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You say that Lexus is luxury but Acura is not. This makes no sense to me as they have comparable competing cars at similar price points (luxury divisions of Toyota and Honda). If Acura is not luxury then neither is Lexus!
Your view of luxury seems overly subjective to me.
Acura doesn't immediately come to mind when someone says luxury so I'll give you that.
Its not being selective its understanding what peoples perceptions are. You have in what we are talking about four manufactures that have $100,000+ lines of passenger cars. That gives the perception of a luxury brand. Its trickle down image.
I have never thought of any BMW that I owned except maybe the Z4 at being a luxury car. A $73,000 two seater is pretty much on the premium/luxury line. Points against are that it shares it shell with the 4 cylinder $50,000 version.
They were to me premium cars $60,000+ MSRP made by a luxury car manufacture. Lexus makes the ES 350 a tricked out Avalon that is sold to old lady's as a "luxury sedan" based on Lexus luxury image. Is the car a luxury unit? Not really it fails the cost test, but perception is in the BADGE. Its what the guys here are actually talking about when they say people are buying the badge with a 330, A4 whatever.
Not concerned about the rear seat space. Look at it's competition. I've yet to sit in any 3 series BMW or Mercedes C class and have any actual space back there. People who normally buy these cars either have one kid that's like 9 or have SUVs to carry the kids around. No one's really throwing friends in the back seat and running around with these cars.
Its not being selective its understanding what peoples perceptions are. You have in what we are talking about four manufactures that have $100,000+ lines of passenger cars. That gives the perception of a luxury brand. Its trickle down image.
I have never thought of any BMW that I owned except maybe the Z4 at being a luxury car. A $73,000 two seater is pretty much on the premium/luxury line. Points against are that it shares it shell with the 4 cylinder $50,000 version.
They were to me premium cars $60,000+ MSRP made by a luxury car manufacture. Lexus makes the ES 350 a tricked out Avalon that is sold to old lady's as a "luxury sedan" based on Lexus luxury image. Is the car a luxury unit? Not really it fails the cost test, but perception is in the BADGE. Its what the guys here are actually talking about when they say people are buying the badge with a 330, A4 whatever.
"After explaining why we (the public) call a car or brand “luxury”, I will now be moving on to the second part: The tiers and levels of luxury. Personally, I think there are 3 tiers:
The first tier is Super-luxury (i.e Rolls-Royce, Bentley)
The second tier is luxury (i.e Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Lexus, Genesis, Cadillac, Maserati)
The third tier is premium (i.e Buick, Acura, Infiniti, Lincoln)"
I never would have put Genesis in Tier 2 but the reasoning is sound.
Doesn't Maserati belong in Super-Luxury with Bentley?!!!
"After explaining why we (the public) call a car or brand “luxury”, I will now be moving on to the second part: The tiers and levels of luxury. Personally, I think there are 3 tiers:
The first tier is Super-luxury (i.e Rolls-Royce, Bentley)
The second tier is luxury (i.e Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Lexus, Genesis, Cadillac, Maserati)
The third tier is premium (i.e Buick, Acura, Infiniti, Lincoln)"
I never would have put Genesis in Tier 2 but the reasoning is sound.
Doesn't Maserati belong in Super-Luxury with Bentley?!!!
"After explaining why we (the public) call a car or brand “luxury”, I will now be moving on to the second part: The tiers and levels of luxury. Personally, I think there are 3 tiers:
The first tier is Super-luxury (i.e Rolls-Royce, Bentley)
The second tier is luxury (i.e Audi, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Lexus, Genesis, Cadillac, Maserati)
The third tier is premium (i.e Buick, Acura, Infiniti, Lincoln)"
I never would have put Genesis in Tier 2 but the reasoning is sound.
Doesn't Maserati belong in Super-Luxury with Bentley?!!!
Maserati's flagship car is "only" around $100K. That's Mercedes S-Class money. The Bentley Continental GT is over twice that. They're in two different leagues.
Its not being selective its understanding what peoples perceptions are. You have in what we are talking about four manufactures that have $100,000+ lines of passenger cars. That gives the perception of a luxury brand. Its trickle down image.
