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It looks like we got more data from C&D: 13.6s quarter miles, just like what the AHC guys got. Are you going to eat crow yet?
I guess things don't exactly work out the way we think they will, do they?
Hahaha. All good. Never said Type S is that fast anyway. We all know now that something was def up with that S4 comparison at the launch. They either butchered the S4 or had the press cars running at higher boost. Would not pass it by them....
What amount of discount did you get and do you really think that every Joe walking into a BMW dealership could get a deal as good as yours?
I got 8% off MSRP and other discounts and I’m a first time BMW customer. Most people can. This was Pre Covid since all cars right now are MSRP at minimum. It’s easier to deal with BMW than Acura or even Kia who thinks their performance cars are exotics. Also if you use a Broker you don’t do anything but pay $350 and wait for your car.
The first post was from someone who was offered invoice from the get go, plus $3000 worth of incentives.
When I was considering the M2 Comp the quotes I was getting as the initial offer was about $2000 under invoice. If you check out the pricing threads people were regularly getting $3-4K under invoice: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1541148.
Fact of the matter is that the pre-pandemic street price for BMWs are a lot lower than you'd think just by looking at the sticker price. 10% off sticker at a minimum is what people should aim for.
The first post was from someone who was offered invoice from the get go, plus $3000 worth of incentives.
When I was considering the M2 Comp the quotes I was getting as the initial offer was about $2000 under invoice. If you check out the pricing threads people were regularly getting $3-4K under invoice: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1541148.
Fact of the matter is that the pre-pandemic street price for BMWs are a lot lower than you'd think just by looking at the sticker price. 10% off sticker at a minimum is what people should aim for.
Thanks for the information, but the links you posted contain 3 year old pricing comments. You don’t have anything more recent?
Originally Posted by dmskiView Post
The fact that they let journalists drag against the S4 proves that Type S is faster.With that, it's not that far off from 340 which is a damn fast car.
Not exactly. The M340 beat the S4 by more than the S4 beat the Type-S. Check the inconvenient vids. Meanwhile the TLX-S VS M340 C&D numbers
60 mph 4.9 sec VS 3.8 sec
1/4-Mile 13.6 sec @ 103 mph VS 12.3 seconds at 116 mph.
Looks like, could be wrong, they let a selected "journalist", Red Line, do a launch, period. All the rest was just a photo-op to have a German car in the launch commercial. Have not read or seen vids of anyone else going head to head with the two cars at Laguna Seca. That should have been a very big clue that all was not going as planned. If the Type-S could actually beat the S4 YouTube would have been flooded with the vids.
Just for a history refresh. Remember the "leaked" photos s year or so ago of the TLX-Type-S testing with the MB C43AMG, BMW M340 & Audi S4 setting the table. Then you have guys here saying that Acura's engineering never really intended to compete with the Germans. If thats true then marketing has gone rogue, playing their own game, & senior management has never pulled their leash.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 07-13-2021 at 11:34 AM.
If you copy the link while looking at the page you referenced in your post that is the page that will appear when others click the link here.
Spread over 18 yeas for the ones I got never less then minus 10% or more than minus 15% or so. General chip & car shortage will make 2021/22 the tightest in a very long time. Could sell mine today 18 months old at a profit.
Not exactly. The M340 beat the S4 by more than the S4 beat the Type-S. Check the inconvenient vids. Meanwhile the TLX-S VS M340 C&D numbers
60 mph 4.9 sec VS 3.8 sec
1/4-Mile 13.6 sec @ 103 mph VS 12.3 seconds at 116 mph.
Looks like, could be wrong, they let a selected "journalist", Red Line, do a launch, period. All the rest was just a photo-op to have a German car in the launch commercial. Have not read or seen vids of anyone else going head to head with the two cars at Laguna Seca. That should have been a very big clue that all was not going as planned. If the Type-S could actually beat the S4 YouTube would have been flooded with the vids.
Just for a history refresh. Remember the "leaked" photos s year or so ago of the TLX-Type-S testing with the MB C43AMG, BMW M340 & Audi S4 setting the table. Then you have guys here saying that Acura's engineering never really intended to compete with the Germans. If thats true then marketing has gone rogue, playing their own game, & senior management has never pulled their leash.
