Acura: TLX News
07-30-2003, 05:26 PM
#1761
Originally posted by RJC RSX
Marketed as 270 right? Some "insiders" on TOV were saying it will be another underrated engine from honda and the actual power (dyno) is more like 280, I guess we'll find out eventually.
It's VTEC and not i-VTEC??
Marketed as 270 right? Some "insiders" on TOV were saying it will be another underrated engine from honda and the actual power (dyno) is more like 280, I guess we'll find out eventually.
It's VTEC and not i-VTEC??
I see what the problems are right now with the TL. Some of you are expecting way too much. Just like back in Feb. for the TSX. Give it time folks...they can't sell a low 30K car with E Class options. It can't be done. You want the toys?...spend the money. Finally, the 04TL is not here to compete against an E Class or a 5 Series. It may have the power and the size but that's not what a car is all about. The TL is for those that are looking for G35/I35, ES300s, 3 Series, CTS, Volvo S60s, etc...Let's not get ahead of ourselves and want more than what the TL can and will deliver.
07-30-2003, 05:26 PM
#1762
Cruisin'
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's exactly the point - why does the TL have to be sub 35K at all? It can be priced even at 40K to 45K fully loaded and I'm sure lots of people will still buy it, given the low cost of ownership of Honda vehicles and high reliability.
This will make the TL more exclusive, which helps its resale value (less supply) and can possibly reinforce the idea that Acura is a luxury brand that is at par with Lexus, BMW, etc.
This will make the TL more exclusive, which helps its resale value (less supply) and can possibly reinforce the idea that Acura is a luxury brand that is at par with Lexus, BMW, etc.
07-30-2003, 05:30 PM
#1763
Originally posted by 99TL
That's exactly the point - why does the TL have to be sub 35K at all? It can be priced even at 40K to 45K fully loaded and I'm sure lots of people will still buy it, given the low cost of ownership of Honda vehicles and high reliability.
That's exactly the point - why does the TL have to be sub 35K at all? It can be priced even at 40K to 45K fully loaded and I'm sure lots of people will still buy it, given the low cost of ownership of Honda vehicles and high reliability.
07-30-2003, 05:42 PM
#1764
Cruisin'
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So what you're saying is that people who want a luxury sport sedan should look elsewhere? In that case, how come people (including car magazines) keep saying that the TL competes with the 3 series BMW (or in some cases, the 5 series)? I don't believe the 3 series or the 5 series are really considered as near-luxury sedans. They are luxury (or luxury sport) sedans, period.
Maybe the TL should be compared to cars like the Nissan Maxima, since it can be loaded with near luxury features like the TL? But wait...isn't the Accord V6 the competitor for the Maxima?
That's basically what we're trying to say here - the TL and the Accord are just too similar, and Honda and Acura cars are too similar. The distance (in both equipment levels and price) between these two brands should be increased to differentiate these two brands.
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
Maybe the TL should be compared to cars like the Nissan Maxima, since it can be loaded with near luxury features like the TL? But wait...isn't the Accord V6 the competitor for the Maxima?
That's basically what we're trying to say here - the TL and the Accord are just too similar, and Honda and Acura cars are too similar. The distance (in both equipment levels and price) between these two brands should be increased to differentiate these two brands.
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
07-30-2003, 05:48 PM
#1765
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,000
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don't get me wrong, I'm happy with the hp figure, I was just curious whether you knew if honda was going to underrate the engine or not.
edit: And didn't Honda say all of their engines are going to by i-VTEC by 2005 or something?
edit: And didn't Honda say all of their engines are going to by i-VTEC by 2005 or something?
07-30-2003, 06:00 PM
#1767
Audi Driving Snob
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: San Diego
Posts: 2,694
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The i-vtec we are all thinking of is VTC. That's the vvt on the intake cam which is used to gain moderate torque throughout the entire band and flatten out torque curves. There is an issue here though as VTC requires a dohc setup. Can't be done with a single cam like the j3x have. Right now honda has two forms of I-vtec which can be confusing. That's where the second i-vtec setup comes in. If you look at the new inspire with it's "i-vtec" j30a4 you will see that it isn't actually a VTC setup at all. They are using a system of cylinder deactivation to save gas mileage and calling it "i-vtec." That form of i-vtec has no performance benefits. We'll have to be warry of what they call i-vtec from here on out.
