Acura: Development and Technology News
09-30-2010, 09:32 AM
#2561
Senior Moderator
First they have to figure out how to sell the TSX for less than a TL. A V6 TSX is priced far too close to a base TL. In Canada they're within a few hundred dollars of each other. A AWD TSX would without doubt cost almost as much as an AWD TL. That's too much overlap. Until they figure out how to properly price the TSX, they shouldn't bother with AWD.
10-04-2010, 09:41 PM
#2562
Senior Moderator
More of the same news.....
Most of this we've heard already, some is a new twist on old news. The part of the report referring to a coupe makes no sense at all.
Still...BAH! Me wanna V8 and RWD but it no happen.
http://www.autoweek.com/article/2010...NEWS/101009998
Still...BAH! Me wanna V8 and RWD but it no happen.
http://www.autoweek.com/article/2010...NEWS/101009998
Originally Posted by Autoweek
The dreams of getting a V8 engine, rear-wheel-drive platforms and a sports car to replace the NSX have died for Acura dealers. Now the question is whether Acura can follow Audi's lead and elevate its brand from premium to luxury with front- and all-wheel-drive platforms.
Meanwhile, Acura may return to two segments that it had abandoned by adding a compact car and a coupe.
Compact car: An Acura compact would be based on the next-generation Honda Civic, which means a spring 2012 launch as a 2013 model at the soonest. Acura left the compact segment at the end of the 2006 model year when it dropped the RSX. Acura doesn't want merely to homologate the Canadian market CSX, which is a badge-engineered Civic.
TSX: A wagon variant comes this fall, based on the European market Honda Accord wagon. The wagon will be available with fwd only and a four-cylinder engine. The sedan version of the TSX offers awd and a V6 option.
TL: The mid-sized sedan is due for a redesign for the 2014 model year. At that time, Honda's large-platform hybrid system should be ready. Expect a freshening for the 2012 model year.
Coupe: Although the CL coupe was dropped several years ago, Acura is considering re-entering the segment on the TSX platform, shared with the European Accord. But there are no plans now.
RL: The rwd V8 sedan that had been expected won't happen, the result of recession-driven cost-cutting. Honda Motor Co. has said the RL is not going to be redesigned, but U.S. executives insist that there will be another edition.
The RL is based on an outdated, stand-alone platform that may be re-engineered for the 2013 model year to make it last a couple of years more while the brand figures out what to do next. The RL also would be restyled at that time. The solution may be to stretch the next TL platform. So much for a flagship.
RDX: A redesign is slated for the 2012 model year.
ZDX: No significant changes are planned.
MDX: The redesign was planned for the 2012 model year, but that may be pushed back a year, when Honda's large-platform hybrid powertrain will be ready. The MDX currently comes only with a 3.7-liter V6 engine, which may raise concerns about fuel economy.
Meanwhile, Acura may return to two segments that it had abandoned by adding a compact car and a coupe.
Compact car: An Acura compact would be based on the next-generation Honda Civic, which means a spring 2012 launch as a 2013 model at the soonest. Acura left the compact segment at the end of the 2006 model year when it dropped the RSX. Acura doesn't want merely to homologate the Canadian market CSX, which is a badge-engineered Civic.
TSX: A wagon variant comes this fall, based on the European market Honda Accord wagon. The wagon will be available with fwd only and a four-cylinder engine. The sedan version of the TSX offers awd and a V6 option.
TL: The mid-sized sedan is due for a redesign for the 2014 model year. At that time, Honda's large-platform hybrid system should be ready. Expect a freshening for the 2012 model year.
Coupe: Although the CL coupe was dropped several years ago, Acura is considering re-entering the segment on the TSX platform, shared with the European Accord. But there are no plans now.
RL: The rwd V8 sedan that had been expected won't happen, the result of recession-driven cost-cutting. Honda Motor Co. has said the RL is not going to be redesigned, but U.S. executives insist that there will be another edition.
The RL is based on an outdated, stand-alone platform that may be re-engineered for the 2013 model year to make it last a couple of years more while the brand figures out what to do next. The RL also would be restyled at that time. The solution may be to stretch the next TL platform. So much for a flagship.
RDX: A redesign is slated for the 2012 model year.
ZDX: No significant changes are planned.
