Microsoft: Surface News and Discussion Thread
#201
Go Giants
Getting good press, may pick one up.
#202
Suzuka Master
dont you already have a nexus 7, ipad 3 or 4 and some macbook pro???
#203
Go Giants
Currently a MacBook Pro retina, MacBook Air, nexus 7, iPad 4 and an iPhone 5. What's your point?
The following users liked this post:
Mizouse (02-14-2013)
#204
Suzuka Master
when will you even use it?
#205
Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Not Las Vegas (SF Bay Area)
Age: 39
Posts: 63,171
Received 2,773 Likes
on
1,976 Posts
Not liking the battery reviews, so no thanks
#206
Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Not Las Vegas (SF Bay Area)
Age: 39
Posts: 63,171
Received 2,773 Likes
on
1,976 Posts
@ wsklar
#207
Senior Moderator
#208
The Third Ball
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
Age: 45
Posts: 49,122
Received 4,824 Likes
on
2,571 Posts
in teh tube
#209
The Third Ball
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
Age: 45
Posts: 49,122
Received 4,824 Likes
on
2,571 Posts
the big mistakes (and largest critiques) of the Pro are shit for nothing battery life and shit for memory...Kinda blows when the OS eats up a huge chunk of the Solid State...which is where a lot of what you're paying for comes from.
#210
Pro
Picked one up today at the MS Store. I just dropped by to play with one and see if I could be put on a call list or something since I wasn't expecting them to have any til the weekend. They said they got a shipment in the afternoon so I grabbed one.
There was a lot of interest while I was playing with the display model. At least 10 people came in to check it out while I was playing on it for about 45 minutes. Eavesdropping on the conversations, there was a lot of positive feedback from them too. The only bad things I heard was price and weight. For me the price was fair value, but I do agree the weight does feel a little on the hefty side. Since I'm getting this to work on as a laptop though, it's not really that big a deal.
There was a lot of interest while I was playing with the display model. At least 10 people came in to check it out while I was playing on it for about 45 minutes. Eavesdropping on the conversations, there was a lot of positive feedback from them too. The only bad things I heard was price and weight. For me the price was fair value, but I do agree the weight does feel a little on the hefty side. Since I'm getting this to work on as a laptop though, it's not really that big a deal.
#211
Go Giants
Agreed. I would be ok with 64 GB and use a SD card or USB stick as a 3rd laptop.
#212
Pro
After a week with it, I think I will be keeping it. The first one I got had some hardware problem with the keyboard, but the replacement has been working great. The weight is not an issue anymore, it only feels heavy when you first pick it up, but I've gotten used to it and barely notice it now. Much lighter and more portable than any laptop I've ever used. Performance is great, no lag anywhere as far as I can tell.
There needs to be more metro style apps, but that will come in time. Really looking forward to the VLC port since I plan on using VLC a lot and the desktop version works well, but one with touchscreen compatibility would be nice. From other reports, lots of games run well on it too. I've only tried Counter Strike 1.6 since that's the only game I play and it's not much of a benchmark anymore.
At work, I have it on the side to browse Chive, Reddit, ect while doing real work on my desktop so I don't have to switch between windows. At home I use it in bed a lot while watching tv or just to browse before going to sleep. Pop out the stand, flip the cover to use as a base and rest it on my lap. Works great and just as stable as a laptop for me. Of course it's because I don't need the keyboard and the on-screen is quick enough for doing searches and short messages.
Pretty glad I skipped the last 3-4 years of laptops and tablets to wait for a hybrid device like this. For me, MS delivered exactly what I was looking for, but some people will have problems with it. I noticed the small screen size will be hard for people with bigger hands to use. It also makes text sharp, but very small. I like using the pen if I have trouble with it. Everyone knows about the battery life and storage issues so that's really up to the buyers needs. The 128GB is more than I need, still have over 80GB free and haven't removed my recovery yet. Will do that when I feel like I need the extra room. I access most of my stuff remotely so I don't really need it on the hard drive locally. Might just put a few movies and tv shows though since those lag when I stream. Everyone pretty much knows what's negative with the device already, but to me, they aren't really major problems. To others though it might be, but I'd say test it out and see for yourself.
