TSX69

Sampling the 2014 Acura RLX’s Goodies: Precision All-Wheel Steer and Sport Hybrid SH-AWD

We have a pretty good idea what the new Acura RLX looks like based on the concept shown at this year’s New York auto show. And now we’ve test-driven both versions of the RLX’s powertrain at Honda’s Tochigi, Japan, proving grounds. Our test cars were previous-generation Accords equipped with RLX running gear.

The front-wheel-drive version debuts 1st next spring. It’s powered by a direct-injection version of Honda’s 3.5-liter V-6 making at least 310 hp and 265 lb-ft of torque, which is basically the same output as the 3.7-liter in the outgoing RL sedan with a claimed 10% increase in fuel economy. A 6-speed auto manages the gear swaps. Key to the front-wheel-drive RLX is what Acura calls Precision All-Wheel Steer (yes, animal lovers, it spells PAWS). This system has 2 electric motors built into the rear toe link, and each link can act independently, a world 1st. Under braking, PAWS will increase toe-in for enhanced stability. In a lane-change maneuver, the rear wheels will steer in the same direction as the front wheels, whereas the rear wheels turn opposite of the front in tighter corners. The total adjustment is roughly 2 degrees in each direction, and a Honda engineer on hand said it acts in less than a second. It also works at all speeds.

On our test drive, a few laps around a 0.8-mile handling course, the RLX exhibited much less understeer than we expected from a large front-wheel-drive sedan. Turn-in was especially sharp, and the car held the line particularly well in sweeping corners. When coming out of corners, we did notice a slight bobble as PAWS adjusted, not enough to upset the chassis but enough to tell that the system was working.

The all-wheel-drive RLX forgoes the rear-wheel steering and instead employs what Acura calls Sport Hybrid Super Handling All-Wheel Drive. This new version of SH-AWD uses two 27-hp electric motors at the rear wheels instead of a driveshaft and clutch packs. The 3.5-liter V-6 still is present under the hood, but paired to a 7-speed dual-clutch automatic with an integrated 40-hp motor that also acts as a generator. Peak total system power is about 370 hp, but the car feels stronger thanks to the instantaneous torque of the electric motors, which assist propulsion up to 75 mph. The rear motors also provide torque vectoring in corners, putting resistance on the inside wheel (which generates electricity for instantaneous use, lessening the draw on the 6.7-kWh battery) and driving the outside wheel to minimize understeer. Track performance is impressive, with instantaneous turn-in and grip that seems to transcend the abilities of the Michelin Pilot Sport 3 tires. We didn’t have the chance to mess around too much, but there is no power oversteer. Jam on the gas and the car simply follows exactly where you point it with a neutral attitude.

There are other benefits to the system, as well. Not counting the batteries, the rear motors weigh less than the driveshaft and clutches in the mechanical SH-AWD system. Those motors, which can provide silent EV-style propulsion at low speeds have the side benefit of smoothing out the engagement of the dual-clutch transmission when pulling away from a stop. And the hybrid system helps fuel economy—we estimate EPA figures of around 30 in both city and highway driving, a big jump from the current RL’s 17/24 sticker.

Our brief preview has us eager to drive the full-production RLX, even if we’re not too excited to spend any time gazing at the, um, polarizing design. While the front-wheel-drive version offers interesting new technology with the all-wheel steering, we’re enthusiastic about the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD, a far more revolutionary concept in terms of performance. Stay tuned.

oo7spy

Thank you Honda.

TSX69

New 2014 Acura RLX DriveTrains Aim for Smiles

When my colleagues learned I would be interviewing Takanobu Ito, Honda’s CEO and former engineer, most of their questions were some variation of, “When will Honda make a fun car again?”

Honda appears to have taken notice of such criticism, because before we got behind the wheel of a 2014 Acura RLX development mule, the automaker’s pre-drive presentations were full of big, bold examples of “FUN.” This being contemporary Honda, though, “ENVIRONMENT” and “SAFETY” weren’t far behind. The 2013 Honda Accord sedan is capable enough when it comes to safety and efficiency, but the car placed 2nd out of 6 cars in a recent comparison because it wasn’t as fun to drive as our 1st-place finisher. So does the Acura RLX bring the fun back to the Acura lineup?