MDX: The redesign was planned for the 2012 model year, but that may be pushed back a year, when Honda's large-platform hybrid powertrain will be ready. The MDX currently comes only with a 3.7-liter V6 engine, which may raise concerns about fuel economy.
Last edited by neuronbob; 10-04-2010 at 09:44 PM.
10-05-2010, 10:22 AM
#2563
I'm the Firestarter
10-05-2010, 11:43 AM
#2564
Senior Moderator
10-05-2010, 01:39 PM
#2565
At the dealer show in Denver (two weeks ago) they showed a sub-TSX vehicle based on the next gen-Civic. It will be a sedan and the prototype they were shown was very promising and described as 'very European or Audiesque" whatever that means. It will be available in both gas and hybrid trim and might debut in CY 2011 as a 2012
10-05-2010, 02:24 PM
#2566
I'm the Firestarter
^ Would you say style/agressiveness-wise it's more like a 1-series or more like an A1?
10-05-2010, 04:03 PM
#2567
Instructor
Honda motor group is completely confused although not as much as Hyundai trying to make a $60,000+ luxery car to compete with BMW's 7-Series, Lexus LS, Audi A8 & Mercedes S class sedans! I dont know who at Hyundai thought it would be a good idea to make Ultra Luxury cars but all of them need to be fired!! They need to try to build cars that last beyond 120k miles first! If VW couldn't sell the Pheaton which was the same exact car as the Audi A8 but $15k less Hyundai's got no chance, who the hell would buy a $60k Hyundai in the first place. Honda-Acura needs to seperate themselves its hard though because Acura's in North America are Honda's in every other continent. Acura needs to build a flagship full size sedan with a 340hp+ V8 standard to compete with the Lexus LS & BMW 7 Series for starters. The new TL's & TSX's look to similar and are about the same size so they need to shrink the TSX a little or differentiate it from the TL. The TL needs an engine option. So the TL would come with a 6cyl standard & a V8 or turbo charged V6. Then the TSX would be your entry level car and have it standard with a 4cyl or 4cyl w/ a low pressure turbo & a V6 optional like what Audi does with the A4 and then finally you need a sport coupe for some excitement but you cant screw it up like you did with the 3.2CL's!! They could easily take the Accord coupes platform to start from since in my opinion thats the best looking car Honda-Acura sells! Take the Accord coupe re-style it slightly to make it different enough so they dont get confused use higher end materials inside so it feels like a luxury sport coupe, give it a sport suspension, you could use the Honda Accord V6 which I believe is around 280hp & tune it to over 300hp as the standard engine and sell it in the mid $30k's to compete with the G37 coupe. Then you could add a Type-S package which would add twin turbo's, supercharger or a V8 & sell that in the $40K's and if you wanna go all out I'm sure you could figure out a engine & suspension set up to compete with the S4, S5, IS-F & M3 but you cant screw it up! The coupe needs factory optional lip-kits or body kits because that wasx a huge mistake not to make one for the 01-03 CL, standard 17" wheels with optional 18's & 19's. If they do that they'll kill Infiniti! Dont worry so much about the NSX or any type of supercar because they dont sell, look at the Skyline people were begging for that car and when it came here no one bought it and as for the SUV's your on your own but the Acura version of that monstrosity they call the Accord cross tour is actually really nice but they need that sport coupe to get people excited & in the door and then you could sell them a TL or something. Look what the G35 coupe did for Infiniti it saved there ass and I know Acura can come up with something better!
