Acura: Development and Technology News
10-10-2010, 09:43 PM
#2641
Senior Moderator
10-10-2010, 10:05 PM
#2642
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The first article is talking about tires, and the TL has been critisized for its ride quality in many tests. I can provide those if your ass kissing (or is that Acura kissing?) self can't locate any.
The second article NEVER said that the suspension was wearing. The problem was the very low profile 19 inch wheel-tire combination.
The lie that no "standard" BMW can get over .9G in that test is also a complete, well, LIE.
.92 from a basic 328i. Care you revise your statement, fanboy?
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/..._sh-awd_page_2
Get a clue and stop lying. At 2:15 this reviewer complains about the ride in a 2009 TL AWD with the 18 inch wheels. Guess it's not a fact is it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l29TOI7eYIs
Last edited by MyCarIsntInMyWifesName; 10-10-2010 at 10:13 PM.
10-10-2010, 10:45 PM
#2643
How fucking stupid do you have to be?
The first article is talking about tires, and the TL has been critisized for its ride quality in many tests. I can provide those if your ass kissing (or is that Acura kissing?) self can't locate any.
The second article NEVER said that the suspension was wearing. The problem was the very low profile 19 inch wheel-tire combination.
The lie that no "standard" BMW can get over .9G in that test is also a complete, well, LIE.
.92 from a basic 328i. Care you revise your statement, fanboy?
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/..._sh-awd_page_2
Get a clue and stop lying. At 2:15 this reviewer complains about the ride in a 2009 TL AWD with the 18 inch wheels. Guess it's not a fact is it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l29TOI7eYIs
The first article is talking about tires, and the TL has been critisized for its ride quality in many tests. I can provide those if your ass kissing (or is that Acura kissing?) self can't locate any.
The second article NEVER said that the suspension was wearing. The problem was the very low profile 19 inch wheel-tire combination.
The lie that no "standard" BMW can get over .9G in that test is also a complete, well, LIE.
.92 from a basic 328i. Care you revise your statement, fanboy?
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/..._sh-awd_page_2
Get a clue and stop lying. At 2:15 this reviewer complains about the ride in a 2009 TL AWD with the 18 inch wheels. Guess it's not a fact is it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l29TOI7eYIs
It is not standard car. and you comparing it against standard TL-SH-AWD.
Second Honda has alot better Euro GT and Type S in EU. they are quieter, better comfort, tighter turning circle and better high speed fuel economy. not to mention higher ground clearance
BMW cant match it. I am not even going into 99% reliability ratings.
Acura has demonstrated of getting 0.92g on all Independent Magazine tests. not some one Magazine that awards 3 series most of the time.
Acura test results has alot more credibility. and all has been achieved on taller, wider and longer car.
10-10-2010, 10:47 PM
#2644
There is no evidence of new 5 serires more fun than TL-SH-AWD. every one is complaining about its electric steering, poor handling. TL also uses short life PS2. It has guaranted passed all first year rigours long term testing.
10-10-2010, 11:08 PM
#2646
I quote an AZ member whose name escapes me right now.... but it's "like talking to a brick wall covered in bird shit"
Everyone else is gonna look at you funny and no matter what point you're trying to prove or how well you're explaining it, well....
Everyone else is gonna look at you funny and no matter what point you're trying to prove or how well you're explaining it, well....
10-10-2010, 11:39 PM
#2648
My first Avatar....
10-11-2010, 01:05 AM
#2649
Burning Brakes
10-11-2010, 01:15 AM
#2650
אני עומד עם ישראל
oh man here we go again...
10-11-2010, 09:55 AM
#2651
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You dont have evidence that 328i not having Sport suspension. otherwise how tested price became $36,600 when it is was pretty strpped down?
It is not standard car. and you comparing it against standard TL-SH-AWD.
Second Honda has alot better Euro GT and Type S in EU. they are quieter, better comfort, tighter turning circle and better high speed fuel economy. not to mention higher ground clearance
BMW cant match it. I am not even going into 99% reliability ratings.
Acura has demonstrated of getting 0.92g on all Independent Magazine tests. not some one Magazine that awards 3 series most of the time.
Acura test results has alot more credibility. and all has been achieved on taller, wider and longer car.
It is not standard car. and you comparing it against standard TL-SH-AWD.
Second Honda has alot better Euro GT and Type S in EU. they are quieter, better comfort, tighter turning circle and better high speed fuel economy. not to mention higher ground clearance
BMW cant match it. I am not even going into 99% reliability ratings.
