Moog-Type-S

On a serious note, my guess it's transmission software issues.

Whiskers

So I shouldnt get one huh.

qingcong

Someone on ToV who claims to work closely with the Acura team says it's a problem with the production facility, not the actual car design. It has to do with the part where they mate the transmission with the SH-AWD.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

Cool.

ttribe

Story.

oonowindoo

Bro

oonowindoo

That is not the point. When you release a car or any new product into the market, everything including facility coordination and logistics should have been sorted out LONG before the official unveil date.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

stuff happens. lots of manufacturers have delayed releases in the past, even...*wait for it*...bmw has delayed releases before.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

Yumcha

Mebbe the delay is to test out what better-tires will do for performance as they take on that Koenigsegg One:1 in a drag race?


You'll be floored and shocked by the results.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

:getsomenewmaterialbro:

oonowindoo

Yes you can delay cars that is NOT your bread and butter (NSX), when was 3 or 5 series ever delayed?

You keep on bring up BMW, you think we won't talk shit about BMW for its whoring? then go the BMW thread.
The fact that you think Acura can do no wrong = you are a brainwashed fanboy.
You said Acura is not Tier 1 and does not compete with BMW, yet you kept bring BMW comparisons. Pick 1 and stick with it.

You are on the losing side of pretty much every debate in this thread, so just stop.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

like I said, stuff happens...it's not the end of the world or a reason not to buy a tlx.

I never said acura can do no wrong. on the contrary, a few of you in the 'cool story bro' club seem to think acura can do no right, what does that say about you? :rhetoricalquestion:

bmw is a convenient example bc they've been highlighted as what acura should be benchmarking, not by me.

thus saith oonowindoo.

oonowindoo

Let me re-quote myself for the 2nd time, to prove you are talking out of your ass.

And no one even mentioned anything BMW's release date until you brought it up. not by you?

Keep rolling your eyes, maybe you can see better when they are in the back of your head.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

again, bmw has been used as a benchmark for acura in this thread many times, not just by me. so, I've merely carried on with that and again used bmw as a benchmark.

keep trying to silence dissent, it says volumes about your ability to have an open minded discussion.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

Yes that was in response to the 20-100mph comment back then. Sorry I was away on vacation during the Easter holiday...may be that's why you don't remember what we were discussing about.

Of course of course, most consumers don't look at 0-60mph 5-60mph etc when making their car buying decisions. Most of them also don't care about 20-100mph since that's way above speed limit anyway.

This whole topic got brought up when Legend2TL brought up the peak hp figures of various cars in the TLX segment (page 208). oonowindoo then countered that by saying its low end torque that matters when it comes to real world performance. He concluded by saying FI engines are thus better in terms of real world efficiency and performance. He went on and said that the TLX 2.4 DCT might accelerate as fast as a A4 in 0-60mph, but for 20-100mph acceleration, it won't be close, and that the TLX will feel slower in every day driving.

In response to that, I said that from a roll, NA powered cars tend to be more responsive than turbocharged cars. Most car magazines show 5-60mph numbers as that takes the launch control, traction, etc away from the equation. That gives you REAL WORLD number as to how a car would do. I then posted numbers from various A4's and other cars to illustrate this point. Whether it's 5-60mph, 20-60mph, 40-80mph, you don't have the chance to build up the boost.

This is not about 0-60mph or 0 to whatever. This is about the difference between 0-60mph and 5-60mph. This is about how much slower a car is without brake torquing, building up boost, revving the engine to 5000rpm before dumping the clutch etc. 0-60mph uses the above techniques. 5-60mph does NOT use those techniques, and thus is a much more realistic indication as to how fast a car is IN THE REAL WORLD.

ttribe

A number of companies have been mentioned as benchmarks for Acura, not just BMW. I suspect your continued referenced to BMW has more to do with a desire to try to elicit an emotional response from several posters in this thread who are former Acura owners, but current BMW owners. It's a rather juvenile tactic, but I suspect (borrowing a phrase from a wise board member who shall remain nameless) that you would argue with yourself if you could. In other words, I'm not sure how much you actually believe in your arguments, but I'm quite sure you get some kind of thrill out of positing them.

Yumcha

Ah yes. This would explain why the successor of the NSX has been delayed since the Stone Age.

Yumcha

I dunno...if he decided to talk about MINI or Infiniti, it wouldn't bother me one spit.

To be fair, BMW is more or less the benchmark for luxury cars these days. Mercedes-Benz, Audi and Lexus do have nice stuff but most comparisons of cars in OUR stratosphere seem to easily go against the 3er and 5er.

