The Official 2009 TSX Thread **Unvelied in NY**
02-14-2008, 09:50 PM
#2001
Drifting
Oh no, you are so wrong... LOL!
Originally Posted by LukeaTron
Your crazy. I hate to say it but if you're that obsessed with how people perceive you, Acura was never the right brand for you. Nor will it ever be.
02-14-2008, 11:16 PM
#2002
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Long time no see fellas!
After seeing the proposed NSX body and the RL's, I actually expected them to do worse in some regard.
I'm pretty sure they even considered placing the good ol' trusty B18B motor in the TSX!
Also, it's kind of ironic that they made all those changes just to end up with an almost identical setup as my old TSX with improved gearing!
After seeing the proposed NSX body and the RL's, I actually expected them to do worse in some regard.
I'm pretty sure they even considered placing the good ol' trusty B18B motor in the TSX!
Also, it's kind of ironic that they made all those changes just to end up with an almost identical setup as my old TSX with improved gearing!
02-15-2008, 12:22 AM
#2003
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Originally Posted by LukeaTron
If you're looking at upwards of 290 HP, the TSX should never have even figured in your possibilities. You can be sure that even the Type-S won't come close to that. What's TL-S putting out? Isn't it like 285? Why would you ever have thought that Honda would out of the blue throw out a RWD that isn't a balls out sports car?
Your expectations are so far from reality that there was no other possible outcome than disappointment.
Your expectations are so far from reality that there was no other possible outcome than disappointment.
You missed my point, I clearly said I could overlook 50HP if the car looked better and offered a diff drivetrain, which, if you do the math would put it in the 240HP range. I dont know how long you have owned Honda products, but it was not an unreasonable expectation for them to take up the HP to 230-240 range. The reason I say I will be looking for 290 or more now, is because all the other sedans I am looking at now are in that range, plain and simple. I have no desire to buy a honda sports car, I have that area taken care of, but that also means I dont want an average performer sedan, that probably will not out perform the lower HP Civic SI M sedan.
Like I said before, I love my TSX, thats why I have had it so long, but this new offering, FOR ME, is sure to end my acura sedan driving days. My wife on the other hand, may never part with her MDX.
02-15-2008, 02:21 AM
#2004
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Once the new 2009 TSX, no matters how it looks, I will take it for a test drive. I will compare w/ my all-mod-up 05 TSX and see how it do... When is it in the showroom again?
02-15-2008, 07:29 AM
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Pretty ironic that on the top of the page as I'm replying to this post it has an advertisement for the Audi A5/S5. 
I heard that the new TSX will be in showrooms on Apr. 24.
I heard that the new TSX will be in showrooms on Apr. 24.
02-15-2008, 07:39 AM
#2007
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by Mokos23
Pretty ironic that on the top of the page as I'm replying to this post it has an advertisement for the Audi A5/S5.
I heard that the new TSX will be in showrooms on Apr. 24.
I heard that the new TSX will be in showrooms on Apr. 24.
02-15-2008, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
Hope your right. Maybe the RL will be in sooner too. I don't know why, but I'm dying to see this RL in person more then the TSX. Maybe it's like driving by a car accident. You know it's going to be ugly, but you still have to look
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f181ae4/0
02-15-2008, 08:18 AM
#2009
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by CGTSX2004
Those of you who have been around a while know that I am one of the staunchest defenders of the TSX. I loved everything about the current generation car. So much so that I have owned 2 of them. My family is about as loyal a buyer for Acura as any manufacturer could wish for, having owned in the last 15 years eight Acuras. I personally have had 3 Acuras and I have resisted going to other brands largely because no matter what I drove, the Acuras always had the best balance of driving dynamics, interior ergonomics, comfort, driving feel, technology, and value. The fact that it was an attractive looking car was absolutely a plus as well.
But you know that Acura has failed miserably when even a loyal family such as mine decides that none of us is interested in the next generation of Acura cars. My brother, who currently has an older Accord, is more enamored by the Golf GTI than he is by the offerings from Acura. My mother, who has an RL, saw the refreshed design and wrote it off completely from being her next car, which she will be looking to get within the next few months. My dad is ready to trade his MDX in for a Cadillac CTS. Even I find the new Audi A4, due in fall of this you, much more intriguing. When a family that owns 4 cars from the same manufacturer suddenly decides that nothing that manufacturer offers is of interest seems to clearly indicate that Acura and Honda are doing absolutely nothing for current buyers.