The first post was from someone who was offered invoice from the get go, plus $3000 worth of incentives.
When I was considering the M2 Comp the quotes I was getting as the initial offer was about $2000 under invoice. If you check out the pricing threads people were regularly getting $3-4K under invoice: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1541148.
Fact of the matter is that the pre-pandemic street price for BMWs are a lot lower than you'd think just by looking at the sticker price. 10% off sticker at a minimum is what people should aim for.
I'm currently in the process of buying an m340i. I've placed an order with the exact options I want. The dealer never charges any markup, but they are holding firm to MSRP minus rebates. My sales guy says this isn't just due to the severe shortage, but that "the industry" is moving this direction altogether where everyone just pays MSRP.
If I was like you guys a true enthusiasts, and care so much about 0-60 and 4.5 vs4.6. I wouldn't have spent a min in Acurazine. Believe me. The number of you guys participating here and wasting your time arguing about 0-60 about a $50-55K car surprises me
if you care so much about these fraction of seconds and of course Sam's drag race, you should all buy a Ferrari. Enjoy!
I'm currently in the process of buying an m340i. I've placed an order with the exact options I want. The dealer never charges any markup, but they are holding firm to MSRP minus rebates. My sales guy says this isn't just due to the severe shortage, but that "the industry" is moving this direction altogether where everyone just pays MSRP.
If I was like you guys a true enthusiasts, and care so much about 0-60 and 4.5 vs4.6. I wouldn't have spent a min in Acurazine. Believe me. The number of you guys participating here and wasting your time arguing about 0-60 about a $50-55K car surprises me
if you care so much about these fraction of seconds and of course Sam's drag race, you should all buy a Ferrari. Enjoy!
Enjoy the conversation for what it is, brother. Acura needs to shovel it's own mess like a big boy. They started the fight guns a-blazing with a Super Soaker
The 0-60 difference between an Accord and Type-S is 0.3s, but price is 20k+ more. Forget the Ferrari.
Unlike the regular TLX, this section of the market is much less forgiving.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 09:24 AM.
I think what people are missing is that not everyone is keen to go through gazillion options that the Germans have, to get some of the basic stuff. Thats where Acura shines with its simple to understand packages. Want luxurious Accord, get the base TLX, want a little tech get the tech package, want Stylish appearance go for A Spec, want all creature comforts get Advance/Elite. Easy choices. Now with Type-S want a sporty reliable car go for Type-S
I know some would still do all the math on various options on a German and find it cheaper than an Acura even if that means spending a lot of time understanding it.
One way to look at it is Acura shoppers are like Costco members, they trust its the best quality and cheapest and buy it without checking elsewhere. While there are others who rely on coupons and may find stuff better and/or cheaper than Costco
Last edited by technocrat; 07-14-2021 at 09:24 AM.
If I was like you guys a true enthusiasts, and care so much about 0-60 and 4.5 vs4.6. I wouldn't have spent a min in Acurazine. Believe me. The number of you guys participating here and wasting your time arguing about 0-60 about a $50-55K car surprises me
if you care so much about these fraction of seconds and of course Sam's drag race, you should all buy a Ferrari. Enjoy!
Acura's problem is they picked a performance fight with the wrong guys. Now you all are trying to walk back your comments over the past few years. One even said the engineers had no intention of competing with the Germans. Wonder who brought the prototypes to Spain to play cars?
Testing in SPAIN "The leader of the pack"
Spied being benchmarked against an Audi S4 Avant and Mercedes-AMG C43,Acura has previously described the engine as a “high-performance powerplant”
Acura's problem is they picked a performance fight with the wrong guys. Now you all are trying to walk back your comments over the past few years. One even said the engineers had no intention of competing with the Germans. Wonder who brought the prototypes to Spain to play cars?
Testing in SPAIN "The leader of the pack"
Spied being benchmarked against an Audi S4 Avant and Mercedes-AMG C43,Acura has previously described the engine as a “high-performance powerplant”
There are currently only two drag races available on YouTube that involve Type S. Both from Sam CarLegion. TLX lost both; drag an roll. So far it's been matched against S4 and G70 and so far TLX is 0 for 2. Ridiculous and embarrassing are the two words that come to mind. They hyped this car for almost 4 years and dared to say it's the best performance sport sedan ever. Once again for the umptieth time; Acura overpromised and underdelivered.
