Poor sales?
03-24-2021, 12:53 AM
#521
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that would be the dumbest move Acura ever allowed to happen. Only a fool pays above MSRP for a depreciating asset like this.From what I hear, CT4-V and CT5-V Blackwings are going for $10k+ mark-up, which is kind of low seeing as a) GM dealers are crooks and b) they announced only 250 of each, which is spectacularly low. Though, it could be worse. I'm hearing mark-ups of $30k-50k for the RS6 Avant. I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that the TLX Type-S gets some hefty mark-ups as well for the first batch of them. Nature of the beast.
Personally, I'd never pay MSRP for a car, let alone a mark-up.
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03-24-2021, 01:18 AM
#522
03-24-2021, 06:42 AM
#523
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I couldn't agree more, but Acura has little control over what their independent dealers do as far as pricing is concerned. If Acura announces they will only produce "X" amount of TLX Type-S's for the first year of production, I wouldn't be surprised if dealers asked over MSRP for them. Who knows though.
From what I hear, CT4-V and CT5-V Blackwings are going for $10k+ mark-up, which is kind of low seeing as a) GM dealers are crooks and b) they announced only 250 of each, which is spectacularly low. Though, it could be worse. I'm hearing mark-ups of $30k-50k for the RS6 Avant. I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that the TLX Type-S gets some hefty mark-ups as well for the first batch of them. Nature of the beast.
Personally, I'd never pay MSRP for a car, let alone a mark-up.
From what I hear, CT4-V and CT5-V Blackwings are going for $10k+ mark-up, which is kind of low seeing as a) GM dealers are crooks and b) they announced only 250 of each, which is spectacularly low. Though, it could be worse. I'm hearing mark-ups of $30k-50k for the RS6 Avant. I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that the TLX Type-S gets some hefty mark-ups as well for the first batch of them. Nature of the beast.
Personally, I'd never pay MSRP for a car, let alone a mark-up.
Also think any car at or above MSRP is crazy to buy.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 03-24-2021 at 06:45 AM.
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03-24-2021, 10:26 AM
#525
No one ever operated a dealership under "goodwill." It's all about the cheese!
03-24-2021, 11:14 AM
#526
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I love my dealership. Everyone is super nice and I never felt they are overcharging me. Last year, we got for my sis in law an A-SPEC RDX and the dealer did their best to give us some goodies. But i know overall, dealers aren't honest. I am not painting everyone with the same brush as i said there are some great dealers and sales peoples.
03-24-2021, 12:34 PM
#527
Burning Brakes
"The 2021 Type S will start arriving at Acura dealers in June, with a price somewhere around $60,000,"
03-24-2021, 12:41 PM
#528
https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases...year-of-type-s
03-24-2021, 11:00 PM
#529
6G TLX-S
That's for Canadians. Expected US price is low $50's and late May debut.
https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases...year-of-type-s
https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases...year-of-type-s
03-25-2021, 11:07 AM
#530
People do pretty insane things just to be the first....paying above MSRP is one of them. Unless is a truly exotic, instant classic car (and even then I'm not so sure) I would never ever do it. I always bought my car under invoice, even cars that initially carried a second sticker.
03-25-2021, 11:17 AM
#531
I couldn't agree more, but Acura has little control over what their independent dealers do as far as pricing is concerned. If Acura announces they will only produce "X" amount of TLX Type-S's for the first year of production, I wouldn't be surprised if dealers asked over MSRP for them. Who knows though.
From what I hear, CT4-V and CT5-V Blackwings are going for $10k+ mark-up, which is kind of low seeing as a) GM dealers are crooks and b) they announced only 250 of each, which is spectacularly low. Though, it could be worse. I'm hearing mark-ups of $30k-50k for the RS6 Avant. I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that the TLX Type-S gets some hefty mark-ups as well for the first batch of them. Nature of the beast.
Personally, I'd never pay MSRP for a car, let alone a mark-up.
From what I hear, CT4-V and CT5-V Blackwings are going for $10k+ mark-up, which is kind of low seeing as a) GM dealers are crooks and b) they announced only 250 of each, which is spectacularly low. Though, it could be worse. I'm hearing mark-ups of $30k-50k for the RS6 Avant. I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that the TLX Type-S gets some hefty mark-ups as well for the first batch of them. Nature of the beast.
