2009 RL (press releases and pics pages 41-3)
#441
Safety Car
Ehh ...
What you are saying does makes sense but since the RL struggled in the mid-luxury class, I am not sure how successful it would be going up market. Maybe it's best to make a new name & start fresh?
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
#442
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Originally Posted by Mike_TX
Honda moves in small, calculated steps, and a production V-8 from them isn't realistically likely to exceed 325-330 hp. Corvette LS1-level horsepower just isn't in Honda's playbook ... they've never been about class-leading horsepower in their family vehicles.
On top of all that, you wouldn't have a V-8 competing with a V-6 of essentially the same hp anyway!
On top of all that, you wouldn't have a V-8 competing with a V-6 of essentially the same hp anyway!
Well when the 3rd Gen TL came out it was class-leading. So I don't think Honda is afraid to do it again. Whatever it is they decide to do
#443
AcurAdmirer
I'm repeating myself, I know, but most car companies aren't constantly trying to outdo the other guy. And Honda *certainly* isn't.
The kind of one-upmanship competition some of you guys are hoping for exists in Italy, between Ferrari and Lamborghini, or in Germany between M-B's AMG Division and BMW's M Division, but not down in the ranks of mass-production family cars like Accords and Camry's or Q45's and RL's. Sure, they try to be competitive, but not by sitting around in secret meetings talking about shoehorning 500hp engines into Civics or making RL's that will make BMW 7's blush. There just isn't enough money in mainstream cars to do that.
So, while we all might like to see big monster engines and every possible bell and whistle stuffed into the new RL, the accountants are busy counting beans and marking things off the list so they can make a buck.
Just sounding a note of reality here ...
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The kind of one-upmanship competition some of you guys are hoping for exists in Italy, between Ferrari and Lamborghini, or in Germany between M-B's AMG Division and BMW's M Division, but not down in the ranks of mass-production family cars like Accords and Camry's or Q45's and RL's. Sure, they try to be competitive, but not by sitting around in secret meetings talking about shoehorning 500hp engines into Civics or making RL's that will make BMW 7's blush. There just isn't enough money in mainstream cars to do that.
So, while we all might like to see big monster engines and every possible bell and whistle stuffed into the new RL, the accountants are busy counting beans and marking things off the list so they can make a buck.
Just sounding a note of reality here ...
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#444
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by U8INIT
Well when the 3rd Gen TL came out it was class-leading. So I don't think Honda is afraid to do it again. Whatever it is they decide to do
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#445
I would imagine that Acura might revamp the line and have it similar to BMW
Sub-TSX (Future?) = 1 series = ?
TSX = 3 Series = IS
TL = 5 Series = GS
RL = 7 Series = LS
The ES from Lexus is their upgraded Camry. They sell too many to discontinue. Lexus should invest more in the ES and scrap the GS which struggles compared to the E and 5 series.
I think the TL could get pretty close in driving dynamics with a 5 series IF Acura does the job right with the FMC. If it does go upstream and is affordable, the new TL could be an even higher volume car than it already is.
Sub-TSX (Future?) = 1 series = ?
TSX = 3 Series = IS
TL = 5 Series = GS
RL = 7 Series = LS
The ES from Lexus is their upgraded Camry. They sell too many to discontinue. Lexus should invest more in the ES and scrap the GS which struggles compared to the E and 5 series.
I think the TL could get pretty close in driving dynamics with a 5 series IF Acura does the job right with the FMC. If it does go upstream and is affordable, the new TL could be an even higher volume car than it already is.
Originally Posted by TSX69
What you are saying does makes sense but since the RL struggled in the mid-luxury class, I am not sure how successful it would be going up market. Maybe it's best to make a new name & start fresh?
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
#447
Originally Posted by TSX69
What you are saying does makes sense but since the RL struggled in the mid-luxury class, I am not sure how successful it would be going up market. Maybe it's best to make a new name & start fresh?