I have never thought of any BMW that I owned except maybe the Z4 at being a luxury car. A $73,000 two seater is pretty much on the premium/luxury line. Points against are that it shares it shell with the 4 cylinder $50,000 version.
They were to me premium cars $60,000+ MSRP made by a luxury car manufacture. Lexus makes the ES 350 a tricked out Avalon that is sold to old lady's as a "luxury sedan" based on Lexus luxury image. Is the car a luxury unit? Not really it fails the cost test, but perception is in the BADGE. Its what the guys here are actually talking about when they say people are buying the badge with a 330, A4 whatever.
Even prices aside, there's a few other things that hold Acura back from being considered a luxury brand in terms of perception.
1) They never had a flagship to compete with the S-Class/7-Series/A8 etc. Lexus has the LS which is a legitimate competitor.
2) Acura also doesn't have any RWD cars. Sure they added AWD, but for the first 20 years their flagship was FWD only.
3) Last but not least, probably the biggest issue, no V8. Granted, in today's world luxury cars are moving to turbocharged V6, but Acura still doesn't even have that in production yet. Always Catching Up, Rarely Ahead indeed.
Edit: I forgot, one more thing. Acura dealerships don't behave like a luxury dealerships. At least, not the ones in my area. Luxury dealerships groom you to be repeat buyers. Even when you show up with an entry-level car like an IS or A4 or CLA, you're given the same 5-star treatment. That's because they want you to come back and upgrade to a 5-series, and then a 7-series, etc. I suspect Acura dealers know that they're just a stepping stone in the pantheon of car brands. Just look at how many Acura owners here wind up "upgrading" to an Audi/Mercedes/BMW. It's a bit of a chicken-and-the-egg situation; they don't act like an aspirational brand because they don't expect many people to come back to the brand, and many people don't come back because they don't aspire to own one once they have more money.
Even prices aside, there's a few other things that hold Acura back from being considered a luxury brand in terms of perception.
1) They never had a flagship to compete with the S-Class/7-Series/A8 etc. Lexus has the LS which is a legitimate competitor.
2) Acura also doesn't have any RWD cars. Sure they added AWD, but for the first 20 years their flagship was FWD only.
3) Last but not least, probably the biggest issue, no V8. Granted, in today's world luxury cars are moving to turbocharged V6, but Acura still doesn't even have that in production yet. Always Catching Up, Rarely Ahead indeed.
Edit: I forgot, one more thing. Acura dealerships don't behave like a luxury dealerships. At least, not the ones in my area. Luxury dealerships groom you to be repeat buyers. Even when you show up with an entry-level car like an IS or A4 or CLA, you're given the same 5-star treatment. That's because they want you to come back and upgrade to a 5-series, and then a 7-series, etc. I suspect Acura dealers know that they're just a stepping stone in the pantheon of car brands. Just look at how many Acura owners here wind up "upgrading" to an Audi/Mercedes/BMW. It's a bit of a chicken-and-the-egg situation; they don't act like an aspirational brand because they don't expect many people to come back to the brand, and many people don't come back because they don't aspire to own one once they have more money.
My best dealership experiences have been Mercedes. Audi wasn't bad either. Acura, to their credit, tried really hard to keep me and managed to give me a good deal on the TLX. I wouldn't call myself an Acura customer for life but I really have no complaints at this point.
Genesis should not be placed along side of Mercedes, BMW, Lexus and Audi. Yes, they are making strides and are knocking on the door but not there yet especially without a dealer network in place. Go read some owners stories how you get treated when you need warranty work. You have to deal with Hyuandai dealers directly and they treat you like you bought another econo box. Their service is just awful...
Genesis should not be placed along side of Mercedes, BMW, Lexus and Audi. Yes, they are making strides and are knocking on the door but not there yet especially without a dealer network in place. Go read some owners stories how you get treated when you need warranty work. You have to deal with Hyuandai dealers directly and they treat you like you bought another econo box. Their service is just awful...
Even prices aside, there's a few other things that hold Acura back from being considered a luxury brand in terms of perception.
1) They never had a flagship to compete with the S-Class/7-Series/A8 etc. Lexus has the LS which is a legitimate competitor.