There needs to be more metro style apps, but that will come in time. Really looking forward to the VLC port since I plan on using VLC a lot and the desktop version works well, but one with touchscreen compatibility would be nice. From other reports, lots of games run well on it too. I've only tried Counter Strike 1.6 since that's the only game I play and it's not much of a benchmark anymore.
At work, I have it on the side to browse Chive, Reddit, ect while doing real work on my desktop so I don't have to switch between windows. At home I use it in bed a lot while watching tv or just to browse before going to sleep. Pop out the stand, flip the cover to use as a base and rest it on my lap. Works great and just as stable as a laptop for me. Of course it's because I don't need the keyboard and the on-screen is quick enough for doing searches and short messages.
Pretty glad I skipped the last 3-4 years of laptops and tablets to wait for a hybrid device like this. For me, MS delivered exactly what I was looking for, but some people will have problems with it. I noticed the small screen size will be hard for people with bigger hands to use. It also makes text sharp, but very small. I like using the pen if I have trouble with it. Everyone knows about the battery life and storage issues so that's really up to the buyers needs. The 128GB is more than I need, still have over 80GB free and haven't removed my recovery yet. Will do that when I feel like I need the extra room. I access most of my stuff remotely so I don't really need it on the hard drive locally. Might just put a few movies and tv shows though since those lag when I stream. Everyone pretty much knows what's negative with the device already, but to me, they aren't really major problems. To others though it might be, but I'd say test it out and see for yourself.
The following users liked this post:
JeffCr (04-28-2013)
#213
Go Giants
Good review....
#214
Go Giants
The wife got me a Surface RT, we are going to exchange it for a Surface pro soon. Woot....
The following users liked this post:
JeffCr (04-28-2013)
#215
Drifting
I kinda forgot about the Surface for a while, and I admit I thought it was kinda dumb/overpriced at first. It's really started to grow on me though and I LOVE the tablet form and function, I don't think I could ever go back to a keyboard and trackpad only laptop again. My old TF101 was great and I love my Nexus 7, I watch Netflix at lunch, read the internet on it, listen to podcasts in the car, do some light photoshopping but ultimately it's limited. My 6 year old Macbook needs a new keyboard and battery, it's stuck in my room because I can't even unplug it for a second without it dying.
So I've been researching everything and I think I'm gonna get a Surface Pro tomorrow after work . I got to play with some Windows 8 tablets before and was really impressed, and it'll be nice to have a machine that I can photoshop RAW files on without it choking.
So I've been researching everything and I think I'm gonna get a Surface Pro tomorrow after work . I got to play with some Windows 8 tablets before and was really impressed, and it'll be nice to have a machine that I can photoshop RAW files on without it choking.
#216
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
Microsoft said to be planning next-gen Surface announcement for June
http://www.theverge.com/2013/5/2/429...gen-rumor-june
Microsoft has long been rumored to be working on a 7-inch version of its Surface tablet, but a new report suggests the company may be preparing to unveil it in June. DigiTimes claims that second-generation Surface devices, with 7- to 9-inch displays, will be announced at Microsoft's Build developer conference in late June. If the report is accurate, then it suggests Microsoft may be preparing more than one Surface device.
An Xbox Surface device emerged shortly before Microsoft's official Surface tablet announcement last year, and we understand the Xbox and Surface teams have been working closely on the company's 7-inch plans. Microsoft is expected to launch a 7-inch Surface-branded tablet, with the company recently changing its Windows 8 tablet specifications to support smaller screen sizes. Microsoft has confirmed it's working closely with OEMs to bring cheaper and smaller Windows tablets to market. A leaked 8-inch Acer tablet suggests these types of devices are imminent.
Microsoft's Build conference will focus on its Windows 8.1 upgrade and the improvements for 7- and 8-inch tablets, we understand. It also follows shortly after Intel's planned Haswell launch on June 3rd and the annual Computex event where OEMs typically announce devices. Intel's new Haswell chips are designed to improve battery life and graphics performance, and The Verge understands Microsoft will continue to update its Surface Pro with the latest Intel chipsets.
With Microsoft's continued insistence that it is a "devices and services" company, there has been a distinct lack of devices. Microsoft originally announced its Surface tablets almost a year ago, launching the Surface RT in October, but the company has remained silent on any further plans. Continued smartwatch and Surface Phone rumors suggest the company is investigating additional devices, but a focus on smaller 7-inch devices appears to be the more immediate plan for Surface.
