2021 Acura TLX vs The Competition
#722
We don't believe it. I prefer to get my info from C&D than ads. But that doesn't stop Acura from making these. And here is the real problem for Acura - when BMW, Mercedes and Lexus make their commercials and they show their sedans with silhouettes of their former and past racecars doing hill climbs, rally races, and burnouts, or showing husbands gifting their ridiculously luxurious cars to wives, they actually back up the performance and prestige - unlike Acura.
#723
Some Guy Who Loves Cars
What’s the point and what in the hell does that have to do with you as a human being? Who cares what Acura does? I’d suggest you remove that one from your anger list and invest that energy into something that actually makes you or those around you feel more positive. Just chill man and enjoy life.
I do love my life. I love cars too. I don't love all Acura cars, but I love many of them, including the TSX I owned. I love every Honda car I've owned and driven. I'm not angry. Well I'm kinda angry. Sometimes I sound angry, usually toward my TLX or Acura as a brand being a shell of its former self. But I come here to discuss the brand and all cars. I'm chilled. Are you? If you're not here to discuss Acura, or don't care what they do, you could probably exit the forum and go back to trolling on Facebook.
Last edited by someguy11; 07-14-2021 at 01:51 PM.
#724
Yeah OK Acura fan, i'm far from gullible or delusional. ![rofl](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rofl.gif)
Jeffery J:
You guys want Acura to be something they never were. At least with this generation they are in the conversation. Like I said in my earlier post if you want to be king of the hill pay $10k+ more and buy the car that bests the competition. Sorry fellows that Acura couldn’t deliver on your $52k dreams. Buy a G70 or Stinger and move on. Could be it’s just because I’m older, but I really don’t understand why folks crave for a 4 second 0-60 in a daily driver.
Why you still upset? You keep failing to realize Acura dealerships are marking these up and they over hyped the TLX and TLX-S to be something ITS NOT.. The way I see is, you bought the base TLX, upset that people are calling out Acura for their BS and now your here with your cape to protect the brand. Sounds like you have some issues.
![rofl](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rofl.gif)
Jeffery J:
You guys want Acura to be something they never were. At least with this generation they are in the conversation. Like I said in my earlier post if you want to be king of the hill pay $10k+ more and buy the car that bests the competition. Sorry fellows that Acura couldn’t deliver on your $52k dreams. Buy a G70 or Stinger and move on. Could be it’s just because I’m older, but I really don’t understand why folks crave for a 4 second 0-60 in a daily driver.
Why you still upset? You keep failing to realize Acura dealerships are marking these up and they over hyped the TLX and TLX-S to be something ITS NOT.. The way I see is, you bought the base TLX, upset that people are calling out Acura for their BS and now your here with your cape to protect the brand. Sounds like you have some issues.
#725
Who cares what Acura does? This is an Acura forum, where people come to talk about Acura, critique Acura cars and discuss other Acura things like commercials. Discussing. Acura. Is literally. The point. Of this forum.
I do love my life. I love cars too. I don't love all Acura cars, but I love many of them, including the TSX I owned. I love every Honda car I've owned and driven. I'm not angry. Well I'm kinda angry. Sometimes I sound angry, usually toward my TLX or Acura as a brand being a shell of its former self. But I come here to discuss the brand and all cars. I'm chilled. Are you? If you're not here to discuss Acura, or don't care what they do, you could probably exit the forum and go back to trolling on Facebook.
I do love my life. I love cars too. I don't love all Acura cars, but I love many of them, including the TSX I owned. I love every Honda car I've owned and driven. I'm not angry. Well I'm kinda angry. Sometimes I sound angry, usually toward my TLX or Acura as a brand being a shell of its former self. But I come here to discuss the brand and all cars. I'm chilled. Are you? If you're not here to discuss Acura, or don't care what they do, you could probably exit the forum and go back to trolling on Facebook.
#726
That's probably because the deniers and fanboys and apologists are the reason why Acura thinks it can continue to underperform. What twists the knife is that these fanboys purpoit to be enthusiasts when really they're just enables. And truth be told, an underperforming and underwhelming Type S is not going to make or break Acura's business. How many additional sales could a really good Type S generate them? Maybe 5K a year, if even that? When it comes to their crossovers, that's a rounding error.