Personally, I'd never pay MSRP for a car, let alone a mark-up.
It is true that the RS6 currently carries heavy second sticker, one of the reasons I did not consider one for my wife's ride and we went the Trackhawk route...some dealers still tried to sell Trackhawks at above MSRP (a little more than 500 were made for MY 2020) but the novelty is no longer there and eventually, with time and patience, I bagged one at significantly under invoice.
I do not think dealers will be able to slap a second sticker to the Type S for long.
Interestingly enough, it can happen that some instant classics sell at discount, a good example is the current Camaro ZL1....you can get one at under invoice, I would not say easily but with not too much effort and that is a car that will depreciate little initially and it has very good chances to gain value significantly in the long run...another similar instant classic like the Mustang GT500, instead, still carries heavy second stickers at dealers.
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leomio85 (03-26-2021)
03-25-2021, 11:27 AM
#532
AZ Community Team
I am sure you never saw me driving one 
3G MDX is already quite capable for its size at high speed, with high performance tires of course. As long as you accept the suspension is soft (but well damped) and the huge tendency to understeer without trailbraking, you can take advantage of the weight transfer to dive into corners, then use SH-AWD and the smooth V6 torque to get out in textbook style of SH-AWD.
I am fine with these ads personally, because at least Acura did improve 4G MDX handling significantly. This is better than IS500, where you are supposed to show a good sports sedan, but the chassis dynamics completely falls apart.
3G MDX is already quite capable for its size at high speed, with high performance tires of course. As long as you accept the suspension is soft (but well damped) and the huge tendency to understeer without trailbraking, you can take advantage of the weight transfer to dive into corners, then use SH-AWD and the smooth V6 torque to get out in textbook style of SH-AWD.I am fine with these ads personally, because at least Acura did improve 4G MDX handling significantly. This is better than IS500, where you are supposed to show a good sports sedan, but the chassis dynamics completely falls apart.
love to know where that mythical place is where unicorn soccer moms drive their MDX's in the left lane at the speed limit or less. Neverland? 
Where I live, seems like everyone is going +5 to +20MPH on highways no matter what their vehicles are (MDX, F150, Corolla, GLK, Sienna, Explorer, ...)
Traffic deaths were up in 2020 despite less traffic, lotta accidents all over.
Last edited by Legend2TL; 03-25-2021 at 11:30 AM.
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03-25-2021, 01:08 PM
#533
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love to know where that mythical place is where unicorn soccer moms drive their MDX's in the left lane at the speed limit or less. Neverland? Where I live, seems like everyone is going +5 to +20MPH on highways no matter what their vehicles are (MDX, F150, Corolla, GLK, Sienna, Explorer, ...)
Traffic deaths were up in 2020 despite less traffic, lotta accidents all over.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 03-25-2021 at 01:10 PM.
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03-25-2021, 05:52 PM
#534
Senior Moderator
love to know where that mythical place is where unicorn soccer moms drive their MDX's in the left lane at the speed limit or less. Neverland? Where I live, seems like everyone is going +5 to +20MPH on highways no matter what their vehicles are (MDX, F150, Corolla, GLK, Sienna, Explorer, ...)
Traffic deaths were up in 2020 despite less traffic, lotta accidents all over.
03-26-2021, 11:19 AM
#535
AZ Community Team
Yeah speeds are up. In our eastern regions (empty space) on the interstates posted at 70MPH +15 is pretty much immune to tickets & the normal speed in the outside lane. Also WAZE helps. Interesting to me note, I would swap the unicorn soccer mom's MDX with the Tesla any model which are more frequently seen in the curb lane at the posted limit or less. Wonder in real life how fast the batteries drain in a high speed long distance run with A/C cooling the car in the Carolina sun?
Last summer in the middle of the pandemic, I never saw any speed traps on I95 in Maryland. Helluva lot of drivers exploring triple digit speeds mostly at night on I95 and other highways.
03-26-2021, 01:02 PM
#536
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BTW one other set of cars I would add to the slow curb lane runners are Hellcats & Demons. Out east toward the coast gas stations are pretty scarce in some sections. Have to wonder what kind of mileage the big engines Dodge's get. Think I have a good performance fuel usage package with near 80MPH average door to door with almost 31MPG to the coast & back. Can do it on a single 13.5 gallon tank if I have too. Run is pretty flat no real hills.