2) Acura also doesn't have any RWD cars. Sure they added AWD, but for the first 20 years their flagship was FWD only.
3) Last but not least, probably the biggest issue, no V8. Granted, in today's world luxury cars are moving to turbocharged V6, but Acura still doesn't even have that in production yet. Always Catching Up, Rarely Ahead indeed.
Edit: I forgot, one more thing. Acura dealerships don't behave like a luxury dealerships. At least, not the ones in my area. Luxury dealerships groom you to be repeat buyers. Even when you show up with an entry-level car like an IS or A4 or CLA, you're given the same 5-star treatment. That's because they want you to come back and upgrade to a 5-series, and then a 7-series, etc. I suspect Acura dealers know that they're just a stepping stone in the pantheon of car brands. Just look at how many Acura owners here wind up "upgrading" to an Audi/Mercedes/BMW. It's a bit of a chicken-and-the-egg situation; they don't act like an aspirational brand because they don't expect many people to come back to the brand, and many people don't come back because they don't aspire to own one once they have more money.
100% agreed, especially on the dealership experience.
Also on the Acura product themselves, I don't know when and how but now we are just seeing them as premium cars carrying great values for your money. That's why Acura make the best used cars. It's hard to go away from that image unless they spin off another Luxury Division of Acura LOL.
I like the Genesis's approach to the luxury market: No holding back, just go all out with their products. They may fail, idk, but their products are definitely completive in features and performance.
100% agreed, especially on the dealership experience.
Also on the Acura product themselves, I don't know when and how but now we are just seeing them as premium cars carrying great values for your money. That's why Acura make the best used cars. It's hard to go away from that image unless they spin off another Luxury Division of Acura LOL.
I like the Genesis's approach to the luxury market: No holding back, just go all out with their products. They may fail, idk, but their products are definitely completive in features and performance.
I seriously considered Genesis, especially when most reviewers universally stated how some of the interiors outdid German counterparts!
What held me back was dealing with servicing that may go back to "Hyundai treatment" and the fuel economy numbers tend to be at the bottom of the pack.
Edit: I forgot, one more thing. Acura dealerships don't behave like a luxury dealerships. At least, not the ones in my area. Luxury dealerships groom you to be repeat buyers. Even when you show up with an entry-level car like an IS or A4 or CLA, you're given the same 5-star treatment. That's because they want you to come back and upgrade to a 5-series, and then a 7-series, etc.
Agree 100%. This upward within the family marketing strategy was invented by Alfred P. Sloan at GM. Program consisted of annual model changes & overlapping prices Chevy to Caddy. Most all of the successful mass market manufactures have adopted it over the the years. The less successful have not. You need three things a good low priced car a very good high priced car & some fillers to act as steps to the top. Plan was capture the first time new car buyer with a Chevy then move him along the ever more expensive GM name plates into most expensive cars as the persons income grew.
Unlike Lexus Acura never built the top end car nor the required fillers. Image flows downward. If you build $150,000 cars chances are your $40,000 cars are OK. Does not hurt that they have the same logo on the hood.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 11-29-2020 at 12:22 PM.
I seriously considered Genesis, especially when most reviewers universally stated how some of the interiors outdid German counterparts!
What held me back was dealing with servicing that may go back to "Hyundai treatment" and the fuel economy numbers tend to be at the bottom of the pack.
Yeah that can be a crapshoot that Genesis will have to work past. My grandsons Genesis has been 100% reliable since new. It goes in annually to the local Hyundai dealer for any normal maintenance items (FreeB) & state inspection. That said we have never seen anything past the drop-off point since we just leave it there & pick it up when its done.
Agree excellent interiors.
Please tell me where I or anyone else said a newer A6 was less reliable than a TLX. You're imagining things!
You didn't say it directly, but you did mention that your old A6 had problems. When I mentioned the old TLX also had issues, you brushed it off as it's not this gen. So, in the end you're indirectly assuming the newer TLX will be better then the 1G TLX and potentially the newer A6. Besides price, reliability must also be a reason you didn't consider a newer A6 for it's replacement.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 11-29-2020 at 09:04 PM.