Some of you seem to be okay with Acura keeping this TSX as the status quo. However, as a whole new design, it really does not offer anything that is hugely appealing. Sure the price will be good. Sure the manual transmission will be the best feeling of any other car in the segment. But honestly, the lack of many features that other manufacturers are starting to offer as standard is beginning to become tiresome. For an MMC, I can forgive that. For a FMC, I cannot.
My expectations for the TSX were not that it would be a huge departure from the current car. However, I did expect Acura to at least maintain its tradition of handsome and timeless exterior designs. I did expect Acura to offer a more competitive engine package. I did expect there to be some sort of advancement in the drivetrain technology that was used on the vehicle. Unfortunately, Acura has failed rather miserably in all respects. Plus, they made the cardinal mistake of making the car even bigger, which honestly, was the last thing I wanted in a car.
So unless Acura decides to do the smart thing and offer up news of the Type-S, which by itself will not be enough to sway me from moving to another brand, they can pretty much count me as a previous customer. I have loved my TSX and it really has been the best car I have ever owned. I did not have the problems that many others here have experienced and the ownership experience has been one of the best I have experienced. But my loyalty is based on merit and unfortunately, Honda and Acura have proven that they are not interested in buyers like me.
But you know that Acura has failed miserably when even a loyal family such as mine decides that none of us is interested in the next generation of Acura cars. My brother, who currently has an older Accord, is more enamored by the Golf GTI than he is by the offerings from Acura. My mother, who has an RL, saw the refreshed design and wrote it off completely from being her next car, which she will be looking to get within the next few months. My dad is ready to trade his MDX in for a Cadillac CTS. Even I find the new Audi A4, due in fall of this you, much more intriguing. When a family that owns 4 cars from the same manufacturer suddenly decides that nothing that manufacturer offers is of interest seems to clearly indicate that Acura and Honda are doing absolutely nothing for current buyers.
Some of you seem to be okay with Acura keeping this TSX as the status quo. However, as a whole new design, it really does not offer anything that is hugely appealing. Sure the price will be good. Sure the manual transmission will be the best feeling of any other car in the segment. But honestly, the lack of many features that other manufacturers are starting to offer as standard is beginning to become tiresome. For an MMC, I can forgive that. For a FMC, I cannot.
My expectations for the TSX were not that it would be a huge departure from the current car. However, I did expect Acura to at least maintain its tradition of handsome and timeless exterior designs. I did expect Acura to offer a more competitive engine package. I did expect there to be some sort of advancement in the drivetrain technology that was used on the vehicle. Unfortunately, Acura has failed rather miserably in all respects. Plus, they made the cardinal mistake of making the car even bigger, which honestly, was the last thing I wanted in a car.
So unless Acura decides to do the smart thing and offer up news of the Type-S, which by itself will not be enough to sway me from moving to another brand, they can pretty much count me as a previous customer. I have loved my TSX and it really has been the best car I have ever owned. I did not have the problems that many others here have experienced and the ownership experience has been one of the best I have experienced. But my loyalty is based on merit and unfortunately, Honda and Acura have proven that they are not interested in buyers like me.
Amen.
02-15-2008, 08:21 AM
#2010
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Mokos23
here's the link i saw from edmunds, not 100% sure its legit, but the 04 TSX did get released in Apr 2003. so, this guy may be right.
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f181ae4/0
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f181ae4/0
We've known it will be in dealers April 24th for weeks if not well over a month already.
02-15-2008, 08:30 AM
#2011
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by LukeaTron
I've been thinking the exact same thing. The rear seat would have to effectively become two bucket type seats to accommodate the huge center hump to pass the axle through. The trunk would have to become much more shallow for the giant SH-AWD rear differential and axles. The rear suspension would need to be totally re-engineered. In essence, it would become a completely different animal.