03-26-2021, 06:15 PM
#537
User Awaiting Email Confirmation
The Vs will end up selling at under invoice, give it enough time....same thing happened with my CTS-V...initially they carried crazy second sticker, eventually people got crazy deals and I'm one of them.
It is true that the RS6 currently carries heavy second sticker, one of the reasons I did not consider one for my wife's ride and we went the Trackhawk route...some dealers still tried to sell Trackhawks at above MSRP (a little more than 500 were made for MY 2020) but the novelty is no longer there and eventually, with time and patience, I bagged one at significantly under invoice.
I do not think dealers will be able to slap a second sticker to the Type S for long.
Interestingly enough, it can happen that some instant classics sell at discount, a good example is the current Camaro ZL1....you can get one at under invoice, I would not say easily but with not too much effort and that is a car that will depreciate little initially and it has very good chances to gain value significantly in the long run...another similar instant classic like the Mustang GT500, instead, still carries heavy second stickers at dealers.
It is true that the RS6 currently carries heavy second sticker, one of the reasons I did not consider one for my wife's ride and we went the Trackhawk route...some dealers still tried to sell Trackhawks at above MSRP (a little more than 500 were made for MY 2020) but the novelty is no longer there and eventually, with time and patience, I bagged one at significantly under invoice.
I do not think dealers will be able to slap a second sticker to the Type S for long.
Interestingly enough, it can happen that some instant classics sell at discount, a good example is the current Camaro ZL1....you can get one at under invoice, I would not say easily but with not too much effort and that is a car that will depreciate little initially and it has very good chances to gain value significantly in the long run...another similar instant classic like the Mustang GT500, instead, still carries heavy second stickers at dealers.
As much as I love hi-po RWD American muscle, something more practical I can use every day, all year round is pretty enticing too. I wish they’d do an AWD Charger Hellcat. That would be absurdly good. Same with GM and their Blackwings, but Chrysler already basically has the platform with their Trackhawk/Durango HC.
03-26-2021, 10:55 PM
#538
If you don’t mind me asking, how much did you get down on your TrackHawk? I’m seeing some supposed deals people got a couple years ago that seem too good to be true. Like, $20k+ under sticker.
As much as I love hi-po RWD American muscle, something more practical I can use every day, all year round is pretty enticing too. I wish they’d do an AWD Charger Hellcat. That would be absurdly good. Same with GM and their Blackwings, but Chrysler already basically has the platform with their Trackhawk/Durango HC.
As much as I love hi-po RWD American muscle, something more practical I can use every day, all year round is pretty enticing too. I wish they’d do an AWD Charger Hellcat. That would be absurdly good. Same with GM and their Blackwings, but Chrysler already basically has the platform with their Trackhawk/Durango HC.
I gave up several times, many had significant second stickers and at best I was able to get few grand off MSRP..and with the COVID things actually got worse, dealers were holding on inventory.
Finally last July I got a tip on the Trackhawk forum about a dealer in New Jersey (I live in Seattle) willing to deal so after a bit of back and forth I got it exactly where I wanted (a black MY 2020)....considering that any flying locations for vacations were off we decided to fly there and drive back, our vacation for the year...it was a blast!! I'm so glad I did it.
Car is a beast...freakingly fast (it would probably beat my CTS-V to 60) very nice interior (if you get one, find one with the full leather interior package, it's worth every penny) and very well built, surprising for a FCA product but even my old Grand Cherokee SRT (I sold it privately, it was my wife previous ride) did hold incredibly well.....one big difference from Acura, the paint thickness, so much better not even a comparison.
Paying our respects to the Gods of speed at the Bonneville Salt Flats with our Trackhawk (no I did not drive it on salt! LOL)
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03-27-2021, 06:40 AM
#539
Senior Moderator
The Vs will end up selling at under invoice, give it enough time....same thing happened with my CTS-V...initially they carried crazy second sticker, eventually people got crazy deals and I'm one of them.
