KeithL

A couple of points. First to Colin about no one seeing the TLX prototype then they wasted whatever money they have spend on the few ads they ran. Why advertise a handful of times, if you are serious then advertise the hell out of it. To docboy, I am sure they did not plan to run out of cars. They probably had every indication that the car was going to,launch June 1 as anticipated until the last second. if they had built TLs and TSXs right up to the end they would have a glut of them that would be so discounted it would have possibly hurt the initial sales of the TLX. Let's face it if you have the average buyer walk into a dealership and there are tons of TLs for $5K off and TSXs with similar discount sitting next to new a handful of MSRP TLXs what do you think most buyers that typically shop Acura are going to buy. They gambled on a on time launch and planned for minimal out going inventory. Unfortunately that strategy failed with the last minute delay. Let's just hope Acura advertises the hell out of the TLX when it ships.

Treblig

I have heard that Marysville is building TLX's and has been for while and is stockpiling the inventory. That is curious if one considers that the delay is to make some changes. With all of that inventory on hand, those changes would have to be minor or just software related which could be a quick fix at dealers. So I guess the delay is so that they will have plenty of cars available for the release date. But that assumes that there will be quite a demand for the car. Could Acura be "crazy like a fox"? I still hold out hope for the TLX in that maybe it is one of those cars that you have to see in the "flesh". I do know that I, for one, like what they did with the RLX's interior which is refined and full of quality. If nothing else, I would anticipate that the TLX interior will be a nice place to spend some time.

Colin

Keith, I think that the initial advertising that they were doing was just the start. It would have continued to build momentum leading up to the vehicle launch. However, when the car was delayed they stopped advertising, saving the money for their future efforts. I believe they posted their future advertising plans on our interactive network a few weeks ago. There is a lot.

KeithL

If this was like the Q50 launch, they built cars then had stickers on all the head units telling dealers not to sell car until latest firmware was loaded. My guess is what ever they found was not mechanical, but would be fixed by software so they started building cars.

Treblig

That would seem logical since any major changes, like bodywork or drivetrain changes would be cost prohibitive. If I wasn't of the mindset of staying away from first model year cars, the TLX would surely be a reason to.

Rocketsfan

Considering the issues the Q50's had and some say still has since launch, software issues may be more of a curse than hardware issues. lol.

randomRon82

This is sales for the US market. Audi for instance has substantially more market share on a global scale and is significantly more profitable than Acura and they will continue to expand their product portfolio and continue to be more successful. Unlike Acura, they aren't sitting around doing nothing... Acura has had MANY opportunities.

From Audi's most recent swot analysis:

strengths: Stronger brand portfolio helps to register higher revenues -- robust focus on research and development drives innovation -- strong parent position gives significant competitive advantage
(items that Acura falls very short of.)

To be honest, Acura's tiny and constantly dwindling "lineup" is a complete joke and the small amount of vehicle offerings that they do have aren't a huge leap from their Honda counterparts. I hate to say this, but they might as well combine the remaining "Acura" vehicles with the rest of the Honda lineup. It's clear that Acura is fine with remaining at the bottom of the barrel of luxury brands so it really isn't necessary to be a standalone brand.

Although decreasing, the current Acura sales are acceptable in the US because of the MDX and RDX... but I can guarantee that if things don't change soon, it won't be that way for long. Competition is growing at a rapid pace and brands are making substantial changes to their products and to their brands. I'm hearing a lot of complaints about the MDX..... and the RDX at this point is already outdated. Acura never really future proofs their products, they make incremental updates. Folks aren't going to continue to flock to the MDX and RDX like they did upon first release. The other brands are smart enough to know that incremental changes are no longer going to cut it.

Whether you work for Acura.... or not, it's very clear that the company has lost its way. People that continue to justify its disasters and mistakes are the reason why the company has not reached its full potential... and why it's moving so slowly.

Colin

^^ you are certainly entitled to your opinion. But make no mistake, although you state your feelings as fact, they are actually opinions. What else can I say? Either you are trying to deliberately create controversy or have already made up your mind.

neuronbob

You and your logic and facts and comparisons stuff. Excellent points all, and thank you again for the "on the ground" perspective. Few people here sell Acura products so that perspective is helpful. BTW Cadi outsells Acura but not by a huge margin. Not that it makes a huge diff.