07-30-2003, 06:00 PM
#1768
Originally posted by 99TL
So what you're saying is that people who want a luxury sport sedan should look elsewhere? In that case, how come people (including car magazines) keep saying that the TL competes with the 3 series BMW (or in some cases, the 5 series)? I don't believe the 3 series or the 5 series are really considered as near-luxury sedans. They are luxury (or luxury sport) sedans, period.
Maybe the TL should be compared to cars like the Nissan Maxima, since it can be loaded with near luxury features like the TL? But wait...isn't the Accord V6 the competitor for the Maxima?
That's basically what we're trying to say here - the TL and the Accord are just too similar, and Honda and Acura cars are too similar. The distance (in both equipment levels and price) between these two brands should be increased to differentiate these two brands.
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
So what you're saying is that people who want a luxury sport sedan should look elsewhere? In that case, how come people (including car magazines) keep saying that the TL competes with the 3 series BMW (or in some cases, the 5 series)? I don't believe the 3 series or the 5 series are really considered as near-luxury sedans. They are luxury (or luxury sport) sedans, period.
Maybe the TL should be compared to cars like the Nissan Maxima, since it can be loaded with near luxury features like the TL? But wait...isn't the Accord V6 the competitor for the Maxima?
That's basically what we're trying to say here - the TL and the Accord are just too similar, and Honda and Acura cars are too similar. The distance (in both equipment levels and price) between these two brands should be increased to differentiate these two brands.
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
Is the ES300 a luxury car? Or just a near luxury car built by Lexus. Is the 325/330 a luxury car? Or just a near luxury car built by BMW. Is the Maxima a luxury car? Or just a car Nissan is trying to market as luxury.
What is really bothering you?
What does the 330, ES300, G35, I35, S60. CTS have that is so amazing that the TL do not have? Do Acura need a car to compete against an E Class, 5 Series, GS, S-Type...you bet we do. Is the current RL a thing of the past? Of course it is. Will the new RL play in the E Class segment? You bet it will.
07-30-2003, 06:05 PM
#1769
Cruisin'
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RJC: Please enlighten me (no sarcasm intended) and tell me what's Honda's motives?
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
07-30-2003, 06:07 PM
#1770
Originally posted by 99TL
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
Seriously, with the direction Acura is going, it's telling people that if you can't afford a real luxury brand, you can come and buy our products. This will eventually create the image that Acuras are simply luxury car wannabes - in other words, Acuras are just poor men's luxury cars.
Is this the image Acura wants to project? I surely hope not.
On a side note, isn't it funny how some of us b*tch and b*tch about how expensive the TSX is and how expensive the TL will most likely be and others think it should be more expensive so it can include every feature and option under the god given sun?! I mean, no one car appeals to everybody. The Acura has it's niche and it's right along Infiniti. Acura is not Lexus or BMW or Mercedes Benz, but that is okay! If you want one of those cars they are available. Variety is a good thing. And for what it's worth, this new TL appears to be quite different from the current Accord in style as well equipment/performance. Probably more so than any other car I can think of that share the same platform (A4/Passat, Camry/ES300).
07-30-2003, 06:22 PM
#1772
Originally posted by 99TL
RJC: Please enlighten me (no sarcasm intended) and tell me what's Honda's motives?
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
RJC: Please enlighten me (no sarcasm intended) and tell me what's Honda's motives?
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
So to answer your question...what do I have in my inventory to compete against a GS430 or similiar....my answer is simple...if you are in the market now then currently I have NOTHING.
07-30-2003, 06:40 PM
#1773
Suzuka Master
Love is in the air.
While we are all getting along, is there anyone here that would not pay $40k for the TL if it had AWD and all the other stuff we are seeking? I would.
This would force the RL into the $50k+ range and get it in the face of some other competition.
All IMO.
While we are all getting along, is there anyone here that would not pay $40k for the TL if it had AWD and all the other stuff we are seeking? I would.
This would force the RL into the $50k+ range and get it in the face of some other competition.
All IMO.
07-30-2003, 06:45 PM
#1774
Suzuka Master
Originally posted by justinjsw
Why should anybody be disappointed?
We are talking about 270 not 170.
Why should anybody be disappointed?
We are talking about 270 not 170.
Regardless, I would be thrilled to drive a car with 270HP!
I think a 0-60 number at 6.0 or lower would create a lot more smiles.
Like most of us, I like to drive fast, but any opportunity to drive fast is not from 0-60 it is on the highway from 60-130 and I think that has less to do with horsepower than the engine itself.
Justin, thanks for the information.