I just don't see that happening for a car that will have relatively limited production. This is why I brought up the idea of an SH-FWD a few pages ago. Apparently Honda has done this already with the Prelude Type-SH and the reviews were glowing. Car and Driver claimed it made the car handle almost like a RWD. Personally, I could settle for a turboed FWD with a computer controlled differential. RWD and especially AWD eat so much horsepower anyway.
WRT to the delay of the Type-S. Yeah, you've got a legitimate gripe but I don't think you're situation is representative of most people's. I think by and large, a lot of these people are bitching because they want to bitch and aren't realistically considering a new TSX in the near future anyway. I mean if you have the choice of a BMW or Audi as so many are claiming they do, why are they looking at the TSX anyway? Just look at the price difference, these cars are only competitive with the TSX if you're willing to make concessions that the whiners are very much not. If you want more car than you'll ever be able to use, you're barking up the wrong tree with Honda.
I just don't see that happening for a car that will have relatively limited production. This is why I brought up the idea of an SH-FWD a few pages ago. Apparently Honda has done this already with the Prelude Type-SH and the reviews were glowing. Car and Driver claimed it made the car handle almost like a RWD. Personally, I could settle for a turboed FWD with a computer controlled differential. RWD and especially AWD eat so much horsepower anyway.
WRT to the delay of the Type-S. Yeah, you've got a legitimate gripe but I don't think you're situation is representative of most people's. I think by and large, a lot of these people are bitching because they want to bitch and aren't realistically considering a new TSX in the near future anyway. I mean if you have the choice of a BMW or Audi as so many are claiming they do, why are they looking at the TSX anyway? Just look at the price difference, these cars are only competitive with the TSX if you're willing to make concessions that the whiners are very much not. If you want more car than you'll ever be able to use, you're barking up the wrong tree with Honda.
Are you serious?
I had no idea all Subaru's had bucket seats in the back? What about the RL, does it have buckets too?
You speak as if no manufacturer has ever offered an AWD sedan would obviously could not be further from the truth. And last I heard, lack of trunk space, or bucket seats
in the back were not an issue. Not to mention the fact that the current gen TSX platform, as an Accord, had AWD as an option in Japan. Not SH-AWD but AWD nonetheless. So i'm sure there would be little difficulty offering AWD. But lets see what other excuses you can come up with. 
People are bitching because the car is a disappointment. Spin it any way you like, current owners are not happy, because the car is not enough of an improvement over the old one. If it is for you, great, enjoy. But don't try and convince us they did enough, its not happening.
The fact you can't seem to understand (see CGTSX2004's post) is that most of us want to buy another TSX, we are Acura fans, we love the brand. That's why we are here. We feel we are being forced into another brand, not really going there by choice.
<--- Getting really annoyed at being called a whiner.
02-15-2008, 08:48 AM
#2012
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by CGTSX2004
My expectations for the TSX were not that it would be a huge departure from the current car. However, I did expect Acura to at least maintain its tradition of handsome and timeless exterior designs. I did expect Acura to offer a more competitive engine package. I did expect there to be some sort of advancement in the drivetrain technology that was used on the vehicle. Unfortunately, Acura has failed rather miserably in all respects.
But I agree the engine package is a head scratcher. The K24 with a 5at is OLD stuff. Been around for years. This is what they package the new TSX with? At a time when they are saying a "new" Acura is about to emerge?
They've clearly fallen behind the competition now. I've been reading about the new BMW 128 and what it will offer. Very impressive. Either this is a temporary lull for them, and they've got their energies focused on some other new breakthroughs, or this is the beginning of a sea change in the industry. Hard to tell when you're in the middle of it. Probably the kind of thing you can only evaluate by looking back on it in 5/10 years
02-15-2008, 08:51 AM
#2013
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I'm aware other manufacturers have done it but I wasn't aware there's a version of the TSX with AWD. From under the car I just don't see where they'd have the room to pass the drive train. Just looking at the way the whole rear wheel assembly is put together the trunk floor would absolutely have to be raised as the bottom of it is well lower than the center point of the wheel. How are you supposed to get the axle through? Same thing with the center hump. Currently it's totally occupied by the exhaust with nowhere near enough room for the addition of an axle.
I am curious how they address these issues in the Japanese version.
I am curious how they address these issues in the Japanese version.