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
I always thought Acura should follow Lexus in terms of:
TSX = IS
TL = ES
RL = GS
{new model} = LS
Acura does very well in the entry level luxury department so having 2 vehicles there could help their #s. However, the TL has been so successful that moving it up a class might actually work.
#448
Senior Moderator
OK, since people are posting here about what they want in their RL....
Neuronbob's dream RL
Exterior:
Leave the overall shape alone other than to change the rear so that it flows better with the sides of the car.
Get rid of those dowdy base wheels. Forever. They don't even work in Japan. Give us some split spoke wheels (aka A-Spec) 17", with 18" and 19" as dealer-installed options.
Change the grille so it is more like JDM Honda. Looks cleaner! The new corporate grille on the MDX reminds me of a rhino.
Interior:
iPod text integration with navi
Sport pedals as dealer-installed option
XM or Sirius choice (won't happen, Honda is a partner in XM)
Ventilated AND heated seats, please. While it gets plenty cold here in Cleveland, it also gets plenty hot during the summer, too.
Reclining rear seats?
Drivetrain and suspension:
V6 with more low end torque, please! Max torque available at 5k rpm is not acceptable in a luxury car anymore. V8 as no holds barred option.
Leave SH-AWD alone unless the weight will be less
Must have a sport suspension as a marketed option (A-Spec please) for those who like to feel the road along with their luxury. Alternately, the adjustable suspension in the MDX others have mentioned here would be nice.
Is that too much to ask?
Please don't take me the wrong way, I love my RL. However, it seems we have a unique chance to influence the powers that be at Honda by what we write here.
Neuronbob's dream RL
Exterior:
Leave the overall shape alone other than to change the rear so that it flows better with the sides of the car.
Get rid of those dowdy base wheels. Forever. They don't even work in Japan. Give us some split spoke wheels (aka A-Spec) 17", with 18" and 19" as dealer-installed options.
Change the grille so it is more like JDM Honda. Looks cleaner! The new corporate grille on the MDX reminds me of a rhino.
Interior:
iPod text integration with navi
Sport pedals as dealer-installed option
XM or Sirius choice (won't happen, Honda is a partner in XM)
Ventilated AND heated seats, please. While it gets plenty cold here in Cleveland, it also gets plenty hot during the summer, too.
Reclining rear seats?
Drivetrain and suspension:
V6 with more low end torque, please! Max torque available at 5k rpm is not acceptable in a luxury car anymore. V8 as no holds barred option.
Leave SH-AWD alone unless the weight will be less
Must have a sport suspension as a marketed option (A-Spec please) for those who like to feel the road along with their luxury. Alternately, the adjustable suspension in the MDX others have mentioned here would be nice.
Is that too much to ask?
Please don't take me the wrong way, I love my RL. However, it seems we have a unique chance to influence the powers that be at Honda by what we write here.
#449
07 RL (non-tech)w/06 Nav
I agree with bob...i would also like to have more transmission speeds, a more uptodate navagation system...air tuned suspension (u set the ride)...better fuel economy while adding lots of torque....solar coated windshield...panaramic roof...add more speakers and wattage
#450
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by larrynimmo
I agree with bob...i would also like to have more transmission speeds, a more uptodate navagation system...air tuned suspension (u set the ride)...better fuel economy while adding lots of torque....solar coated windshield...panaramic roof...add more speakers and wattage
#451
Safety Car
MP3 Capability
As an anti Ipod user {I have like 10 different players} & the fact that Ipod is losing some ground in mp3 player sales {altho they still dominate the market} I think that the RL should have like a 40gb hard drive & a USB interface. That way people can install a memory stick or their flash mp3 players & just transfer it over like a computer ... no matter what player you use, you can still get your music into your RL.
I think that Nissan does something along these lines ...
Oh & also like a lot of new mp3 players, people can copy & paste their videos onto the harddrive & watch them on the screen ... which, mind you, should have the option of a touchscreen since VW is going to make all their cars w/ em.