You didn't say it directly, but you did mention that your old A6 had problems. When I mentioned the old TLX also had issues, you brushed it off as it's not this gen. So, in the end you're indirectly assuming the newer TLX will be better then the 1G TLX and potentially the newer A6.
Reread what I wrote.
Originally Posted by ELIN
I started an A6 lease shortly before the scandal broke concerning VW’s cheating with the diesel emissions. Although my A6 was not a Diesel engine, I was not exactly spared. Every so often, the check engine light would pop up. I notified my dealer and he recommended getting it “checked”. It wasn’t enough of an issue so I let it go. Shortly afterwards, there was a recall on the car that, surprise!, involved the emissions. After the recall, the check engine light never popped up again.
I lost complete trust in Audi/VW. So yeah, I’ll take a sporty looking TLX over Audi any day...since we were on the topic of “faking”...
The check engine light was related to the Volkswagen scandal. It had nothing to do with reliability but rather integrity.
The check engine light was related to the Volkswagen scandal. It had nothing to do with reliability but rather integrity.
You said recall fixed it, that's reliability and your dealership didn't initially acknowledge it. EXACTLY like the ZF9 situation on the 1G TLX.
We can agree to disagree, but Acura and Audi can behave the same on same issues.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 11-29-2020 at 09:10 PM.
You said recall fixed it, that's reliability and your dealership didn't initially acknowledge it. EXACTLY like the ZF9 situation on the 1G TLX.
We can agree to disagree, but Acura and Audi can behave the same on same issues.
No. Audi/Volkswagen lied to people in 2015. It is nothing like Acura offering a transmission that doesn't meet expectations. Not even close.
No. Audi/Volkswagen lied to people in 2015. It is nothing like Acura offering a transmission that doesn't meet expectations. Not even close.
The 2015 transmission nonsense was not HONDA'S first Rodeo.
Unfortunately they all do it including Honda. Honda lost a class action suit on Accord AT's after denying they had any problems with them for years. My daughter got a new transmission at 70,000 miles & extended warranty out of it. In the case of the 6MT in Accord & 3G TL's they folded after another class action suit was being worked up. For years they denied there was was a problem with them. At first to stave off the complaints they swiched the trans oil to GM friction modified synchromesh which turned out to be a short term fix. I got a new transmission at 24,000 miles under a TSB. Documented in the 3G forum around 2008/9. Smaller issue again denied for a long time TL 4G torque converters.
It would be hard to find a car company that does not have a big ass skeleton in their closet. Ford Pinto gas tanks, GM ignition keys. BMW fuel pumps. Firestone SUV tires. Everybody Air Bags & on & on.
Edit: If you follow my 3G posts you will discover that the 3G was the most problem plagued car I owned going back to the 1960's
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 11-30-2020 at 05:10 AM.
No. Audi/Volkswagen lied to people in 2015. It is nothing like Acura offering a transmission that doesn't meet expectations. Not even close.
You seem like a nice guy. You're brand new here - probably signed up because you're giddy with your new 2G TLX. Not taking anything away from that, but you obviously don't know the 1G TLX backstory. Since this is the 2G thread and I'm perilously close to being some guy who keeps beating a dead horse, I'll just say that Acura spent months in denial about the ZF9, including instructing dealers to give owners run-arounds about software problems, telling drivers they were driving the car wrong, or telling drivers their perception about the shifting was wrong - and even battling disgruntled owners in court for months and years, before finally caving into the ZF9 complains, which, by the way, are also legendary for tranny issues in FCA vehicles made back then. It was simply a bad slushbox.
I don't recall exactly, but it wasn't until like 2016 or 2017 that the TSB allowed customers of 2015 and half of 2016 (either that or just the first half of 2015) cars to request a new tranny. Once you made the complaint and you were in the VIN range, there was a pretty rigorous analysis of test drives, proving issues with snapshots and a manufacture rep inspection to get approved. Not everyone was approved, but by then it didn't matter anyway, because many TLX owners already hated their car, their dealership or both, some already moving on from the car and brand. Your use of the word "offering" is a stretch.