10-05-2010, 04:06 PM
#2568
Instructor
Look how long it took Audi to realize thet needed to make a coupe version of the A4 and now they finally did with the A5 and its a huge success!!!! Bring our Coupe BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
10-05-2010, 05:52 PM
#2570
Honda motor group is completely confused although not as much as Hyundai trying to make a $60,000+ luxery car to compete with BMW's 7-Series, Lexus LS, Audi A8 & Mercedes S class sedans! I dont know who at Hyundai thought it would be a good idea to make Ultra Luxury cars but all of them need to be fired!! They need to try to build cars that last beyond 120k miles first! If VW couldn't sell the Pheaton which was the same exact car as the Audi A8 but $15k less Hyundai's got no chance, who the hell would buy a $60k Hyundai in the first place. Honda-Acura needs to seperate themselves its hard though because Acura's in North America are Honda's in every other continent. Acura needs to build a flagship full size sedan with a 340hp+ V8 standard to compete with the Lexus LS & BMW 7 Series for starters. The new TL's & TSX's look to similar and are about the same size so they need to shrink the TSX a little or differentiate it from the TL. The TL needs an engine option. So the TL would come with a 6cyl standard & a V8 or turbo charged V6. Then the TSX would be your entry level car and have it standard with a 4cyl or 4cyl w/ a low pressure turbo & a V6 optional like what Audi does with the A4 and then finally you need a sport coupe for some excitement but you cant screw it up like you did with the 3.2CL's!! They could easily take the Accord coupes platform to start from since in my opinion thats the best looking car Honda-Acura sells! Take the Accord coupe re-style it slightly to make it different enough so they dont get confused use higher end materials inside so it feels like a luxury sport coupe, give it a sport suspension, you could use the Honda Accord V6 which I believe is around 280hp & tune it to over 300hp as the standard engine and sell it in the mid $30k's to compete with the G37 coupe. Then you could add a Type-S package which would add twin turbo's, supercharger or a V8 & sell that in the $40K's and if you wanna go all out I'm sure you could figure out a engine & suspension set up to compete with the S4, S5, IS-F & M3 but you cant screw it up! The coupe needs factory optional lip-kits or body kits because that wasx a huge mistake not to make one for the 01-03 CL, standard 17" wheels with optional 18's & 19's. If they do that they'll kill Infiniti! Dont worry so much about the NSX or any type of supercar because they dont sell, look at the Skyline people were begging for that car and when it came here no one bought it and as for the SUV's your on your own but the Acura version of that monstrosity they call the Accord cross tour is actually really nice but they need that sport coupe to get people excited & in the door and then you could sell them a TL or something. Look what the G35 coupe did for Infiniti it saved there ass and I know Acura can come up with something better!
There sizes are completely different.
TSX is 185.6''L/72.4''W/56.6''H
TL is 195.5''L/74.0''w/57.2''H
Those specs are not even close to each other. The TL is a much bigger car compared to the TSX.
10-05-2010, 07:36 PM
#2571
Senior Moderator
At the dealer show in Denver (two weeks ago) they showed a sub-TSX vehicle based on the next gen-Civic. It will be a sedan and the prototype they were shown was very promising and described as 'very European or Audiesque" whatever that means. It will be available in both gas and hybrid trim and might debut in CY 2011 as a 2012
10-05-2010, 08:43 PM
#2572
Senior Moderator
Honda motor group is completely confused although not as much as Hyundai trying to make a $60,000+ luxery car to compete with BMW's 7-Series, Lexus LS, Audi A8 & Mercedes S class sedans! I dont know who at Hyundai thought it would be a good idea to make Ultra Luxury cars but all of them need to be fired!! They need to try to build cars that last beyond 120k miles first! If VW couldn't sell the Pheaton which was the same exact car as the Audi A8 but $15k less Hyundai's got no chance, who the hell would buy a $60k Hyundai in the first place. Honda-Acura needs to seperate themselves its hard though because Acura's in North America are Honda's in every other continent. Acura needs to build a flagship full size sedan with a 340hp+ V8 standard to compete with the Lexus LS & BMW 7 Series for starters. The new TL's & TSX's look to similar and are about the same size so they need to shrink the TSX a little or differentiate it from the TL. The TL needs an engine option. So the TL would come with a 6cyl standard & a V8 or turbo charged V6. Then the TSX would be your entry level car and have it standard with a 4cyl or 4cyl w/ a low pressure turbo & a V6 optional like what Audi does with the A4 and then finally you need a sport coupe for some excitement but you cant screw it up like you did with the 3.2CL's!! They could easily take the Accord coupes platform to start from since in my opinion thats the best looking car Honda-Acura sells! Take the Accord coupe re-style it slightly to make it different enough so they dont get confused use higher end materials inside so it feels like a luxury sport coupe, give it a sport suspension, you could use the Honda Accord V6 which I believe is around 280hp & tune it to over 300hp as the standard engine and sell it in the mid $30k's to compete with the G37 coupe. Then you could add a Type-S package which would add twin turbo's, supercharger or a V8 & sell that in the $40K's and if you wanna go all out I'm sure you could figure out a engine & suspension set up to compete with the S4, S5, IS-F & M3 but you cant screw it up! The coupe needs factory optional lip-kits or body kits because that wasx a huge mistake not to make one for the 01-03 CL, standard 17" wheels with optional 18's & 19's. If they do that they'll kill Infiniti! Dont worry so much about the NSX or any type of supercar because they dont sell, look at the Skyline people were begging for that car and when it came here no one bought it and as for the SUV's your on your own but the Acura version of that monstrosity they call the Accord cross tour is actually really nice but they need that sport coupe to get people excited & in the door and then you could sell them a TL or something. Look what the G35 coupe did for Infiniti it saved there ass and I know Acura can come up with something better!