Enjoy the conversation for what it is, brother. Acura needs to shovel it's own mess like a big boy. They started the fight guns a-blazing with a Super Soaker
The 0-60 difference between an Accord and Type-S is 0.3s, but price is 20k+ more. Forget the Ferrari.
Unlike the regular TLX, this section of the market is much less forgiving.
I wish Acura or any other brands could care about you and I
Customers come and go...business is business. You and I will stop buying, and there will be another set of new customer start buying. This is the game in any industry. Research shows that that most customers stick to a brand for 10 years and then there is a shift. You and few other may not like the Acura brand. That's fine. They still find 150K+ people to buy their cars. And as you know their target for TLX or entire brand is very modest. So they know what they are doing. If Acura would have came and said, we will sell 500K cars per year and we will expand to Europe, Australia and middle east. i would have been the first one to point that out.
I wish Acura or any other brands could care about you and I
Customers come and go...business is business. You and I will stop buying, and there will be another set of new customer start buying. This is the game in any industry. Research shows that that most customers stick to a brand for 10 years and then there is a shift. You and few other may not like the Acura brand. That's fine. They still find 150K+ people to buy their cars. And as you know their target for TLX or entire brand is very modest. So they know what they are doing. If Acura would have came and said, we will sell 500K cars per year and we will expand to Europe, Australia and middle east. i would have been the first one to point that out.
Oops. You're exaggerating and making sweeping generalizations again. Do you know why Amazon has massive retention rate? Putting the customer first. I'm never wrong when I reach out with an order problem or return. Automakers should strive for such relentless pursuit of customer satisfaction. Meanwhile, you're suggesting exactly the opposite, at least applicable to me personally, which is that people just go buy any car they like because they have the memory of a gnat. That's false. I know what I've driven in the past, lean toward Asian, and historically favored Honda of the lot. Why? Good value, decent performance and superior reliability. The only reason I was ready to walk from the brand was the piss poor quality of my 1G TLX and the apathy of my dealership to do anything about it. Memories like those stick with people for life. Honda should be glad that they make such a great Accord.
Besides customer retention, you swung and missed on another point that proves you know nothing about business - competition. Amazon succeeded in the e-commerce land-grab not just by being first, but being secure with credit card info, providing good service and pricing out competition. They are still doing all those things to this date. Their high quality service why I'm never giving up my subscription, although I trimmed my share quantity for the time being. People don't just come and go. If no one was discerning, we would all drive GMC Envoys. There are like 10 legit automakers competing for your dollar. VWAG, BMW, HMC, TM, GM, F, Fuji, Hyundai, Daimler/FCA, plus all their brands and probably a few more companies I excluded.
You know what happens when you build bad cars? No, automakers don't simply find new buyers. They die. Saab #1 before they were bought out. Then Saab #2 after they were bought out. Pontiac. Oldsmobile. Volvo #1 before they were bought. Mercury. Edsel. Eagle. Saturn. Scion. And on and on. Eventually, it's more profitable to kill the brand than to sell a bad car at a loss.
Lastly, careful when you throw out swag numbers like 500k. That's a massive target for sedans nowadays. Neither the Camry nor Accord hit that number. Combined they would be just over that. Those cars are so good (they have to be to perennially to sell that volume) that Ford and GM basically stopped making sedans and left that market. These are all points that show how wrong your sentiment is and how unlikely it is that you'll ever be a CEO of any company providing any service or making any product.
Acura's problem is they picked a performance fight with the wrong guys. Now you all are trying to walk back your comments over the past few years. One even said the engineers had no intention of competing with the Germans. Wonder who brought the prototypes to Spain to play cars?