Yes. Well, mostly yes. With the same basic drivetrain approach as the radical new NSX – dubbed “Sport Hybrid All Wheel Drive” – the top-of-the-line RLX is fun, based on our time driving a development mule. Whereas the NSX uses 2 unique motors to send power to the front wheels and a Hybrid V-6 to motivate the rear wheels, the RLX’s flips the system, with the fronts powered by a direct-injected 3.5-liter V-6 coupled to a 7-speed dual-clutch transmission with a built-in electric motor, and the rears by 2 individual electric motors that send instant torque to the outside wheel while regenerating (slowing down) the inside wheel. Think of the brake-steer system on a McLaren 12C and you’re halfway there.

The system doesn’t quite deliver the “on-rails” driving experience promised in the briefing, but it does perform some neat tricks. On the short course provided for evaluation, it was easy to push the RLX mule into a corner with understeer, let off the brakes to induce oversteer, and then feel the 2 motors work their magic and wiggle the butt back in line. Sport Hybrid SH-AWD (not to be confused with normal SH-AWD) is actually what Acura thinks will be the less popular of the 2 drivetrains offered when the RLX hits showrooms; the less expensive and less tech-heavy front-drive variant will be the volume RLX, which is powered by a 310-hp 3.5-liter V-6 and debuts at the 2012 Los Angeles Auto Show.

After driving the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD RLX and then the front-drive version, I walked away just as impressed with the base 2014 RLX mule, thanks to its new Precision All Wheel Steer system. Various forms of all-wheel steering have been around for some time; Nissan had it on the GT-R in 1986 and even Honda offered it on the Prelude starting in 1987. While Acura’s new system does all the old tricks – rear wheels mimicking the fronts during lane changes for high-speed stability, and aiming opposite the fronts for a hard corner to increase handling prowess – it offers a few new moves as well. For example, the precision actuators positioned in the toe control link use an electric extending and retracting arm to achieve an industry 1st “toe-in” position, which improves stability under hard braking.

Maybe it’s because I usually have a pessimistic approach to front-drive cars and their natural tendency to understeer, but I was pleasantly surprised with the PAWS’ aptitude around the handling course. The PAWS car, which felt like it was pushing around less weight up front, actually carries a higher percentage of its curb weight over the front wheels compared to the SH-AWD car. Bottom line: the system works. So for those who won’t be willing to spend the premium on the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD RLX, the front-drive version with PAWS will have little trouble prompting smiles from enthusiasts.

If the production RLX Sport Hybrid SH-AWD really returns the “dynamic performance equivalent to a V-8 with higher fuel efficiency than an in-line 4” as Acura says it will, then the brand’s upcoming flagship sedan will not only be an impressive handler, but also a drag strip and fuel economy champ. Based on our short and very early drive in Japan, it’s too early to validate those facts just yet, but we’re happy to report Acura’s on the right track. Systems such as Sport Hybrid SH-AWD and PAWS are steps in the right direction for heightening the fun factor. Perhaps the biggest takeaway from our time in the RLX is knowing that the next NSX, which will get a more potent version of Sport Hybrid SH-AWD, could very well take the fun factor off the charts.

getakey

dude - great find

TSX69

2014 Acura RLX Tech Preview Drive

Acura may not quite have the prestige or the cachet of longtime luxury marques like Mercedes-Benz, Jaguar, or even Lexus, but it does have top-drawer access to the most innovative powertrain and chassis engineering developments from Honda. And with Acura’s upcoming flagship sedan, the 2014 RLX, it may very well make up for that with several breakthrough technologies that—based on what we’ve just experienced in some short road-course exercises—safer, more responsive, and a heck of a lot of fun to drive.

The most noteworthy of those technologies in the upcoming RLX is the so-called Sport Hybrid version of Acura’s Super-Handling All-Wheel Drive (SH-AWD) system, which uses 3 electric motors in all. That includes 1 high-power (30 kW or greater) motor built into a 7-speed automated dual-clutch gearbox, as well as 2 20-kW motors—each 1 individually powering the rear wheels.

This new powertrain promises much-improved acceleration and fuel economy versus the outgoing model, and it should put the new RL at the head of the pack for gas mileage among large, performance-oriented luxury sedans. In short, it promises acceleration and output (370 horsepower) on the level of a modern V-8, with better fuel efficiency than a 4-cylinder models.