Acura has demonstrated of getting 0.92g on all Independent Magazine tests. not some one Magazine that awards 3 series most of the time.
Acura test results has alot more credibility. and all has been achieved on taller, wider and longer car.
10-11-2010, 11:20 AM
#2652
Senior Moderator
And NO tire can be guaranteed to last a full season. Tire life all depends on how its driven, like i said, i could wear the tires off the car in less than half a day. Fronts and Rears!
10-11-2010, 01:14 PM
#2653
why do u think Type-S was created in EU when Euro GT was already there?
It is to give that extra level of handlling and comfort on bigger standard tires and much tighter turngin circle.
And NO tire can be guaranteed to last a full season. Tire life all depends on how its driven, like i said, i could wear the tires off the car in less than half a day. Fronts and Rears!
your simply not admitting BMW failure. build & design quality is not upto the task.
10-11-2010, 03:21 PM
#2655
Yet that old out dated one exist. How many G it is pulling?. what great Slolam run it has?. It is competing against base TL-SH-AWD. not some Type S from Acura.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/co...2006-bmw-m5-m6
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests
Acura is larger car, more comfortable and likely to outlast BMW.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/co...2006-bmw-m5-m6
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests
Acura is larger car, more comfortable and likely to outlast BMW.
10-11-2010, 04:27 PM
#2656
You admit their lineup is limited but then say they do well with what they have. Their drop in sales over the last few years would incline to say differently. Superior resale, value, and reliability is not enough any more in this business when it comes to both Honda and Acura. Other companies are offering the same or very similar levels of all those areas. They need something more than that to make them stand out in the pack again.
I cannot find anything great about their conservative and behind-the-times attitude toward their line-up and its really beginning to get old. You can say what you want about Infiniti but them and other companies did not have the sales decline that Acura did and much better improvement in sales compared to Acura during the recovery.
I just can not believe how many people are complacent with the way Acura runs their business and line-up. I do not know what more Acura needs to get slapped in the face to wake up and make some changes and add more options to their line-up. The recession has been officially declared over, car sales have improved, now seems like the right time, not procrastinating and waiting for a few more years. RL is a great example of this. Now is the time to completely gut and make a proper luxury level flagship sedan for Acura.
I cannot find anything great about their conservative and behind-the-times attitude toward their line-up and its really beginning to get old. You can say what you want about Infiniti but them and other companies did not have the sales decline that Acura did and much better improvement in sales compared to Acura during the recovery.
I just can not believe how many people are complacent with the way Acura runs their business and line-up. I do not know what more Acura needs to get slapped in the face to wake up and make some changes and add more options to their line-up. The recession has been officially declared over, car sales have improved, now seems like the right time, not procrastinating and waiting for a few more years. RL is a great example of this. Now is the time to completely gut and make a proper luxury level flagship sedan for Acura.
They may need more to attract another type of consumer but they specialize in their type of vehicles (FWD, torque vectoring variable AWD, and V6) and there is nothing wrong with that. Not everyone wants or even has the demographics for RWD, or wants the conventional AWD system, and V8's are such a low percentage it barely covers the R&D for itself.
That's why companies who offer these things often need to partner up to reduce those costs and/or they need massive volume to clear profits. Acura does not and they make their own major components, like engines, platforms, transmissions and they are not shared across outside brand lines or are outsourced by 3rd party suppliers and there is something to be said for that.
If you can't find anything positive in Acura's approach because you are looking for them and you don't understand the future benefits to companies who still set record profits in down times vs those who float.
You are strongly mistaken that other brands did not have the same type of decline. No, no brand has experienced the same exact decline but they are all down just starting to get back up again and one of the stronger ones on the up is Acura if you didn't notice. Acura's decline is line with everyone elses and that has much more to do with economic reasons than anythig else.
In 06 and 07, Acura had record years and were consistently ranked 5th as a luxury brand in total sales and had the 5th best selling sedan lineup, today they are still ranked 5th in both of those positions or 6th if you count Buick and the success of the LaCrosse and that is considering the loss of a popular RSX model.
People aren't necessarily complacent with the brand it's just that the things that people cry about are coming. It's rare for someone to be an over enthusiast only to buy one car for the next 10+ years. Generally people turn over cars every few years, so if Acura does not have something they want right now, I don't see what the big deal is, come back when and if they do if it matters that much otherwise I don't see how this is anyone's problem or why they should be so concerened about it. I am not complaining that MB does not offer cheaper FWD vehicles or vectoring AWD on anything. They all have their own philosophies and business practices and that is the best part.
