alphason'sac

Seems absolutely plausible to me. It has been speculated that the next Gen TL will have the SH-AWD system. We have seen statements from Honda say that they intend on sharing the AWD system with other Acura models. It is on the TOV website as well. We have all seen this and It has been pretty heavily debated and discussed ad nauseum. Honda will have to do this in order to competitively market the TL against its rivals, IMHO. That was a pretty decent look back to see how the HONDA/ACURA models stacked up HP wise over the years, and I think that you have made a pretty accurate Hypothesis given the history..

However, I do see a limit to the increase in HP , especially the Honda Accord. I would hate to see the SH-AWD get shared on the Mainstream platforms, but without that the Accord has hit it's HP peak with this iteration IMO. Maybe they could engineer some lesser form of the AWD system for Honda during the Generation after this next one. I am sure that we won't see that until we see an AWD Toyota Camry.

Oh, and you are a math nerd.

mrdeeno

the rims don't look too bad in the bottom picture

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

Yeah like I said I dont know this for sure im just saying if they follow the same pattern this is what is possible. I mean when the 04 TL came out it had the HP in its class at the time. So if Acura changed the FWD setup I dont see why they couldnt be more then 300 HP.

Edward'TLS

I have two comments.
(1) TL + SH-AWD = much more expensive than current price = less attractive to buyers.
(2) TL + SH-AWD + 12.5% hp increase over Accord = much slower than the Accord due to extra weight, AWD traction and additional AWD gear loss.

The key is TL + RWD + (300hp+). This is the formula to success. You just can't dump 300hp+ to the FWD TL making the car undrivable in terms of handling performance.

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

Thats why im hoping just maybe they will go RWD but we will have to wait and see.

dom

One can only hope. But I suspect Acura has put all its eggs in the "SH-AWD" basket.

jwong77

Unless the accord somehow becomes RWD, there's little chance the TL will either.

phile

I think the TL can go RWD. Alls Honda has to do is bump the TSX into the old TL slot.

mrdeeno

The TL can definitely go RWD...and it should...

unfortunately Honda has such a low opinion of RWD that I doubt we'll see it for Acura's bread and butter sedan.

At least you can get a RWD lawnmower from honda.

biker

Ding, ding, ding - we have a winner.

When the Acura folks said they were going to differentiate from Honda offerings this is what they were talking about. Platform and some drivetrain sharing will still go on but SH-AWD will the differentiator.

biker

Yep, got one of those and that's probably the only RWD anything I'll ever see from Honda (cause I have no need for an S2000).

unlemming

Actually we're all forgetting the market that Honda leads, with nothing but RWD...biker of all people should know

biker

We're talking about 4 wheeled vehicles....but, yeah, I kinda forgot about the huge bike market Honda has.

Is the HondaJet RWD? How about their JetSki?

Edward'TLS

Maybe the newly opened North America design center will do something to REALLY differentiate the Acura products - RWD on their list !?

phile

At least for the TL. But if the TSX comes with a V6 and priced under 30K, I wouldn't mind FWD

v6cord2k5

iTrader: (1)

I thought he was talking about the s2k when he mentioned the lawnmower in his statement

fsttyms1

And a bad trans in those as well. Mine just died in my mower

alphason'sac

Too bad you can't do the manual 6 SP tranny swap on that as well, huh?

Or can you......

sonnyboyacura

I shouldn't have read this.

TSX69

Honda Dropping the Accord Hybrid

Honda will not launch a hybrid version of its next-generation Accord sedan when the revamped model goes on sale in the second half of the year. According to the Nihon Keizai Shimbun, Honda will instead promote a new range of petrol-electric hybrid versions of the new Civic and another subcompact model currently in development.

Under a new program, Honda’s midsize and large vehicles, including the next Accord, will feature a new clean-diesel powertrain that’s scheduled for introduction by 2009.

Last month, we reported that Honda was working on an affordable, high-volume model that would be hybrid only, as well as a new hybrid sports coupe for launch in 2009. The senior vice president of Honda Motor Europe, Ken Keir, told reporters from Automotive News that the entry-level hybrid will be a family-targeted model and be offered to worldwide markets for around $25,000.

In early May, Honda also announced that it would launch a hydrogen fuel-cell sedan next year to be based on its four-door FCX Concept car. It will be very interesting to see if Honda manages to live up to its bold claims, but we for one welcome the introduction of a cleaner lineup.

LuvMyTSX

That's ok. I'd rock the diesel instead. The hybrid wasn't even worth it...it barely got better gas mileage than the regular version and wasn't a very big seller.