02-15-2008, 09:17 AM
#2014
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by LukeaTron
I'm aware other manufacturers have done it but I wasn't aware there's a version of the TSX with AWD. .
The rumor was that this new TSX would have an optional package with possibly a v6 and SHAWD. But where is it?
02-15-2008, 09:27 AM
#2015
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
There isn't. That's a big source of the complaining. Acura seemed to suggest they were committed to moving Acura to a Tier 1 lux brand. Well, that means more sophisticated powertrains, among other things. Then they release this same old story.
The rumor was that this new TSX would have an optional package with possibly a v6 and SHAWD. But where is it?
The rumor was that this new TSX would have an optional package with possibly a v6 and SHAWD. But where is it?
Read my post. We're talking previous gen here. There was an AWD Accord sold in Japan. As we know, the Accord and TSX are essentially the same car. Again, it was not SH-AWD.
I have no doubt the 09 TSX platform can accept AWD.
02-15-2008, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by dom
the current gen TSX platform, as an Accord, had AWD as an option in Japan. Not SH-AWD but AWD nonetheless.
02-15-2008, 10:01 AM
#2019
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The current TSX is the current JDM Accord. I can't find any reference on google to an AWD option for that car. All I see are people on other chat boards wishing there was an AWD option for the Accord.
02-15-2008, 10:23 AM
#2020
Originally Posted by wackura
The current TSX is the current JDM Accord. I can't find any reference on google to an AWD option for that car. All I see are people on other chat boards wishing there was an AWD option for the Accord.
Bottom of the page
02-15-2008, 10:58 AM
#2022
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That's the wagon version though, the area mostly involved with AWD mechanisms is a different car. I seriously doubt they would have gouged out a spot for AWD on the new TSX and not make use of it right off the bat. AWD isn't one of those teaser features you offer down the road like a Type-S where they just polish spark plugs and drill out larger air holes. The new TSX is boasting a tweaked engine and improved emissions, it's obvious what their priorities are.
02-15-2008, 11:05 AM
#2023
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by wackura
That's the wagon version though, the area mostly involved with AWD mechanisms is a different car. I seriously doubt they would have gouged out a spot for AWD on the new TSX and not make use of it right off the bat. AWD isn't one of those teaser features you offer down the road like a Type-S where they just polish spark plugs and drill out larger air holes. The new TSX is boasting a tweaked engine and improved emissions, it's obvious what their priorities are.
I guess only time will tell as far as AWD and the 09+ goes.
02-15-2008, 12:28 PM
#2024
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^^Great points you guys. I'd just like to add that maybe the 09 TSX really does have room for the SH-AWD components, turbo I4, &/or small V6, because isn't it something like 3 inches or so wider than the current version?
I thought I read somewhere that it's about as wide as the current TL (I'll post the specs when I find em). So if that extra girth isn't meant for power/drivetrain "upgrades" later on, it'd be a hell of a lot of size & weight to gain just for better passenger and cargo room don't ya think? Just my two cents. Carry on ;-)!
I thought I read somewhere that it's about as wide as the current TL (I'll post the specs when I find em). So if that extra girth isn't meant for power/drivetrain "upgrades" later on, it'd be a hell of a lot of size & weight to gain just for better passenger and cargo room don't ya think? Just my two cents. Carry on ;-)!
02-15-2008, 12:35 PM
#2025
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Originally Posted by Aspire705
I thought I read somewhere that it's about as wide as the current TL (I'll post the specs when I find em). So if that extra girth isn't meant for power/drivetrain "upgrades" later on, it'd be a hell of a lot of size & weight to gain just for better passenger and cargo room don't ya think? Just my two cents. Carry on ;-)!
2009 TSX
185.8" Length
72.4" width
62.2" Track
106.4" Wheelbase
2008 TSX
183.4" Length
69.4" Width
59.6" Track
105.1" Wheelbase
2008 TL
189.3" Length
75.4" Width
62.1" track
107.9" Wheelbase
Notice the track is the same as the TL, but other dimensions are less. I am hoping for slightly more leg room.