It's kinda been that flavor for years, IMO. I would not make that assumption of skd2k1...

ttribe

Yes, well, "mentioning" is one thing..."harping" is another.

Yumcha

Fair enough. I think it's just perception since I'm not an owner and so, maybe you perceive it that way.




Still, can we seriously all agree that using BMW to benchmark Acura is a boat that has left the port awhile ago? I fail to see Honda targeting that market to be honest...the fight is against Lincoln and Buick these days.

And nothing wrong with that. Personally, as a Honda fanboi, I wish they'd aim higher...but, if they want to be "complacent"...whatever. I won't buy anything from them until they decide to do better.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

Are you serious?

I wonder why TSX or any other Acura sedans were being selected as best performance car or drivers car.

Must be the brand name.

Read his all posts again.

This.

Another Acura car added to the Vapor list?

Yumcha

Well, hang on...I suppose you COULD argue that by being a MINI owner, I would be hypersensitive about BMW-this and BMW-that...

Yumcha

Yeah, I skimmed them...and addressed, IMO, his flawed logic of bringing BMW into this debate at all in the post right above yours.

oonowindoo

Let's not get into this because it is going to be the longest debate ever.

But FYI depends on the size of the turbo and the way the engine is setup. when you are going 20, 40, or 60, in the appropriate gear (assuming it is 6mt), the throttle response is immediate without any turbo lag.

Turbo lag is usually associated in lower RPM with small displacement engines with turbo that is too big. It is inevitable if the goal is to have high speed runs with big power. Most of the current production FI cars ATS, 3 series and etc.. have turbo that is so small that they barely qualify as FI just for 1 purpose - minimize any turbo lag to improve low end torque for better fuel consumption.

That is especially true nowadays with cars that have sport and Sport+ mode, where the throttle response feels like s2000 in 3rd at 5000 rpm.

Whiskers

http://www.honda.co.uk/cars/civictourer/

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

I don't need to elicit emotional responses, as that's happening already without any input from me. even the above post of yours is an emotional response, hence your attack on my person. isn't it ironic? I'd much rather have a conversation free of personal attacks and pop psychologizations, maybe then we could actually get somewhere. (there's also the fact that I've owned multiple bmws in the past)

back to topic: so tlx release is delayed, so what? bmw and a number of other manufacturers have done the same thing in the past, again, so what?

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

remember, I didn't bring bmw into this debate originally.

Yumcha

Honda rebadged the Toyota Venza?

Yumcha

Well, whoever brought in BMW to start, should never have. Seriously, use Buick or Lincoln to argue Acura's merits these days.

Whiskers

I think it looks great. Maybe Ill ship one back.

ttribe

Nice deflection, but, no.

We get it, you don't care. Some of us, however, see this as symptomatic of bigger problems, especially when it relates to the introduction of what is (arguably) the most important model in the last 10 years.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

that may be so, but turn about is fair play, no?

oonowindoo

He does not seems to get the fact that -

Being the benchmark does NOT mean it is the best.......5 is the bench mark to 10.. you can have cars that is better than the benchmark S5>335 or you can have cars that is below bench mark C350<335. That is all it means to be the benchmark.

JS + XES

iTrader: (1)

Hey, that Civic looks much funkier and cuter than TLX.

You should get one. Not sure it's worth shipping one back to US, but definitely a pretty cool car.

MTEAZY

The actual release date doesn't really surprise me much, although they should have been upfront about it from the beginning.


For a period of time, Honda refused to put much money into R&D, so we were stuck with little to no powertrain changes or technologies. Now they are trying to catch up with all-new DCTs, 9AT, eSHAWD, 1.5T, 2.0T, and 3.5TT, so they have a lot on their plate to get right and reliable.

skd2k1

iTrader: (1)

oh yeah, because personal attacks have a place in open minded debate.

seems like you're looking for reasons at this point.

Whiskers

Could be a steering wheel issue.

Yumcha

Well, PERSONALLY, and obviously, it does not impact sdk2k1's perception -- which is what all this new debate is about, perception -- I FEEL that Acura's delay is a negative thing.

Don't announce something and then shortly after, postpone it because it only leads to negative posturing if anything. And that's all we're doing, posturing...but, none of it is POSITIVE stuff. We're speculating now if it is the drivetrain or the transmission or the computer or etc. etc.

Poor planning on Acura's part IMO.

oonowindoo

you know something that we don't?