Testing in SPAIN "The leader of the pack"
Spied being benchmarked against an Audi S4 Avant and Mercedes-AMG C43,Acura has previously described the engine as a “high-performance powerplant”
Yeah but just look at that presence and stance! /s
Oops. You're exaggerating and making sweeping generalizations again. Do you know why Amazon has massive retention rate? Putting the customer first. I'm never wrong when I reach out with an order problem or return. Automakers should strive for such relentless pursuit of customer satisfaction. Meanwhile, you're suggesting exactly the opposite, at least applicable to me personally, which is that people just go buy any car they like because they have the memory of a gnat. That's false. I know what I've driven in the past, lean toward Asian, and historically favored Honda of the lot. Why? Good value, decent performance and superior reliability. The only reason I was ready to walk from the brand was the piss poor quality of my 1G TLX and the apathy of my dealership to do anything about it. Memories like those stick with people for life. Honda should be glad that they make such a great Accord.
Besides customer retention, you swung and missed on another point that proves you know nothing about business - competition. Amazon succeeded in the e-commerce land-grab not just by being first, but being secure with credit card info, providing good service and pricing out competition. They are still doing all those things to this date. Their high quality service why I'm never giving up my subscription, although I trimmed my share quantity for the time being. People don't just come and go. If no one was discerning, we would all drive GMC Envoys. There are like 10 legit automakers competing for your dollar. VWAG, BMW, HMC, TM, GM, F, Fuji, Hyundai, Daimler/FCA, plus all their brands and probably a few more companies I excluded.
You know what happens when you build bad cars? No, automakers don't simply find new buyers. They die. Saab #1 before they were bought out. Then Saab #2 after they were bought out. Pontiac. Oldsmobile. Volvo #1 before they were bought. Mercury. Edsel. Eagle. Saturn. Scion. And on and on. Eventually, it's more profitable to kill the brand than to sell a bad car at a loss.
Lastly, careful when you throw out swag numbers like 500k. That's a massive target for sedans nowadays. Neither the Camry nor Accord hit that number. Combined they would be just over that. Those cars are so good (they have to be to perennially to sell that volume) that Ford and GM basically stopped making sedans and left that market. These are all points that show how wrong your sentiment is and how unlikely it is that you'll ever be a CEO of any company providing any service or making any product.
You missed the whole point.! All good. Enjoy your day brother.
My perspective from what I've seen posted here, Facebook and YouTube, I am not here to start rolling out absurd excuses on why the base 3-series lost. It's still a proven fact that the K5 is quicker. So I for one can accept the reality of it for what it is. The difference is, you have a bunch of dead from the neck up fanboys that will continue to roll out every single excuse or reason why the TLX or TLX-S is still better. I already listed some of the petty excuses posted. Just to prove more of a point, if you read Baktash (tonypac) and Jeffery (Honda430) comments on the TLX 2nd gen FB group, you will see what I am saying because others find their comments hilarious. Facts are still facts, they don't change. A normal person will accept it for what it is and not try to make excuses or play stupid about it. You have Tony once again acting like a child because he can't accept the truth and makes ass backwards statements. Nearly everyone explained to Jeffery with poof and you still have him here trying to defend the brand. You have another user here who posted the crap Acura claims about their SH-AWD system and that the M340i, C43, G70 & S4 will be in the junkyards while the TLX-S will still be on the road. So when are we going to grow up?
My perspective from what I've seen posted here, Facebook and YouTube, I am not here to start rolling out absurd excuses on why the base 3-series lost. It's still a proven fact that the K5 is quicker. So I for one can accept the reality of it for what it is. The difference is, you have a bunch of dead from the neck up fanboys that will continue to roll out every single excuse or reason why the TLX or TLX-S is still better. I already listed some of the petty excuses posted. Just to prove more of a point, if you read Baktash (tonypac) and Jeffery (Honda430) comments on the TLX 2nd gen FB group, you will see what I am saying because others find their comments hilarious. Facts are still facts, they don't change. A normal person will accept it for what it is and not try to make excuses or play stupid about it. You have Tony once again acting like a child because he can't accept the truth and makes ass backwards statements. Nearly everyone explained to Jeffery with poof and you still have him here trying to defend the brand. You have another user here who posted the crap Acura claims about their SH-AWD system and that the M340i, C43, G70 & S4 will be in the junkyards while the TLX-S will still be on the road. So when are we going to grow up?