I mean, as far as I'm concerned, that's as bad as, if not worse than, VW fudging numbers on emissions tests, which has little impact on driving quality or customer satisfaction. I don't know how big of a fight VW put up against the USA, but I do know my friend got a fat check in the mail, kept his VW and didn't have it fixed, without asking or filing anything.
You seem like a nice guy. You're brand new here - probably signed up because you're giddy with your new 2G TLX. Not taking anything away from that, but you obviously don't know the 1G TLX backstory. Since this is the 2G thread and I'm perilously close to being some guy who keeps beating a dead horse, I'll just say that Acura spent months in denial about the ZF9, including instructing dealers to give owners run-arounds about software problems, telling drivers they were driving the car wrong, or telling drivers their perception about the shifting was wrong - and even battling disgruntled owners in court for months and years, before finally caving into the ZF9 complains, which, by the way, are also legendary for tranny issues in FCA vehicles made back then. It was simply a bad slushbox.
I don't recall exactly, but it wasn't until like 2016 or 2017 that the TSB allowed customers of 2015 and half of 2016 (either that or just the first half of 2015) cars to request a new tranny. Once you made the complaint and you were in the VIN range, there was a pretty rigorous analysis of test drives, proving issues with snapshots and a manufacture rep inspection to get approved. Not everyone was approved, but by then it didn't matter anyway, because many TLX owners already hated their car, their dealership or both, some already moving on from the car and brand. Your use of the word "offering" is a stretch.
I mean, as far as I'm concerned, that's as bad as, if not worse than, VW fudging numbers on emissions tests, which has little impact on driving quality or customer satisfaction. I don't know how big of a fight VW put up against the USA, but I do know my friend got a fat check in the mail, kept his VW and didn't have it fixed, without asking or filing anything.
Thanks everyone for the 1G recap. I will refrain from further 1G comments since I don’t have all the background.
Thanks everyone for the 1G recap. I will refrain from further 1G comments since I don’t have all the background.
No prob bud. I'm just glad you're happy with your 2G. That's all that matters. If you want to read more about the ZF9 and let me know what you think, the 65-page thread is here. That horse has been beaten beyond dead, but it's still good for lively discussion around here. https://acurazine.com/forums/1g-tlx-...-2-3-a-919230/
Thing to remember is never raise your car to the status of religious icon like Tesla. Icons tend to develop cracks.
Just saw a report on RPM Plus (Quebec car show) about how badly designed Tesla's are for northern climate and rusting. They will cost a fortune to keep from falling apart. Good intentions for the planet, but extremely costly for owners.
2021 Acura TLX Luggage Test | Perfectly reasonable trunk space
Its exterior dimensions say midsize sedan; its trunk space says compact
James Riswick
Nov 30th 2020 at 11:00AMThe 2021 Acura TLX has a 13.5-cubic-foot trunk according to the spec sheet. That would be comparable to a typical compact mainstream sedan despite the TLX's exterior dimensions being more akin to a midsize sedan (its 194.6-inch length is right smack between a Toyota Camry and Honda Accord). Luxury cars usually sacrifice utility for style, and by adapting cab-rearward proportions for this latest generation, it shouldn't be surprising that the TLX follows the trend.
However, how much utility does the new TLX sacrifice and is the trunk still useful? Let's find out.
It's a fairly deep space, but the amount of width and space behind the wheel wells is also reasonably generous and seemingly useful.
As with every luggage test, I use 2 midsize roller suitcases that would need to be checked in at the airport (26 inches long, 16 wide, 11 deep), 2 roll-aboard suitcases that just barely fit in the overhead (24L x 15W x 10D), and 1 smaller roll-aboard that fits easily (23L x 15W x 10D). I also include my wife's fancy overnight bag just to spruce things up a bit (21L x 12W x 12D).
To start off, I lined the biggest bags on their sides to demonstrate the difference in the trunk's width relative other sedans. Only 3 can fit, whereas you can fit four in the majority of midsize sedans.
Nevertheless, all the bags fit. That's not the case with the Cadillac CT4 or CT5, or the big fibber, the BMW 3 Series and its "17-cubic-foot" trunk.
