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If those are actual images of the final design I’d say Lexus may be headed in the wrong direction. That has to be one of the worst looking designs I’ve seen in a long time.
The next generation Lexus IS patent images more or less reveal the design...
The overhangs look long but that's normal for patent images. Here's the TLX's patent images for reference...
makes me wonder if he is is going to be a FWD design, those are not RWD proportions, looks similar to the TLX proportions ( FWD trying to look like RWD) but less well executed.
I don’t think anyone underestimate the effort of H K and G. They have done a great job but the financial commitment as you said is a huge factor.
If you read the number of positive reviews and comments about G, and if that translate to actual buying. Genesis would be the number one luxury brand in terms of sales. But we all know that’s not the case. Praise, praise, and praise but buy Japanese or German 😂
This behaviour of those people in the market actually will hurt Genesis in the long term. It’s like your boss keep praising you and giving you credit. But he doesn’t raise your salary lmao! Genesis’ well wishers remind me of those bosses!
The problem is there ability to attract customers from both other manufactures and within. Germans attract customers from ither brands, Acura/Lexus attract from within, Genesis has a hard time doing either of those.
H/K for a long time been a brand built on being a cheaper option with their vehicles being a slight step down from the competition. It was generally a slight step to up to move from say a sonata to an Accord, and that is how people would graduate from H/K to other brands, and then if you loved the honda maybe you would graduate to an Acura or if you werent attached to the Honda maybe you would go to lexus/audi/bmw, whoever. H/K has only quite recently become much more competitive directly but building a customer base that is Loyal and looking to go up within your own tier system from hyundai to Genesis takes a level of commitment from your customer beyond someone looking for cheap transportation. It takes time to build that loyalty.
There are not a ton of people looking to move from the germans to Acura/Lexus but when they do it is generally for the very understandable reasoning of reliability / resale. A person can convince themselves of that. But to move from a german car to a Korean Genesis, thats generally going to be seen as taking a step back to most people. And the Acura/ Lexus customers will have a hard time believeing the Genesis will be more reliable or have as food of a resale value.
Its a tough sell until they really prove themselves.
p.s. This is not me shit talking H/K. I think they’ve done a great job and are heading in the right direction to meet these goals. I myself have been considering getting a new van and i have a hard time convincing myself that i need to spend $48,000 Canadian on the cheapest level Odyssey i can get which is basically the same as it was when it was released in 2018 when I can get the second tier Kia Carnival for $38,000 that was a brand new design last year.
The problem is there ability to attract customers from both other manufactures and within. Germans attract customers from ither brands, Acura/Lexus attract from within, Genesis has a hard time doing either of those.
H/K for a long time been a brand built on being a cheaper option with their vehicles being a slight step down from the competition. It was generally a slight step to up to move from say a sonata to an Accord, and that is how people would graduate from H/K to other brands, and then if you loved the honda maybe you would graduate to an Acura or if you werent attached to the Honda maybe you would go to lexus/audi/bmw, whoever. H/K has only quite recently become much more competitive directly but building a customer base that is Loyal and looking to go up within your own tier system from hyundai to Genesis takes a level of commitment from your customer beyond someone looking for cheap transportation. It takes time to build that loyalty.
There are not a ton of people looking to move from the germans to Acura/Lexus but when they do it is generally for the very understandable reasoning of reliability / resale. A person can convince themselves of that. But to move from a german car to a Korean Genesis, thats generally going to be seen as taking a step back to most people. And the Acura/ Lexus customers will have a hard time believeing the Genesis will be more reliable or have as food of a resale value.
Its a tough sell until they really prove themselves.
p.s. This is not me shit talking H/K. I think they’ve done a great job and are heading in the right direction to meet these goals. I myself have been considering getting a new van and i have a hard time convincing myself that i need to spend $48,000 Canadian on the cheapest level Odyssey i can get which is basically the same as it was when it was released in 2018 when I can get the second tier Kia Carnival for $38,000 that was a brand new design last year.
You bring up a good point. Someone who isn't thrilled with their Hyundai dealership for service and trying to graduate to Genesis will have to deal with the same dealership for Genesis service!
Thank you. The MDX is a 2020 PMC edition with the valencia red pearl from the NSX. It's hard to tell it's a PMC from the photo though. The black roof and the black doorhandles are the only way you'd know.