KeithL

I think that is the nature of the beast now going forward. Infiniti was very ambitions, full electric steering completely new head unit and new tech top to bottom, thinking of all that code to operate all they I would be shocked if they did not have any issues. I like where Infiniti is going I just think they have waited too long to replace the V6 workhorse that is rooted in 10+ year old design. The 2 biggest complaints I had with my M37S was the cabin noise ) they suppose resolved that in 15 Q70) and the rough raspy V6 that is just not on par with almost every competitor.

randomRon82

I'm definitely in no way trying to start controversy. I'm sad, disappointed and frustrated is all. In my head I've already made up my mind to just move on, but in my heart there's that tiny ounce of faith left. I've always looked at Acura as being a very promising alternative to the Germans. I used to think they were very special and desirable. This is going back to 1997 when a friend's mom drove us around in her new TL, I fell in love with the brand. It was a desirable alternative with advanced tech, multiple coupes and other luxury options. I guess over the years I expected Acura to be even better, but instead it's just gotten worse. The frustration comes from knowing they have the capability of being excellent, but they are okay with being mediocre and stagnant. Some of my bitterness comes from the purchase of my TL. For some strange reason I thought getting the TL would help me relive some of my childhood memories. I was extremely proud of having an Acura and thought everyone else would be also.... Until the only comments I got in real life were things like "Is that a rental? Is that a Honda Accord? Why did you get rid of your other car? Why would you spend that much money on a Honda? This is a Honda it's the same thing. Acura is not luxury. What is Acura?" I thought, okay... People's perception about Acura cannot be that bad... But I've discovered that it truly is... and now I'm finally understanding why.

Anyway, I'll wait a few more months to hear about Acura' plans for the future and I'll possibly test drive the tlx before completely pulling the trigger.

weather

Colin....Again, you know me enough to know that I am not trying to be overly critical. I value everyone's input and contribution on this site and you are one of the solid member and we all appreciate your view point. I agree that many (including myself) are disapointed in the way the TLX turned out. Its not a bad car but its just that they just stopped short of hitting a homerun. It is really annoying to see the "potential" they had and decided to take the route of half measures when THEY acknowledged they needed a homerun.

Biggest example.....The bodykit. The compalins about the 4G (post MMC) has been bashed by many and you can't tell me Acura is not aware of the complaints and how bad it looks.....I can understand that for a MMC, they may have not wanted to invest lots of money but for the TLX, and a vehicle they KNEW they had to have a homerun, why give us again, a tacked on when they have created such a wonderful option on the 2009 TSX??! Even the kit on teh ILX is much better than that of the TLX.

The overall lines of the TLX are WELL EXECUTED.....its in the details that they screwed it up and the details are often what makes or breaks a vehicle. Wheels, accessories etc.

I am disapointed in teh delay but not to a point where its a show stopper for me as I wasn't planning on getting a TLX until next spring anyway. The delays are affecting my planning decision because I want to see the car in the flesh first, so the longer the delays, the more it screws my ability to go through my sequence of options....I want to have all teh fact prior to say I am staying, or leaving Acura.

Now a quick point if I may, and again, no disrespect to you whatsoever as you know I value your contribution, but Acura has been bashed significantly throughout the auto industry. The prototype, which I knew was not going to be exactly the same as the production car, was very well received by critics which is the kind of buzz Acura needed to create. It wasn't just the folks here on Acurazine that enjoyed the car, but reviewers overall loved the direction that Acura was going and that is teh kind of buzz I was talking about....Whether or not we want to admit or not but most people are followers. They get influenced by auto critics so if they sit down in their lazboys ona sunday morning while having their breakfast and Motorweek is bashing teh styling of the Acura TLX and saying how ugly it is, do you think that it will not influence their decision? Of course it will.....the same way I am being influenced by the constant reviews of reliability issues that German brands have....