Rear wheels push and pull around corners

While that’s the straight-line story, the real advancement in this system (which uses some technology that will also be used in the upcoming NSX supercar) is in handling. With the electric motors, you get power delivered to the rear wheels to aid traction in bad weather or to help neutralize understeer during handling. But it’s better than that; each of those rear-wheel motors operate fully independently, meaning that 1 of them can deliver positive torque while the other can generate torque in the opposite direction—generating a yaw moment and making a more effective correction to vehicle stability than a brake intervention alone.

Acura just this week allowed us the chance to get a preview of how this system will feel from the driver’s seat. Driving an advanced RLX development mule—within a Honda Accord—we were able to negotiate a tight road course extremely quickly. The system showed its strengths both in tight corners and in more gradual, higher-speed corners. At the tightest corners we could feel power being applied to the outer rear wheels while the inner rear wheel opposed or ‘pulled back’—helping to rotate the car and seamlessly minimize understeer. Right at the limit the angles could very gently and safely be altered with the accelerator.

Although we didn’t get a chance to experience the hybrid system under gentle, more ordinary driving, we did notice, as we did in our drive of the new i-DCD system for small cars, that the electric motor in front helps smooth shifts of the 7-speed dual-clutch transmission by providing an added kick of power just before and during shifts.

Motor system ready for a workout

Judging not only by what we felt ‘by the seat of the pants’ but also by an interactive display mode showing power flow, the system gets a workout on the track. Engineers said that they’ve put the system to the test in some demanding high-temperature conditions. The electric motors at the rear wheels are oil-cooled, and they’ll only reduce their torque output somewhat if they do rise above a particular temperature. Meanwhile, of course, the new system makes even ham-fisting more fuel-efficient.

Front-wheel-drive versions of the 2014 RLX aren’t left out; they get their own all-new handling-oriented technology, called Precision All Wheel Steer. The idea builds on decades of development of rear-wheel steering systems and is quite simple: a special actuator is placed along the toe-control link for the multi-link rear suspension. Through it, the system can electronically manage rear toe-in—adding varied amounts of it to the inside rear wheel (up to 2 percent)—to increase stability during abrupt handling maneuvers, like high-speed lane-changes, or to reduce understeer during other higher-speed corners.

A ‘nudge’ into a more confident line

The effect of this technology (and its advantages) is more straightforward than that of the hybrid system (which we look forward to revisiting when it’s close to production), and it’s easy to feel in both tight corners and high-speed sweepers. It’s especially pronounced in tight corners and in high-speed lane-change maneuvers, where it provides a subtle yet noticeable ‘nudge’ of the back end—not widening its line, but making it feel more neutral near the limit, and more like the front and rear wheels are following your intended line. It’s all very fluid and there’s nothing digital in the way the system deals with transitions.

There’s 1 other big advantage of Precision All Wheel Steer: more stable braking. On abrupt stops, no matter the speed, the RLX system kicks the toe in smoothly up to a maximum, to help keep the rear wheels more stable.

Between these 2 breakthrough technologies, we already anticipate that the 2014 Acura RDX will be more responsive and enjoyable to drive—as well as more efficient—than a number of those top-shelf luxury sedans. And with these technologies here, and perhaps further developed in the NSX, we wouldn’t be surprised if the Acura name does some status-climbing in the next few years.

neuronbob

Oh hell yeah. This car sounds really cool. It looks like the FWD model will not be as much of a penalty box as I thought it would be. The SH-SH-AWD model, though....it looks like our low-torque complaints on the RL have been officially addressed.

to Honda/Acura for this car. Hopefully they will market the neck out of this, or at least better than they did our beloved 2G RL.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

I'll be damned, my Caddy might have to wait.

getakey

Now I'm lusting for the Super Handling version, but how can I wait almost 1 year for it?
I wish we knew the price point. I'ver been looking at the Tesla S as an alternative

TSX69

Quick Drives:
Acura RLX Precision All-Wheel Steering
Sport Hybrid SH-AWD ProtoTypes

Tokyo — They may look like regular 2008 Honda Accord sedans, but the cars seen here are actually engineering mules for chassis and powertrain technologies that will underpin the 2014 Acura RLX luxury sedan.