02-15-2008, 12:35 PM
#2026
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Man there are a lot of apologists on these boards! The TSX is still a very quality car and a great value but acura has really taken away any upgrade path for current owners. Looks, performance and size are all almost identical. Acura will sell plenty, but they will never grow their customer base if they continue to lose current customers who want more from their car.
I still think that the gas mileage on the TSX is laughable. My 2.0t now generates 245hp and 285lbft of torque(software) and I get 2 mpg BETTER than I did on the same commute with my TSX! (all the while driving a much much faster car)
Honestly I think part of my reason for going audi was to support what they did with the new TT. It's slightly longer and wider, but 300lbs lighter which is something i wish acura would look into doing!
I still think that the gas mileage on the TSX is laughable. My 2.0t now generates 245hp and 285lbft of torque(software) and I get 2 mpg BETTER than I did on the same commute with my TSX! (all the while driving a much much faster car)
Honestly I think part of my reason for going audi was to support what they did with the new TT. It's slightly longer and wider, but 300lbs lighter which is something i wish acura would look into doing!
02-15-2008, 12:40 PM
#2027
Go Big Blue!
I can understand the new TSX didn't come with SHAWD initially (disappointed by understand). However I can't believe they didn't design this new car to handle it when the optional engine packages are offered (6 months, a year from now, whenever).
If they plan on NEVER offering SHAWD on this 09+ TSX then I'm speechless. They've disappointed me lately but I still have more faith in them then that.
If they plan on NEVER offering SHAWD on this 09+ TSX then I'm speechless. They've disappointed me lately but I still have more faith in them then that.
02-15-2008, 12:47 PM
#2028
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Originally Posted by prballard
Slightly updated numbers from my earlier post
2009 TSX
185.8" Length
72.4" width
62.2" Track
106.4" Wheelbase
2008 TSX
183.4" Length
69.4" Width
59.6" Track
105.1" Wheelbase
2008 TL
189.3" Length
75.4" Width
62.1" track
107.9" Wheelbase
Notice the track is the same as the TL, but other dimensions are less. I am hoping for slightly more leg room.
2009 TSX
185.8" Length
72.4" width
62.2" Track
106.4" Wheelbase
2008 TSX
183.4" Length
69.4" Width
59.6" Track
105.1" Wheelbase
2008 TL
189.3" Length
75.4" Width
62.1" track
107.9" Wheelbase
Notice the track is the same as the TL, but other dimensions are less. I am hoping for slightly more leg room.
So now with an extra 2.6 inches of track width I'd say that bodes well for a future SH-AWD drivetrain setup wouldn't you guys? Fingers crossed, til then. 
One more thing. If Acura releases a more enthusiast-minded model with SHAWD, turbo 4/NA V6, uprated shocks, springs, wheels, tires, brakes & the lot, how much of a weight & price penalty are most of us here willing to pay? Because I could easily seeing such a model tipping the scales up around 3600lbs. & the hitting the pocket-book for around 35k. That too much for anyone to handle?
02-15-2008, 01:01 PM
#2029
Team Owner
Regarding the 201HP (manual transmission). If they specifically refer to the manual transmission then maybe they are quoting power and torque numbers at the wheels. Could they possibly have a different engine tune dependent on transmission choice?
Could they possibly have a different engine tune dependent on transmission choice?
02-15-2008, 01:05 PM
#2030
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As far as the AWD for the 09 TSX goes, the AWD used on the JDM 2.4 EL wagon is the 'Real Time 4WD system' same found on the CRV, which is basically a dual hydraulic pump differential.
This is a very basic setup compared with the VTM-4 setup on the Pilot and old MDX which uses a twin-clutch mechanisms on the center and rear LSDs.
SH-AWD employs a larger, twin-clutch rear differential, more sensors and a separate ECU. There is no CENTER DIFFERENTIAL.
In summary, Honda's basic 'Real Time 4WD' would be easy to incorporate in a sedan
The typical AWD system, Honda's VTM-4 is where we think of the 'hump' in cars becasue of the center differential. Not sedan friendly.
SH-AWD does not require this, so no 'hump', however the additional sensors, ecu, and the more complicated rear differential adds weight and considerable cost to the vehicle.
They would have to definitely engineer space in the TSX for all of that, but much easier than a typical AWD setup (i.e. VTM-4)
I'm not an expert, but hope that helps.