I am just wondering why Acura could not find a way to "leak" the cause of their concerns to a credible source (like TOV) or something so we can at least have a sense of what is teh cause for the delays and stop us from speculating. I can assure that the worst thing you can have is rumors and gossips....just take that concept to a work place, a good manager will always be transparent to staff and put any rumors to rest as that only destroys moral....Acura should try and do the same here. They don't have to go into all teh details but at least give us a little nugget to make us understand....I said this before but enthusiast are also very loyal customers, the one that buys and buys and buys! I strated in 2006 with Acura and I am on my 5th Acura which is not huge but the TLX could be my 6th....Sure, I am just a drop in the bucket but reading some post of very senior people here that are also getting frustrated and are starting to lose confidence in the brand, which is something Acura can't afford.

...and one last point, if they created that red paint for the prototype, why not make it available for a production car?! It was such a hit with people and don't tell me that this is a paint that can't be brought to a production car because it has an impact on aerodynamics *lol* I know "OSTRICH" would have been all over this red car.....I am a white guy but some like exciting color and even I have to admit that this red was gorgeous.

KeithL

At the end of the day Acura will do what Acura wants. We can all speculate as to what drives them or what their goals are and whether they are meeting those goals. As we all know it is us loyalists and fans on sites like this that get upset because they are not executing as we think they should. Many are disappointed with the TLX. If we look at the TLX typical buyer (and few of us are that) the TLX will probably be a booming success. The 2 things I am most frustrated with is Acura's stubbornness to let go of the beak. Sure it better, but it is still probably one of the most controversial topics discussed. Just look at ronjons sample and how it transforms the car. Next is the lack of a true sports model. Infiniti and Lexus release both release sport variants up front and Lexus has been surprised at the take rate on them, to the point when the GS released the F-Sport was rare.

I have said it before that Acura is being too conservative on their approach. With all the competition they need to go big or go home. Sure some would argue they tried that with the 4G, but they should not give up. They have Hyundai now being seen as the value German alternative and Infiniti re-branding the company and refreshing their lineup to take on the Germans. Lexus broke into true Tier 1 status after a lot of work and Infinit is trying. So Acura can get lost in the background of make a stand and move forward. Of course what we we don't know is what Acura management wants or if they are happy where they are. In the end a profitable company that has sustainability and return is all stock holders want.

Acura_Dude

I do wish the prototype wheels were an accessory for the production TLX as well as the availability of that red paint.

Definitely makes sense.

I do like the VQ motors though.

KeithL

I enjoyed it other than the raspy roughness, but the 7AT was another story, they need to tweak that puppy. Periodic hunting for gears and often at the wrong time when you are trying to mash the pedal. It was not as abd as some have said, but the 8AT in my A6 is buttery smooth and dead on quick shifts.

4thaccord

Except that in this particular example, in this particular post, his opinions are fact (RDX outdated? It's less well equipped than an Accord. Vehicles that are souped-up versions of their Honda counterparts? No rational person can argue that point. Etc...)

Acura_Dude

I haven't had any time in a Q50 yet. But if i'm not mistaken the powertrain from the G37 was carried over for the 2014 MY Q50. I think i've seen one, and the closest dealer is an hour drive away. I do like how the G35/37 sound though.

rsx2rdx

Was looking at the Acura Mobile site, and they have some updated pictures of the red TLX with accessories and a silver with the Base wheels.

http://m.acura.com/TLXLanding

KeithL

Correct, the VQ power train is still being used, Nissan is only now starting to develop a more modern V6.

randomRon82

Thanks.... below is the pic with the glued on accessories. lol



"Accessorized TLX in Basque Red Pearl II with:

- 19-inch Diamond-Cut Alloy Wheels
- Aero Kit
- Decklid Spoiler"

jshaw

It's a bit different. I've rented a couple of G37 verts in FL before, and drove a relative's Q50. The engine seems much quieter, and less harsh than before. Transmission is less indecisive, though it doesn't become unnoticeable. It's lack of conviction when choosing a gear still comes up, occasionally.



---------------------------------------


Reading up, it seems the Q50 has a different intake than the G37. Exhaust, too. Makes sense, they don't have to cover up the intake with a loud exhaust, anymore.

Rocketsfan

If you're letting other people's opinions of what you drive decide for you what you'll drive, you should already be in a Mercedes, BMW, etc. Few people are going to praise Acura like they praise those brands (whether warranted or not). This is like saying people that love BMW's and Audi's shouldn't buy those brands because others say things like "I guess your service department is going to log more miles on that than you do" or "I like your A4 ... oh, crap... sorry... from a distance, I thought your A6 was an A4 - my bad". Maybe Hyundai Genesis drivers should care when someone asks "hey, was that your Genesis parked next to my Rio in the service bay? Nice car!" Who gives a flip?