The 1st technology is Precision All-Wheel Steering for front-wheel-drive versions of the 2014 Acura RLX. PAWS consists of 2 electrically adjustable suspension links, 1 at each rear wheel, that can adjust the alignment of each wheel by up to about 2 degrees. Steering the rear wheels isn’t a new idea in itself, but while previous systems moved the rear wheels by the same amount, Honda’s PAWS is claimed to the 1st that can operate the wheels independently on each side, allowing for better control.

PAWS has 3 primary procedures: Under hard braking, it angles both rear wheels inward slightly (toe in) to improve stability; in normal cornering, the rear wheels are angled opposite to the front wheels to reduce the car’s turning circle (in right turns, the rear wheels point toward the left of the car); and in some high-speed lane-change maneuvers, the rear wheels move in the same direction as the front wheels to improve stability.

We tested an Accord with the system on a 0.8-mile handling loop at Honda’s R&D facilities here in Japan and found it promising. When you enter a corner and add steering input, there’s a miniscule pause before you feel the car tighten its line slightly as the rear wheels add more steering. It produces a sensation of rotation that gives the car a livelier feel than is typical of front-wheel-drive cars. At lower speeds, PAWS makes for easier maneuvering because of the reduced turning circle. PAWS also can correct under- or oversteer by adjusting the line of the rear wheels, which means sometimes PAWS can fix small slides without any need for the brake-based electronic stability control to activate.

Torque-Vectoring Hybrid System

We then had a chance to sample an Accord mule with what Honda calls Sport Hybrid Super Handling All-Wheel Drive (Sport Hybrid SH-AWD), which will be the upgrade powertrain choice on the 2014 Acura RLX. It uses a 3.5-liter V-6 engine and 7-speed dual-clutch transmission, augmented by a 30-kW electric motor/generator, to power the front wheels. A separate pair of 20-kW electric motors powers the rear wheels.

In general, the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD mule behaved like a normal hybrid car. In electric driving, only the rear motors are used. The front motor acts as a starter for the V-6 engine, a generator under braking, and also provides extra torque for hard acceleration. Acceleration was brisk and smooth, although we think Honda is over-promising when it says the setup provides V-8-levels of thrust. The dual-clutch transmission shifts promptly and smoothly, and even blipped the throttle to downshift as we braked for turns — although engineers later confessed that was because the transmission was locked in a sport mode.

The rear motors, meanwhile, provide torque-vectoring during cornering. As shown by a power-flow animation in the car’s head-up display, the outer wheel is overdriven while the inner rear wheel acts as a generator, sapping power and dragging to help turn the car. The goal, like with PAWS, is to provide sharper turning and more lively handling by using the rear wheels to help influence the car’s rotation. It’s quite successful in making the car turn in quickly, although the added weight of the motors and batteries mean the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD mule felt a lot less nimble than the PAWS car.

The torque vectoring still works if the main hybrid battery is depleted because power from “dragging” the inner wheel powers the outer wheel. The function works at all vehicle speeds, even at parking lot speeds. A more powerful version of this powertrain will be used in the 2015 Acura NSX, but it will be reversed so that V-6 powers the rear wheels and the 2 electric motors power the front wheels.

Honda and Acura hope that the development of these 2 systems will help imbue new cars, starting with the 2014 RLX, with a sportier driving dynamic that will help them compete with the best German and Japanese luxury cars. We’ll put that to the test in the real world when we drive the Acura RLX sometime next year.

TSX69

2014 Acura RLX Drive PreView

What is it?

While Acura's RLX flagship sedan isn't slated to arrive in dealerships until next spring, we had an opportunity to sample the new car's 2 drivetrain setups installed in previous-generation Honda Accord bodies. Our test venue was a short handling course at Honda's Tochigi research and development center in Japan.

The RLX will launch with front-wheel drive. It will be powered by a 3.5-liter direct-injected V6 delivering 310 hp and 256 lb-ft of torque, and is mated to a 6-speed automatic transmission. Standard is Honda's new "precision" all-wheel-steer system, which uses actuators in the rear suspension to adjust wheel toe angles independently. Acura says the system works with stability control and the variable gear-ratio steering to improve cornering ability and steering response. Additionally, the system provides better stability under hard braking, when both the rear wheels toe in. According to Acura, the system is the world's 1st independent left and right rear toe-control system.