I think that Nissan does something along these lines ...
Oh & also like a lot of new mp3 players, people can copy & paste their videos onto the harddrive & watch them on the screen ... which, mind you, should have the option of a touchscreen since VW is going to make all their cars w/ em.
#452
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by TSX69
As an anti Ipod user {I have like 10 different players} & the fact that Ipod is losing some ground in mp3 player sales {altho they still dominate the market} I think that the RL should have like a 40gb hard drive & a USB interface. That way people can install a memory stick or their flash mp3 players & just transfer it over like a computer ... no matter what player you use, you can still get your music into your RL.
I think that Nissan does something along these lines ...
Oh & also like a lot of new mp3 players, people can copy & paste their videos onto the harddrive & watch them on the screen ... which, mind you, should have the option of a touchscreen since VW is going to make all their cars w/ em.
I think that Nissan does something along these lines ...
Oh & also like a lot of new mp3 players, people can copy & paste their videos onto the harddrive & watch them on the screen ... which, mind you, should have the option of a touchscreen since VW is going to make all their cars w/ em.
In my opinion, acura is going to go with one of the two possible routes:
1. Have the TSX level with the 3 series, have the Tl level with the 5 series and KILL the RL off as Acura/Honda won't be taken seriously for 7 series Luxury.
2. Have the TSX compete with the 3 seriers 4 banger, have the TL compete with the 5 Series v6, and have the RL compete as the 7 series size with either a 5 series V6 or V8, a total 7 series would not be appliacable.
Going with the first option will keep honda's profits up and make the TSX and TL appeal to larger markets. If honda goes with the second, it will be easily be overtaken and land in the same boat again with in 3 years.
#454
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by ssim3
In the US there is no 4 banger 3 series anymore. So the TSX may be the same size, but does not compete with a rwd 6.
#455
Safety Car
TouchScreen
I never use my touchscreen on my TSX {mostly bc I am too lazy to clean it} but I do think that it should be an optoin - just for the sake of having options. In the luxury market especially, I think that having more options available will bring more customers - this way people who like using the knob and people who like using the touchscreen both will be pleased instead of looking elsewhere for the style that they prefer.
In order to save the RL, Acura should throw every trick in the book to make sure no one is turned away bc the RL lacks something that the competition has ... hard to do but it would be nice.
On a side note: the Lexus GS just had another recall to fix a leaking fuel pipe so maybe its declining reliability (Consumer Reports no longer recommends the AWD version) will help the RL sales -- these are exciting times coming for Acura ...
In order to save the RL, Acura should throw every trick in the book to make sure no one is turned away bc the RL lacks something that the competition has ... hard to do but it would be nice.
On a side note: the Lexus GS just had another recall to fix a leaking fuel pipe so maybe its declining reliability (Consumer Reports no longer recommends the AWD version) will help the RL sales -- these are exciting times coming for Acura ...
#456
Three Wheelin'
2009 RL - fyi...
I have been away from this site for a bit as some of you know my RL was wrecked back in October and I sitll havent gotten it back from the body shop. I have seen some discussion about the mid model change anticipated for the RL. I went looking for a replacement car today and one Acura dealer told me the '09 should start appearing at dealer lots by May - June. Its still on the same platform, doesnt have a V8, and will be mostly cosmetic changes to the exterior. he wasnt sure about the interior.
Happy New year to you all!
Happy New year to you all!
#457
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by 2007AcuraRL
I have been away from this site for a bit as some of you know my RL was wrecked back in October and I sitll havent gotten it back from the body shop. I have seen some discussion about the mid model change anticipated for the RL. I went looking for a replacement car today and one Acura dealer told me the '09 should start appearing at dealer lots by May - June. Its still on the same platform, doesnt have a V8, and will be mostly cosmetic changes to the exterior. he wasnt sure about the interior.
Happy New year to you all!
Happy New year to you all!