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

When they say 09 do they mean its going to be on the 09 model or they are going to have it ready in the year 09

F23A4

Yes, that was pretty much what my sales person (who sold to me my AV6) told me. He indicated that the AV6H gets only about 2mpg (avg) more than the AV6.

chungkopi

phile

^ It simply amazes me how the people on VTEC can possibly see BMW from that pic. Alls I see is a steering wheel, what looks to be ringed gauges and what looks to be the upper part of a central stack that could end up looking like anything.

biker

The hype and upswing in hybrid sales has peaked. When even the Prius is being discounted you know the hype is over.

This Sunday's Wash Post had an article about a Bosch built diesel in a Chrysler 300 that got 41 MPG. Assuming a small premium for the diesel who in their right mind would ever choose a hybrid with numbers like that. The 09 Accord with the 2.2 iCDTi could get crazy millage like 50+MPG.

F23A4

That photo does show the design of the 8G Accord dashboard alluding to that of the BMW E90/92.

TSX69

I was hoping for a 4 cylinder version w/ the new generation but I guess diesel was the better way to go. In 2005, this sold OK but in 2006 when the MPG dropped for whatever reason, sales started to decline (probably due to other reasons as well) they went back up in 2007 but I guess it was not enough.

If Honda can pull this off even I would buy it:



A Diesel Honda? That Gets 62.8 MPG?
Feast your eyes on this, car technology and high-mileage nuts. It's a Honda Accord that runs on diesel.

Honda expects to bring the clean-diesel car to the U.S. by 2010. It gets 62.8 miles a gallon on the highway, but otherwise looks and feels like a regular Accord. At that mileage level, the car is about as "clean" as a new Toyota Prius. But if you run it on biodiesel, a form of diesel made from vegetable oil or animal fat, it would be even cleaner than a Prius (Priuses get 60 in the city).

The advantage of diesel cars, however, is that they pack a lot of power.
Honda diesel Accord(Credit: Courtesy Diesel Technology Forum)

The car was shown off with a number of other cars in Sacramento, Calif., earlier this month as a way to promote clean diesel cars and technology. In the '90s, California passed strict emission controls that restricted the amount of sulfur a car could emit. As a result, diesel manufacturers curbed sales to California and the U.S. in general.

Since then, petroleum manufacturers have devised cleaner diesels that only emit about 15 parts per million of diesel, down from hundreds of parts per million. That satisfies the California law. Manufacturers, meanwhile, have come out with more efficient and powerful diesel engines that get 20 to 40 percent better mileage than their older cars.

"A lot of changes have taken place in the engine, all thanks to electronics," said Allen Schaeffer, executive director of the Diesel Technology Forum, which helped organize the Clean Diesel Technology Tour. (Cars from Audi and a tractor trailer rig from Caterpillar were also shown). "Half the cars in Europe are diesel."

Thus, diesels, usually thought of as smelly, are now environmentally somewhat sound.

herbalist

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070605/japan_honda_hybrid.html

kwelity

I think in 5 years something about hybrids will be discovered that show they are actually more dangerous/expensive to the enviroment/consumer that will make all the people buying them deeply regret it............jmo

CLpower

I'll disagree Rumors will pop up about how they are dangerous, etc ( we already know they are expensive)...but these things have been in development a long time. The downsides are known.


BTW, hondas mistake was the high sticker price

kwelity

I just get this gut feeling like these are going to be that next product that everyone rushed and bought just to realize OH SHIT _________ (insert harmful consumer notice here)

CLpower

we'll be fine

biker

Not to the CA environmental Nazis - they'll find a way to outlaw even these clean cars.

AMGala

iTrader: (4)

Honda's other mistake was giving the hybrid an electric motor that only produces about 10 hp, making the fuel savings and performance increase not worth the higher price.

Moog-Type-S

a V6 hybrid was a poor choice for Honda.

TMQ

I agree, V6 hybrid is the wrong direction for an Accord. For the hybrid in Honda lineup, you want to boast fuel efficiency, not HP. That may be fine with Lexus LS, but not Accord. Honda still has senior managers making stupid business decisions; the whole hybrid part got fouled up. The insight was too small and impractical, and then adding hybrid to a civic lineup rather than a dedicated model, and then the v6 hybrid. IMO, Toyota has made all the right moves for Prius and the Lexus hybrids.

LuvMyTSX

If you're going to make a hybrid, you have to make it fuel efficient, that's the whole point . They defeated the purpose of the hybrid by not making it efficient enough, and made it worse by adding a bigger price tag for negligible fuel savings.

LuvMyTSX

Yup. And I think they could use a mid-size model hybrid, like the Camry (some people want/need more space than a Civic provides but still want the fuel economy), but they need to do it right so it actually gets better fuel economy. There was basically no point to the old Accord hybrid. Good idea, but poor execution.

Trackruner228

iTrader: (1)

Yeah I didnt like the old Accord hybird idea either but I think the diesel engine is going to be a strong seller if it gets good MPG. However the Civic hybird seems to be doing very well.