We won't see a RWD line, not happening. A RWD sports car or coupe is possible but with SH as a highlight it's not necessary. A compact is coming, a coupe is on the drawing board, the wagon and 6AT are here, the toned down styling "process" starts in a few months, the TSX and TL are transitioning to other market positions, a full sized flagship is coming. What else is there to say?
Last edited by winstrolvtec; 10-11-2010 at 04:33 PM.
10-11-2010, 06:31 PM
#2657
They do well for what they have, the same lineup most complain about. You can be limited in a diverse lineup, preventing you from doing a lot more business, but it doesn't have to prevent you from doing well in the first place not to mention adding more costs more at the same time. Clearly the Acura and Honda trademarks are enough, there a few who would probably trade their designs, RWD platforms, and V8's for the sales Acura has and the greater level of profit margins they experience.
They may need more to attract another type of consumer but they specialize in their type of vehicles (FWD, torque vectoring variable AWD, and V6) and there is nothing wrong with that. Not everyone wants or even has the demographics for RWD, or wants the conventional AWD system, and V8's are such a low percentage it barely covers the R&D for itself.
That's why companies who offer these things often need to partner up to reduce those costs and/or they need massive volume to clear profits. Acura does not and they make their own major components, like engines, platforms, transmissions and they are not shared across outside brand lines or are outsourced by 3rd party suppliers and there is something to be said for that.
If you can't find anything positive in Acura's approach because you are looking for them and you don't understand the future benefits to companies who still set record profits in down times vs those who float.
You are strongly mistaken that other brands did not have the same type of decline. No, no brand has experienced the same exact decline but they are all down just starting to get back up again and one of the stronger ones on the up is Acura if you didn't notice. Acura's decline is line with everyone elses and that has much more to do with economic reasons than anythig else.
In 06 and 07, Acura had record years and were consistently ranked 5th as a luxury brand in total sales and had the 5th best selling sedan lineup, today they are still ranked 5th in both of those positions or 6th if you count Buick and the success of the LaCrosse and that is considering the loss of a popular RSX model.
People aren't necessarily complacent with the brand it's just that the things that people cry about are coming. It's rare for someone to be an over enthusiast only to buy one car for the next 10+ years. Generally people turn over cars every few years, so if Acura does not have something they want right now, I don't see what the big deal is, come back when and if they do if it matters that much otherwise I don't see how this is anyone's problem or why they should be so concerened about it. I am not complaining that MB does not offer cheaper FWD vehicles or vectoring AWD on anything. They all have their own philosophies and business practices and that is the best part.
We won't see a RWD line, not happening. A RWD sports car or coupe is possible but with SH as a highlight it's not necessary. A compact is coming, a coupe is on the drawing board, the wagon and 6AT are here, the toned down styling "process" starts in a few months, the TSX and TL are transitioning to other market positions, a full sized flagship is coming. What else is there to say?
They may need more to attract another type of consumer but they specialize in their type of vehicles (FWD, torque vectoring variable AWD, and V6) and there is nothing wrong with that. Not everyone wants or even has the demographics for RWD, or wants the conventional AWD system, and V8's are such a low percentage it barely covers the R&D for itself.
That's why companies who offer these things often need to partner up to reduce those costs and/or they need massive volume to clear profits. Acura does not and they make their own major components, like engines, platforms, transmissions and they are not shared across outside brand lines or are outsourced by 3rd party suppliers and there is something to be said for that.
If you can't find anything positive in Acura's approach because you are looking for them and you don't understand the future benefits to companies who still set record profits in down times vs those who float.
You are strongly mistaken that other brands did not have the same type of decline. No, no brand has experienced the same exact decline but they are all down just starting to get back up again and one of the stronger ones on the up is Acura if you didn't notice. Acura's decline is line with everyone elses and that has much more to do with economic reasons than anythig else.
In 06 and 07, Acura had record years and were consistently ranked 5th as a luxury brand in total sales and had the 5th best selling sedan lineup, today they are still ranked 5th in both of those positions or 6th if you count Buick and the success of the LaCrosse and that is considering the loss of a popular RSX model.