#458
AcurAdmirer
Hmmmm ... sounds like the MMC is getting more watered down as the rumors continue to roll in.
But the "mostly cosmetic changes to the exterior" comment doesn't jibe with everything else we've been hearing. Unless, of course, they free up interior room by going to thinner seatbacks or something. Still, that doesn't account for all the reports that the trunk will grow in size.
I suspect this dealer doesn't really know much about it.
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But the "mostly cosmetic changes to the exterior" comment doesn't jibe with everything else we've been hearing. Unless, of course, they free up interior room by going to thinner seatbacks or something. Still, that doesn't account for all the reports that the trunk will grow in size.
I suspect this dealer doesn't really know much about it.
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#459
The v-8 would need a new tranny, bigger engine compartment, etc, this is a BIG change, so I say probably will not happen.
The car will be larger most likely due to the fact that is the feedback sales gave to Acura, people wanted a larger car. I personally do not want a bigger car but plan on it.
The car will be larger most likely due to the fact that is the feedback sales gave to Acura, people wanted a larger car. I personally do not want a bigger car but plan on it.
#460
Safety Car
I cannot see them stuffing a V8 in there. The 3.7, yes. Six speed, I doubt it, mostly because we have not heard anything about a new tranny, although the RL may be the place to introduce it. More likely any 6 + speed will be in the new TL... We will have to wait and see.
#461
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
If they have developed a V8 for a consumer vehicle, it is well hidden...which Honda is very good at doing. There is a new Canadian engine plant opening in 2008, but all reports are for 4 cylinder engines only.
There is a lot going on in Saitama. The LEGEND / RL plant is retooling soon. There is a new plant for vehicle assembly being bult nearby in Yorii and will open in 2010, The LEGEND / RL plant is to be completely remodeled when the Yorii plant opens. Seems like good timing for a full model change to be introduced by the Yorii plant
Meanwhile a new engine plant nearby Saitama is due to open in 2009...again good timing for a new engine (V8 or V10?). And to sweeten the mix, a new tranny plant is to open late 2009. Which vehicles, engines and trannies are not specified other than 'domestic and global' vehicles. But the pieces seem to fit.
IMHO it all points to the next Gen LEGEND / RL appearing as a late 2010 / 2011 model.
In the mean time, I am anticipating tweaking to the current vehicle, perhaps a platform stretch, some sheetmetal cosmetics and likely the 3.7 V6 along with some content goodies. Likley not enough to make me wander from my RL.
There is just not enough time between February and a launch in late spring to produce anything requiring any significant engineering changes.
There is a lot going on in Saitama. The LEGEND / RL plant is retooling soon. There is a new plant for vehicle assembly being bult nearby in Yorii and will open in 2010, The LEGEND / RL plant is to be completely remodeled when the Yorii plant opens. Seems like good timing for a full model change to be introduced by the Yorii plant
Meanwhile a new engine plant nearby Saitama is due to open in 2009...again good timing for a new engine (V8 or V10?). And to sweeten the mix, a new tranny plant is to open late 2009. Which vehicles, engines and trannies are not specified other than 'domestic and global' vehicles. But the pieces seem to fit.
IMHO it all points to the next Gen LEGEND / RL appearing as a late 2010 / 2011 model.
In the mean time, I am anticipating tweaking to the current vehicle, perhaps a platform stretch, some sheetmetal cosmetics and likely the 3.7 V6 along with some content goodies. Likley not enough to make me wander from my RL.
There is just not enough time between February and a launch in late spring to produce anything requiring any significant engineering changes.
#462
Senior Moderator
We'll see if Acura has learned anything this summer, I guess. The timing is consistent with other rumors, but the feature set conflicts.
As far as the V8....as much as I'd love to see that in an RL or other Acura lux car, I think that with the new CAFE standard, that idea is done. Even though the mileage differential is minimal between V6 and well-tuned V8s, my guess is that Honda will merely try to do better with more efficient V6s or start bringing diesels over here faster to keep their title as"most fuel efficient fleet". I think that's more important to them than satisfying luxury customers.