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#727
That's probably because the deniers and fanboys and apologists are the reason why Acura thinks it can continue to underperform. What twists the knife is that these fanboys purpoit to be enthusiasts when really they're just enables. And truth be told, an underperforming and underwhelming Type S is not going to make or break Acura's business. How many additional sales could a really good Type S generate them? Maybe 5K a year, if even that? When it comes to their crossovers, that's a rounding error.
#728
Burning Brakes
It didn't need that much more R&D to do so: a bit more boost, some weight reduction, and a beefier tranny. If the AWD is the weak point, well that's something else.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 03:16 PM.
#729
I beg to differ, if the Type-S had very close performance to the M340i and had all luxury options standard, it would have a ripped a new asshole in the German's sport sedan sales. Probably even taking some of the regular models too. I can get an 330i/A4/C300 or a sport sedan for the same price.
It didn't need that much more R&D to do so: a bit more boost, some weight reduction, and a beefier tranny. If the AWD is the weak point, well that's something else.
It didn't need that much more R&D to do so: a bit more boost, some weight reduction, and a beefier tranny. If the AWD is the weak point, well that's something else.
#730
Burning Brakes
Are you an automobile engineer who is familiar with the Honda supply chain, profit targets, and corporate governance? Absent that knowledge you realistically can’t say how easy anything can be done by Acura. I believe that under the circumstances they have put what they believe is their best foot forward. If the effort doesn’t meet with your needs don’t buy the vehicle. It’s really as simple as that. Might be time for you to go haunt the Audi forums and espouse on the merits and deficiencies of the A4 with A4 owners.
Clearly Acura engineers know jack shit too to say it competes with the S4 ... and stop using price as a selling point since it means nothing for performance. The Type-S' competition will always be the S4/M340i/C43 AMG even if they cost 20k more, starting price is similar and they all have the same engine from low to high option ranges.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 04:29 PM.
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#731
Burning Brakes
What I don't get is if all the Acura fans don't all of a sudden care about going fast or 0-60 times in the 4 ranges. Why not just get the Regular TLX? Why do you even care about the Type S since everybody else is stupid for wanting to Drag race or Dragy their 0-60 times? If none of that matters to you, just get a base TLX or an Accord then? Why is there even a Type S if nobody cares about going fast?
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#732
Burning Brakes
What I don't get is if all the Acura fans don't all of a sudden care about going fast or 0-60 times in the 4 ranges. Why not just get the Regular TLX? Why do you even care about the Type S since everybody else is stupid for wanting to Drag race or Dragy their 0-60 times? If none of that matters to you, just get a base TLX or an Accord then? Why is there even a Type S if nobody cares about going fast?
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 04:49 PM.
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#733
Before the TLX-S became the slowest new car in the segment, I'm wondering if those ppl harping atm had went onto the previous slowest car's forums to harp there (not sure which car was the slowest prior to the TLX-S)
Also... never realized marketing was such a sensitive subject here lol
Also... never realized marketing was such a sensitive subject here lol
#734
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
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Before the TLX-S became the slowest new car in the segment, I'm wondering if those ppl harping atm had went onto the previous slowest car's forums to harp there (not sure which car was the slowest prior to the TLX-S)
Also... never realized marketing was such a sensitive subject here lol
Also... never realized marketing was such a sensitive subject here lol
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#735
I beg to differ, if the Type-S had very close performance to the M340i and had all luxury options standard, it would have a ripped a new asshole in the German's sport sedan sales. Probably even taking some of the regular models too. I can get an 330i/A4/C300 or a sport sedan for the same price.
It didn't need that much more R&D to do so: a bit more boost, some weight reduction, and a beefier tranny. If the AWD is the weak point, well that's something else.
It didn't need that much more R&D to do so: a bit more boost, some weight reduction, and a beefier tranny. If the AWD is the weak point, well that's something else.
Ladies and gents, I present to you the stereotypical Acura Fanboy.