Like someone mentioned, your data is like a drug and we want more, more, more, more, every time you give us a small, new piece of data.
07-30-2003, 06:51 PM
#1775
Advanced
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
justinjsw: I didn't know you were an Acura dealer. No one is making fun of Acura or its products. We are concerned about Acura's direction. We loved the Legend and some people still do. Now it's gone. That's Acura's mistake. But you're right, it's time to move on.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
07-30-2003, 06:56 PM
#1776
Originally posted by EmuMessenger
Who doesn't want more?
Regardless, I would be thrilled to drive a car with 270HP!
I think a 0-60 number at 6.0 or lower would create a lot more smiles.
Like most of us, I like to drive fast, but any opportunity to drive fast is not from 0-60 it is on the highway from 60-130 and I think that has less to do with horsepower than the engine itself.
Justin, thanks for the information.
Like someone mentioned, your data is like a drug and we want more, more, more, more, every time you give us a small, new piece of data.
Who doesn't want more?
Regardless, I would be thrilled to drive a car with 270HP!
I think a 0-60 number at 6.0 or lower would create a lot more smiles.
Like most of us, I like to drive fast, but any opportunity to drive fast is not from 0-60 it is on the highway from 60-130 and I think that has less to do with horsepower than the engine itself.
Justin, thanks for the information.
Like someone mentioned, your data is like a drug and we want more, more, more, more, every time you give us a small, new piece of data.
07-30-2003, 07:00 PM
#1777
Originally posted by Gebbeth
justinjsw: I didn't know you were an Acura dealer. No one is making fun of Acura or its products. We are concerned about Acura's direction. We loved the Legend and some people still do. Now it's gone. That's Acura's mistake. But you're right, it's time to move on.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
justinjsw: I didn't know you were an Acura dealer. No one is making fun of Acura or its products. We are concerned about Acura's direction. We loved the Legend and some people still do. Now it's gone. That's Acura's mistake. But you're right, it's time to move on.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
07-30-2003, 07:09 PM
#1778
Cruisin'
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
EmuMessenger:
Yes, I would pay US$40K or even $45K for the TL if it had AWD and all the options we wished for. Afterall, if the TL is equipped that way, it will be a worthy competitor to the I6 BMW 5 series and Lexus GS300. At $45K, the TL would be a bargain compared to the 5 series and the GS - this is still consistent with Honda's philosophy of creating cars with very good values.
Yes, Gebbeth is right - none of us is making fun of Acura, we are very concerned about Acura's direction, since we're all Honda fans!
I sincerely hope that the brand that we loved so much will actually become the #1 Japanese luxury car brand some day, and that's why I would like to see the TL to really move upscale and compete with real luxury sports sedans like the Lexus GS300 or the I6 BMW 5 series.
Yes, I would pay US$40K or even $45K for the TL if it had AWD and all the options we wished for. Afterall, if the TL is equipped that way, it will be a worthy competitor to the I6 BMW 5 series and Lexus GS300. At $45K, the TL would be a bargain compared to the 5 series and the GS - this is still consistent with Honda's philosophy of creating cars with very good values.
Yes, Gebbeth is right - none of us is making fun of Acura, we are very concerned about Acura's direction, since we're all Honda fans!
I sincerely hope that the brand that we loved so much will actually become the #1 Japanese luxury car brand some day, and that's why I would like to see the TL to really move upscale and compete with real luxury sports sedans like the Lexus GS300 or the I6 BMW 5 series.
07-30-2003, 07:42 PM
#1779
Suzuka Master
Thank you. I am not sure of you are referring to me, but I could care less about post count.
Not withstanding, I appreciate the data you have provided and I look forward to receiving more.
Lastly, I certainly do not want you in hot water.
Thanks again for your candid posts.
Not withstanding, I appreciate the data you have provided and I look forward to receiving more.
Lastly, I certainly do not want you in hot water.
Thanks again for your candid posts.