You think these excuses are bad, you should check out some of the excuses on the FB page. Some guy is adament that Honda restricts the power of the car to 305hp until 3000KM. I also see excuses about how the Type S is a track car, and it'll plow the doors off of the competition on a race track.
Also seeing some excuses about how the Type S was not in Sport+ mode, or how they didn't allow it to cool down between runs, or how Sam is an Acura hater and purposely rigged the tests.
My perspective from what I've seen posted here, Facebook and YouTube, I am not here to start rolling out absurd excuses on why the base 3-series lost. It's still a proven fact that the K5 is quicker. So I for one can accept the reality of it for what it is. The difference is, you have a bunch of dead from the neck up fanboys that will continue to roll out every single excuse or reason why the TLX or TLX-S is still better. I already listed some of the petty excuses posted. Just to prove more of a point, if you read Baktash (tonypac) and Jeffery (Honda430) comments on the TLX 2nd gen FB group, you will see what I am saying because others find their comments hilarious. Facts are still facts, they don't change. A normal person will accept it for what it is and not try to make excuses or play stupid about it. You have Tony once again acting like a child because he can't accept the truth and makes ass backwards statements. Nearly everyone explained to Jeffery with poof and you still have him here trying to defend the brand. You have another user here who posted the crap Acura claims about their SH-AWD system and that the M340i, C43, G70 & S4 will be in the junkyards while the TLX-S will still be on the road. So when are we going to grow up?
We use handles here for a reason. Why is it you felt the need to out us? 😏 Might as well provide the board with your first name while you’re at it. Maybe you can post something here from the FB group that I wrote that supports your contention. You have my permission.
We use handles here for a reason. Why is it you felt the need to out us? 😏 Might as well provide the board with your first name while you’re at it. Maybe you can post something here from the FB group that I wrote that supports your contention. You have my permission.
Just to show how much of the denial game you play
Jeffery J.
What are they claiming to be? For the most part I ignore all advertising so when I hear people make statements like this I’m left a bit in the dark.
This was your response to those TELLING you that Acura set themselves as a performance brand and hyped up the TLX-S. They put themselves against the top 3.
So let me get this straight Jeffery, a person like yourself such a loyal Acura / Honda owner for 15+ years, an active member here and on several FB group are going to tell me and others that you are "In the dark" with what Acura advertises?? Are you believing your own bullshit? I'll call out whoever I want at this point, because it's time to grow up and you're old enough at this point.
My perspective from what I've seen posted here, Facebook and YouTube, I am not here to start rolling out absurd excuses on why the base 3-series lost. It's still a proven fact that the K5 is quicker. So I for one can accept the reality of it for what it is. The difference is, you have a bunch of dead from the neck up fanboys that will continue to roll out every single excuse or reason why the TLX or TLX-S is still better. I already listed some of the petty excuses posted. Just to prove more of a point, if you read Baktash (tonypac) and Jeffery (Honda430) comments on the TLX 2nd gen FB group, you will see what I am saying because others find their comments hilarious. Facts are still facts, they don't change. A normal person will accept it for what it is and not try to make excuses or play stupid about it. You have Tony once again acting like a child because he can't accept the truth and makes ass backwards statements. Nearly everyone explained to Jeffery with poof and you still have him here trying to defend the brand. You have another user here who posted the crap Acura claims about their SH-AWD system and that the M340i, C43, G70 & S4 will be in the junkyards while the TLX-S will still be on the road. So when are we going to grow up?
Originally Posted by fiatlux
You think these excuses are bad, you should check out some of the excuses on the FB page. Some guy is adament that Honda restricts the power of the car to 305hp until 3000KM. I also see excuses about how the Type S is a track car, and it'll plow the doors off of the competition on a race track.
Also seeing some excuses about how the Type S was not in Sport+ mode, or how they didn't allow it to cool down between runs, or how Sam is an Acura hater and purposely rigged the tests.
Jeffery J.
What are they claiming to be? For the most part I ignore all advertising so when I hear people make statements like this I’m left a bit in the dark.
This was your response to those TELLING you that Acura set themselves as a performance brand and hyped up the TLX-S. They put themselves against the top 3.