Clearly Acura engineers know jack shit too to say it competes with the S4 ... and stop using price as a selling point since it means nothing for performance. The Type-S' competition will always be the S4/M340i/C43 AMG even if they cost 20k more, starting price is similar and they all have the same engine from low to high option ranges.
Clearly Acura engineers know jack shit too to say it competes with the S4 ... and stop using price as a selling point since it means nothing for performance. The Type-S' competition will always be the S4/M340i/C43 AMG even if they cost 20k more, starting price is similar and they all have the same engine from low to high option ranges.
#736
There you got it. Acura made the car, that based on their customer base, they thought they could make the most money on. I don’t know why this is so hard for people to understand. Unfortunately for a lot of enthusiasts companies are in business to make money. You could argue that a $60k Super Type S while satisfying a certain slice of the enthusiast market would have actually bleed sales from Acura by making the other cars in the segment better value propositions. My take is that there’s really not a lot of volume in that $55k + sports sedan market for a company who’s market is limited to North America.
A lot of times, the raison d'etre for cars like this goes beyond simply maximizing ROI. Performance models are typically an ineffecient use of capital and resources even if they're NPV positive, but automakers still build these cars as a way to demonstrate their capabilities, or as a sense of pride and executive desire (as is the case of the GR Supra, GR Yaris, etc.). For the Type S, Ikeda talked it up like it's supposed to be the pinnacle of Honda/Acura engineering and that it cements Acura as a performance brand, but what was delivered does not live up to those expectations by any stretch of the imagination.
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#737
Burning Brakes
My definition of a proper sports sedan should be coming in next month, exactly as configured. The only reason I lose some sleep and I'm a hot mess (so you say) is because I need to wait for it. For Acura fans, that wait will be in years as the counter reset back to zero.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 05:06 PM.
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04WDPSeDaN (07-14-2021)
#738
Burning Brakes
Some of the popular arguments for getting a TLX versus the Accord is a better sound system, handling/AWD, and interior (etc) for 10k more. Well, the difference between the Type-S and the Germans is 10K (ish), the jump in performance quality is THE SAME BLOODY THING! You can't say it's good for one but not the other lol.
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#739
Suzuka Master
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Everyone storm the BWM forums and make fun of them!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJ_sSd-5bFI&t=245s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJ_sSd-5bFI&t=245s
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#740
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That's the whole point....we don't believe it, know its bull shit & point out the bull shit in clear detail.....then you go & get all defensive because we knocked the product. Find it interesting you are two different people on the Acura/Honda forums.
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04WDPSeDaN (07-14-2021)
#741
Some of the popular arguments for getting a TLX versus the Accord is a better sound system, handling/AWD, and interior (etc) for 10k more. Well, the difference between the Type-S and the Germans is 10K (ish), the jump in performance quality is THE SAME BLOODY THING! You can't say it's good for one but not the other lol.
At some point, budget will have to be a consideration. What can you buy that will give you the best combination of driving experience and performance, for the price that they are willing to spend. You can't just keep saying, oh just pay $10K more and you'll have a faster car. I think Acura was aiming for a $50K MSRP car, and due to whatever reasons, the price ballooned up and they had to get rid of HUD/Surround view to get the price to $53K. Just my speculation of course. Now, if they wanted more that 355hp to compete with the Germans, then they will have to sell you a fully loaded car for $56K+ car. Is that more to your liking if it's as fast/slightly faster than an S4, but now it's approaching 60k? Then some people will complain about the price.
Last edited by whiteGSR; 07-14-2021 at 06:46 PM.
#742
Burning Brakes
What's the price difference between a M340I (decently equipped) and a base model M3? Probably $10k? So by your logic, why stop at the M340I, why not get a M3 that has better performance for "only" $10K more? So why aren't you getting a RS4 or RS5 and settling for a slower S4/S5 ?
At some point, budget will have to be a consideration. What can you buy that will give you the best combination of driving experience and performance, for the price that they are willing to spend. You can't just keep saying, oh just pay $10K more and you'll have a faster car. I think Acura was aiming for a $50K MSRP car, and due to whatever reasons, the price ballooned up and they had to get rid of HUD/Surround view to get the price to $53K. Just my speculation of course. Now, if they wanted more that 355hp to compete with the Germans, then they will have to sell you a fully loaded car for $56K+ car. Is that more to your liking if it's as fast/slightly faster than an S4, but now it's approaching 60k? Then some people will complain about the price.