07-30-2003, 08:23 PM
#1781
Instructor
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
acuras models
heres a new view on things what if acura was to bring out a new sedan in the 60k area?? this would keep everything in its place. this new sedan is what acura is missing if BMW didn't have the 7 series, MB without S class, Lexus without LS430, and audi without A8, they would all be in the same position as acura is in right now
rsx/tsx- entry lower level coupe and sedan (325, A41.8T,C230,IS300)
TL/CL(if it lives on)- upper entry level/ lower mid-level sedan and coupe(330, 525, A4 3.0, A6 2.7, C320, E320, ES/GS300)
RL- mid level luxury(540, E500, A6 4.2, GS430)
new sedan (_L)-upper level luxury-( 7 series, A8, S class, LS430)
the new sedan will fill the missing link in acuras line up to be able to compete with BMW, MB, lexus, Audi. the IMA system would benefit acura greatly. new high end luxury sedan and IMA in their line up will bring acura its presitge.
rsx/tsx- entry lower level coupe and sedan (325, A41.8T,C230,IS300)
TL/CL(if it lives on)- upper entry level/ lower mid-level sedan and coupe(330, 525, A4 3.0, A6 2.7, C320, E320, ES/GS300)
RL- mid level luxury(540, E500, A6 4.2, GS430)
new sedan (_L)-upper level luxury-( 7 series, A8, S class, LS430)
the new sedan will fill the missing link in acuras line up to be able to compete with BMW, MB, lexus, Audi. the IMA system would benefit acura greatly. new high end luxury sedan and IMA in their line up will bring acura its presitge.
07-30-2003, 08:29 PM
#1782
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,000
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just made a new observation that I don't think has been mentioned yet. The center mount tail light is on the ceiling as opposed to the rear dash on the current model.
07-30-2003, 08:47 PM
#1783
Originally posted by EmuMessenger
Thank you. I am not sure of you are referring to me, but I could care less about post count.
Not withstanding, I appreciate the data you have provided and I look forward to receiving more.
Lastly, I certainly do not want you in hot water.
Thanks again for your candid posts.
Thank you. I am not sure of you are referring to me, but I could care less about post count.
Not withstanding, I appreciate the data you have provided and I look forward to receiving more.
Lastly, I certainly do not want you in hot water.
Thanks again for your candid posts.
07-30-2003, 09:30 PM
#1786
Moderator Alumnus
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Raleigh, NC
Age: 51
Posts: 4,858
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by justinjsw
This is official...the 04TL will have 270HP. Confirmed.
04MDX will have 265HP. Confirmed.
This is official...the 04TL will have 270HP. Confirmed.
04MDX will have 265HP. Confirmed.
07-30-2003, 10:44 PM
#1787
Originally posted by 99TL
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).]
Honda was the first Japanese automaker to introduce the concept of Japanese luxury cars back in 88 (or 87) with the G1 Integra and G1 Legend. Lexus followed a few years later with the LS400 and the ES250. The ES250 was too similar to the Camry back then (and it's somewhat underpowered), that's why it was dropped and replaced by the ES300 (still similar to Camry, but a lot more luxurious and powerful).]
Originally posted by 99TL
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
Now, if you ask anyone what's the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, I'm sure Lexus will come to anyone's mind first.
Originally posted by 99TL
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
So, how come Lexus is now the #1 Japanese luxury car brand, not Acura? Afterall, Acura was the first brand, and usually first-to-market brands have an advantage. Was Acura too proud of itself back then and didn't see Lexus as a threat, and therefore Lexus was able to overtake Acura?
Now will you just stop.
07-30-2003, 11:05 PM
#1788
Originally posted by Gebbeth
justinjsw: I didn't know you were an Acura dealer. No one is making fun of Acura or its products. We are concerned about Acura's direction. We loved the Legend and some people still do. Now it's gone. That's Acura's mistake. But you're right, it's time to move on.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
justinjsw: I didn't know you were an Acura dealer. No one is making fun of Acura or its products. We are concerned about Acura's direction. We loved the Legend and some people still do. Now it's gone. That's Acura's mistake. But you're right, it's time to move on.
For all the other Acura dealers on this board, the new TL will be a wonderful car and you will sell a ton of them. It's not personal.
07-30-2003, 11:21 PM
#1789
Race Director
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 11,001
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I dont know if anyone mentioned this feature before, but when the 2003 Accord was first coming out and I heard about the Navi and MP3 CD Player, I coulda swore that the Screen would show the names of the songs from ID3 Tags, but I heard its just a POS Mp3 CD Player and u Just have to memorize 150 Tracks and names!!
I thought it would be cool if I could use my finger on the navi and touch the name of any song I want to play..
But I guess this didn't happen, I wish a feature like that would be in the 2004 TL, But I doubt it!
I thought it would be cool if I could use my finger on the navi and touch the name of any song I want to play..
But I guess this didn't happen, I wish a feature like that would be in the 2004 TL, But I doubt it!