Thank you. The MDX is a 2020 PMC edition with the valencia red pearl from the NSX. It's hard to tell it's a PMC from the photo though. The black roof and the black doorhandles are the only way you'd know.
as soon as I saw it I knew it was the PMC Edition! Truly a man of the culture and an Acura Enthusiast among us!
Thank you. The MDX is a 2020 PMC edition with the valencia red pearl from the NSX. It's hard to tell it's a PMC from the photo though. The black roof and the black doorhandles are the only way you'd know.
It's beautiful. My bad for missing it was a PMC in Valencia Red. Very obvious now that you point out the tell-tale PMC indicators.
Thank you. The MDX is a 2020 PMC edition with the valencia red pearl from the NSX. It's hard to tell it's a PMC from the photo though. The black roof and the black doorhandles are the only way you'd know.
We liked our 2014 MDX Tech/shAWD . It was fairly trouble-free but we just didn't need anything that big any more. If it would have been an Advance model, it would have been harder to part with. We still would have though since we wanted a smaller SUV (that was also a Hybrid). AFAIK, yours is one of the last (full updated and optioned) models of ours:
I like the wide-body fender flares and hood vent. Those would've looked nice on the TLX-S (although the TLX is already pretty wide as is.)
Of note, the ITS gets the HUD so I'd expect that on the TLX-S's MMC.
I like the wide-body fender flares and hood vent. Those would've looked nice on the TLX-S (although the TLX is already pretty wide as is.)
Of note, the ITS gets the HUD so I'd expect that on the TLX-S's MMC.
That ITS is a good looking car and will sell like hotcakes! Only barrier to entry is the manual transmission. 30 lbs heavier than CTR despite not having the spoiler. Probably makes the additional HP a wash for 0-60 against the CTR.
I'm still iffy on the front intakes but the rest of the car is pretty badass! If I was choosing b/w CTR and ITS, I'd definitely go for the ITS!
First one I've seen it in white (my favorite) and I absolutely love it. Probably too small for me, but I might mosey on down to the dealer and sit in one before I completely write it off. Also, we'll see how the ride comfort is ... if it's comparable to the Type-R, it's a no-go.
Originally Posted by ELIN
That ITS is a good looking car and will sell like hotcakes! Only barrier to entry is the manual transmission. 30 lbs heavier than CTR despite not having the spoiler. Probably makes the additional HP a wash for 0-60 against the CTR.
I'm still iffy on the front intakes but the rest of the car is pretty badass! If I was choosing b/w CTR and ITS, I'd definitely go for the ITS!
Completely agree. Better styling, though I do quite like the CTR - the wing does make it a bit too "boy racer" for me ... ITS styling is perfect IMO. 0-60 isn't going to be this car's strong suit (FWD = crap launch), but with the already bountiful aftermarket support, you could easily build one to pull on even a tuned TLX-S from a roll.
I just hope they produce these in large enough quantities that they're actually attainable without mark-ups.
I hope the integra type s exterior design language will translate throughout the brand. It would be nice to see the type s with a hood vent and fender flares.
Here’s an interesting article regarding touch screens in cars. Apparently contrary to what passes for a common belief not all drivers are enamored with them.
Here’s an interesting article regarding touch screens in cars. Apparently contrary to what passes for a common belief not all drivers are enamored with them.
Here’s an interesting article regarding touch screens in cars. Apparently contrary to what passes for a common belief not all drivers are enamored with them.
My favorite quote from the article:
“One would hope that luxury trickles down,” said Farah. “As they reject the screens, it could over time be seen as luxurious to have buttons instead.”
It'll be interesting to see where Acura's leaning in their next gen cars.
I got used to using the pad in like a week. It's not that big of a deal. I've never had a car with a touch screen before so maybe that's why it was easy to start using the pad. I've also seen reviews where people say they can't get used to the push button gear selector either... Really? Buttons confuse you? Maybe you shouldn't drive then.
I got used to using the pad in like a week. It's not that big of a deal. I've never had a car with a touch screen before so maybe that's why it was easy to start using the pad. I've also seen reviews where people say they can't get used to the push button gear selector either... Really? Buttons confuse you? Maybe you shouldn't drive then.
Most people can get used to anything. But does that make it intuitive or the preferred method? I have driven many cars now with buttons, dials and shifters. Where I live you need to make a lot of quick changes, especially when pulling away from a curb and going the other direction...I may need to reverse a few times depending on how tight the street is (and most are tight here) and quickly, as traffic is coming at me. The shifter is the fastest method for me and more natural. Yes, old habits can die hard but that is my preference.