People aren't necessarily complacent with the brand it's just that the things that people cry about are coming. It's rare for someone to be an over enthusiast only to buy one car for the next 10+ years. Generally people turn over cars every few years, so if Acura does not have something they want right now, I don't see what the big deal is, come back when and if they do if it matters that much otherwise I don't see how this is anyone's problem or why they should be so concerened about it. I am not complaining that MB does not offer cheaper FWD vehicles or vectoring AWD on anything. They all have their own philosophies and business practices and that is the best part.
We won't see a RWD line, not happening. A RWD sports car or coupe is possible but with SH as a highlight it's not necessary. A compact is coming, a coupe is on the drawing board, the wagon and 6AT are here, the toned down styling "process" starts in a few months, the TSX and TL are transitioning to other market positions, a full sized flagship is coming. What else is there to say?
10-11-2010, 10:22 PM
#2658
My first Avatar....
10-11-2010, 10:25 PM
#2659
SSFTSX
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10-12-2010, 07:11 AM
#2661
Senior Moderator
Yet that old out dated one exist. How many G it is pulling?. what great Slolam run it has?. It is competing against base TL-SH-AWD. not some Type S from Acura.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/co...2006-bmw-m5-m6
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests
Acura is larger car, more comfortable and likely to outlast BMW.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/co...2006-bmw-m5-m6
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests
Acura is larger car, more comfortable and likely to outlast BMW.
10-12-2010, 07:47 AM
#2662
10-12-2010, 08:54 AM
#2663
10-12-2010, 09:59 AM
#2664
אני עומד עם ישראל
LOL what? Why is there a Base TL and an SH-AWD model? Just because it lacks an 8k redline doesn't mean it's not the best TL Acura has unless there is something else hiding that I don't know about?
10-12-2010, 10:14 AM
#2665
Senior Moderator
10-12-2010, 10:19 AM
#2666
TL-SH-AWD is not competitor to M/AMG/RS.
It competes with regular BMW/Audi that are equiped with sport suspension and surpass them for its size/refinement.
Civic Euro Type R is you can put it M/AMG/RS category in its class. Even Honda Civic SI can pull 0.9g. try to imagine G pulling power of Type R and add SH-AWD over top of that. Your looking car that competes against Audi R8 with size & refinement of Acura TL.
It competes with regular BMW/Audi that are equiped with sport suspension and surpass them for its size/refinement.
Civic Euro Type R is you can put it M/AMG/RS category in its class. Even Honda Civic SI can pull 0.9g. try to imagine G pulling power of Type R and add SH-AWD over top of that. Your looking car that competes against Audi R8 with size & refinement of Acura TL.
The sport suspension setup and road holding capabilities of the Civic Type R accentuates the handling and overall driving effect to a whole new level as the car doesn't body roll even a bit be it taking a corner at 160 km/h or making an emergency stop.
Last edited by SSFTSX; 10-12-2010 at 10:21 AM.
10-12-2010, 11:20 AM
#2668
Senior Moderator
TL-SH-AWD is not competitor to M/AMG/RS.
It competes with regular BMW/Audi that are equiped with sport suspension and surpass them for its size/refinement.
Civic Euro Type R is you can put it M/AMG/RS category in its class. Even Honda Civic SI can pull 0.9g. try to imagine G pulling power of Type R and add SH-AWD over top of that. Your looking car that competes against Audi R8 with size & refinement of Acura TL.
]
It competes with regular BMW/Audi that are equiped with sport suspension and surpass them for its size/refinement.
Civic Euro Type R is you can put it M/AMG/RS category in its class. Even Honda Civic SI can pull 0.9g. try to imagine G pulling power of Type R and add SH-AWD over top of that. Your looking car that competes against Audi R8 with size & refinement of Acura TL.
]
Yea, and just like your example of comparing the TL SHAWD to a base 5 series, it isnt a competitor!
10-12-2010, 11:22 AM
#2669
My first Avatar....
*sigh*
My head hurts from this.
My head hurts from this.
10-12-2010, 11:33 AM
#2670
Acura is essentially giving SH-AWD at price of Sport package of Germans. Thats why Acura is asking $3.5K price jump from regular TL FWD to TL SH-AWD on average.
Even FWD TL pulls more Gs than base 5 series.
All those M/RS/AMG model have atleast $25K jump from base cars. Similar is Civic Type R that is $30K more expensive than Civic SI.
IF Acura creates Type R of TL. It will be atleast $25K price jump.
Car in $60K~$65K price range. that will put $90K M5 to shame.