Basically, the numbers make sense here. While it can hold all the bags, there really isn't any leftover space as there is in a midsize sedan.
That said, I should note that there are plenty of compact crossovers that can't fit all these bags below their cargo covers, including the Mercedes GLC and Alfa Stelvio.
OK, 1 more trunk-related note.
While there is a spare-tire-shaped hole under the trunk floor, there is no spare tire. Instead, you get a compressor encased in foam covering the car's battery. Putting the battery in the trunk is totally normal, but there's something a tad bootleg about this placement. It seems like an afterthought.
It almost certainly has to do with engine compartment packaging and/or weight distribution, but it does mean you do without a spare tire. Or, I suppose as BMW is apt to do, extra under-floor cargo space.
2021 Acura TLX Luggage Test | Perfectly reasonable trunk space
Its exterior dimensions say midsize sedan; its trunk space says compact
James Riswick
Nov 30th 2020 at 11:00AMThe 2021 Acura TLX has a 13.5-cubic-foot trunk according to the spec sheet. That would be comparable to a typical compact mainstream sedan despite the TLX's exterior dimensions being more akin to a midsize sedan (its 194.6-inch length is right smack between a Toyota Camry and Honda Accord). Luxury cars usually sacrifice utility for style, and by adapting cab-rearward proportions for this latest generation, it shouldn't be surprising that the TLX follows the trend.
However, how much utility does the new TLX sacrifice and is the trunk still useful? Let's find out.
It's a fairly deep space, but the amount of width and space behind the wheel wells is also reasonably generous and seemingly useful.
As with every luggage test, I use 2 midsize roller suitcases that would need to be checked in at the airport (26 inches long, 16 wide, 11 deep), 2 roll-aboard suitcases that just barely fit in the overhead (24L x 15W x 10D), and 1 smaller roll-aboard that fits easily (23L x 15W x 10D). I also include my wife's fancy overnight bag just to spruce things up a bit (21L x 12W x 12D).
To start off, I lined the biggest bags on their sides to demonstrate the difference in the trunk's width relative other sedans. Only 3 can fit, whereas you can fit four in the majority of midsize sedans.
Nevertheless, all the bags fit. That's not the case with the Cadillac CT4 or CT5, or the big fibber, the BMW 3 Series and its "17-cubic-foot" trunk.
Basically, the numbers make sense here. While it can hold all the bags, there really isn't any leftover space as there is in a midsize sedan.
That said, I should note that there are plenty of compact crossovers that can't fit all these bags below their cargo covers, including the Mercedes GLC and Alfa Stelvio.
OK, 1 more trunk-related note.
While there is a spare-tire-shaped hole under the trunk floor, there is no spare tire. Instead, you get a compressor encased in foam covering the car's battery. Putting the battery in the trunk is totally normal, but there's something a tad bootleg about this placement. It seems like an afterthought.
It almost certainly has to do with engine compartment packaging and/or weight distribution, but it does mean you do without a spare tire. Or, I suppose as BMW is apt to do, extra under-floor cargo space.
The reviewer shouldn't have been comparing against Camry and Accord for luggage space. Just keep it within the segment and it will be more apples to apples.
Also, it should be public knowledge by now but the lack of spare tire is so Acura can eek out every drop of fuel economy as the TLX sorely needs it.
Not sure what issues the reviewer has with the 17 CF BMW trunk but I never had any issues stuffing the 440 with as much as I wanted. On a Costco run with toilet paper, paper kitchen towels & paper shop towels they all went right is along with anything else. If I ran out of trunk space the rear seat folded flat.
Thought this would give a chuckle. Two seat sport car 10CF of trunk space.
4 Door two ton car with a 13.5 CF trunk.
Works out to 5CF per person @ 2 vs 3.37CF per person @ 4 or 2.7CF @ 5 passengers. Major case of form over function. Think any 4 door sedan Germans included regardless of make should have reasonable luggage space as they are supposed to be multi-person movers.
Not sure what issues the reviewer has with the 17 CF BMW trunk but I never had any issues stuffing the 440 with as much as I wanted.