It's not just a buttons. The way Acura aligns them is traditional in placement. Also reverse button you press backwards and drive button is round and you press forward. If you do it a couple of times it's so damn easy and you can be just as fast as using a shifter. I have seen some reviewers just shit on the set up like it's some sort of mind maze.
Also, I have seen many reviewers shit on Acura for using too many buttons on previous gens. The same morons would sit in older Porsches and praise them for using many buttons.... Oh, can't complain here cause we're in a German car .....
I got used to using the pad in like a week. It's not that big of a deal. I've never had a car with a touch screen before so maybe that's why it was easy to start using the pad. I've also seen reviews where people say they can't get used to the push button gear selector either... Really? Buttons confuse you? Maybe you shouldn't drive then.
One of the things I disliked the most in both my tlx's was the push buttons rather than a shift lever. It wasn't that it was confusing it was that is sucked compared to having the shift lever, I would have paid extra for a shift lever and for the buttons be removed. It something that you interact with every time you drive the car and there was nobody asking for a button controlled transmission. Can't recall any complaints on shift levers over the years. Buttons however there is very few saying they are an improvement.
One of the things I disliked the most in both my tlx's was the push buttons rather than a shift lever. It wasn't that it was confusing it was that is sucked compared to having the shift lever, I would have paid extra for a shift lever and for the buttons be removed. It something that you interact with every time you drive the car and there was nobody asking for a button controlled transmission. Can't recall any complaints on shift levers over the years. Buttons however there is very few saying they are an improvement.
Yes, just personal preference. I've always had a shift lever too but I'm sort of liking the buttons and the cleaner look of the center stack area. I also have a 5 speed manual supercharged first generation Miata for my tactical shifting needs
Yes, just personal preference. I've always had a shift lever too but I'm sort of liking the buttons and the cleaner look of the center stack area. I also have a 5 speed manual supercharged first generation Miata for my tactical shifting needs
agreed. I actually think it makes the interior look cleaner and more spacious.
agreed. I actually think it makes the interior look cleaner and more spacious.
I've always found the location of the wireless charging pad a little odd but I understand why they put it there (to minimize cable length since TLX is wired CP/AA). How many of us have also spilled something on the phone when putting our drink in the cup holder (rare but it happens)? The push button transmission doesn't really save a ton of space, especially with the massive drive selector dial taking so much real estate!
If I was Acura and I knew wireless CP/AA was coming (as it did for MDX/RDX), I would have gone back to conventional gear shifter and put the wireless charging pad where the current transmission buttons are and locate the drive selector knob where the charging pad is now (a more natural position for the hand). If Acura catered more towards the general public instead of long-time Honda/Acura folks, they'd probably sell more cars!
Having only used a shift lever previously, there was a learning period with the buttons, but I actually even like them now though a lever would be good also. The touch pad was a bigger learning experience, but it helped to have it set the least sensitive setting starting out, it greatly reduced mis-selections. I was considering a G70 at the time and its touch screen was not that much easier. I am VERY glad the HVAC is still buttons and not buried in the screen.
And ELIN, yes Honda/Acura does cater to long-timers, as I have never been able to get my wife away from Toyotas.
I didn't mind the TrueTouch interface myself. The biggest knock against it was the jarring experience going from the Acura-specific screens (i.e. radio/satellite) vs the CP/AA setup. If the "cursor" acted the same b/w both interfaces, I would've spent less time staring at the screen for the expected response.
I am the first one to say that Acura has gone mad. Teggy TYPE S $51K vs. TLX TYPE S $55-$56K (USA). The comparison is not even close. The fit and finish, awesome chassis, braking, SH-AWD of TLX are just on another level....
Unless, Acura did their research and they will be happy by selling only a couple of thousands of them per year. More of a limited edition. I am not too sure people will pay for ITS $51K. That mean it will cost more than TLX TYPE S in Canada (direct conversion is $69K)?
I am the first one to say that Acura has gone mad. Teggy TYPE S $51K vs. TLX TYPE S $55-$56K (USA). The comparison is not even close. The fit and finish, awesome chassis, braking, SH-AWD of TLX are just on another level....
Unless, Acura did their research and they will be happy by selling only a couple of thousands of them per year. More of a limited edition. I am not too sure people will pay for ITS $51K. That mean it will cost more than TLX TYPE S in Canada (direct conversion is $69K)?
Pricing that's just right for AZ members!
I did notice how the fuel econ for city slipped 1 mpg against the CTR despite the higher HP.