It is true that the RS6 currently carries heavy second sticker, one of the reasons I did not consider one for my wife's ride and we went the Trackhawk route...some dealers still tried to sell Trackhawks at above MSRP (a little more than 500 were made for MY 2020) but the novelty is no longer there and eventually, with time and patience, I bagged one at significantly under invoice.
I do not think dealers will be able to slap a second sticker to the Type S for long.
Interestingly enough, it can happen that some instant classics sell at discount, a good example is the current Camaro ZL1....you can get one at under invoice, I would not say easily but with not too much effort and that is a car that will depreciate little initially and it has very good chances to gain value significantly in the long run...another similar instant classic like the Mustang GT500, instead, still carries heavy second stickers at dealers.
It is true that the RS6 currently carries heavy second sticker, one of the reasons I did not consider one for my wife's ride and we went the Trackhawk route...some dealers still tried to sell Trackhawks at above MSRP (a little more than 500 were made for MY 2020) but the novelty is no longer there and eventually, with time and patience, I bagged one at significantly under invoice.
I do not think dealers will be able to slap a second sticker to the Type S for long.
Interestingly enough, it can happen that some instant classics sell at discount, a good example is the current Camaro ZL1....you can get one at under invoice, I would not say easily but with not too much effort and that is a car that will depreciate little initially and it has very good chances to gain value significantly in the long run...another similar instant classic like the Mustang GT500, instead, still carries heavy second stickers at dealers.
I bought my "instant classic" manual CTS-V wagon just under invoice. No one wanted these despite all the fawning in the press over them at the time. That's why there are only 514 extant LOL. (Note: Last OBM manual CTS-V wagon sold on BAT above original MSRP. Now even I'm thinking--weakly--about BATting mine
)
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04-01-2021, 04:35 PM
#541
User Awaiting Email Confirmation
04-01-2021, 04:37 PM
#542
During March 2020, most of the nation was on lockdown or thinking about it.
04-01-2021, 05:47 PM
#543
Good to see that the incentive increase in mid-February had a real effect on sales. If this did not work then there would have been a real problem for Acura. The March total of 3,041 almost equaled the combined January/February total of 3,100 sales.
In addition to the positive reviews the car has received, more visibility on the road can only help going forward.
In addition to the positive reviews the car has received, more visibility on the road can only help going forward.
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Tony Pac (04-01-2021)
04-01-2021, 08:11 PM
#544
User Awaiting Email Confirmation
I saw two 2G TLXs. A black Advance and a white A-Spec. I want to like this car, but I just don’t. The only one I’ve liked so far was the blue A-Spec I saw. Hopefully the Type-S has enough design changes to change my mind (need to see it in person to make final judgment).
04-01-2021, 11:40 PM
#545
On my way into work tonight, I was on the highway and spotted an Audi with quad tips. Looked like an S6 so I sped up. Nope, 2021 S4 in dark grey with blacked out accents. I couldn’t stop looking at it. Gorgeous car.
I saw two 2G TLXs. A black Advance and a white A-Spec. I want to like this car, but I just don’t. The only one I’ve liked so far was the blue A-Spec I saw. Hopefully the Type-S has enough design changes to change my mind (need to see it in person to make final judgment).
I saw two 2G TLXs. A black Advance and a white A-Spec. I want to like this car, but I just don’t. The only one I’ve liked so far was the blue A-Spec I saw. Hopefully the Type-S has enough design changes to change my mind (need to see it in person to make final judgment).
04-02-2021, 01:25 AM
#546
User Awaiting Email Confirmation
I was a good distance away. From a close to moderate distance, I have no issues differentiating from any of the models. Further away, I think the A/S 6 honestly share more similarities in body lines to the 4 than the 3.
04-02-2021, 03:14 PM
#547
Senior Moderator
Looks like Honda did fairly well across most products. I noticed some very competetive March deals on the Accord 2.0T and CTR over at Princeton Honda (NJ); seriously considered swapping out my base 19 TLX for a 21 Accord Touring.
04-02-2021, 03:59 PM
#548
On my way home from the grocery store, I saw 4 (yes, four) 2021 TLX's. White, grey, and blue x2, all A-specs. I was thinking how wide they look wide in person... until I saw an Audi RS6 and Porsche Taycan moments later! Weird considering I've only seen 2 TLX's and 1 Taycan in the preceding few months.