About the only thing I'm pissed off at Acura for right now are the delays and the somewhat mundane styling (at least from pictures) of the TLX. Otherwise, I think I'm still cool with the car ... so far. Now if there're a ton of problems with it upon release, I'll be a bit more furious. lol. I know the day I let my 3G go, it'll be a sad day. And that day is drawing closer.

Goosew

iTrader: (1)

Damn,

That's the wheel-gap with the 19's?

Otherwise, it's quite a handsome looking car. (just needs a drop)>

randomRon82

I'm not... And that wasn't my point. I'm simply displaying the current perception of many many folks regarding the brand's identity...

Anyway, I think this thread has gone to another level. Lol. Perhaps we should stick to posting new pics as it was intended. Many of us have expressed our concerns with Acura's future... And we've debated nonstop about what the company is doing wrong, what it's doing right... So on and so forth. I think it's only making many of us more frustrated. Let's just hope for the best? Anyone have any news or new pics? Lmao

MisterZDX

You should never let what others think influence your buying decision. I too was in a similar situation when I purchased my 2013 ZDX new. I kept hearing things like "If you're going to spend that much, you might as well get a BMW or Mercedes Benz!" But the ZDX is the car that I wanted and in spite of what others thought I still bought it. I could care less how people perceive Acura and if they consider it a true luxury brand or not. At the end of the day I know I have a truly reliable vehicle with an upscale interior (yes I do feel the ZDX has one of the nicest interiors I've seen) and as long as I'm happy with it that's all that matters.

randomRon82

See my response above.... that was one small piece of my statement that doesn't need to be focused on. Many of us rely on other's perceptions to some degree when making purchases... That's why they have things like reviews and ratings for products... And there's that thing called word of mouth and peer influence... It happens. You may not consider those sources when making a decision, but many do.

Ps.... Next to the rlx, the zdx does have a gorgeous interior. If only they had also made a proper coupe with that same interior and similar exterior styling it probably would have sold much much better.

weather

I hear ya .... I think I need to take an EX LAX then RELAX...

randomRon82

Lmao, the fact that I'm on day 14 of a 30 day water fast is not making matters any better. Haha

weather

^^ LMAO.....Good luck with that!! You are gonna get plugged solid man!

Rocket_man

Actually the sheet metal did not appear to change. What you were seeing in those pictures was in the lighting. Very bright lighting at angles that highlighted the curves. The bumper covers, side skirts, and mirrors changed.

I suspect this bolt on kit is to somehow pacify the complaints from the prototype, but gawd the rear bolt on looks awful.

ostrich

LOL randomRon about that "glued on" comment! LOL! Yes, they do look a bit of an after thought, don't they!? LOL

'Tis silly that with the perfect Prototype design, they have to come up with something different and much more undesirable.

Oh, I am still not feeling these 19" wheels still - OK, perhaps they do look better in person, but right now, they just don't compare to those 5 spoke design on the Prototype. BTW, don't you think that the Volvo 5 spoke wheels look very similar to those on the Prototype?! If Volvo could use those on a regular vehicle, why not the TLX!? Sigh....

These 19" wheels are way too busy and too "bling" for my taste. They look like they were surely designed in North America LOLOLOL

ostrich

Look at this Volvo XC60 and those wheels:

randomRon82

I know. Perhaps they're saving them for a Type S variant. Wouldn't that be an awesome surprise?

ostrich

Oh, I don't think that they should hold anything back now.... just give it the best that they can now, and then later on when the Type S is to be released (or I probably should say, "IF the Type S is to be released") then they should come up with something even better at that time.