An Xbox Surface device emerged shortly before Microsoft's official Surface tablet announcement last year, and we understand the Xbox and Surface teams have been working closely on the company's 7-inch plans. Microsoft is expected to launch a 7-inch Surface-branded tablet, with the company recently changing its Windows 8 tablet specifications to support smaller screen sizes. Microsoft has confirmed it's working closely with OEMs to bring cheaper and smaller Windows tablets to market. A leaked 8-inch Acer tablet suggests these types of devices are imminent.
Microsoft's Build conference will focus on its Windows 8.1 upgrade and the improvements for 7- and 8-inch tablets, we understand. It also follows shortly after Intel's planned Haswell launch on June 3rd and the annual Computex event where OEMs typically announce devices. Intel's new Haswell chips are designed to improve battery life and graphics performance, and The Verge understands Microsoft will continue to update its Surface Pro with the latest Intel chipsets.
With Microsoft's continued insistence that it is a "devices and services" company, there has been a distinct lack of devices. Microsoft originally announced its Surface tablets almost a year ago, launching the Surface RT in October, but the company has remained silent on any further plans. Continued smartwatch and Surface Phone rumors suggest the company is investigating additional devices, but a focus on smaller 7-inch devices appears to be the more immediate plan for Surface.
#217
Go Giants
#218
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
Those haswell chips are pretty bad ass. Here's two great articles about Haswell and the ton of changes coming with it.
http://anandtech.com/show/6355/intel...l-architecture
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/...ok-at-haswell/
When these chips shrink to 14nm next year and then Broadwell goes to 10nm in 2016, shit is going to get real!
http://anandtech.com/show/6355/intel...l-architecture
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/...ok-at-haswell/
When these chips shrink to 14nm next year and then Broadwell goes to 10nm in 2016, shit is going to get real!
#220
Go Giants
Getting mine in 2 weeks....This will complete my laptop collection for now.
#221
Drifting
Old comment I know, but honestly these two critiques are kinda BS. You'll get 4-6 hours off of the battery, and with a 128gb SSD you have 93ish gb's available BUT this is in line with pretty much EVERY ultrabook on the market. For example the Macbook Air (almost the same guts) gets 4-6 hours of battery and has 95gb's available from it's 128gb drive.
#222
Go Giants
My MBA has a 512 GB Drive....
#224
Go Giants
Im not sure if the Surface to Air is a good comparison....Now a touch screen Air with a detachable keyboard would be hot, there is a new Apple patient out there.
#225
Pro
Same here, love mine. But I might be very tempted to update if the new one stays at 10.6" with the new chip in a thinner and lighter body. If the screen is smaller then I might have to pass this time though.
#227
Go Giants
#229
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
#230
Drifting
Thank you, I was looking for that pic.
Honestly, it would make a lot of sense for Apple to make one too since they are the only other ones with a desktop OS (not counting Linux or Ubuntu). I don't think it would ever happen though, Apple has made it clear that they are now a consumer company and has no interest in the professional world anymore. They making a killing off of all the iPad iterations and I'm sure they would charge an arm and a leg for a iPad w/osx... Plus it would cannibalize Macbook Air sales more then they already are.
Honestly, it would make a lot of sense for Apple to make one too since they are the only other ones with a desktop OS (not counting Linux or Ubuntu). I don't think it would ever happen though, Apple has made it clear that they are now a consumer company and has no interest in the professional world anymore. They making a killing off of all the iPad iterations and I'm sure they would charge an arm and a leg for a iPad w/osx... Plus it would cannibalize Macbook Air sales more then they already are.
#231
Go Giants
Exactly, Apple doesnt want to compete against itself.
#232
Unofficial Goat
iTrader: (1)
they did it with the mini, and the iPhone. They've been successfully trading consumers down for years in a grab for share. They've cannibalized ipod sales to the point where the sales are insignificant. They can't be afraid to destroy a product category under the guise of protecting it versus selling something the market wants.
#233
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
I got to agree with teh dougler, Apple isn't afraid to cannibalize. No sense making a product that doesn't fit all of your customers needs when you can make one that does.