Customers looking for all-wheel drive in their RLX will have to wait until next fall and will also have to want a hybrid. The range-topping RLX will feature the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD system, 1st shown on the NSX concept. It uses the 3.5-liter V6, an in-house developed seven-speed dual clutch sequential manual transmission with a built-in motor, 2 20-kilowatt motors at the rear to distribute variable torque to the right and left wheels and a lithium-ion battery pack. Acura is aiming to provide V8 performance with at least 370 hp and 4-cylinder fuel economy with an estimated EPA combined fuel economy of 30 mpg.

While the upcoming NSX production car employs the same Sport Hybrid SH-AWD system as the RLX, the major difference is that the mid-engine supercar's gasoline engine will drive the rear wheels and the 2 electric motors will power the front wheels and deliver more power.

What's it like to drive?

We first set sail around Honda's Tochigi test track with the front-wheel-drive drivetrain and "precision" all-wheel-steer system. In the 4 laps allowed, we were impressed with the car's tracking ability through corners. Where most front-drive Acura vehicles have the tendency to understeer through slow- to medium-speed corners, the RLX drivetrain mule offered plenty of control. At turn-in there is the slightest bit of push in the car before the rear end falls in line and scoots itself around. We even dialed-in more steering angle mid-corner to see what the car would do and were surprised to have the car quickly respond and go where pointed.

The 3.5-liter V6 delivered power smoothly and pulled nicely through the rev band, with a decent sounding exhaust note to boot. The 6-speed automatic performed crisp shifts and was well-tuned for quick downshifts when more power was ordered.

Next we hopped into the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD and immediately picked up on the dual-clutch's incredibly quick upshifts and aggressive downshifts with rev-matching. When diving into corners under braking, it almost felt like the gearbox was downshifting a hair too early when left in full automatic mode. However, when we opted to shift gears ourselves with the steering wheel-mounted paddles, shift response was a bit sluggish in the prototype.

During our 4 laps, the SH-AWD system allowed for some rear slip angle that was entertaining before stability control jumps in to bring things back in line when you push it too hard, but it takes a lot of pushing. There's a heavy dose of grip available in track situations, which means the RLX Sport Hybrid SH-AWD should be incredibly sure-footed on regular roads. Acceleration is brisk from launch and out of corners with all 4 tires clawing the pavement.

Speaking of tires, the prototype mules were outfitted with some serious performance tires-Michelin Pilot Sport 3s to be exact-that contributed some to both cars' nice steering response and high grip levels. It's doubtful that production RLXs will come from the factory equipped with this type of performance rubber, but we expect it to still perform well with higher-performance all-season rubber.

Braking in both cars was strong and easy to modulate, featuring a pleasing, firm pedal feel, which is especially nice on the hybrid-since the brakes on most hybrids often operate like on/off switches.

Do I want it?

There are many interesting aspects to Acura's new top sedan, but we don't expect people to cross shop it between other luxury flagships such as the Mercedes-Benz S-class, BMW 7-series, Audi A8 and Lexus LS. Even though the RLX's wheelbase is stretched 2 inches over the outgoing RL, it still lacks the dimensions to compete in that field. Instead, look for the RLX to play with the likes of the Mercedes E-class, BMW 5-series, Audi A6 and Lexus GS. From that perspective, the RLX could well entice some buyers with the innovative features such as the all-wheel-steering system on the lower end and the hybrid system at the top.

Unlike other hybrids, such as the BMW ActiveHybrid 5 which is geared toward fuel economy, the Acura RLX's hybrid is there for efficiency and improved handling performance. Acura is trying to break from the notion that hybrids are only there to satisfy green weenies, and the Sport Hybrid SH-AWD makes a strong case on both accounts with its handling prowess and fuel economy expected to punch in at 30 mpg.

More details and the final styling of the production model will be revealed at the Los Angeles auto show on Nov. 28. Expect the Jewel Eye LED headlamps from the RLX Concept that debuted in April at the New York auto show to make it to production, along with a slew of other available features such as a collision-mitigation braking system and lane-keeping assist. Forward-collision warning and lane-departure warning will be standard.