Lots of ignorance Oh and the only people that should be fired are the Acura designers and top brass. Hyundai is leaps and bounds ahead of acura. At least they have the guts to try, and so far succeeding. Quit being so close minded. Before you knock the car, why dont you actually spend a little time looking at the car. After what they have done in the first time out with the Genesis sedan i would say it should be a great car. When it comes time for gen 2 of it the others will be playing big time catchup. But thats my
10-05-2010, 10:20 PM
#2573
6G TLX-S
Lots of ignorance Oh and the only people that should be fired are the Acura designers and top brass. Hyundai is leaps and bounds ahead of acura. At least they have the guts to try, and so far succeeding. Quit being so close minded. Before you knock the car, why dont you actually spend a little time looking at the car. After what they have done in the first time out with the Genesis sedan i would say it should be a great car. When it comes time for gen 2 of it the others will be playing big time catchup. But thats my
After a couple of iterations to smooth out all the bugs, the Genesis sedan will become high polished, and can even rival other high-end sedans with it's high-power V8 and 8-speed auto box. But it desperately needs a brand new (high-end) name plate to separate from the econo Hyundai division.
Just see how the 2nd iteration (Gen 2) of the Prius 5-passenger hybrid car virtually runs away from the new-entry Insight 5-passenger hybrid car in sales figure. Honda tried to beat Toyota to the hybrid market by releasing the rush-job 2-seater Insight which was a complete flop.
10-05-2010, 10:20 PM
#2574
At first i was eager to trade my 2010 TL for a 2012 MMC TL (I know, waste of $, but I heard there might be an advanced pkg, if so, i may trade) but hearing all this talk about newer acuras is making me wait.
I'm hoping for a fastback, coupe, or hatch from acura soon. As big as the TL is, it's pretty inefficient in it's interior space usage.
I also hope they start stuffing the ventilated seats or a mini-advanced pkg into all their models.
I'm hoping for a fastback, coupe, or hatch from acura soon. As big as the TL is, it's pretty inefficient in it's interior space usage.
I also hope they start stuffing the ventilated seats or a mini-advanced pkg into all their models.
10-05-2010, 10:41 PM
#2575
intelligentsia
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What I don't understand is why the TSX does not come with AWD. I mean a V6 AWD TSX will compete against the A4, 3 series, and IS pretty damn easily. Not to mention the G although thats a bigger car. I mean if the TSX AWD V6 with all the options was priced around 40k well then that is a steal.
10-06-2010, 10:44 AM
#2576
Senior Moderator
What I don't understand is why the TSX does not come with AWD. I mean a V6 AWD TSX will compete against the A4, 3 series, and IS pretty damn easily. Not to mention the G although thats a bigger car. I mean if the TSX AWD V6 with all the options was priced around 40k well then that is a steal.
10-07-2010, 10:07 AM
#2577
I'm the Firestarter
^ I don't think it's a TL issue. The real reason is because it's really a dressed-up Honda Accord, and as such it's designed to be a mass-market platform and to save costs it's not designed to have AWD fitted to it. They're lucky enough as it is to be able to stick a V6 into it.
10-07-2010, 11:47 AM
#2578
Senior Moderator
^ I don't think it's a TL issue. The real reason is because it's really a dressed-up Honda Accord, and as such it's designed to be a mass-market platform and to save costs it's not designed to have AWD fitted to it. They're lucky enough as it is to be able to stick a V6 into it.