I think the main issue was that the reviewer took the 17 CF with a grain of salt as he appears to be implying it's a lot less than what is claimed (that was my takeaway, at least).
I think the main issue was that the reviewer took the 17 CF with a grain of salt as he appears to be implying it's a lot less than what is claimed (that was my takeaway, at least).
Don't these interior dimension number have to agree with the EPA numbers?
"For obvious reasons, let's take the trunk. It has grown to 17 cubic feet from 15.8, which on paper at least, means the 3 Series has a bigger trunk than a Honda Accord. It would also be a whopping 6 cubic-feet bigger than that aforementioned 5 Series from 20 years ago."
"So, all of the four biggest bags fit between the wheel wells, but they couldn't be lined up on their sides as you can in a Sonata, Passat, Camry, Legacy and the ultra-wide Accord. There's also less space remaining between the bags and the trunk lip. That proves this car has LESS space than those, not more. "
"In total, I have no idea where BMW is getting that 17 cubic-foot measurement. If this is 17 cubes, then all the midsize sedans I've tested must be grossly under-reporting their capacities. In reality, I suspect it's a difference in measurements. Perhaps BMW is including the extra space afforded by those bins. Who knows. If I were to guess, I'd say this is closer to 12 or 13 cubes using those midsize sedans as a reference point. That actually wouldn't be that bad for a luxury sport sedan like the 3 Series, and let's not lose sight of the fact that it still managed to hold five suitcases with space left over. That seems pretty good."
The reviewer is justified in calling BS on BMW as this is a real world example with actual cars and not comparing numbers on paper.
1) Owners may appreciate the "do not interrupt" feature that blocks junk calls while listening to music/programming. If you are an iPhone user, you have a similar feature already since iOS 14.
2) Acura was shooting for the dimensions of the A7, Panamera, and Model S. The dimensions are similar and nearly same fuel economy as the A7. Unfortunately, the A7 has about double the luggage capacity of the TLX.
Weighing in on the "Is Acura a luxury car?" debate. Before purchasing my 2G TLX A-Spec I seriously considered saving 10+ grand and going for a loaded XSE Camry or top trim Hyundai Sonata (Limited). Sonata has an arguably superior digital gauge cluster, limited trim gives you HUD, panoramic sunroof, surround view camera, Bose sound system. Top trim Camry gives you the pano sunroof as well, JBL sound system and surround view camera (which Toyota calls birds-eye camera). Sonata exterior styling is polarizing - personally I think at first glance it looks stunning and futuristic, then you stare at it for awhile and you start developing a craving for Cajun fried catfish. Camry has shucked its plain-Jane styling and looks like a damn cool car especially in blue with the black roof and pano sunroof. Then you sit in them awhile and there just is an absolute crap-ton of hard plastics and cheap materials. Top trim Accord, too. You can definitely perceive the cost-cutting even with all the top trim bells and whistles. Plus the current gen Accord's exterior styling - while classy - just doesn't really do it for me. I had a 2016 Accord Coupe. Stunning looking car in my opinion. Dark blue. Got lots of compliments. But the interior rattled more than the Mandalorian's ship at any speed over 20 MPH. Sure Acura isn't at the level of Lexus, Merc, BMW in terms of dealership experience. Sure, there is no "flagship" (unless you count the NSX). Sure there is a curious lack of amenities in the lower than top level trims (My A-spec lacks HUD, heated steering wheel, surround view camera - for a 45-47K car, that is borderline inexcusable). Their ILX model is only barely a luxury vehicle at all. But as I drive my 2G TLX over the last few days the luxury touches it does have - the ELS, the leather seats, the soft touch materials ... to me all of this screams luxury. So, overall, for me, I definitely lump Acura in with Lexus, Merc, BMW, Audi. Until Genesis has a dealership experience that at minimum rivals Acura, (which depending on the dealership is middling compared to, say, Lexus), they don't belong fully in the luxury club and I'd have to call them high-premium.