At some point, budget will have to be a consideration. What can you buy that will give you the best combination of driving experience and performance, for the price that they are willing to spend. You can't just keep saying, oh just pay $10K more and you'll have a faster car. I think Acura was aiming for a $50K MSRP car, and due to whatever reasons, the price ballooned up and they had to get rid of HUD/Surround view to get the price to $53K. Just my speculation of course. Now, if they wanted more that 355hp to compete with the Germans, then they will have to sell you a fully loaded car for $56K+ car. Is that more to your liking if it's as fast/slightly faster than an S4, but now it's approaching 60k? Then some people will complain about the price.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 06:58 PM.
#743
And give me your 3G TL so I can finally be part of the Acura family
#744
Air Vice Marshal
My definition of a proper sports sedan should be coming in next month, exactly as configured. The only reason I lose some sleep and I'm a hot mess (so you say) is because I need to wait for it. For Acura fans, that wait will be in years as the counter reset back to zero.
There were two results from this inauspicious beginning. Our car was forever known to our friends and coworkers as Das Boot,
and since it ran for 432,000 miles with no expenses other than the normal consumables (e.g. brakes, tires, etc) and routine service it earned our loyalty to the Honda Brand. In subsequent years we had a series of Accords, always V6 MTs, until the '07 TL Type-S came along. I fully expected to continue with another Type-S, but I can't get past the disappointment this time.
#745
Funny you mention the RS models, as if Acura has anything that's in the same league. If you can't afford, you can't afford it (same when looking above from an Accord). If the Type-S will break budget by adding a few thousand, then maybe you should stick to the lower versions. Like fans say on forum, no one needs that much performance.
Budget doesn't necessarily only mean ability to pay, but rather willingness to pay as well.
Last edited by whiteGSR; 07-14-2021 at 07:12 PM.
#746
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
iTrader: (1)
What's the price difference between a M340I (decently equipped) and a base model M3? Probably $10k? So by your logic, why stop at the M340I, why not get a M3 that has better performance for "only" $10K more? So why aren't you getting a RS4 or RS5 and settling for a slower S4/S5 ?
At some point, budget will have to be a consideration. What can you buy that will give you the best combination of driving experience and performance, for the price that they are willing to spend. You can't just keep saying, oh just pay $10K more and you'll have a faster car. I think Acura was aiming for a $50K MSRP car, and due to whatever reasons, the price ballooned up and they had to get rid of HUD/Surround view to get the price to $53K. Just my speculation of course. Now, if they wanted more that 355hp to compete with the Germans, then they will have to sell you a fully loaded car for $56K+ car. Is that more to your liking if it's as fast/slightly faster than an S4, but now it's approaching 60k? Then some people will complain about the price.
At some point, budget will have to be a consideration. What can you buy that will give you the best combination of driving experience and performance, for the price that they are willing to spend. You can't just keep saying, oh just pay $10K more and you'll have a faster car. I think Acura was aiming for a $50K MSRP car, and due to whatever reasons, the price ballooned up and they had to get rid of HUD/Surround view to get the price to $53K. Just my speculation of course. Now, if they wanted more that 355hp to compete with the Germans, then they will have to sell you a fully loaded car for $56K+ car. Is that more to your liking if it's as fast/slightly faster than an S4, but now it's approaching 60k? Then some people will complain about the price.
AS of this moment, in the united states, most Acura dealerships have marked up the TLX-S price from 5-15K. This is also without any discounts allowed. Read it carefully. AS OF THIS moment. So this means, the TLX-S is NO LONGER a $53,000 vehicle. It is now a 53K Plus the mark-up excluding additional fees.
As of this moment, you can still custom build your M340i and get 5-9% discount. No mark up on the prices.
What this means, is you are spending roughly the same cost depending on your M340i build options.