10-07-2010, 12:10 PM
#2579
Here is the "sub-TSX based off of the Civic", Acura CSX
the current/old JDM Civic Type-R
Of course this is the current and soon to be older generation of CSX, but it might give you a glimpse of what is to come.
the current/old JDM Civic Type-R
Of course this is the current and soon to be older generation of CSX, but it might give you a glimpse of what is to come.
@ the civic with the beak
10-07-2010, 02:58 PM
#2581
and that is the only sedan where that beak looks good on. TSX is a close second, but I think the grill works really well on the CSX. TL is just a lost cause.
10-07-2010, 03:05 PM
#2582
Acura really needs to take a que from Infiniti and start making their own freakin platforms separate from their mainstream company! They are never going to be taken seriously with the other luxury players until they do! We don't need something like a CSX to just be a rebadged Civic. We here the rebadged stuff thrown around enough with Acuar as it is, this would only go to fuel it.
10-07-2010, 07:56 PM
#2585
^ I don't think it's a TL issue. The real reason is because it's really a dressed-up Honda Accord, and as such it's designed to be a mass-market platform and to save costs it's not designed to have AWD fitted to it. They're lucky enough as it is to be able to stick a V6 into it.
10-07-2010, 08:32 PM
#2586
It doesn't share a platform with a Nissan here in this country, unlike Acura and Lexus who share some platforms with their parent company. The new 2011 QX no longer shares the Armada platform and I thought Nissan was getting rid of the Armada all together?
10-08-2010, 04:27 AM
#2587
For the record in Japan they are all Nissans, there is no Infiniti, it's rebadged for the US. Lexus only started to have a seperate nameplate in Japan. Acura has nearly all exclusive models despite the global platform sharing. The only Acura that is a Honda is the TSX but not the V6 version and the RL used to be a Honda, the Legend, but they discontinued it there so it is now an exclusive.
If they want to get serious about a real flagship sedan then a new platform would be a good idea, they are currently working on one. Rumor is, it is larger, full sized, and hybrid capable. The platform for the current TL and TSX models are fine for their size and use.
10-08-2010, 09:26 AM
#2588
I'm the Firestarter
For the next Accord maybe (they'd be wise to do that) but not for this one. And I think the reason is cost, because they didn't want build that cost into what is supposed to be an affordable car in Japan and Europe.
10-08-2010, 11:25 AM
#2589
infact it is cheaper to buy 520SE than Euro Accord diesel because of high emmission levels of Honda engine/transmission combination.
BMW 520 SE is with in 2000 dollars of Honda Euro Accord Type S. and Type S dont get that some of expensive engine features of BMW diesels that give extra ordinary fuel economy and emission levels to BMW. infact 5speed Auto in diesel is pretty obsolete for car.
10-08-2010, 12:15 PM
#2590
I'm the Firestarter
Your blatant attempt to get me to pointlessly Google stuff has failed.
10-08-2010, 12:47 PM
#2591
This is what you should have seen instead:
SSFTSX
This message is hidden because SSFTSX is on your ignore list.
This message is hidden because SSFTSX is on your ignore list.
10-08-2010, 01:20 PM
#2592
I'm pretty sure the same platform is used in the Z, G, EX, FX and M, although a few are reconfigured depending on the application, as the other brands do.
For the record in Japan they are all Nissans, there is no Infiniti, it's rebadged for the US. Lexus only started to have a seperate nameplate in Japan. Acura has nearly all exclusive models despite the global platform sharing. The only Acura that is a Honda is the TSX but not the V6 version and the RL used to be a Honda, the Legend, but they discontinued it there so it is now an exclusive.
If they want to get serious about a real flagship sedan then a new platform would be a good idea, they are currently working on one. Rumor is, it is larger, full sized, and hybrid capable. The platform for the current TL and TSX models are fine for their size and use.
For the record in Japan they are all Nissans, there is no Infiniti, it's rebadged for the US. Lexus only started to have a seperate nameplate in Japan. Acura has nearly all exclusive models despite the global platform sharing. The only Acura that is a Honda is the TSX but not the V6 version and the RL used to be a Honda, the Legend, but they discontinued it there so it is now an exclusive.
If they want to get serious about a real flagship sedan then a new platform would be a good idea, they are currently working on one. Rumor is, it is larger, full sized, and hybrid capable. The platform for the current TL and TSX models are fine for their size and use.