2014 Acura RLX

On Sale: Spring 2013 (FWD)/ Fall 2013 (SH-AWD) Base Price: $55,000/$62,000 (est)

Drivetrain: 3.5-liter, 310-hp, 265-lb-ft V6; FWD, 6-speed automatic/3.5-liter, 370-hp, V6 hybrid; AWD, 7-speed dual-clutch sequential manual

Curb Weight: 3,700 lb/4,000 lb (est)

0-60 mph: n/a

Fuel Economy: 32 mpg (est)/30 mpg (mfr est)

oo7spy

I am going to go ahead and saw 32 mpg on the FWD is a typo.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

it may be exaggerated from what we will actually see but for a FWD drive car its not impossible.

I think on paper the '13 accord 6spd auto gets 32-36

getakey

Base price 62K on the AWD.
That's getting up there. What do you expect fully loaded: close to 70K?

oo7spy

If those are accurate prices, Acura is going to fuck themselves. The TL base is $35k. SH-AWD base is $39k. Acura's whole motto is value luxury. Next to no one is going to pay $20k more for an RLX over a TL with almost the exact same specs.

neuronbob

Nope, my V wagon is due to be built next week. I admit to being geeked by the RLX's geeky tech, however, and would love to feel how it actually drives.

I do hope that Acura doesn't price itself out of the ballpark with the RLX, though.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

fantastic!!

getakey

I'm confused by this statement: "The torque vectoring still works if the main hybrid battery is depleted because power from “dragging” the inner wheel powers the outer wheel." from the automag writeup.

How would the battery ever be fully depleted?

Rocket_man

They overpriced the ILX and it is not selling well. The revised 2013 ZDX is overpriced. Yes I know it has higher content, but still overpriced. The ZDX used market shows the real value of that car. It seems to be a trend with Acura. I wonder what this means for the TLX? Let's hope that price for the RLX Hybrid isn't right. But the GS Hybrid starts at $59K and the LS hybrid at a whopping $119K. Remember this is a hybrid first, AWD second, so they will market it as such just like their BMW and Lexus brethren. People on this forum may think AWD before Hybrid but we know people on Acurazine are a small part of their market. I think they will sell a lot more FWD versions of this car and the hybrid will only appeal to a few. You can't build that complex system and sell it cheap.

dwboston

I'm sure the price is accurate, and I'm sure it won't sell in any meaningful numbers at that price point. The same thing happened with the current RL. Acura has proved it doesn't have the brand reputation to sell a $60k car, beyond a very low-volume niche product like the NSX. Most of the people here got their RL's well below sticker as Acura had to discount the 06-08 RL's to move them. I wonder what kind of production volumes we'll see on the SH-SH-AWD RL. I'm willing to be they'll be pretty low and we won't see many of them on dealer lots.

oo7spy

I would like to first point out that my comment to which you responded did not call you hopeless or illogical. I said the comment comparing the RLX to an Azera and an Avalon was ludicrous.

With all due respect Tony, and I mean that as sincerely as possible, I am not the only person that takes exception to people saying the RL or the future RLX is comparable to other non-luxury $32k sedans on the market. Surely you have seen the people here that say there isn't enough difference between an Accord and an RL to justify the price. The veteran poster, among many others, that you praised does not stand idly by and not call people out for making ludicrous comments like that. When you compare the RLX to an Azera, you are making the exact same sort of statement. The Avalon comparison is not as crazy, but is still negligent.

Why would the RLX be priced at least $16k more than the Azera if they are so comparable? The answer is very simple, features. The RLX with PAWS will be packed with so many more features that Acura cannot price the RLX with PAWS anywhere near the Azera and expect to make a profit. Some people look at cars and see tires, a chassis, paint, and leather seats. The details of the car don't make a difference to them if the car can get them from point A to point B. That is all good and well; to each their own. However, an enthusiast sees so much more in a car and can understand why a company would pursue putting so many details into a car and expecting people to pay a higher price point.

Is your RL different than an Azera? Why? The RLX with PAWS will have more features, more power, better mpg, and potentially equal handling capabilities. However, you ignore all of these facts and state that the Azera is nearly the same package only because it has a FWD platform. Is the GTR nearly the same package as an Aventador because they both have AWD and can run a 1/4 mile in less than 11 seconds? Will the RLX with PAWS be better than an FWD TL? If the answer is yes and the Azera is on par with the RLX, then you insinuate that Azera is better than the TL. Do you still agree?