The entertainment from the critics & supporters has brought me back from the dead. And I was just super fixated on the harping of 0-60 times in this segment, so I was wondering if that same energy had been applied elsewhere before the TLX-S took the crown of being the slowest with its 4.9s
And give me your 3G TL so I can finally be part of the Acura family
And give me your 3G TL so I can finally be part of the Acura family
When my TL goes on cars and bids you can bid to buy it.
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#747
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Some of the popular arguments for getting a TLX versus the Accord is a better sound system, handling/AWD, and interior (etc) for 10k more. Well, the difference between the Type-S and the Germans is 10K (ish), the jump in performance quality is THE SAME BLOODY THING! You can't say it's good for one but not the other lol.
Saw C&D today. The new Type-S review made the magazine. On page 72 & 73 out of about 80 pages. One of print one of pictures. No one is taking this car seriously.
Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 07-14-2021 at 07:19 PM.
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#748
Yes they can. Its totally dumbass stupid & illogical but they can say it. All the performance metrics are important only if the Acura TLX-Type S wins. When it racks up the start of a string of loses its no longer important. Its $10K cheaper & has a nice radio. Its also unfair to bring up the Honda because its a lesser car.
Saw C&D today. The new Type-S review made the magazine. On page 72 & 73 out of about 80 pages. One of print one of pictures. No one is taking this car seriously.
Saw C&D today. The new Type-S review made the magazine. On page 72 & 73 out of about 80 pages. One of print one of pictures. No one is taking this car seriously.
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BEAR-AvHistory (07-14-2021)
#749
Without writing an entire novel here i'll say it straight forward.
AS of this moment, in the united states, most Acura dealerships have marked up the TLX-S price from 5-15K. This is also without any discounts allowed. Read it carefully. AS OF THIS moment. So this means, the TLX-S is NO LONGER a $53,000 vehicle. It is now a 53K Plus the mark-up excluding additional fees.
As of this moment, you can still custom build your M340i and get 5-9% discount. No mark up on the prices.
What this means, is you are spending roughly the same cost depending on your M340i build options.
.
AS of this moment, in the united states, most Acura dealerships have marked up the TLX-S price from 5-15K. This is also without any discounts allowed. Read it carefully. AS OF THIS moment. So this means, the TLX-S is NO LONGER a $53,000 vehicle. It is now a 53K Plus the mark-up excluding additional fees.
As of this moment, you can still custom build your M340i and get 5-9% discount. No mark up on the prices.
What this means, is you are spending roughly the same cost depending on your M340i build options.
.
NOBODY, and I mean NOBODY is saying that you should pay $10K ADM and go yep, I have a better car than a $63K+ German car. Who is saying that?
Also, stop it with this ADM BS as a way of saying ,see, the TLX-S is not a better value than the a more expensive car. They aren't charging ADMs in my whole country (Canada), and if you look at the other threads, a lot of dealers in the US aren't either, and the ones that are and now taking it away.
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Colorado Guy AF Ret. (07-19-2021)
#750
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
iTrader: (1)
Damn, I sound like a Type S fanboy, even though I am thoroughly disappointed in the car as well and will be keeping my 3G TL-S 6mt for a little while longer. I have multiple cars and was hoping to consolidate, but unfortunately this generation will not be it.
NOBODY, and I mean NOBODY is saying that you should pay $10K ADM and go yep, I have a better car than a $63K+ German car. Who is saying that?
Also, stop it with this ADM BS as a way of saying ,see, the TLX-S is not a better value than the a more expensive car. They aren't charging ADMs in my whole country (Canada), and if you look at the other threads, a lot of dealers in the US aren't either, and the ones that are and now taking it away.
NOBODY, and I mean NOBODY is saying that you should pay $10K ADM and go yep, I have a better car than a $63K+ German car. Who is saying that?
Also, stop it with this ADM BS as a way of saying ,see, the TLX-S is not a better value than the a more expensive car. They aren't charging ADMs in my whole country (Canada), and if you look at the other threads, a lot of dealers in the US aren't either, and the ones that are and now taking it away.
That's why I clearly said AS OF NOW. This will all (Hopefully) change and change soon.
Last edited by 04WDPSeDaN; 07-14-2021 at 07:38 PM.
