97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Finally get to see hockey again tonight, I was so desperate for hockey that I watched the Flyers v Brooklyn Dodgers the other night

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

The Browns?

Look at how many QB's they've been through in the last 10-15 years

Yumcha

Have they had that many #1 overall picks...?

TacoBello

You need to take the #1 draft picks off the pedestal. They're fucking children, not team changers.

And blackack is right. QBs are team changers. And yet the browns have gone through 82756 of them

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Not necessarily #1 overalls, but a LOT of high first rounders

Yumcha

Clearly, not in Edmonton's case.

But, I would suspect Washington with Ovie and Pittsburgh with Sid will politely disagree.

Yumcha

Tell you what: You give any other NHL team THAT many #1 overalls, I would suspect you'd have some sort of salary cap dynasty without skipping years if they are smart with the cap.



#1 overall generally means that a particular player is heads-above the rest. McDavid is SUPPOSED to be a team-changer. He's supposed to push any well-run team above the hump.


Except...in Edmonton.

TacoBello

Yes, and remind me how many times ovie has won the cup...

And Yes, Sid is special, but he is surrounded by a great team overall, and has for years. I don't see them lacking defense as bad as edmonton. Plus, even if edmonton was on the same level as the penguins, 19/20 players would still choose Pittsburgh over edmonton

TacoBello

And he has. He's been putting up great points, along with anyone who plays with him. Are you insinuating that the terrible defense that is supposed to stop plays and pucks from going in is his fault? Or are you insinuating that his offensive prowess should increase the defensive players game?

Yumcha

Whoa whoa...ninja...Edmonton is 32414234 spots away from even getting into the playoffs let alone talking CUP. At least the Caps got in to the playoffs...? And you say great players with Pittsburgh, no argument there...but, was Letang a #1 overall pick? Was Hornqvist a #1 overall pick? How about Maata...?

I don't think you're disagreeing with me.

If you give a team like the Pens repeated #1 overalls over and over and over and over...um, yeah...they'd have more than just that 1 Cup a few years ago.

Yumcha

Not implying anything since we already agreed Edmonton's defense and blueline is beyond turd.

Just that, it's unbelievable how a team can have this many #1 overalls and still suck. I think you and I are on different tangents.

TacoBello

Well played, good sir. Well played.

I think there's more to it than that. I remember many moons ago, in the summer Olympics, the US put together the ultimate basketball dream team, made up of the best of the best players. And yet they were knocked out in the first round or something. A bunch of #1s isn't as important as gelling together.

Look at the Kings when they won the cup the first time, a few years ago. They weren't a dream team by any stretch. But those guys meshed together like crazy. Don't get me wrong- they were good, but many other teams were better than them, at least on paper.

Yumcha

I agree...that talent alone is not enough to WIN IT ALL. It is a factor of luck, systems, coaching, luck...and even match-ups. Many things have to come together for a team to win the Stanley Cup...it's why most agree it's the hardest trophy to win in all team sports.

HOWEVER, we're not talking about the Cup. We are talking about not FINISHING 30th...again. With that talent and repeated #1 overall picks, Edmonton isn't supposed to be this lousy. Just on talent alone, they SHOULD make the playoffs at least...not finish 30th year after year after year so that they can nab yet another #1 overall prospect.

That's all I'm saying. And we also already covered WHY Edmonton is always 30th...they are drafting wrong and any pick past the 1st overall has usually been turd. So, we know what's ailing the franchise.

But, what I'm saying is that by all logic, any team with THIS many #1 overall picks? They should be somewhere now. At least sniffing at the playoffs...Edmonton isn't even in the playoff race. And they are being out-performed by teams PURPOSELY gutted to bleed points. Unreal.

black label

Number 1 picks equal one thing, talent. Talent alone doesn't win cups, talent doesn't win anything besides shootouts.

The unmeasurable win cups, grit, determination, leadership and drive. The things that will never show up on stats sheets quantified into easily read numbers. Without good gritty player and real locker room leadership you are relying on the perfect storm of luck to win the cup.

Yumcha

Is Moog telling you that Deano can fix everything, black label?

black label

Look at the pre salary cap NY rags teams. They assembled the best talent money could buy and they still failed.

black label

So the ducks win a cup with a guy named Thornton, Thornton gets traded to the under performing Bruins. The Bruins win a cup with a guy named Thornton, a few years later the Thornton gets a new deal in Florida with Panthers.

How them panthers kids coming along?