07-30-2003, 11:24 PM
#1790
Intermediate
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Diego
Age: 64
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am disapointed with the 270hp. Only 10 more than the Type-S. However the 6speed will help performance. The rest depends on how the car is geared and how much it weighs.
The TL needs to at least match the G35's performance. The "G" is less expensive and is rear wheel drive. I've been waiting for the new TL to come out. Before deciding on which one to buy.
Then there's the CTS-V with the Z06 powertrain. (400hp) If they can keep that at around 45k. That will be a sweet ride also.
The TL needs to at least match the G35's performance. The "G" is less expensive and is rear wheel drive. I've been waiting for the new TL to come out. Before deciding on which one to buy.
Then there's the CTS-V with the Z06 powertrain. (400hp) If they can keep that at around 45k. That will be a sweet ride also.
07-30-2003, 11:31 PM
#1791
Advanced
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by provench
That is respectable ... should be good for a sub 6 sec 0-60 in the 6MT
That is respectable ... should be good for a sub 6 sec 0-60 in the 6MT
Though I saw 5.9sec for CL-S 6M (but AFAIK that number was achieved with clutch drop at pretty high RPM) but CL-S is lighter and has better Cx drag ( '04 TL also seems to have slick profile but I do not think Cx will be any batter than now - as I can see all nice stuff was published and made available for mass media already).
I'm kinda disappointed here - G35 260hp sedan _automatic_ goes 0-60 in plain 6.2secs (manufacturer data) and some magazines managed to get very close- to-6 numbers, for manual it rather low 5 and for G35 coupe with 280hp 0-60 is 5.5sec - check www.car-stats.com for example.
G35 base right now sold at 27K http://www.carsdirect.com/build/opti...&restore=false , I hate Infinity interior but perfomance-wise seems like TL wan't be a competitor here
07-30-2003, 11:35 PM
#1792
Advanced
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by ViperLuke
I am disapointed with the 270hp. Only 10 more than the Type-S. However the 6speed will help performance. The rest depends on how the car is geared and how much it weighs.
The TL needs to at least match the G35's performance. The "G" is less expensive and is rear wheel drive. I've been waiting for the new TL to come out. Before deciding on which one to buy.
Then there's the CTS-V with the Z06 powertrain. (400hp) If they can keep that at around 45k. That will be a sweet ride also.
I am disapointed with the 270hp. Only 10 more than the Type-S. However the 6speed will help performance. The rest depends on how the car is geared and how much it weighs.
The TL needs to at least match the G35's performance. The "G" is less expensive and is rear wheel drive. I've been waiting for the new TL to come out. Before deciding on which one to buy.
Then there's the CTS-V with the Z06 powertrain. (400hp) If they can keep that at around 45k. That will be a sweet ride also.
Acura pushing it's own clients straight to Infinity dealerships :'(
07-30-2003, 11:47 PM
#1793
Cruisin'
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree with d-rock - introducing an ultra luxury model would solve Acura's problem too (instead of making the existing models more upscale).
One thing I don't understand is: why is everybody asking me to shut up? Isn't what a message forum like this is for - to express your own opinions? I believe I'm entitled to my own opinions and I posted them on this forum so that we (Honda fans) can discuss them. Apparently my comments are not welcomed on this message board.
Maybe you guys are young and don't like to listen to criticism, especially constructive criticism.
Am I really that annoying? This is one thing that really bothers me - I wouldn't want to stereotype, but it seems to me that people on Acura/Honda forums get very defensive (and take things personally) whenever people made a negative comment about Honda/Acura. I frequent the BMW, MB and Lexus message boards too, and I don't see people get defensive so easily when people make negative comments about their brands.
I honestly thought my comments would get us Honda fans to start thinking about whether Honda/Acura is really creating products that will truly satisfy us. Apparently, the Honda/Acura name is all that is required to satisfy some of you people.
Anyway, I will stop making any negative comments about the Honda/Acura brands from now on. I hope this will make all of you happy.
One thing I don't understand is: why is everybody asking me to shut up? Isn't what a message forum like this is for - to express your own opinions? I believe I'm entitled to my own opinions and I posted them on this forum so that we (Honda fans) can discuss them. Apparently my comments are not welcomed on this message board.
Maybe you guys are young and don't like to listen to criticism, especially constructive criticism.
Am I really that annoying? This is one thing that really bothers me - I wouldn't want to stereotype, but it seems to me that people on Acura/Honda forums get very defensive (and take things personally) whenever people made a negative comment about Honda/Acura. I frequent the BMW, MB and Lexus message boards too, and I don't see people get defensive so easily when people make negative comments about their brands.