So let me get this straight Jeffery, a person like yourself such a loyal Acura / Honda owner for 15+ years, an active member here and on several FB group are going to tell me and others that you are "In the dark" with what Acura advertises?? Are you believing your own bullshit? I'll call out whoever I want at this point, because it's time to grow up and you're old enough at this point to not give a shit about what anyone wants to say.
Yes, I think most marketing is a bullshit attempt at mind control. Unless you can prove it you shouldn’t believe it. So if you can’t prove it why read it in depth. Come on man we’re not all mice bemused by to the pied piper’s flute playing. I pride myself on my ability to think independently.
Jeffery J.
What are they claiming to be? For the most part I ignore all advertising so when I hear people make statements like this I’m left a bit in the dark.
This was your response to those TELLING you that Acura set themselves as a performance brand and hyped up the TLX-S. They put themselves against the top 3.
So let me get this straight Jeffery, a person like yourself such a loyal Acura / Honda owner for 15+ years, an active member here and on several FB group are going to tell me and others that you are "In the dark" with what Acura advertises?? Are you believing your own bullshit? I'll call out whoever I want at this point, because it's time to grow up and you're old enough at this point.
I'm trying to figure out how this guy (or anyone else) could be confused about the brand, its advertisements or its goals after seeing any of their recent commercials:
So how many instances of street racing, references to Hondacura cars on race tracks and drifting by an NSX did you see? Sure doesn't look like Acura is trying to appeal to the same buyer that Toyota is targeting with the Corolla.
So how many instances of street racing, references to Hondacura cars on race tracks and drifting by an NSX did you see? Sure doesn't look like Acura is trying to appeal to the same buyer that Toyota is targeting with the Corolla.
I’m shocked. You guys bought into to that marketing? No wonder many of you are disappointed. SMH
So how many instances of street racing, references to Hondacura cars on race tracks and drifting by an NSX did you see? Sure doesn't look like Acura is trying to appeal to the same buyer that Toyota is targeting with the Corolla.
Exactly. Just as good as someone claiming that Acura isn't advertising themselves as a performance brand. Excuse me, but why are they showing Ms. Soccer mom on a race track in an MDX and has a helmet on? Oh gotcha.. It means she's encountering a hazard up ahead and needs to wear a helmet to protect herself while "Racing" to pick up the kiddos from school. Right.
Why is it our fault? At least we aren't in the dark
Because you should understand that most marketing is bullshit. It’s like y’all still believe in Santa Claus. You really should be more discerning about what you read and see on screens. Don’t get mad at me because you’re so gullible.
Because you should understand that most marketing is bullshit. It’s like y’all still believe in Santa Claus. You really should be more discerning about what you read and see on screens. Don’t get mad at me because you’re gullible.
We don't believe it. I prefer to get my info from C&D than ads. But that doesn't stop Acura from making these. And here is the real problem for Acura - when BMW, Mercedes and Lexus make their commercials and they show their sedans with silhouettes of their former and past racecars doing hill climbs, rally races, and burnouts, or showing husbands gifting their ridiculously luxurious cars to wives, they actually back up the performance and prestige - unlike Acura.
At this point, it's obvious that you're pretending to be really smart by pretending to be really dumb. Ultimately, you sound butthurt about being told your brand may be inferior to others, at least on luxury or performance metrics.
Because you should understand that most marketing is bullshit. It’s like y’all still believe in Santa Claus. You really should be more discerning about what you read and see on screens. Don’t get mad at me because you’re so gullible.
Yeah OK Acura fan, i'm far from gullible or delusional.
Jeffery J: You guys want Acura to be something they never were. At least with this generation they are in the conversation. Like I said in my earlier post if you want to be king of the hill pay $10k+ more and buy the car that bests the competition. Sorry fellows that Acura couldn’t deliver on your $52k dreams. Buy a G70 or Stinger and move on. Could be it’s just because I’m older, but I really don’t understand why folks crave for a 4 second 0-60 in a daily driver.
Why you still upset? You keep failing to realize Acura dealerships are marking these up and they over hyped the TLX and TLX-S to be something ITS NOT.. The way I see is, you bought the base TLX, upset that people are calling out Acura for their BS and now your here with your cape to protect the brand. Sounds like you have some issues.
07-13-2021, 09:50 AM