This is a very basic setup compared with the VTM-4 setup on the Pilot and old MDX which uses a twin-clutch mechanisms on the center and rear LSDs.
SH-AWD employs a larger, twin-clutch rear differential, more sensors and a separate ECU. There is no CENTER DIFFERENTIAL.
In summary, Honda's basic 'Real Time 4WD' would be easy to incorporate in a sedan
The typical AWD system, Honda's VTM-4 is where we think of the 'hump' in cars becasue of the center differential. Not sedan friendly.
SH-AWD does not require this, so no 'hump', however the additional sensors, ecu, and the more complicated rear differential adds weight and considerable cost to the vehicle.
They would have to definitely engineer space in the TSX for all of that, but much easier than a typical AWD setup (i.e. VTM-4)
I'm not an expert, but hope that helps.
02-15-2008, 01:05 PM
#2031
I spend 2 much time here
when i spoke to the service guy at my local acura dealership he said all the Acura lineup was eventially going to have SH-AWD.
so hopefully we will see the TSX with a version of this and HP increase via turbo. if we were to get that and slap on a mugen grill we'd be styling.
so hopefully we will see the TSX with a version of this and HP increase via turbo. if we were to get that and slap on a mugen grill we'd be styling.
02-15-2008, 01:38 PM
#2033
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THE JDM Accord SEDAN definitely offered 4WD. Not just wagon
I work at a japanese company, and when i told a fellow co-worker (ex-honda salesman) i was buying a TSX he laughed and told me i was over paying for just an accord. So to show i wasn't OVERPAYING, i built a JDM with smiliar features as the TSX on www.honda.co.jp and there DEFINITELY was an option for 4WD back then (can't remember if it was SH-AWD or anything specific like that).
So i just built the TSX again right now on japanese honda website (still gen 1) and it still lists 4WD as an option. Curiously thou, its only available if you match it with the K20a engine optionand no 6MT option. But as far the the frame having enough space (center and trunk), that should prove it does.
And for those curious, K20a 4wd + navi + leather + NBP/black + 5AT comes out to $29,860 (converted using today's exchange rate)
I work at a japanese company, and when i told a fellow co-worker (ex-honda salesman) i was buying a TSX he laughed and told me i was over paying for just an accord. So to show i wasn't OVERPAYING, i built a JDM with smiliar features as the TSX on www.honda.co.jp and there DEFINITELY was an option for 4WD back then (can't remember if it was SH-AWD or anything specific like that).
So i just built the TSX again right now on japanese honda website (still gen 1) and it still lists 4WD as an option. Curiously thou, its only available if you match it with the K20a engine optionand no 6MT option. But as far the the frame having enough space (center and trunk), that should prove it does.
And for those curious, K20a 4wd + navi + leather + NBP/black + 5AT comes out to $29,860 (converted using today's exchange rate)
02-15-2008, 01:39 PM
#2034
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by jlukja
Regarding the 201HP (manual transmission). If they specifically refer to the manual transmission then maybe they are quoting power and torque numbers at the wheels.
If so, I think that would be the first time a manufacturer advertised HP at the wheels.
So no.
Could they possibly have a different engine tune dependent on transmission choice?
The way I read that leads me to believe the AT for whatever reason will have less than 172. Not only do I not understand why, but how truly pathetic if the case.
02-15-2008, 01:43 PM
#2035
Originally Posted by dom
Thanks gt0279a, nice rundown.
I'd imagine the SH-AWD system has only gotten cheaper to produce and lighter since its inception back in 05.
I'd imagine the SH-AWD system has only gotten cheaper to produce and lighter since its inception back in 05.
The the systems in the current RDX and MDX use a fixed overdrive and steel shaft (not lighter!). When I look at the penalty the RL pays (in trunk space) for SH, I'm not convinced the TSX needs it. Personally, I wouldn't trade a manual for SH!
It's also worth noting that although we generalize these cars as 'platform' cars, there really are three sub-chassis that go together to make each car. In this fashion, each model is more distinct than the "accord chassis" moniker would have you believe. FWIW, it was told to me several years ago that the TSX wouldn't have AWD in order to keep it an entry level car.