04-02-2021, 04:41 PM
#549
Over the last two weeks, I have seen 4-8 TLXs every day.
Last edited by WTF.Acura; 04-02-2021 at 04:47 PM.
04-02-2021, 04:56 PM
#550
Where do you guy all live? It's crazy to me that I've yet to see a single 2G TLX in my area yet I see plenty of 1G TLXs.
04-02-2021, 05:34 PM
#551
User Awaiting Email Confirmation
Looking over the chart again, MDX sales are absolutely insane. Since 2005, no single month has even come close to what the MDX did in March '21. Now, obviously, I assume a good chunk of that is 3G MDX's on absolute fire sale. Most of the dealerships around me have plenty of stock of 4G MDXs and 3G MDX inventory has significantly decreased. It looks like some dealers moved nearly 100 MDXs in the last month or so each.
That's not to take anything away from the 4G MDX. I feel like I've seen almost as many of them driving around already as 2G TLXs.
I dunno what Honda did in March, but people went nuts for them last month.
That's not to take anything away from the 4G MDX. I feel like I've seen almost as many of them driving around already as 2G TLXs.
I dunno what Honda did in March, but people went nuts for them last month.
04-02-2021, 05:58 PM
#552
Looking over the chart again, MDX sales are absolutely insane. Since 2005, no single month has even come close to what the MDX did in March '21. Now, obviously, I assume a good chunk of that is 3G MDX's on absolute fire sale. Most of the dealerships around me have plenty of stock of 4G MDXs and 3G MDX inventory has significantly decreased. It looks like some dealers moved nearly 100 MDXs in the last month or so each.
That's not to take anything away from the 4G MDX. I feel like I've seen almost as many of them driving around already as 2G TLXs.
I dunno what Honda did in March, but people went nuts for them last month.
That's not to take anything away from the 4G MDX. I feel like I've seen almost as many of them driving around already as 2G TLXs.
I dunno what Honda did in March, but people went nuts for them last month.
Last edited by fiatlux; 04-02-2021 at 06:03 PM.
04-02-2021, 10:01 PM
#553
04-02-2021, 11:58 PM
#554
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I live in Montréal, and honestly until Feb I saw 3 New TLX. But in March, I saw pretty much one every day. I remember when 1st gen TLX came out, it was the same. First few months, I barely saw any and then started appearing in every corner. Montréal is a smaller market compared to Toronto, but still many many 1st gen. The second gen is starting to appear more and more. Wednesday I saw a black one on the service road. I won’t lie it looked amazing with those slim lights and wide hood.
04-03-2021, 07:09 AM
#555
Racer
I've seen zero 2nd Gen TLX in the Raleigh, NC area (other than my own), but then I haven't gotten out much due to the pandemic. I'm fully vaccinated now and getting out a bit more, but still haven't seen one out there yet.
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04-03-2021, 10:16 AM
#556
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Also the reason I didn’t see many 2nd gen is that Montréal was in lockdown for a while and overall, I am noticing new car sales are down in Canada compared to USA. I know someone who works for Audi and VW group told me that sales are slow for them.
04-03-2021, 10:33 AM
#557
Burning Brakes
I guess it depends on each dealership. Audi St. Laurent is having a great month. Showroom is empty and inventory is low. Unless it's BS, but my seller was pretty transparent so seems legit.
04-03-2021, 07:39 PM
#558
Senior Moderator
Im from Jersey but currently in the Fort Myers area and have seen a few 2G TLXs around here, Estero and Cape Coral. But in general, I see very few Acuras in this area. (In my travels, the dropoff in the number of observable newer Acuras is substantial once leaving the northeast.)
04-03-2021, 08:33 PM
#559
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Brand making the most impact in the area is Audi. Where it once was MB, BMW, Acura its now MB, BMW, Audi. The MB SUV's have been the most popular over the years but the BMW X line is doing well. Acura is still doing well with the MDX.
FORD, Chevy & Cadillac (chevy) are the leaders in the super sized SUV's with GMC (chevy) then Dodge trailing. The other brands don't really have competitive products even though some build large SUV's.
We have a Range Rover & Cayenne (daughters cars) in the the family but for what I use the Suburban for they are more like square sedans.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 04-03-2021 at 08:39 PM.
