NFL: 2010 Season Discussion Thread
10-05-2010, 12:21 PM
#521
Banned
if your franchise goes down in a blunder b/c of one player getting removed... you should blame the recruiters/coaches and owner...
but that goes back to most people being sheep and hating/liking who they are told to..
kind of how our stadium boos jordan jefferson for sucking so bad when its les mile's fault he starts...
i was mad about his actions when they occurred several years ago. he has done more than enough to make up for his actions, and also served the time he was given.
does that make him a good person? no.. has he paid for his actions... yes..
whether you agree or not is your decision, im just here to share my opinion.
but that goes back to most people being sheep and hating/liking who they are told to..
kind of how our stadium boos jordan jefferson for sucking so bad when its les mile's fault he starts...
i was mad about his actions when they occurred several years ago. he has done more than enough to make up for his actions, and also served the time he was given.
does that make him a good person? no.. has he paid for his actions... yes..
whether you agree or not is your decision, im just here to share my opinion.
Saints (Brees)
Colts (Manning)
Arizona Cardinals (Warner)
Steelers (Polamalu)
Oregon Ducks (Dixon)
Bengals (Palmer)
Lions (Sanders)
...coaches would like to have a word.
10-05-2010, 12:25 PM
#523
Banned
Yeah, that's just what was on the top of my head. Especially in the QB position, most teams would shit bricks if their starter would be out for an extended period of time.
Fortunately, the Black and Gold seemed to have dodged the bullet with a 3-1 record.
Fortunately, the Black and Gold seemed to have dodged the bullet with a 3-1 record.
10-05-2010, 12:27 PM
#524
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
if brees left, and we sucked (which we would)
i would in fact be pissed at the organization for not having a suitable "decent" backup..
relying on one guy to carry the burden of winning for years on top of years isnt the smartest thing you can do.
and eventually, it will happen to some of those current teams you listed...
ps. i never said there weren't teams that wouldn't go under if they lost their star..
and detroit sucked, even with sanders
78-82
i would in fact be pissed at the organization for not having a suitable "decent" backup..
relying on one guy to carry the burden of winning for years on top of years isnt the smartest thing you can do.
and eventually, it will happen to some of those current teams you listed...
ps. i never said there weren't teams that wouldn't go under if they lost their star..
and detroit sucked, even with sanders
78-82
Last edited by Rockstar21; 10-05-2010 at 12:32 PM.
10-05-2010, 12:32 PM
#526
None of the coaches/recruiters/owner knew about Vick's personal issues. If they did, do you honestly think they'd approve of his actions?
And not everyone can have a backup QB that can win games on his own. If Charlie Batch were starting for some other team with a subpar defense, I don't think that team would win. Plus, if the backup QB were THAT good, he'd probably want to start, or be traded. And if he really is that good, and your starter isn't injury prone, wouldn't you want to trade him for a draft pick to possibly make your team that much better, instead of letting him rot on the bench?
Hey, not everyone can have Steve Young as a backup
And not everyone can have a backup QB that can win games on his own. If Charlie Batch were starting for some other team with a subpar defense, I don't think that team would win. Plus, if the backup QB were THAT good, he'd probably want to start, or be traded. And if he really is that good, and your starter isn't injury prone, wouldn't you want to trade him for a draft pick to possibly make your team that much better, instead of letting him rot on the bench?
Hey, not everyone can have Steve Young as a backup
10-05-2010, 12:35 PM
#527
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
not all team's stars are their quarterbacks...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
10-05-2010, 12:39 PM
#528
not all team's stars are their quarterbacks...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
Just checking...
10-05-2010, 12:42 PM
#529
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
not sure what you're asking..
it has nothing to do with playing backups..
is about the fact that people would be pissed at manning for the colts sucking if he retires or gets traded.. what are you talking about?
it has nothing to do with playing backups..
is about the fact that people would be pissed at manning for the colts sucking if he retires or gets traded.. what are you talking about?
10-05-2010, 12:50 PM
#530
How can you blame the coaches if Manning retires? If he's secretly organizing cat fighting rings, and ends up going to prison on federal charges, and the coaches knew nothing about it.... how can you blame them? How would they know?
10-05-2010, 12:52 PM
#531
Banned
not all team's stars are their quarterbacks...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
some teams have zero quality quarterbacks...
the reason you dont normally see a good QB tandem is b/c you have to build your offense around your starter...
RB's WR's can easily be subbed in and out without messing with a teams strategy...
Now, answer the question - what franchise would be in great shape if their QB disappeared 10 days before the season starts?