Doesn't mean I think they'll make an iPad running OS X though, not yet at least
Doesn't mean I think they'll make an iPad running OS X though, not yet at least
Last edited by #1 STUNNA; 05-04-2013 at 11:39 AM.
#234
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
So here's a new feature that surfaced () in the leaked build of 8.1 9385 that's will be most beneficial to the Surface Pro.
In Blue: Automatic Desktop Display Scaling
This is a leaked beta build so it's probably not working perfectly yet.
http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/bl...isplay-scaling
In Blue: Automatic Desktop Display Scaling
In yesterday’s brief overview of a newly-leaked build of Windows 8.1 “Blue,” I noted that Microsoft had added a new automatic desktop screen scaling feature that appears aimed at fixing a long-standing issue with Windows. Having tested this feature on a real PC with multiple displays, I now have a bit more to report.
Check out In Blue: Notes from Build 9385 if you haven’t already. But this automatic desktop screen scaling feature is perhaps more momentous than is immediately obvious. If you recall, I had previously written a series called Going Pro in which I described my attempts to migrate entirely to the Microsoft Surface with Windows 8 Pro. In one of those articles, Going Pro: Replacing the Desktop, I hit upon a key weakness in Windows that was made obvious by this hardware:
“The Surface Pro, as you know, utilizes a 1080p (1920 x 1080) HD screen that is often touted as one of its best features,” I wrote. “But this display is only 10.6 inches big. Which is to say it’s tiny by PC standards … For me, and for many others, the Surface Pro screen is simply too tiny to accommodate that 1080p resolution.”
“Microsoft ships the Surface Pro with the rarely-used desktop display scaling feature set to 150 percent. This bumps up the size of all on-screen objects by the specified percentage. So at 150 percent, everything is half again as big as it would be natively. The effect on the 10.6 inch Surface screen is that the desktop looks roughly—not exactly, roughly—like a 1366 x 768 display.”
“Windows’ lackluster desktop scaling functionality really becomes a problem when you need to connect a second screen. Among other issues, you can’t set the scaling to different values for each screen. So while the Surface Pro’s 1080p screen looks OK at 150 percent scaling, when you duplicate or extend or replace that screen to a second display, like my 27-inch Planar monitor, which also runs at a native 1080p resolution, it looks terrible. Onscreen elements are now gigantic, and the Windows desktop looks like a Fisher Price toy.”
Faced with criticism like this, Panos Panay, who leads the Surface team at Microsoft, pledged that a fix for the Windows desktop display scaling issue—which, to be fair, has been a problem for a long, long time—would be fixed sometime this year. Some wondered if the fix would come as an update for Surface users, but it seemed to me that the right place was in Windows itself. And with Windows 8.1 “Blue” shipping this year … well, that seemed like the obvious place to make it happen.
And sure enough, that is exactly what’s happening.
By default, the Display control panel in Windows 8.1 indicates that Windows will automatically manage the display settings, including display scaling. But when I installed this build on a real PC, an addition control emerged, supporting my contention that the auto scaling would be based on some combination screen size and pixel density. There’s a slider that lets you move between Smaller and Larger steps.
Disable the auto display scaling, and you get the old-school manual choices, though the 200 percent option I see in the VM (virtual machine) is not available on this particular computer. I’m curious if that’s because of the size of the display.
I was also curious to see what would happen if I connected a large, external display. After all, the other question about this promised desktop display scaling issue is whether Windows would ever support different display scaling on each connected display. Obviously, that would be ideal, not just for Surface Pro but for many PCs.
So I connected my 27-inch Planar display to the PC running Windows 8.1 “Blue” build 9385. The results were interesting … but inconclusive.
First, I extended the display to the second monitor and rebooted just in the cas. Examining the Display control panel side-by-side on the two displays, I noted that the Smaller/Larger slider had changed from Larger to one step up from Smaller. (There are four steps in all.)
Furthermore, I could open this control panel separately on each display. I changed the one on the larger display to a step below Larger. The control panel on the smaller (built-in) display didn’t change. But when I closed it and reopened it … it did change. To the same value.
There are all kinds of reasons for this behavior, not the least of which is that it’s beta code. But it may just not work ideally, with different display scaling on each monitor. I’ll need to examine this on more machines, and with future builds, to be sure.
