change the driving experience as well as the HP bump so it was faster by a little but there was much more to the Type S than just a bump in HP.

BEAR-AvHistory

Yeah I speced out an M340 to see what a M440 would cost & it was $61,520. Coupe which I don't like the new body & will not get would add $4000 to that. The Germans play both the pricing & horsepower game like the Gods of Marketing to keep you hooked into the brands. As mentioned do not pay any attention to a German horsepower rating, nobody who knows & buys those marks do. I think the German horses they are rating are those bread to seat mounted armored knights or pull Budweiser beer wagons. Do what the performance buyer do & look at the track numbers.

Pricing sort of like do you understand the game. If you are able to take advantage of performance center delivery you can shop any dealer in the country for the best price on a custom ordered car. Already got an offer from the dealer I got the 440 from for $9000 off a 2021 Z4 M40i MSRP of $71,000 which will not even be on sale for order before the end of February. Lots of incentives on top of that like favorable BMWFS rates, MSD to reduce rates, unused miles refunded, free drivers schools etc. Should, in most cases, be able to knock down the MSRP by 13/14% then have the better BMWFS rates applied to the purchase price.

MB. Porsche & AUDI also run similar systems. Porsche is the least buyer friendly.

dmski

Not convinced that the 4 cyl will be going in the new MDX or TLX. I can see the all new 6 cyl detuned with smaller turbos for regular TLX and MDX pushing around 330hp. Type S, close to 400hp or even higher. There's no way in hell that Acura is spending all the R&D money just to drop this all new motor only in Type S, which will only bring a fraction of total sales.

dzionny_dzionassi

Regular TL VS Type-S was 3.2 to 3.5...

jhb31

Ir wouldn't just be for a TLX Type S. Acura will likely have a Type S for all models in the next few years. At least that is what I was told about 1.5 years ago when I was told that the TLX type S likely release date would be Nov 2020 as a 2021 model.

Yeah, my bad. Should have known that since I bought the Type S back in 07.

TVL65

This comment from an interview with Jon Ikeda Acura Vice President and Brand Officer scares me: "We're not just chasing numbers, it's more human centered, it needs to feel right" So in other words expect a lame 330 Hp from Acura.

dzionny_dzionassi

It was great car, I still miss it. If it had SH-awd would kept it much longer...

k_dot

It looks like the new TLX (non-Type S) will have a 4 cyl. just by looking at the leaked image below:



This setup looks quite similar to that of the Accord 1.5/2.0T.

russianDude

they want to get EPA credits for better MPG and will install annoying auto idle stop thingy

TVL65

UNBELIEVABLE now I'm getting disappointed

mojo_79

That’s what ACURA does. They tease you with high-performance sports sedans and release eco-friendly family sedans.

TVL65

I guess I'll keep driving my 07' Type S currently with 168,000 miles and forget it. It all makes sense when you realize how tight lipped Acura has been. No info at all. Nearly all manufacturers would have released numbers by now.

BGR

No one should worry about the TLX from a performance, horsepower or feature content perspective. The only thing that I'm curious about is the price. The car will have an e-turbo and someone confirmed active exhaust to me. A new VTEC system will also be used. This isn't like the previous Type S models with marginally better performance. The reason you don't see a lot of information is because Acura is very secretive with anything just like Honda and a lot of testing is performed in Europe for the Type S model.

As far as design goes, the designers of the concept were told to keep the Type S design as close as possible to the production model. The bumpers on the front won't be as aggressive, the brakes and tires will also be smaller, but it will have brembos. You can see by the mule pics there are 20 inch wheels. It is ashame because Acura put themselves in this position due to how they've watered down the brand. Production on the base engine starts sometime this month with a late spring release so hopefully both models will be at Chicago next month. The base has to be there.

silverTL6

iTrader: (2)

Isn't that why the 4 banger TLX exists? I'd also venture the Aspec V6 sells better than the base V6, which likely means most V6 buyers are "sport-minded" (taking a page from Acura's gag-inducing terminology)

someguy11

Bingo. Never was this more apparent than the 1G TLX. Read the press releases and interviews to see it was touted as the biggest, best, most important launch in Acura history - a performance sedan that would glue you to your seat and deliver thrills beyond belief. The "performance" variant V6 actually released was kind of a dud, if not a complete turd, in its own value performance/luxury sedan category, plagued with uncharacteristic quality issues to boot. While the NA I4 FWD is a nice package, the fact that it's even available in this class is sort of laughable. Other makers, including some even less prestigious than Acura (see Honda, Genesis, Audi and MB), have been turbocharging base models and supercharging performance versions for years. Meanwhile, after 28 years, the 2020 TLX has the same fundamental powertrain as my 1992 Accord EX - NA I4 FWD, except 0.2L more displacement, 3 extra MPGs, 60 more HP and 40 ft/lbs of TQ. It's that sort of thrill.

Per their same old MO, Acura is already promoting the 2G TLX with commercials parading around NSXs street racing and doing burnouts. I mean, talk about smoke and mirrors. Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result. I would be very suspicious about Acura currently being up to its same old tricks. Regardless, whatever base model they have in mind for the TLX to replace the I4 will continue to hold back its reviews, performance and perception.