Neglecting the details that make a car fun to drive, enjoyable to own, and nice to look at (the Azera is IMO) and then saying that cars are equivalent only because of their drive train, rear seat, and engine size is ludicrous. To say that the interior accommodations of the RLX can be compared to anything when no one has even had the chance to sit in a production model is a little silly as well. Are you sure the RLX can't compete with an Equus?

db22

007Spy - you are preaching to the choir. Most of us here bought the RL over a TL because we "value" the difference even though we could obviously afford either. An Azera shopper may consider the TL and vice-versa but, I have to agree with you, those shoppers are not in the same market as an RLX.
The differences are very apparent but if you put no value on the differences then the cars are comparable.

TSX69

Acura Announces the Debut of Its New FlagShip:
The 2014 RLX

On Wednesday, November 28, Acura will reveal the all-new 2014 RLX sedan to a crowd of assembled journalists at the Los Angeles Auto Show. Since the reveal happens during the show’s press days, the general public will have to rely on media coverage to see the new RLX before the show opens its doors to everyone on November 30.

Acura feels your pain, and it wants to do everything it can to drum up interest for its RL replacement. With that focus in mind, Acura will broadcast the RLX reveal live on the web, beginning at 11:00 a.m. (Pacific Time, we’d guess) on November 28.

Want to see the reveal for yourself? Just click on this hotlink for the Acura webcast site.

As previously reported, the 2014 RLX should closely resemble Acura’s RLX Concept, which debuted at the 2012 New York Auto Show. Unlike the concept and the current Acura RL, the production RLX is expected to debut with front-wheel-drive (at launch, anyway) instead of Super-Handling All Wheel Drive (SH-AWD). Front-drive models will get 4-wheel-steering for improved handling, though.

The hybrid SH-AWD version of the RLX should debut sometime next fall, featuring a V-6 engine driving the front wheels paired with two electric motors powering the rear wheels. Acura promises sure-footed traction, V-8 power from a V-6 engine and impressive (but still unknown) fuel economy from this version of its range-topping sedan. The SH-AWD system will also appear in Acura's upcoming NSX supercar.

The RLX will be powered by a new, direct-injected 3.5-liter V-6, rated at some 310 horsepower. Like the RL it replaces, expect the 2014 RLX to come loaded-up with technology, safety and luxury amenities.

As for details on pricing, launch date and specific equipment levels, you’ll have to wait until next Wednesday to find out, at the same time we do.

oo7spy

Between you and me, yes, but not everyone here is practicing the same religion apparently.

06RL/NBP

In the late 1980's I had a chance to drive a Honda Prelude 4WS and the 4 wheel steering was very impressive.

dwboston

I bought my first new car in 1990. I really wanted the Prelude with 4WS, but I also wanted ABS and the 4WS model didn't come with ABS. I ended up buying a Maxima SE. We bought a new Prelude Si for my wife four years later - that was a fun car to drive.

neuronbob

Anxiously awaiting the webcast. Thanks TSX69 for the link.

Hoping they lost the fugly wheels for the production car.




I remember the 1990 Prelude with 4WS. It was one of the first cars I lusted after. Had I not been a poor college student at the time, I would have bought one instead of my cheapo used 1982 Civic hatch.

oo7spy

The concept wheels were 20" just like the 2004 concept, but one of those reports put the production wheels at 19". I think it is safe to say they are long gone (or at least I hope).

mayflowerman

PAWS, Super-Duper All wheel handling, toe-in, electric V-8, blah, blah, blah. It's all great and extremely industry leading. I get that.

While we haven't yet had the chance to know more but how about arm rests (and glove boxes) with real leather that doesn't pucker. Or door handles that are waterproof, or HD radio and Pandora, or loads of other "basic" luxury sedan amenities?

Hey, do you think those headlights are glass or plastic?......(can you guess what I'm my RL project is for today?)

They better get the inside right this time. They are genius about what's under the hood but seem milk-toast to what the public expects in the cabin. If they want to sell this car they need to make sure they get the inside as high quality and high tech as their competition.

Glashub

I feel certain you all will know the details as soon as possible but I'm planning on going to auto show on the 1st. Great fun.