But even in the worst-case scenario, this new auto display scaling feature appears to be an improvement.
Let’s say you have a small screen tablet, like Surface Pro, that you dock and use with a large display at work (or home, or whatever). Worst case, an auto display scaling feature will still provide the “right” desktop display scaling … after a reboot. Better would be auto-adjusting on the fly. Best would be different scaling settings for different displays.
Today, Windows 8 doesn’t provide auto scaling or different scaling per display. So however this works out, it’s still better.
Check out In Blue: Notes from Build 9385 if you haven’t already. But this automatic desktop screen scaling feature is perhaps more momentous than is immediately obvious. If you recall, I had previously written a series called Going Pro in which I described my attempts to migrate entirely to the Microsoft Surface with Windows 8 Pro. In one of those articles, Going Pro: Replacing the Desktop, I hit upon a key weakness in Windows that was made obvious by this hardware:
“The Surface Pro, as you know, utilizes a 1080p (1920 x 1080) HD screen that is often touted as one of its best features,” I wrote. “But this display is only 10.6 inches big. Which is to say it’s tiny by PC standards … For me, and for many others, the Surface Pro screen is simply too tiny to accommodate that 1080p resolution.”
“Microsoft ships the Surface Pro with the rarely-used desktop display scaling feature set to 150 percent. This bumps up the size of all on-screen objects by the specified percentage. So at 150 percent, everything is half again as big as it would be natively. The effect on the 10.6 inch Surface screen is that the desktop looks roughly—not exactly, roughly—like a 1366 x 768 display.”
“Windows’ lackluster desktop scaling functionality really becomes a problem when you need to connect a second screen. Among other issues, you can’t set the scaling to different values for each screen. So while the Surface Pro’s 1080p screen looks OK at 150 percent scaling, when you duplicate or extend or replace that screen to a second display, like my 27-inch Planar monitor, which also runs at a native 1080p resolution, it looks terrible. Onscreen elements are now gigantic, and the Windows desktop looks like a Fisher Price toy.”
Faced with criticism like this, Panos Panay, who leads the Surface team at Microsoft, pledged that a fix for the Windows desktop display scaling issue—which, to be fair, has been a problem for a long, long time—would be fixed sometime this year. Some wondered if the fix would come as an update for Surface users, but it seemed to me that the right place was in Windows itself. And with Windows 8.1 “Blue” shipping this year … well, that seemed like the obvious place to make it happen.
And sure enough, that is exactly what’s happening.
By default, the Display control panel in Windows 8.1 indicates that Windows will automatically manage the display settings, including display scaling. But when I installed this build on a real PC, an addition control emerged, supporting my contention that the auto scaling would be based on some combination screen size and pixel density. There’s a slider that lets you move between Smaller and Larger steps.
Disable the auto display scaling, and you get the old-school manual choices, though the 200 percent option I see in the VM (virtual machine) is not available on this particular computer. I’m curious if that’s because of the size of the display.
I was also curious to see what would happen if I connected a large, external display. After all, the other question about this promised desktop display scaling issue is whether Windows would ever support different display scaling on each connected display. Obviously, that would be ideal, not just for Surface Pro but for many PCs.
So I connected my 27-inch Planar display to the PC running Windows 8.1 “Blue” build 9385. The results were interesting … but inconclusive.
First, I extended the display to the second monitor and rebooted just in the cas. Examining the Display control panel side-by-side on the two displays, I noted that the Smaller/Larger slider had changed from Larger to one step up from Smaller. (There are four steps in all.)
Furthermore, I could open this control panel separately on each display. I changed the one on the larger display to a step below Larger. The control panel on the smaller (built-in) display didn’t change. But when I closed it and reopened it … it did change. To the same value.
There are all kinds of reasons for this behavior, not the least of which is that it’s beta code. But it may just not work ideally, with different display scaling on each monitor. I’ll need to examine this on more machines, and with future builds, to be sure.
But even in the worst-case scenario, this new auto display scaling feature appears to be an improvement.
Let’s say you have a small screen tablet, like Surface Pro, that you dock and use with a large display at work (or home, or whatever). Worst case, an auto display scaling feature will still provide the “right” desktop display scaling … after a reboot. Better would be auto-adjusting on the fly. Best would be different scaling settings for different displays.