You really need to stop drinking the Honda/Acura Kool-Aid man! You can't say Infiniti's are rebadges and Acura's are not. All Acura's are rebadged Honda's either here or somewhere else in the world so lets cut out the double standard. Acura does not have exclusive models, if you think so your deluding yourself. The TL shares similar layout like the Accord man so TSX is not only model. Intersting how big the 8th Gen Accord and 4th Gen TL grew consectively yet they are suppose to be not sharing same platform anymore, I mean c-mon. Don't make excuse for the pitiful RL, it doesn't matter the Legend is discontinued. It still existed thus current RL is still a rebadge until a completely new one is made.
At least Infiniti is making a conserted effort in seriously differentiated its vehicles from parent company Nissan in this country. They don't even share the same transmissions, driving dynamics, etc. Too many things are still shared between Acura and Honda compared to Nissan and Infiniti.
I want Acura to make unique platforms for RL, TL, TSX. All I'm saying is I want even more differenitation between the two. I don't want no stupid CSX as a rebadged Civic that is all I'm saying.
Audi are rebadged VW's, some Lexus vehicles are rebadged Toyota's, hell, even some BMW's and MB are either called something else or are classified differently over in Europe.
Technically, BMW and MB are the only one without rebadged models.
10-08-2010, 01:28 PM
#2593
I'm the Firestarter
10-08-2010, 01:57 PM
#2594
6G TLX-S
Acura really needs to take a que from Infiniti and start making their own freakin platforms separate from their mainstream company! They are never going to be taken seriously with the other luxury players until they do! We don't need something like a CSX to just be a rebadged Civic. We here the rebadged stuff thrown around enough with Acuar as it is, this would only go to fuel it.
If this still doesn't fully differential the luxury Acura products from the econo Honda products, nothing else will.
And in order to shut up the hard-core FWD buyers, chuck in one or two FWD vehicle models into the Acura lineup, but the rest of the Acura's remains to be focused on RWD performance.
This is exactly the proven-successful luxury-Lexus/econo-Toyota sales model.
10-08-2010, 02:15 PM
#2595
The only shared component with Nissan is the 370z sports coupe, definitely not a bad thing, but not with any of their sedans, cross-overs, or SUVs, at least not any more. Can't say the same for Acura.
You really need to stop drinking the Honda/Acura Kool-Aid man! You can't say Infiniti's are rebadges and Acura's are not. All Acura's are rebadged Honda's either here or somewhere else in the world so lets cut out the double standard. Acura does not have exclusive models, if you think so your deluding yourself. The TL shares similar layout like the Accord man so TSX is not only model. Intersting how big the 8th Gen Accord and 4th Gen TL grew consectively yet they are suppose to be not sharing same platform anymore, I mean c-mon. Don't make excuse for the pitiful RL, it doesn't matter the Legend is discontinued. It still existed thus current RL is still a rebadge until a completely new one is made.
At least Infiniti is making a conserted effort in seriously differentiated its vehicles from parent company Nissan in this country. They don't even share the same transmissions, driving dynamics, etc. Too many things are still shared between Acura and Honda compared to Nissan and Infiniti.
I want Acura to make unique platforms for RL, TL, TSX. All I'm saying is I want even more differenitation between the two. I don't want no stupid CSX as a rebadged Civic that is all I'm saying.
Audi are rebadged VW's, some Lexus vehicles are rebadged Toyota's, hell, even some BMW's and MB are either called something else or are classified differently over in Europe.
Technically, BMW and MB are the only one without rebadged models.
You really need to stop drinking the Honda/Acura Kool-Aid man! You can't say Infiniti's are rebadges and Acura's are not. All Acura's are rebadged Honda's either here or somewhere else in the world so lets cut out the double standard. Acura does not have exclusive models, if you think so your deluding yourself. The TL shares similar layout like the Accord man so TSX is not only model. Intersting how big the 8th Gen Accord and 4th Gen TL grew consectively yet they are suppose to be not sharing same platform anymore, I mean c-mon. Don't make excuse for the pitiful RL, it doesn't matter the Legend is discontinued. It still existed thus current RL is still a rebadge until a completely new one is made.
At least Infiniti is making a conserted effort in seriously differentiated its vehicles from parent company Nissan in this country. They don't even share the same transmissions, driving dynamics, etc. Too many things are still shared between Acura and Honda compared to Nissan and Infiniti.