10-05-2010, 12:58 PM
#532
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
I'm not asking anything. I'm saying you're not making sense, in that not all teams are equipped to handle losing their starting QB. I just used the fact that the Colts lost games when they rested their starters, despite their years of proven success, supporting my point that you can't blame the coaches IF your starter is removed by some random, hidden deep down secret.
that is a coaching/recruiting issue.. not completely the fault of a single player.
How can you blame the coaches if Manning retires? If he's secretly organizing cat fighting rings, and ends up going to prison on federal charges, and the coaches knew nothing about it.... how can you blame them? How would they know?
im saying if manning retires "early" or gets traded.. and the colts lose 10 games next season.. is it mannings fault? no... granted you cant have another manning on deck.. but if your team doesnt have enough talent (both players and coaches) to win games without one person.. then yes, you blame administrators also...
CAR
ARI
DET
CLE
there's a few others that might benefit from the loss as well :wink:
Last edited by Rockstar21; 10-05-2010 at 01:02 PM.
10-05-2010, 01:07 PM
#533
we are not talking about subbing players to save the starters for the playoffs.. the discussion is about a team losing many more games the following season after one star player has left (for whatever reason)
that is a coaching/recruiting issue.. not completely the fault of a single player.
you're avoiding the point completely
im saying if manning retires "early" or gets traded.. and the colts lose 10 games next season.. is it mannings fault? no... granted you cant have another manning on deck.. but if your team doesnt have enough talent (both players and coaches) to win games without one person.. then yes, you blame administrators also...
that is a coaching/recruiting issue.. not completely the fault of a single player.
you're avoiding the point completely
im saying if manning retires "early" or gets traded.. and the colts lose 10 games next season.. is it mannings fault? no... granted you cant have another manning on deck.. but if your team doesnt have enough talent (both players and coaches) to win games without one person.. then yes, you blame administrators also...
What I was trying to put forth is a hypothetical situation. OF COURSE it wouldn't be Manning's fault if he were traded.... that's not what I'm trying to say.
You're trying to make it sound like Vick shouldn't be blamed for the Falcons fall from grace after 2006, it should be on the coaches and the organization.... at least that's what I was getting from your posts, and its what I'm getting at. And what I'm getting at is if Vick had changed his ways before then without going to jail, the Falcons might have been in a better position today and even back then.
10-05-2010, 01:11 PM
#534
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
You're trying to make it sound like Vick shouldn't be blamed for the Falcons fall from grace after 2006, it should be on the coaches and the organization.... at least that's what I was getting from your posts, and its what I'm getting at. And what I'm getting at is if Vick had changed his ways before then without going to jail, the Falcons might have been in a better position today and even back then.
but losing for consecutive seasons involves alot more people.. and im sure if the falcons dont make the playoffs this year, there are still people who are willing to just blame vick
10-05-2010, 01:18 PM
#535
he was part of the reason that they lost more games immediately following his arrest b/c of his absence, true.
but losing for consecutive seasons involves alot more people.. and im sure if the falcons dont make the playoffs this year, there are still people who are willing to just blame vick
but losing for consecutive seasons involves alot more people.. and im sure if the falcons dont make the playoffs this year, there are still people who are willing to just blame vick
The Falcons seemed to bounce back quickly though.
10-05-2010, 01:27 PM
#537
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
he was part of the reason that they lost more games immediately following his arrest b/c of his absence, true.
but losing for consecutive seasons involves alot more people.. and im sure if the falcons dont make the playoffs this year, there are still people who are willing to just blame vick
but losing for consecutive seasons involves alot more people.. and im sure if the falcons dont make the playoffs this year, there are still people who are willing to just blame vick
He only fessed up when he had no choice.
Here's Peter King's article on Vick and his impact to the Atlanta franchise: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...mqb/index.html
10-05-2010, 01:32 PM
#538
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
seems so..your asking questions that benefit your case.. and im giving answers that benefit mine.
GG
i never disputed any of this.
what part of history would him telling the truth change in the falcons franchise? since we are focusing on the fact that he lied so adamantly....
he still would have left the falcons to drown, been convicted, served time.. etc.
GG
Dude...Vick's case was what tanked the Falcon's 2006 season. Certainly, I agree with everyone that he has put in his time...However, that does not change the fact that he flat-out LIED to an owner that truly believed in him and spent alot on him, the commissioner, and EVERYONE who asked him about his involvement in the dog-ring...
He only fessed up when he had no choice.
He only fessed up when he had no choice.
what part of history would him telling the truth change in the falcons franchise? since we are focusing on the fact that he lied so adamantly....
he still would have left the falcons to drown, been convicted, served time.. etc.
Last edited by Rockstar21; 10-05-2010 at 01:37 PM.