Acura isn't numbering the ITS and isn't doing crazy things like shipping a US engine to Japan, so I expect ITSs to not be deliberately underproduced. It will be a niche model: want a manual buy an ITS and want SHAWD buy a TLX-S.
Acura supply shortages are pretty much gone, my dealer has a fully stocked showroom of every high end Acura model so I don't expect long waits for ITS (or any waits at all a month after it launches). So my guess is you can buy one for 45-50k a month after it launches. That will leave a good gap between TLX-S pricing, but my guess is that drivers will know what transmission they want and pick the car based on that.
Acura isn't numbering the ITS and isn't doing crazy things like shipping a US engine to Japan, so I expect ITSs to not be deliberately underproduced. It will be a niche model: want a manual buy an ITS and want SHAWD buy a TLX-S.
Acura supply shortages are pretty much gone, my dealer has a fully stocked showroom of every high end Acura model so I don't expect long waits for ITS (or any waits at all a month after it launches). So my guess is you can buy one for 45-50k a month after it launches. That will leave a good gap between TLX-S pricing, but my guess is that drivers will know what transmission they want and pick the car based on that.
Acura isn't numbering the ITS and isn't doing crazy things like shipping a US engine to Japan, so I expect ITSs to not be deliberately underproduced. It will be a niche model: want a manual buy an ITS and want SHAWD buy a TLX-S.
Acura supply shortages are pretty much gone, my dealer has a fully stocked showroom of every high end Acura model so I don't expect long waits for ITS (or any waits at all a month after it launches). So my guess is you can buy one for 45-50k a month after it launches. That will leave a good gap between TLX-S pricing, but my guess is that drivers will know what transmission they want and pick the car based on that.
I forget that the ITS is manual-only and by definition, a niche product. The ITS and TLX-S have their own lanes but folks chasing 0-60 will probably go with the smaller car.
I forget that the ITS is manual-only and by definition, a niche product. The ITS and TLX-S have their own lanes but folks chasing 0-60 will probably go with the smaller car.
yes. But I just realized as well that it's only manual. So, Acura knows it will be very limited and not everyone wants and can drive manual in North America....
Now, I see why Acura is refreshing the TLX and TLX TYPE S. Probably we will get some goodies
yes. But I just realized as well that it's only manual. So, Acura knows it will be very limited and not everyone wants and can drive manual in North America....
Now, I see why Acura is refreshing the TLX and TLX TYPE S. Probably we will get some goodies
Another look of the ITS reminds me that there is a vent on the hood not present on the regular Teggy.
Leads me to agree with someone who said the TLX-S MMC spy pics may possibly be covering a vent on the hood as well!
I am the first one to say that Acura has gone mad. Teggy TYPE S $51K vs. TLX TYPE S $55-$56K (USA). The comparison is not even close. The fit and finish, awesome chassis, braking, SH-AWD of TLX are just on another level....
Unless, Acura did their research and they will be happy by selling only a couple of thousands of them per year. More of a limited edition. I am not too sure people will pay for ITS $51K. That mean it will cost more than TLX TYPE S in Canada (direct conversion is $69K)?
To put this into perspective, a 1997 ITR sold for ~$25k which is $47k in 2023 so the pricing for the 2024 ITS is just a little more.
To put this into perspective, a 1997 ITR sold for ~$25k which is $47k in 2023 so the pricing for the 2024 ITS is just a little more.
Agreed! Today, everything is crazy and the car market is on fire.
I have one issue with this pricing: At $51K, there are a lot of other options. I still believe that TLX and TLX TYPE S is very well priced compared to the competition. I built a C43 last night with very similar options to TLX TYPE S and the price came to $89K CAD vs the TYPE S is $64K. Now with ITS, it is no longer a value car but a niche and special product if we go based on the pricing.
Another look of the ITS reminds me that there is a vent on the hood not present on the regular Teggy.
Leads me to agree with someone who said the TLX-S MMC spy pics may possibly be covering a vent on the hood as well!
A new stamping cast costs a lot of money, if you are Acura boss, would you spend the money on a car that barely sell 20k/year and has no platform mate to share the underlying cost with?
A new stamping cast costs a lot of money, if you are Acura boss, would you spend the money on a car that barely sell 20k/year and has no platform mate to share the underlying cost with?
Probably not.
Once the ZDX rolls in, Acura may eventually become a single sedan company like Ford.
04-03-2023, 06:20 AM