Weighing in on the "Is Acura a luxury car?" debate. Before purchasing my 2G TLX A-Spec I seriously considered saving 10+ grand and going for a loaded XSE Camry or top trim Hyundai Sonata (Limited). Sonata has an arguably superior digital gauge cluster, limited trim gives you HUD, panoramic sunroof, surround view camera, Bose sound system. Top trim Camry gives you the pano sunroof as well, JBL sound system and surround view camera (which Toyota calls birds-eye camera). Sonata exterior styling is polarizing - personally I think at first glance it looks stunning and futuristic, then you stare at it for awhile and you start developing a craving for Cajun fried catfish. Camry has shucked its plain-Jane styling and looks like a damn cool car especially in blue with the black roof and pano sunroof. Then you sit in them awhile and there just is an absolute crap-ton of hard plastics and cheap materials. Top trim Accord, too. You can definitely perceive the cost-cutting even with all the top trim bells and whistles. Plus the current gen Accord's exterior styling - while classy - just doesn't really do it for me. I had a 2016 Accord Coupe. Stunning looking car in my opinion. Dark blue. Got lots of compliments. But the interior rattled more than the Mandalorian's ship at any speed over 20 MPH. Sure Acura isn't at the level of Lexus, Merc, BMW in terms of dealership experience. Sure, there is no "flagship" (unless you count the NSX). Sure there is a curious lack of amenities in the lower than top level trims (My A-spec lacks HUD, heated steering wheel, surround view camera - for a 45-47K car, that is borderline inexcusable). Their ILX model is only barely a luxury vehicle at all. But as I drive my 2G TLX over the last few days the luxury touches it does have - the ELS, the leather seats, the soft touch materials ... to me all of this screams luxury. So, overall, for me, I definitely lump Acura in with Lexus, Merc, BMW, Audi. Until Genesis has a dealership experience that at minimum rivals Acura, (which depending on the dealership is middling compared to, say, Lexus), they don't belong fully in the luxury club and I'd have to call them high-premium.
Well said!
I'm still listening to the Satellite stations because the ELS somehow has made them compelling, which is hard to imagine as I used to sell high-end sound systems!
Nice Mandalorian reference! "Grogu" is going to take quite a bit of time to get used to...not entirely thrilled with the name...but like all things Star Wars, you eventually accept it!
So, overall, for me, I definitely lump Acura in with Lexus, Merc, BMW, Audi. Until Genesis has a dealership experience that at minimum rivals Acura, (which depending on the dealership is middling compared to, say, Lexus), they don't belong fully in the luxury club and I'd have to call them high-premium.
Same goes for Acura though, until they fully update their customization or trim packages, they also don't fully belong in luxury. I'm curious to see what packages will become available on the MDX once it's revealed on Dec 8th. That model will do luxury on a better scale since it knows it will get killed against the Q7/X5/GLE if not.
Acura is using the Type-S to sell the TLX, so underscoring luxury and directly targeting performance/younger folks.
In the old car, even with the stronger V6 engine, I always felt I was driving a gussied-up Accord. This new TLX with its significantly stiffer chassis feels like a performance car. It’s not the most powerful or the most hardcore – maybe the new Type S will help achieve that in the spring, though we still don’t know many of its most important details – but it did make me want to stay on the back roads, setting up for the next sequence of curves.
"This totally new car is wider, longer and lower than the previous generation, with wider tracking at both front and rear. It’s also at least $5,000 more expensive."
followed by this:
"Horsepower is actually down from the previous V6, but torque is up a bit and kicks in at much lower rpm – Acura says it’s an increase of 48 lbs.-ft. at 1,500 rpm."
Definitely not apples to apples!
I've never had a HUD so I thought this was pretty good insight for prospective buyers:
"The optional heads-up display on the windshield, however, is useful and always clear, even through my polarized sunglasses, which obscure the HUDs in Mercedes, BMW, Genesis and any number of others. Honda’s got it right (and so has Volvo and Ford) – why can’t those other makers learn from this?"
This one was a head-scratcher, especially for a review that was published 12 hrs ago:
"If you’re truly focused on sport-driving though, you should wait a few months to see what the Type S will offer. Rumour has it the V6 engine will produce 355 horsepower, with bigger brakes, bigger wheels and all that other good stuff."
11-27-2020, 02:51 PM
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