I honestly thought my comments would get us Honda fans to start thinking about whether Honda/Acura is really creating products that will truly satisfy us. Apparently, the Honda/Acura name is all that is required to satisfy some of you people.
Anyway, I will stop making any negative comments about the Honda/Acura brands from now on. I hope this will make all of you happy.
07-30-2003, 11:56 PM
#1795
Advanced
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by 99TL
EmuMessenger:
Yes, I would pay US$40K or even $45K for the TL if it had AWD and all the options we wished for. Afterall, if the TL is equipped that way, it will be a worthy competitor to the I6 BMW 5 series and Lexus GS300. At $45K, the TL would be a bargain compared to the 5 series and the GS - this is still consistent with Honda's philosophy of creating cars with very good values.
Yes, Gebbeth is right - none of us is making fun of Acura, we are very concerned about Acura's direction, since we're all Honda fans!
I sincerely hope that the brand that we loved so much will actually become the #1 Japanese luxury car brand some day, and that's why I would like to see the TL to really move upscale and compete with real luxury sports sedans like the Lexus GS300 or the I6 BMW 5 series.
EmuMessenger:
Yes, I would pay US$40K or even $45K for the TL if it had AWD and all the options we wished for. Afterall, if the TL is equipped that way, it will be a worthy competitor to the I6 BMW 5 series and Lexus GS300. At $45K, the TL would be a bargain compared to the 5 series and the GS - this is still consistent with Honda's philosophy of creating cars with very good values.
Yes, Gebbeth is right - none of us is making fun of Acura, we are very concerned about Acura's direction, since we're all Honda fans!
I sincerely hope that the brand that we loved so much will actually become the #1 Japanese luxury car brand some day, and that's why I would like to see the TL to really move upscale and compete with real luxury sports sedans like the Lexus GS300 or the I6 BMW 5 series.
Try then 2004 Volvo S60 R M 4dr Sedan for 37K
http://www.carsdirect.com/build/opti...&restore=false
300hp/300ftlb + true AWD mated with 6M and highly advanced suspension
and it has about the same size as current TL
http://www.carsdirect.com/researchce...,USB30ACC021B0
07-31-2003, 12:04 AM
#1796
has been here awhile
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Charlotte, NC
Age: 38
Posts: 1,612
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by Alex
Hmmm 40K????
Try then 2004 Volvo S60 R M 4dr Sedan for 37K
http://www.carsdirect.com/build/opti...&restore=false
300hp/300ftlb + true AWD mated with 6M and highly advanced suspension
and it has about the same size as current TL
http://www.carsdirect.com/researchce...,USB30ACC021B0
Hmmm 40K????
Try then 2004 Volvo S60 R M 4dr Sedan for 37K
http://www.carsdirect.com/build/opti...&restore=false
300hp/300ftlb + true AWD mated with 6M and highly advanced suspension
and it has about the same size as current TL
http://www.carsdirect.com/researchce...,USB30ACC021B0
If European luxury cars didn't have reliability issues, a lot of people wouldn't be purchasing Japanese luxury cars.
Don't get me wrong...Acura and Lexus make great cars. I think I'll end on that note.SPUDMTN
07-31-2003, 12:05 AM
#1797
Drifting
Originally posted by 99TL
I agree with d-rock - introducing an ultra luxury model would solve Acura's problem too (instead of making the existing models more upscale).
I agree with d-rock - introducing an ultra luxury model would solve Acura's problem too (instead of making the existing models more upscale).
07-31-2003, 12:18 AM
#1800
Advanced
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by SPUDMTN
Only problem w/ the Volvo is that it's a European car--and we all know that European cars have reliability issues.
If European luxury cars didn't have reliability issues, a lot of people wouldn't be purchasing Japanese luxury cars. Don't get me wrong...Acura and Lexus make great cars. I think I'll end on that note.
SPUDMTN
Only problem w/ the Volvo is that it's a European car--and we all know that European cars have reliability issues.
If European luxury cars didn't have reliability issues, a lot of people wouldn't be purchasing Japanese luxury cars.
Don't get me wrong...Acura and Lexus make great cars. I think I'll end on that note.SPUDMTN
But since extended b-t-b 100K miles / 7 years warranty for S Volvo is only 2K I would not give it high priority.
Unless you are _really_ can not stand anything but fine quality and rattle-free ride
Mind you that TL recently had bunch of tranny problems and also has some other quality issues as well