10-12-2010, 11:41 AM
#2671
10-12-2010, 12:03 PM
#2672
I'm the Firestarter
My Audi A4 Avant S-Line can pull 0.92 g, stock. It's by far the most superior car.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
10-12-2010, 12:16 PM
#2673
It has sport suspension and Quattro. but that beside the point. It is too low to the ground. TL-SH-AWD sits hight from the ground. Once Honda adds sport suspension and lowers the car. Handling numbers will further go up.
And this thing cost $48K.
And this thing cost $48K.
plus a six-speed automatic and Quattro all-wheel drive. It also had the optional S-line package, which includes a sport suspension, 19-inch wheels with summer rubber, front sport seats, various interior trim upgrades, and S-line bumpers and rocker panel
10-12-2010, 12:57 PM
#2675
I'm the Firestarter
The A4 is superior to the TL-SH-AWD because it sits lower to the ground. The aerodynamics are superior and this provides superior handling to the SH system. The weight distribution is also much better which again improves the handling. High ground clearance is the TL's Achilles heel.
10-12-2010, 02:42 PM
#2678
Senior Moderator
Opinions, folks.
Remember, it is only an opinion...as much as you disagree with it passionately, it is still an opinion.
Remember, it is only an opinion...as much as you disagree with it passionately, it is still an opinion.
11-09-2010, 11:44 AM
#2679
Safety Car
Update
Date: November 09, 2010 09:13
Submitted by: Jeff
Source: Anonymous
Credibility Rating: 7
A source has provided some new information concerning Acura news for the coming year.
As we reported back in July, the source confirms that the 2011 model year will be a very short run for the TL. The 2012 TL will reportedly go on sale "early next year". There are said to be no sheetmetal changes, but the metallic "tramp stamp" will reportedly disappear from the trunk lid. Also, as we already knew, the grill design has been revised. 19" wheels will be standard on a new Advance package which will also introduce Acura's BSI (Blind Spot Information System) and "other enhanced features". The source supports our earlier reports that Acura's 6-speed automatic will also become a part of the TL product mix.
The new entry level sub-TSX model is on track to be shown next year. The source says it will be offered with gasoline and hybrid powertrains. Also, and I quote: "We have been told it is very edgy and very affordable. 'Think aggressive IS350' we were told." We're not exactly sure what to make of that statement.
Now, we move on to the flagship. In discussions of the upcoming RL, there are said to be consistent comparisons to the 7-series, but it seems the comparisons have mostly been focused on rear leg room. Another source of ours supports this notion that rear seat room is a priority, saying the next RL will be something in the mold of the Mercedes CLS, "a 4-door coupe but with sufficient rear head and leg room for 6+footers". Superior fuel efficiency and new engine technology have been topics that keep coming up as well. Note that in a Q&A with Automotive News that was published yesterday, Honda CEO Takanobu Ito stated:
"We are also developing a hybrid system for larger-size vehicles with a goal to make it contribute not only to fuel economy but to the attractiveness of the products. The concept for this hybrid is significantly different."
When asked about Honda's plans for positioning the Honda brand, Ito stated:
We are having a lot of discussions about Acura and which way it should be going. And what we confirmed is that the brand direction should be smart premium, not top tier.
Among the technologies we have at Honda, we must apply those that symbolize our advanced performance technology and environmental technology. We call this "smart." We agreed that smart premium is what we should be targeting with Acura, not the upper-segment vehicles such as Lexus or Mercedes-Benz. We must apply advanced technologies which make our vehicle more fun to drive, achieve a more comfortable drive and high environmental performance.
One more item of interest from that same Q&A, Ito also mentions that Honda is considering shifting TSX production to the US. And finally, speaking of the TSX, the TSX Sportwagon will be in showrooms within the next 2 months. To be more specific, "late December-early January" is what we've been told. Among the technologies we have at Honda, we must apply those that symbolize our advanced performance technology and environmental technology. We call this "smart." We agreed that smart premium is what we should be targeting with Acura, not the upper-segment vehicles such as Lexus or Mercedes-Benz. We must apply advanced technologies which make our vehicle more fun to drive, achieve a more comfortable drive and high environmental performance.
11-09-2010, 11:50 AM
#2680
Burning Brakes
The new entry level sub-TSX model is on track to be shown next year. The source says it will be offered with gasoline and hybrid powertrains. Also, and I quote: "We have been told it is very edgy and very affordable. 'Think aggressive IS350' we were told." We're not exactly sure what to make of that statement.