Professor

From the pic above I like the sheet metal bending under the A pillar and mirror... the wheels are terrible (looks like some daisy or one of the plastic molds you insert into a Playdough maker). Another thing, and it may just be the angle of the pic, the hood looks short and thick from top to bottom. Finally, the deck lid on the truck looks to be no more than 5 inches... almost a hatchback.

dwboston

That's the concept RLX. The production version is sure to be more conservative.

oo7spy

HD radio and Pandora are confirmed. Please find me a car that has glass headlight assemblies and then we can determine the quality of the rest of your post.

I feel you on the arm rest leather bubbles. IMO, it's unacceptable on a $50k car. However, it isn't specific to the RL when it comes to Honda leather.

What I don't get is why people are holding Acura to a level of luxury that a normal person would expect from an Italian car. You do realize that the vast majority of the automotive world doesn't consider Acura to be a luxury brand; right? It is an entry luxury brand. The upper echelon of everyday mass sellers or the lowest common denominator of the luxury breeds. If you want real leather throughout, fork over the money and buy a Maserati. It doesn't make sense to buy a $50k car and expect $100k quality.

neuronbob

.....mmmmmm.......Maserati.......

mayflowerman

Yeah, I don't think the expectation is leather throughout (let's not get all black and white about the issues) but if the material you use puckers this bad on the "wear & tear" area's, then maybe leather should be the solution. What's one more sq yard of leather going to add to the cost?

Who is holding the car to a higher standard than the car brand communicates? The car is is supposed to compete with the A5/6 and the GS350 and is forecasted to be in that price range so expectations are high but not Bentley-high.

So Volvo has glass headlamps. Hope my post meets the quality standards now.

alcura

Check it,
Very clean and clear than any exposured




Chinese interface dashboard









Thoughts?

TSX69

It looks nice & upscale overall. Not too wild about the interior wood and I find the center stack & the area b/n the 2 front seats oddly bulbous. Yay for cup holder covers - they seem to be going out style on a lot of the latest new models.

The exterior is pleasant enough, especially the shape of headlights. Hopefully some versions will come chrome door handles.

Timmy18

IT LOOKS AMAZING!
Thanks for the post! Alot! I really want to see more! I made sure to share this all with my friends! Thanks! It looks to be a test mule. I see there use and dirt marks in the interior and half the camo tape still on. Very nice, Looks completely upscale. I feel like Acura will sell these well as long as the base MSRP is below 55K.

It looks to be a top trim FWD, PAWS model, correct? I say that for the rims size, they look to be 17's and not exactly top trim worthy. Plus the LED headlights. Some spy shots have already shown a lower trim RLX with out them.

Love it, post more if you have them!

oo7spy

^ Electric e-brake.

I do agree about the leather. However, it is still a Honda. Honda leather tends to bubble. There are plenty of other pros that overwhelmingly outweigh that con.

Do you think the current RL doesn't compete with a GS350 or A6? If the RLX improves upon that (most notably with power), why won't it compete? I just don't understand why you write off the RL as vastly inferior.

My comment about the headlights came from the German cars where your $100k über-luxury sedans come with plastic lamps that get damaged by the UV rays just like the RL. If a Volvo is better than a 7-series or S-class, I don't know what to say.

mayflowerman

OK, no one said "vastly inferior" (where did that come from?) Hey, just sayin'. If it's going to continue to compete with current competition (and it does) then the interior design needs to compete and I mean seriously compete (minus the pop-up navi a-la the Audi). We paid too much for our RL's for them to be grown up TSX's.

That said....the spy pic's are a little disconcerting. Features look to be there (love the electronic brake) but the dual LCD's seem haphazard. A larger display (Tesla) or the side-by-side displays (Lexus, BMW) seem more integrated.

Many will buy based on spec's but more will buy on interior cabin comfort, features and aesthetics. It's an "eye of the beholder" issue, understood.

Those "mouse wheels" on the steering wheel looks interesting. Hopefully that won't be an "iDrive" nightmare. I also see that Acura hasn't lost their penchant for buttons. And the fingerprints on the lower LCD certainly makes that look like a touch screen display (I miss my TL sometimes....)

Can't wait to see it at the auto show!

JKftw

Love it! TSX69: funny you would mention the chrome handles. I like the little bit of chrome trim on the handles of my 2010 TL but noticed it isn't there on the 13 TL. Maybe Acura is moving away from that.