But this is Acura. Always holding back for no clear reasons... LOL

Timmy18

randomRon82

^^ Lol goof.

keith7120

The more they add on to this car, the further they move away from the look of the prototype. The Accessory dept needs a make over. It seems to me they are trying to lose the sporty image the TL has been tagged with.

rockyfeller

iTrader: (6)

The bodykit is not to pacify any complaints. They would only pay attention to complaints from TLX customers who don't exist yet. Acura might be reading these posts just for kicks but it is obvious it has zero impact on their decisions or direction. They may have gauged reaction to their prototype but it was an exercise more to gauge sales. Not to know what changes to make because the production model was already set to go. If the prototype had been released a couple yrs ago that would have been a different story. That could have evolved according to public reception. Today the average consumer is hardly even paying attention of a TLX even coming out. Most people I know don't even know about it. Only commercials and seeing the car on the road gets people's attention.

So the bodykit was always in the plan regardless of reception. They always had a body kit for the TL/TSX. No surprise there, it's just to follow that tradition. That rear how it just covers the side is ridiculous. It is to draw your attention AWAY from the bottom rear. It doesn't wrap to the rear because there is nothing to showcase back there. (ummm exhaust tips?) Sporty car my ass. It shows how inept this "new team" is and how much they BS.

But because the car looks wimpy even with the bodykit doesn't mean that all is lost. It may signal that indeed a more aggressive variation is in the works. On the 2GTL/3GTL were people who wondered if they should splurge on a Type-S instead of the base TLs because of the considerable price differential and modest differences. If they were to release a Type-S of the TLX in the future there is PLENTY they have left a healthy gap that would help contrast itself away from these mundane looking models. I'm not keeping my fingers crossed though because that might make TOO much sense for Acura and they might actually get some serious sales.

rockyfeller

iTrader: (6)

We know the TLX is a good car regardless of styling, it is an Acura product. But should it be relegated to some lower tier perception? Could it do better?

Lexus had the best start in the "German copycat" business of the 90s. We all know they are still the best at it to this day. They are a textbook story of success in this business and the model others learn from. The original LS400 was an S-class copy to the tee. Acura's first Legend was a false start and looked like a rebadged Accord and nothing more. I think Infiniti had a WAY better start than Acura. The Q45 was a car that was clearly going after BMW but with a unique style. The public just didn't understand that belt buckle grille. It think it was the best decision ever to not try and copy that front end with the kidney grille. (The Diamante tried the hardest at this, but who remembers that car? lol.) If you ever drove a Q45 with that V8, you would know that it was the best of all those generation cars. It sold well but it was still under-rated and ahead of it's time. Sadly most buyers of that category weren't going to put down $50k for a car that looked so different and it wasn't receive as well as it should have been.

Acura's saving grace was that 2nd Gen Legend. Arguably one of the most well conceived cars ever and this is the model that everyone remembers and put the brand on the map. Meanwhile Infiniti was losing it's unique-Japanese edge and trying to bloat up it's cars to make them more Lexus-like. (2nd Gen Q45). What did Acura do? THE SAME THING??! (1st gen 3.2TL/RL) Why would they screw up a good thing while they had it? At least they all snapped out of it. But it was too late for the 3rd gen Q45. Somehow Acura was able to hang on with the RL. It's because they had a success story with the TL that Infiniti couldn't brag about. This should prove to them they don't have to copy Germans or Lexus but can be strong by creating their own niche.

So this misdirection here makes no sense today. BOTH these companies have proved they have immense engineering capabilities and the potential to turn out the best cars if they wanted to. This is what makes us frustrated with ANOTHER copycat model like the TLX. When Acura or Infiniti brag they can make a new breakthrough model, we believe it. We know because we have seen them do it historically. We laugh if Kia says it because they never had a Legend or a Q45. So they either struck on these golden cars of the past by sheer accident or this reveals major flaws in the upper management of these companies. I am going to stick to what I've been saying, that it is the latter indeed. And it is sad how many of us are going to end up going to the original German cars they were trying to copy in the first place. Because they are not confused. They never changed their game and stayed true to their formula. They may still not be as reliable but they are trying to get better. They have gotten more serious over the last 10yrs and upped their game. What they have out there nowadays is on the next level. That new S-class is untouchable. So if these guys want to catch up they have to get serious.

jiggaman

^^^^^ Acura lost me to the Germans. if they had only come out with a competitive vehicle sooner they could have had me.

I gave them 10 freaking years to pull that off. I had a 04 TSX and bough it new. all i've wanted them to do is come out with a sporty awd mid-sized vehicle. i've grown tired of waiting and will circle back and see how people are liking their TLXs when my new car comes off lease...