Today, Windows 8 doesn’t provide auto scaling or different scaling per display. So however this works out, it’s still better.
http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/bl...isplay-scaling
#235
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
May 4th only: $100 off a Surface RT or Pro at Staples, 20% off a Touch/Type cover
http://www.staples.com/sbd/cre/coupons/
http://www.winbeta.org/news/may-4th-...ouchtype-cover
Here is a great deal for today only. Head over to Staples to purchase a Surface RT or Surface Pro and get $100 off the price. On top of that, you can utilize a 20% off coupon to purchase a Touch/Type cover for less.
Staples is running a promotion that ends today, Saturday, May 4th, and features a $100 discount coupon that applies to any Windows 8 or Windows RT laptop, desktop, or tablet. "Valid through 5/4/13 in Staples U.S. stores only. Discount applies to any Windows 8/RT laptop, desktop or tablet. Models vary by store. Limit 1 per customer. While supplies last," the promotion disclaimer reads.
The 20% off coupon has a lot more restrictions compared to the $100 off coupon. "Discount applies to highest-priced item. Not valid on desktop or laptop computers, tablets, netbooks, Apple products, Amazon Kindle, NOOK, Epson ink and toner, custom printing orders placed online, gift cards, mobile phones and mobile phone services, Staples EasyTech professional-grade and on-site services, depot repair and parts, phone cards or postage stamps," the disclaimer reads. However, you can use this coupon to snag a Touch or Type cover to go along with your new Surface RT or Surface Pro.
The Surface Pro 128GB currently runs for $999 at Staples and the Surface RT 64GB runs for $599 (without the discount). So If you have been holding out on purchasing a Surface device, today might be your lucky day. Print these coupons and head over to your local Staples to snag your device before supplies are gone!
Staples is running a promotion that ends today, Saturday, May 4th, and features a $100 discount coupon that applies to any Windows 8 or Windows RT laptop, desktop, or tablet. "Valid through 5/4/13 in Staples U.S. stores only. Discount applies to any Windows 8/RT laptop, desktop or tablet. Models vary by store. Limit 1 per customer. While supplies last," the promotion disclaimer reads.
The 20% off coupon has a lot more restrictions compared to the $100 off coupon. "Discount applies to highest-priced item. Not valid on desktop or laptop computers, tablets, netbooks, Apple products, Amazon Kindle, NOOK, Epson ink and toner, custom printing orders placed online, gift cards, mobile phones and mobile phone services, Staples EasyTech professional-grade and on-site services, depot repair and parts, phone cards or postage stamps," the disclaimer reads. However, you can use this coupon to snag a Touch or Type cover to go along with your new Surface RT or Surface Pro.
The Surface Pro 128GB currently runs for $999 at Staples and the Surface RT 64GB runs for $599 (without the discount). So If you have been holding out on purchasing a Surface device, today might be your lucky day. Print these coupons and head over to your local Staples to snag your device before supplies are gone!
http://www.winbeta.org/news/may-4th-...ouchtype-cover
#236
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
if you guys are looking for a good YouTube app. Check out MetroTube. It's the #1 YT app on the WP Store and it looks pretty good on Win 8.
http://apps.microsoft.com/windows/en...0-690365559df6
http://apps.microsoft.com/windows/en...0-690365559df6
#237
Go Giants
they did it with the mini, and the iPhone. They've been successfully trading consumers down for years in a grab for share. They've cannibalized ipod sales to the point where the sales are insignificant. They can't be afraid to destroy a product category under the guise of protecting it versus selling something the market wants.
#238
Go Giants
May 4th only: $100 off a Surface RT or Pro at Staples, 20% off a Touch/Type cover
http://www.staples.com/sbd/cre/coupons/
http://www.winbeta.org/news/may-4th-...ouchtype-cover
http://www.staples.com/sbd/cre/coupons/
http://www.winbeta.org/news/may-4th-...ouchtype-cover
#239
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
it's in-store and US only, Benedict Arnold
#240
Sanest Florida Man
Thread Starter
Well since MS and Apple have their cross patent license agreement they could use the Touchpad, Typepad patents....
Are you gettting the touch or type pad or neither?
Are you gettting the touch or type pad or neither?