I want Acura to make unique platforms for RL, TL, TSX. All I'm saying is I want even more differenitation between the two. I don't want no stupid CSX as a rebadged Civic that is all I'm saying.
Audi are rebadged VW's, some Lexus vehicles are rebadged Toyota's, hell, even some BMW's and MB are either called something else or are classified differently over in Europe.
Technically, BMW and MB are the only one without rebadged models.
Nissan does use the FM platform in the G, M, Z, FX, and EX right now. That why Renault-Nissan and Daimler have teamed up to share engines, platforms and parts in the future and the rumor is the G will get the C class platform and the E platform goes to the M and MB will use Nissan motors. That might be where the new MB V6 and V8 motors are coming from.
I am not drinking Kool-Aid bro, it's called coffee, try it. Infiniti's are rebadges more than Acura's but I never said it was a bad thing only that's what they are, because Infiniti does not exists in Japan, they are all Nissans, and again, there nothing wrong with that. I am just stating information, I am not attacking and I am not sure where the offense is coming from.
Acura does share a lot of platforms, and some Acura models are Hondas, I never disputed that, but if you drive an Accord and than a TL you would never know it because they are so reconfigured and almost as if it's a different one, just like Nissan does, and that is the point in the whole sharing process, to be able to enhance the faltform as needed but save the cost of a total new engineer for only a single car or purpose.
Not every Acura is a Honda period. The TSX is, the V6 is not, the RL used to be a Honda. Does that make it a Honda right now? I don't kow, I don't care, all I said is it is now an exclusive and that is true. Everything else is also an exclusive model and not a Honda in some other country but I never said they didn't work off of a global platform.
Nissan is not differentiating between it and Infiniti because there is no Infiniti in Japan, what they are doing instead is differentiating the individual models and most of those (among others) that use the same FM platform are labaled Infiniti here, except the Z. What both companies are doing is a good thing IMO.
Last edited by winstrolvtec; 10-08-2010 at 02:26 PM.
10-08-2010, 02:42 PM
#2596
TSX V6 TECH is $39K car. Upgrade it with SH-AWD/3.7L/Acura RL interior enhancements/Pushbutton etc. (how much is price difference between TL and TL-SH-AWD?).
your looking at $46~$48K car. Almost exact price as RL but 10inch shorter your failing simple math.
10-08-2010, 03:59 PM
#2597
In fact, all Acura's SHOULD ride on an Acura-exclusive RWD chassis, while leaving the good-old FWD platform(s) for the economy Honda division vehicles.
If this still doesn't fully differential the luxury Acura products from the econo Honda products, nothing else will.
And in order to shut up the hard-core FWD buyers, chuck in one or two FWD vehicle models into the Acura lineup, but the rest of the Acura's remains to be focused on RWD performance.
This is exactly the proven-successful luxury-Lexus/econo-Toyota sales model.
If this still doesn't fully differential the luxury Acura products from the econo Honda products, nothing else will.
And in order to shut up the hard-core FWD buyers, chuck in one or two FWD vehicle models into the Acura lineup, but the rest of the Acura's remains to be focused on RWD performance.
This is exactly the proven-successful luxury-Lexus/econo-Toyota sales model.
Acura is a very conservative, profit minded company and are concerened with selling cars in the tens of thousands, not in the thousands. Granted they had their busts but they don't design a car with intent to sell 5k units a year and that's where their luxury and performance image suffers, altough they do make some really capable and luxurious vehicles it's not as well recognized, but they seem ok with that as long as they are making money.
10-08-2010, 04:26 PM
#2598
Senior Moderator
You made a foollish statement of TSX being affordable car.
TSX V6 TECH is $39K car. Upgrade it with SH-AWD/3.7L/Acura RL interior enhancements/Pushbutton etc. (how much is price difference between TL and TL-SH-AWD?).
your looking at $46~$48K car. Almost exact price as RL but 10inch shorter your failing simple math.
TSX V6 TECH is $39K car. Upgrade it with SH-AWD/3.7L/Acura RL interior enhancements/Pushbutton etc. (how much is price difference between TL and TL-SH-AWD?).
your looking at $46~$48K car. Almost exact price as RL but 10inch shorter your failing simple math.