PS: I plan to merge this with the bigger 2009/3G RL thread.
As far as the V8....as much as I'd love to see that in an RL or other Acura lux car, I think that with the new CAFE standard, that idea is done. Even though the mileage differential is minimal between V6 and well-tuned V8s, my guess is that Honda will merely try to do better with more efficient V6s or start bringing diesels over here faster to keep their title as"most fuel efficient fleet". I think that's more important to them than satisfying luxury customers.
PS: I plan to merge this with the bigger 2009/3G RL thread.
#463
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by neuronbob
We'll see if Acura has learned anything this summer, I guess. The timing is consistent with other rumors, but the feature set conflicts.
As far as the V8....as much as I'd love to see that in an RL or other Acura lux car, I think that with the new CAFE standard, that idea is done. Even though the mileage differential is minimal between V6 and well-tuned V8s, my guess is that Honda will merely try to do better with more efficient V6s or start bringing diesels over here faster to keep their title as"most fuel efficient fleet". I think that's more important to them than satisfying luxury customers.
PS: I plan to merge this with the bigger 2009/3G RL thread.
As far as the V8....as much as I'd love to see that in an RL or other Acura lux car, I think that with the new CAFE standard, that idea is done. Even though the mileage differential is minimal between V6 and well-tuned V8s, my guess is that Honda will merely try to do better with more efficient V6s or start bringing diesels over here faster to keep their title as"most fuel efficient fleet". I think that's more important to them than satisfying luxury customers.
PS: I plan to merge this with the bigger 2009/3G RL thread.
I also have a suspicion these new standards will be watered down some (as has happened more than once). After all, 35mpg for a mfr's entire fleet average isn't realistic, and that's especially true for the luxury carmakers like M-B, BMW and even Cadillac. Those guys don't have little dinky toy cars to offset their "real" cars' mileage.
In fact, I think this new standard would require some totally new technology in order to be achievable, and things like diesel, hybrid and even hydrogen and fuel cell aren't likely to cut it within that timeframe. Just my opinion.
But in any case, look for another 1970's-like wave of little, lightweight, low-powered cars to come onto the market, just like in the "gas crisis" days 35 years ago (you guys old enough to remember that? ). To be honest, that was a factor in my decision to trade to a nice V-8 now, while they're still in their heyday.
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#464
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
This was posted over on Edmunds...
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
#465
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
Hideous
Originally Posted by TampaRL
This was posted over on Edmunds...
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
#466
Someday, an RS6 Avant+
And concerning credibility of dealers: When I lived in Stuttagrt-Sindelfingen, I lived on a small dead end street with 7 Mercedes engineers, and an undercover Polizei (cop). Anyway, my neighbors upstairs talk to me a bit. 2 difererent guys (2 apartments).
Anyway, one guy was a test driver and upper executive who got to try out new toys all the time (the AMG's would occasionally show up, and they were sweet). That was fun.
The other guy was the one of the lead/head design guys for a "new series of Benz", and even he would not tell me exactly he was working on. This was in 2002/2003, so he described the car in a lot of detail, with the US market in mind, but would not divulge the series letter (the R class is what it was). I only found out when he brought one home for some test runs on autobahn 81 and 8 (both very close to our place).
I digress from the RL thread but it's to prove a point. My point is any "dealer" that says they have inside information is full of it.
Anyway, one guy was a test driver and upper executive who got to try out new toys all the time (the AMG's would occasionally show up, and they were sweet). That was fun.
The other guy was the one of the lead/head design guys for a "new series of Benz", and even he would not tell me exactly he was working on. This was in 2002/2003, so he described the car in a lot of detail, with the US market in mind, but would not divulge the series letter (the R class is what it was). I only found out when he brought one home for some test runs on autobahn 81 and 8 (both very close to our place).