02-15-2008, 01:51 PM
#2036
Intermediate
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i forgot to try the wagon on the website
the wagon gives the option for our 2.4L k24a with the 4wd.
i wonder what differences between the k20a and k24a in the accord frame does to possibly having the 4wd option...
the wagon gives the option for our 2.4L k24a with the 4wd.
i wonder what differences between the k20a and k24a in the accord frame does to possibly having the 4wd option...
02-15-2008, 01:53 PM
#2037
Which AWD is this? RealTime, VTM-4 or SH?
02-15-2008, 02:00 PM
#2038
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Colin
SH-AWD has evolved over the original in the RL. The original RL had a carbon fiber driveshaft, and a planetary gearset to generate the 5% overdrive for the outside wheel. (the new RL now does 5.7% overdrive and now in 1st gear vs. 2nd previously)
The the systems in the current RDX and MDX use a fixed overdrive and steel shaft (not lighter!). When I look at the penalty the RL pays (in trunk space) for SH, I'm not convinced the TSX needs it. Personally, I wouldn't trade a manual for SH!
It's also worth noting that although we generalize these cars as 'platform' cars, there really are three sub-chassis that go together to make each car. In this fashion, each model is more distinct than the "accord chassis" moniker would have you believe. FWIW, it was told to me several years ago that the TSX wouldn't have AWD in order to keep it an entry level car.
The the systems in the current RDX and MDX use a fixed overdrive and steel shaft (not lighter!). When I look at the penalty the RL pays (in trunk space) for SH, I'm not convinced the TSX needs it. Personally, I wouldn't trade a manual for SH!
It's also worth noting that although we generalize these cars as 'platform' cars, there really are three sub-chassis that go together to make each car. In this fashion, each model is more distinct than the "accord chassis" moniker would have you believe. FWIW, it was told to me several years ago that the TSX wouldn't have AWD in order to keep it an entry level car.
Fair enough Colin.
But its also worth noting that pretty much everyone else has now jumped on the SH-AWD bandwagon and have an AWD system that varies torque left to right. So we can argue whether Acura should equip the TSX with SH-AWD but its competitors will all have torque vectoring system (for lack of a better term) in the near future.
Off the top of my head Audi and BMW have already announced their systems and the new EVO has it and I'm fairly certain the GT-R has a similar system as well. So its only a matter of time before the rest of Nissan/Infiniti line sees it as well. Saab also equips the new 9-3 with torque splitting AWD.
So the fact that Acura was the first to come out with such a great system and then allowed themselves to once again get passed by the competition is even more disheartening.
02-15-2008, 02:16 PM
#2039
Burning Brakes
No Turbo...
Read here...
http://www.automobilemag.com/auto_sh...tsx/index.html
Don't know if this is just hearsay, but according to this article, the reason why Acura didn't put the K23T into the 09 TSX is because:
http://www.automobilemag.com/auto_sh...tsx/index.html
Don't know if this is just hearsay, but according to this article, the reason why Acura didn't put the K23T into the 09 TSX is because:
The engine's intercooler would not fit under the TSX's streamlined hood, and it would have added weight, complexity, and cost to the car.
02-15-2008, 02:18 PM
#2040
Originally Posted by dom
Fair enough Colin.
So we can argue whether Acura should equip the TSX with SH-AWD but its competitors will all have torque vectoring system (for lack of a better term) in the near future.
So the fact that Acura was the first to come out with such a great system and then allowed themselves to once again get passed by the competition is even more disheartening.
So we can argue whether Acura should equip the TSX with SH-AWD but its competitors will all have torque vectoring system (for lack of a better term) in the near future.
So the fact that Acura was the first to come out with such a great system and then allowed themselves to once again get passed by the competition is even more disheartening.
The much ballyhooed Sports 4 is supposed to be the TL and not the TSX (look at the split lower grill in the front bumper). But even there, the sports 4 is only a concept. Few concepts ever make production.
No doubt that Honda has a long history of developing excellent technology and then not marketing it properly. I suppose this is price we pay for their engineering vs. marketing philosophy. The head at Honda Motor co is always an engineer, they never rise through the marketing ranks......