10-05-2010, 01:35 PM
#540
Banned
Tell the truth to the commissioner - reduce your suspension.
Tell the truth to the feds - possibly don't go to jail.
This is fun.
10-05-2010, 01:36 PM
#541
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
The amount invested in him by the team, his endorsements, the NFL crest...they all require him to be accountable. He is supposed to be a role-model. That's why he gets paid more than you and I will ever in our lifetimes 100000X over...
10-05-2010, 01:36 PM
#542
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
From 2007 in a dialogue between CNN and the Commish:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...30/mmqb/1.html
SI.com: I want to be on the record. Has Michael ever, at any point, said to you he's been involved in dogfighting?
Goodell: No ... His comments to me were very consistent with what he said publicly: That he does not have any involvement in dogfighting, that he loves dogs, that he would not have any interest in that, that it wasn't happening at his property, and that was his discussion ... And I was very clear with him that if it's happening on your property, it's your responsibility.
Goodell: No ... His comments to me were very consistent with what he said publicly: That he does not have any involvement in dogfighting, that he loves dogs, that he would not have any interest in that, that it wasn't happening at his property, and that was his discussion ... And I was very clear with him that if it's happening on your property, it's your responsibility.
10-05-2010, 01:40 PM
#543
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
the suspension wasnt mandatory, but you cant play football in jail.. suspension was coming from one place or another.
he was going to jail, lie or not. maybe less time, but still going.
agreed.
and yum... im aware that he lied... what are you trying to get across?
and i wouldnt say jailtime, fines, bankruptcy, your reputation is exactly, "a free pass"
and what does his dog fighting have to do with me? im against dog fighting as much as the next guy... but did it affect my life? not in the least.
Last edited by Rockstar21; 10-05-2010 at 01:43 PM.
10-05-2010, 01:44 PM
#544
Banned
trust wouldnt matter with the owner. he wont be playing for him in the future anyways, with or without trust.
the suspension wasnt mandatory, but you cant play football in jail.. suspension was coming from one place or another.
he was going to jail, lie or not. maybe less time, but still going.
agreed.
the suspension wasnt mandatory, but you cant play football in jail.. suspension was coming from one place or another.
he was going to jail, lie or not. maybe less time, but still going.
agreed.
10-05-2010, 01:45 PM
#545
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
trust wouldnt matter with the owner. he wont be playing for him in the future anyways, with or without trust.
the suspension wasnt mandatory, but you cant play football in jail.. suspension was coming from one place or another.
he was going to jail, lie or not. maybe less time, but still going.
agreed.
and yum... im aware that he lied... what are you trying to get across?
and i wouldnt say jailtime, fines, bankruptcy, your reputation is exactly, "a free pass"
and what does his dog fighting have to do with me? im against dog fighting as much as the next guy... but did it affect my life? not in the least.
the suspension wasnt mandatory, but you cant play football in jail.. suspension was coming from one place or another.
he was going to jail, lie or not. maybe less time, but still going.
agreed.
and yum... im aware that he lied... what are you trying to get across?
and i wouldnt say jailtime, fines, bankruptcy, your reputation is exactly, "a free pass"
and what does his dog fighting have to do with me? im against dog fighting as much as the next guy... but did it affect my life? not in the least.
And certainly, while his actions in the dog-fighting did not impact you per se, it has for alot of others who once looked up to him...
10-05-2010, 01:49 PM
#546
Niner Faithful
I don't believe we'll make it back to the playoffs unless we get rid of the crap of a QB Alex Smith.....
10-05-2010, 01:57 PM
#549
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
he damn sure wouldnt have been out of football if he hadnt done so..
the dogs were 99% of the straws that broke the camel's back.
i figured you could have realized that, most people do.
the dogs were 99% of the straws that broke the camel's back.
i figured you could have realized that, most people do.
10-05-2010, 02:04 PM
#551
The Dumb One
iTrader: (1)
you could say that.. but im guessing the only reason he plays football at all is b/c of his rehabilitation process... if he doesnt serve jailtime.. people hate him more, and longer... and i dont think any team resigns him...
10-05-2010, 02:06 PM
#552
Banned
He would have gone through that anyway - Blank would have seen to it. Restitution, working with PETA, etc. He could have gone to jail and still stayed with the team.
Blank loved Vick.
Blank loved Vick.
10-05-2010, 02:11 PM
#554
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
So, anyone got a team that can lend its O-line to Chicago...?
10-05-2010, 02:18 PM
#557
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Maybe the Bears can sign some players from the CFL...cuz, the ones they have would not make a varsity squad.
10-05-2010, 03:11 PM
#560
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
