fiatlux

Nevermind, it looks like the NSX engine was indeed developed in Japan:

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cul...017-acura-nsx/

BEAR-AvHistory

Watch the Cosworth NSX engine being built in Anna Ohio

Cosworth made the Honda drawings work with realistic changes & produced a running engine. At the end of the day the parts that get assembled come out of the Cosworth plant with the Cosworth modifications that made it an actual production engine not just a collection of drawings.

Legend2TL

It's not entirely clear but from the wording it sounds like the only motor components that Cosworth produces for the 2G NSX are the block and heads. Cosworth has a unique cylinder bore coating process that apparently Honda wanted. No where does Cosworth indicate they produced a running engine. Cosworth indicated they had input to the design with some changes to tolerances and dimensions of the cylinder bore and other .

From your article linked
From Cosworth
The NSX 2G pics Cosworth shows are only machined heads with no valvetrain components, whereas their same website show the Gordon Murray T50 V12 and it's completed engine which illustrates they produce a complete engine.

dzionny_dzionassi

Interesting, I have same rotors, never had a problem.

alpha0

Is there any news on what acura plans for TLX-L (long wheelbase) for China based on Type S drivetrain? If Acura adds 2-3 inch to length and adds that to rear leg room, adds other missing features like HUD and offers quilted seats like MDX, it will be a good product to compete against 5 sereis, E class, A6s and G80s. I believe it can be a good replacement for RLX and will sell more than RLX.

sonyfever

I am curious about their plan, too. My guess, however, is there will be no TLX for China, and Acura will exit China soon because they simply don't have competitive products for the market there. There is no way that Acura will bring Type-S to China, because first the engine needs particulate filter to pass the stricter emission regulation, and the projected sales volume simply does not support a business case.

F23A4

I’m more interested in seeing if the CDX make its way to the states.

SebringSilver

How can people seriously claim a TLX competes with a 5 Series, an E Class, or an A6 is just mind boggling. Look at the way the leather is wrapped around the steering wheel and then go and compare that with the way it’s done on those German cars and you immediately see the difference in quality. Don’t even bother with the shockingly cheap plastic on the window sills. Design and quality are not the same thing.

Tony Pac

definitely wrong comparison!

But the same way goes, when people here discuss and chat nonsense because it's a free forum and if we don't like it. too bad. But I definitely think 5 series and E class are just next level. I am not too sure about A6 tbh. To me, all Audi products look like VW. The same way, Honda and infiniti look alike Honda and Nissan.

alpha0

Whatever highend treatment they give to MDX -S, they can do the same for this model. I believe it will still be cheaper to develop than completely new RLX replacement if Acura wants to offer a sedan in that segment till eveything becomes EV.

SebringSilver

Therein lies the problem with most people. You talk about the way the car looks. I’m talking about the build quality and the materials. Design is free when you get to scale, but quality will always cost $$$.

Kense

Audi interiors are nothing like VW interiors. Especially on an A6. It’s not even close.

Tony Pac

This is nothing look alike?

Tony Pac

On another note: An Arteon is $52,995 CAD fully loaded from A to Z, and a base, empty, without any tech A6 starts at $65,495 CAD. And the Arteon has more HP and if you add a few similar features to the A6, the price jumps to $71K CAD! Is $18K difference justified?

SebringSilver

To people who can afford that price point and who can appreciate what makes them different then yes of course the price gap is justified. To people on a smaller budget and who don’t know the difference between the two then of course it isn’t.

Funny thing is if your theory is correct, why would anyone buy an Acura over, say, a Honda or something even worse?

pyrodan007

The Arteon has a garbage sound system. Granted you can upgrade system on Audi's, but you can't do anything for the Arteon. I was very interested in taking a look at one, but no R spec and shit sound system makes it a big waste of money for me. May as well get the Stinger. Yes, the price difference is justified. BTW, the direct comparison is not the A6, it's the A5 SB which can be had for way less than 70k.

The Stringer was also a pass for me due to interior being very meh, even after refresh. Granted my 2021 S5 SB is well above 70k, but it was a necessary evil since used "sport wagon-styled" cars are overpriced and in low inventory. Would have loved to get a 2020 S5 SB model but good luck finding them. The 2018s are much easier, but getting a nicely spec-ed one is just as hard. And they still go for 50k (all CAD prices btw), for a 4 year old first year production god knows who abused it sport sedan with almost zero warranty left.

Tony Pac

100% agreed! I always say don't compare TLX to Accord. The price is justified. I had both cars and the TL or TLX is a much superior product. I am sure you have seen people here telling members just go buy an accord and save $10K

Now the same theory goes with A6 and Areton, I am sure there is a difference in material and driving experience, but I just wanted to bring it to people attention that it's not always cool to compare the TLX to Accord. That's all! you see members' reaction isn't positive when you compare their car to another lower brand/vehicle.

Tony Pac

I don't want to argue and waste your time. But let's be honest, are you paying $10-$15K for a sound system? I understand the A6 has probably a prestigious name, better leather and an awesome AWD. I highly doubt anyone pays that price for an A6 for the sound system. But again, if you do...good for you!

pyrodan007

Have you not read the reactions on this forum, most of the reasons people are getting the FWD TLX is due to the better sound system. Yes, for people that can afford it, it's worth the premium. Plus the other upgrades that come when stepping up to a luxury brand/model.