10-08-2010, 04:32 PM
#2599
It's your double standard just go look at the original post and even here you suggest any sharing that Nissan does is not a bad thing but that is what you were suggesting when it comes to Acura.
Nissan does use the FM platform in the G, M, Z, FX, and EX right now. That why Renault-Nissan and Daimler have teamed up to share engines, platforms and parts in the future and the rumor is the G will get the C class platform and the E platform goes to the M and MB will use Nissan motors. That might be where the new MB V6 and V8 motors are coming from.
I am not drinking Kool-Aid bro, it's called coffee, try it. Infiniti's are rebadges more than Acura's but I never said it was a bad thing only that's what they are, because Infiniti does not exists in Japan, they are all Nissans, and again, there nothing wrong with that. I am just stating information, I am not attacking and I am not sure where the offense is coming from.
Acura does share a lot of platforms, and some Acura models are Hondas, I never disputed that, but if you drive an Accord and than a TL you would never know it because they are so reconfigured and almost as if it's a different one, just like Nissan does, and that is the point in the whole sharing process, to be able to enhance the faltform as needed but save the cost of a total new engineer for only a single car or purpose.
Not every Acura is a Honda period. The TSX is, the V6 is not, the RL used to be a Honda. Does that make it a Honda right now? I don't kow, I don't care, all I said is it is now an exclusive and that is true. Everything else is also an exclusive model and not a Honda in some other country but I never said they didn't work off of a global platform.
Nissan is not differentiating between it and Infiniti because there is no Infiniti in Japan, what they are doing instead is differentiating the individual models and most of those (among others) that use the same FM platform are labaled Infiniti here, except the Z. What both companies are doing is a good thing IMO.
Nissan does use the FM platform in the G, M, Z, FX, and EX right now. That why Renault-Nissan and Daimler have teamed up to share engines, platforms and parts in the future and the rumor is the G will get the C class platform and the E platform goes to the M and MB will use Nissan motors. That might be where the new MB V6 and V8 motors are coming from.
I am not drinking Kool-Aid bro, it's called coffee, try it. Infiniti's are rebadges more than Acura's but I never said it was a bad thing only that's what they are, because Infiniti does not exists in Japan, they are all Nissans, and again, there nothing wrong with that. I am just stating information, I am not attacking and I am not sure where the offense is coming from.
Acura does share a lot of platforms, and some Acura models are Hondas, I never disputed that, but if you drive an Accord and than a TL you would never know it because they are so reconfigured and almost as if it's a different one, just like Nissan does, and that is the point in the whole sharing process, to be able to enhance the faltform as needed but save the cost of a total new engineer for only a single car or purpose.
Not every Acura is a Honda period. The TSX is, the V6 is not, the RL used to be a Honda. Does that make it a Honda right now? I don't kow, I don't care, all I said is it is now an exclusive and that is true. Everything else is also an exclusive model and not a Honda in some other country but I never said they didn't work off of a global platform.
Nissan is not differentiating between it and Infiniti because there is no Infiniti in Japan, what they are doing instead is differentiating the individual models and most of those (among others) that use the same FM platform are labaled Infiniti here, except the Z. What both companies are doing is a good thing IMO.
Acura: 5spd and 6spd automatics, mostly FWD set-ups with AWD options
Honda: 5spd and 6spd automatics, mostly FWD set-ups with some AWD options
Nissan: CVT, almost all FWD set-ups
Infiniti: 7spd automatics and RWD set-ups
Much more difference between Nissan and Infiniti then there is between Honda and Acura
I am intersted to see what happens on the next Gen Infiniti b/c of the Dimaler partnership. If they are going to be based on MB plaftorms I don't see how that is not going to be a positive direction for improving their sport performance capabilities to keep up with BMW since Mercedes isn't known for its sport performance prowness like BMW and Infiniti are.
I was hoping MB's biggest influence would not go any further then refining the engine sounds at idle on the Infiniti's.
If they do go in the direction your suggesting then Infiniti's will be unique here since they would share components of MB and Nissan. Not sure if those changes are going to work over to other countries or not. MB is suppose to get some of Nissan's hybrid and fuel saving technology in return so I've read.
10-08-2010, 05:03 PM
#2600
Slight oversimplification since there are three different AWD systems in play with SH-AWD for Acura only. Realtime and VTM-4 are in the Honda line.