I digress from the RL thread but it's to prove a point. My point is any "dealer" that says they have inside information is full of it.
#467
Originally Posted by TampaRL
This was posted over on Edmunds...
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
I have no idea how credible it is, but looks plausible for a freshening.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/b...ars%202/03.jpg
#468
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by geronimomoe
Saw that earlier today. Looks like a copy of the new C-Class back end... Not too sure what to think of it..
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#469
Senior Moderator
I am praying that is someone's photoshop version of their dream RL. All I can say is...that's FUGLY. The current rear is 1000% better.
#470
Race Director
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Originally Posted by neuronbob
I am praying that is someone's photoshop version of their dream RL. All I can say is...that's FUGLY. The current rear is 1000% better.
If you think about almost everything in this thread is a rumor so who knows hopefully Acura will impress.
#471
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
But the license plate appears to say "Legend".
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About the engines.
I don't know how in the USA, but in Europe a 295 hp engine looks very powerful for a car like the Legend.
In Europe the 70% of the market is concentrated on the diesel engines.
The 295 hp of the Legend is one of the most powerful and the car recieved always good reviews from the press.
The Audi A6 3.2 V6 has 255 hp. but we prefer in Europe the 3.0 TDI with 233 hp.
The BMW 5 is selling almost the 530d with 235 hp, or the 525xi with 218 hp or the 523 with 177 hp.
The Mercedes is selling very well the E series with engines ike the 320 CDI (224 hp.) and the 220 CDI or 200 Compressor (184 hp).
The next year Honda will get new diesel engines for Europe, not only for the Honda Accord, but for the CR-V and for the Legend too.
#472
You sure like using the word buddy. :P
Originally Posted by Rexorg
My good buddy at my Acura dealership confirmed the 3rd gen RL will indeed have a V8 (330-340 HP?) and finally be a full-size luxury car. Also, the new TL will really be a stunner when it comes out. He said the TL will borrow a lot from the new Accord as far as styling and be really fast (under 6.0 seconds), but probably with the addition of a modified SH-AWD system to handle all the torque of a new engine.
My buddy told me at his dealership the MDX and TL Type-S are really hot and that the RL is holding its own. However, the RDX is not doing too well since size matters and must buyers want the added room of the MDX.
My buddy told me at his dealership the MDX and TL Type-S are really hot and that the RL is holding its own. However, the RDX is not doing too well since size matters and must buyers want the added room of the MDX.
#473
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by Trackruner228
Well I think it probably is. I mean do you really think Acura would give out a spy shot like that and to emunds of all people? That end kind of looks like an accord so I really think its probably not the new legend.
If you think about almost everything in this thread is a rumor so who knows hopefully Acura will impress.
If you think about almost everything in this thread is a rumor so who knows hopefully Acura will impress.
I'm sure if someone dug hard enough they'd find it's a stock photo of something else from the past with a little cut and paste magic going on.
#474
Safety Car
Accord
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
But the license plate appears to say "Legend".
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#476
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by TSX69
I see the world Accord but it so small that it really could be either.
Enlarge it any more and it just gets more pixelated and harder to read. But back away from your monitor and squint, and it looks like "Legend".
Sure, it's probably not legit - why would Acura leak a tiny picture of part of the car to a photobucket accountholder? Duh.
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#478
Go Big Blue!
Born and raised 12 miles outside Manhattan, NY. I use "buddy" all the time. But then again, I've been living in Florida for 15 years. I could be turning into a southerner
#480
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by acitydweller
You sure like using the word buddy. :P
Back on topic:
I happened to look at the Imagebucket accountholder's other pix. He's got lots of spy pix on there. Was this purposely leaked to get a (free) test market response? Is it a Photoshop (most likely)? Who knows. We'll find out soon enough.
I am digging the quad exhausts, but there are too many severe and straight lines on that trunk. It doesn't go with the gently curved lines on the rest of the car.