#751
Burning Brakes
What does Acura not making a RS model have to do with it? You're telling people to just pony up an extra $10K so they can have S4/S5 performance. So I'm telling you to pony up the extra $10K for RS then. Yet, somehow, you can't or won't AND you don't understand why someone will be perfectly happy with a Type S and doesn't want to spend an extra $10K on top of $53K. Ok...got it.
Budget doesn't necessarily only mean ability to pay, but rather willingness to pay as well.
Budget doesn't necessarily only mean ability to pay, but rather willingness to pay as well.
The performance folks can get pretty insane with budget though, look at how many spend extra for mods. It's not the same group that are thinking about moving up from a regular TLX. Half of the comments in audiworld R/S4/5 forum are strictly about upgrades. Based on what your saying, most of the Type-S folks will end their journey at dealer purchase.
Last edited by pyrodan007; 07-14-2021 at 07:48 PM.
#752
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The entertainment from the critics & supporters has brought me back from the dead. And I was just super fixated on the harping of 0-60 times in this segment, so I was wondering if that same energy had been applied elsewhere before the TLX-S took the crown of being the slowest with its 4.9s
And give me your 3G TL so I can finally be part of the Acura family
And give me your 3G TL so I can finally be part of the Acura family
"dramatic styling and a BMW M-fighting Type S badge, the TLX completes Acura’s return to performance prominence."
Some of these guys should be writing for a half hour TV sitcom.
#753
Could be wrong but I think most if not all the other cars actually in the segment outside of the M340 are pretty much even up. What really makes for entertainment & why the TLX Type-S is the butt of the joke right not is stuff like this from Detroit Free Press article
"dramatic styling and a BMW M-fighting Type S badge, the TLX completes Acura’s return to performance prominence."
Some of these guys should be writing for a half hour TV sitcom.
"dramatic styling and a BMW M-fighting Type S badge, the TLX completes Acura’s return to performance prominence."
Some of these guys should be writing for a half hour TV sitcom.
#754
Nothing Bullshit about the ADM. I bring it up because all the TLX-S at dealership lots in my area are marked up 7K (on average). So If I wanted to buy a TLX-S right now, do you want me to search the entire country to see who isn't marking them up and then see who actually has one for sale? I included the ADM because if it's marked up, guess what buddy, you're paying it. Simple as that.
That's why I clearly said AS OF NOW. This will all (Hopefully) change and change soon.
That's why I clearly said AS OF NOW. This will all (Hopefully) change and change soon.
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#755
Three Wheelin'
Let’s just take the price out of the equation all together. I don’t know the exact weights of all the cars in this segment, but I’m going to generalize and say the C43, S4, M340i are all around 3,600 to maybe 3,800 lbs? Please post the correct numbers if anyone has them. The Type S weighs more, like 400 or 500 lbs more than those I mentioned, is that about right? I just find it interesting that the German manufacturers were able to produce much better cars while using significantly less metal, glass, plastic, leather, rubber, etc than Acura did.
#756
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
iTrader: (1)
#757
iWhine S/C 6MT TL
iTrader: (1)
#758
Let’s just take the price out of the equation all together. I don’t know the exact weights of all the cars in this segment, but I’m going to generalize and say the C43, S4, M340i are all around 3,600 to maybe 3,800 lbs? Please post the correct numbers if anyone has them. The Type S weighs more, like 400 or 500 lbs more than those I mentioned, is that about right? I just find it interesting that the German manufacturers were able to produce much better cars while using significantly less metal, glass, plastic, leather, rubber, etc than Acura did.
#759
The TLX is larger, so intuitively it weighs more. That’s a reasonable trade off, but the car isn’t actually bigger inside, so to me it’s no different than just adding deadweight. Also, the Germans use more aluminum, which is lighter. Acura uses more steel which help keeps the costs down. As always, you get what you pay for.
#760
For me backseat does not work well because I need to fit a rear facing car seat. I suppose once it flips forward it’s not as big of a deal, but it’s still mind blowing to me that a car as long as an Accord can have less room than a Civic, especially for a company renown for its packaging and thoughtful practicality.