Edward'TLS

Back in the 2000's, VW had released the Phaeton sedan in the North American market. It was a full size luxury sedan like the Audi A8, and could be equipped with all high-tech bells and whistles that one could think of during that period, including a giant W12 twelve cylinder optional engine. Moreover, it also carried a hefty price tag that rivaled the Audi A8.

In the end, the VW Phaeton had to be axed due to dismay sales. The VW Phaeton was a good car, except that no one was stupid enough to spend such money on a VW sedan.

BEAR-AvHistory

Definition: great comfort especially as provided by expensive & beautiful possessions. Something expensive that is pleasant to have but not necessary

You don't need to justify a luxury item. They are wants not needs. You buy it because you want it & can afford it, thats why its called a luxury item. Another way it can be looked at is your financial position & earning power can determine what is a luxury car & what is not. A TLX Type S might be a luxury item to some one with a Civic budget but a TLX Type S is not a luxury item to someone who can spend $71,000 for a car.

Example: Do you really think someone going in to buy a $140,000 M5 @ 605BHP is really concerned about the price being $85,800 more than a base 240BHP 530i? For this buyer even an $85,000 car is not a "luxury" item.

Bang for the Buck & Luxury are polar opposites.

Tony Pac

“most of the reasons”! I knew something like this will be your argument

pyrodan007

I specifically mentioned TLX FWD since besides the sound system, the Accord Touring has the better "luxury" items, performance, and interior space. You keep on comparing the Arteon to the A6 because of price, but features don't align. It's clone is the A5 Sportback. It's like comparing the Accord to the RLX if it still existed.

Tony Pac

Please kindly provide me that data of TLX FWD. I have never seen a single data set of Acura showing SH-AWD and FWD sales numbers separately. So how do you know how many AWD vs FWD were sold? Or you are simply assuming based on the "Enthusiasts" of this forum
And in Canada, Acura sells only AWD. There is no more FWD.

F23A4

...also more comfortable yet more supportive seats, better handling (despite the added curb weight), far less repugnant exterior styling (subjective).

pyrodan007

Who mentioned sales? Now look who's going off topic. I specifically mentioned people preferences on this site based on comments. No one needs a TLX, but SOME people still prefer a base TLX to a loaded Accord. Price goes out the door when luxury and preferences are involved. Once you involve AWD, it's understandable why TLX wins in sales.

Tony Pac

Show me the data for preference? I wrote sales since that's the only we can know the number of people which model they prefer. I don't have the data for preference. Or again, you are referring to the "Real Enthusiasts" preference. Please bring facts and not Joe and Moe said that. I heard people prefer Jetta over A4. is this a fact? of course not. No one cares what they said or thought.


And BTW if it was based on this site, Acura would have closed its doors last year and not sold 18K+ units last month.

pyrodan007

This conversation is going nowhere as usual, the same flawed logic as comparing Arteon to A6 when it's really Arteon vs A5 SB.
Yes, the RLX has a better sound system than an Accord and it's worth the price difference. Same for A6 vs Arteon, the end.

Tony Pac

No worries brother!
Enjoy your Friday!

Tony Pac

I am not sure how reliable his analysis is but I watched this the other day. I think it's a cool video about different brands and their sound system .Hope you enjoy: @pyrodan007

F23A4

The Best Car Audio Systems 2021: Top Cars With Best Speakers and Sound - Rolling Stone

Tony Pac

i think the ELS sound system is one the top systems out there, especially at this price point. Acura may have screwed up the last 10 years but their sound systems never disappointed. Now with the new design, better performance and a great sound system, Acura has a winning formula

F23A4

Changing gears:


....noteworthy comment referencing the TLX-S at 6:30 - 6:45; and he just finished shaking down the the TLX-S at Laguna Seca.

ELIN

Definitely an eye-opener from Alex!

Camaro194

I'm wondering if press cars are out and about. Looks like a Type S in that promo.

Camaro194

One more review from the Cali event:

fiatlux

They talked about the Type S about 30 min in. They said they're filming the shop section tonight. Initial impressions is that they liked the dynamics of the car, and they even said it can do things you can't do in the 3-series (excluding the M3). However, they kept talking about how the engine is a letdown because it doesn't rev out, and it no longer feels special anymore. The old Type S felt special because of the engine even if the car wasn't as dynamic, but this one is the other way around.

Jack's issue with the engine is that you can put it into another car (Audi, BMW, Infiniti) and it would feel at home there; it doesn't feel like a Honda engine. And other turbocharged engines can be wound out (B58 has a 7K redline), but the Type S redlines at 6200. They do say it's not a bad car, and that it's a very good car, but it may not appeal to old school Honda/Acura fans.

Kense

There’s nothing alike here. The VW looks more like an accords interior. Not to mention the quality of materials is night and day.

Tony Pac

sure there is no resemblance at all 🤣

mapleloaf

His testing is very thorough. It's interesting that after testing the 2021 TLX top end ELS system, he ranked it as the best system in a sedan he had heard. It is absolutely spectacular sound and one of the many reasons i consider my TLX an excellent value.