Now I fully admit that a guy like Thornton doesn't automatically win a cup, but a smart hardworking veteran voice and presence does a lot to make a group of talented guys a team.

Yumcha

I'm not talking about the Cup. There is no argument there on what it takes to win it all.


I'm talking about a team getting #1 overall pick after #1 overall pick and still finishing 30th.

Yumcha

There's an imaginary debate about how to win a Cup that no one is contesting.

black label

It takes the same qualities to win a cup as it does to not come in last place. You may have noticed that cup winning teams never seem come in last place. What I'm saying is that 1st rounders are typically talent players. Sometimes you get grit with talent (Ovie ain't scared to muck it up in the corners) but those are rare cases. Sometimes you get real good leadership with first rounders like toews but again that's rare.

You're right that Edmonton sucks at drafting because they consistently fail to get NHL caliber player past the 1st overall pick. They are incapable of finding a datsyuk (171st pick) or Bergeron (45th pick) unless the entire hockey world has identified that player as the best of the year. Beyond their drafting failures also lies their inability to identify what can make a talented group of players into a team. You don't have to draft it, players with the right attitude can be acquired if you can identify who they are.

black label

And fwiw, the panthers and the oilers are a similar comparison. Since 2010, florida's had a number 1, 2, two 3's, an 11 and a 22nd overall. Obviously no one can equal edmontons number 1 overall but 5 years in the top 3 overall should yield talent.

Then you add 2 guys with multiple cups each and nearly 40 years of pro hockey experience between them for a total of 4.6 million against the cap and boom you got a contender

TacoBello

slowclap.gif

Yumcha

Hawk prospect suspended for "revenge pr0n"...

Chicago Blackhawks prospect Garret Ross suspended over revenge porn charge | National Post

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Fibbi cha cha, why you buggin?

7-2

There goes the streak

imj0257

iTrader: (1)

The fuck happened to Montreal? Were 1st place 1/3 into the season... now about to be eliminated from the playoffs. Epic/classic Canadian team meltdown? I guess they wanted to be on the same bad page with Toronto/Calgary/Edmonton/Vancouver?

Yumcha

Without Price, their season went in flames.

This is one of the few teams where it's truly built around an elite goalie.

TacoBello

Sounds like Montreal from the last time they won the cup

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Although, they were struggling before Price got hurt. Price getting hurt was the nail in the coffin.

Me thinks Therrien's message has gotten stale, happened here as well

imj0257

iTrader: (1)

Thankfully our team is built around everything BUT the goalie

Yumcha

Well, Hawks made it in by beating on 2 non-contending teams after being slapped around by Western Conference powerhouses this month. I guess we'll take it.

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't be too worried about the Hawks..

Yumcha

They should be fine. They've had late season malaise before and gone on to win the Cup.

BUT, their 5-on-5 and puck possession numbers this year are done compared to prior seasons. So, we'll see...

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Love when then Pens beat the Rangers and Cabbie vanishes

Joneill44

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">When you see it... �� (via <a href="https://twitter.com/HockeyCentraI">@HockeyCentraI</a>)<a href="https://t.co/CkmNzBVGSI">https://t.co/CkmNzBVGSI</a></p>&mdash; Bleacher Report (@BleacherReport) <a href="https://twitter.com/BleacherReport/status/714844954095292417">March 29, 2016</a></blockquote>

Yumcha

Duncan Keith...stupid stupid play.

Enjoy your suspension.

kurtatx

Dallas just broke the single season record for empty net goals with 2 tonight for a total of 22.
They are awesome.

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

black label

Fwiw, most hockey analysts and former players will tell you it's more difficult to score goals with a goaltender in the net attempting to stop the puck.

kurtatx

It's still really impressive. When the opponent goes on the offensive, Dallas executes.

And Yummy, we may be a little hosed if Keith misses postseason time, but that totally doesn't matter if Crawford doesn't come back. The hawks are hosed without Crawford.

Yumcha

The Hawks' generic malaise the last few weeks is something we've seen before.

ON PAPER, they look good albeit, the defense is still IMO, desperate to fill in Oduya's spot at #4. The 5-on-5 scoring and putrid PK are areas of concerns. BUT, with the recent Cups, you have to believe the core knows how to step it up and have earned the benefit of the doubt.

Yesterday's game had the makings of a loss with Seabrook out and then Keith trying to practice golf on Coyle. Add to that no Anisimov, well...yeah...that's 3 pretty important players out. Darling or Crawford for me does not matter too much. I like how much net the former covers...he's a giant in there.