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Old 08-04-2020, 03:53 PM
  #5001  
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Acura TLX sales are better than the Genesis brand
Ehh, just temporary.

G80 sales are low as production of the old model stopped 4 months ago.

There's 15k pre-orders for the new G80 and GV80 which are significantly more expensive than anything left in the Acura lineup (save the NSX).

In Korea alone, sales of the new G80 blow away that of the TLX, and that's despite being at a significantly higher price point.

Funny how you forgot to mention that Hyundai was one of the very few brands to have seen a YoY INCREASE in sales (Kia saw a slight decline,; would have seen an increase but for a change-over in Telluride production which impacted supply).

H/K/G sales were only 15k less than that for H/A.

With the addition of the GV80, GV70, Santa Cruz, as well as the new G80, Sorento, Sedona, Tucson, etc. - can see H/K/G overtaking H/A in sales.

And oh, sales in Europe and India have largely recovered where H/K have increased market share.

In India, Kia is already the 4th best selling brand just on the Seltos, alone (will be launching a smaller CUV soon).

RLX sales are also more than G90 Genesis. I am sure Yeh will come with some new excuses like every month.
Which one was CANCELED? lol

Honda is heavily discounting the RLX, even more so than before.

Acura has the 5th HIGHEST incentive spending as a % of ATP after Buick, Infiniti, Chrysler and Nissan.

Meanwhile, Genesis is on par with Lexus.

Supply of the G90 is tight as Hyundai is trying to produce as many of the GV80 and the new G80 as they can.

Plus, the G90 is considerably more expensive than the RLX.

The G90 will still outsell the RLX for the year.



Last edited by YEH; 08-04-2020 at 04:08 PM.
Old 08-04-2020, 04:35 PM
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Hyundai was also one of the few automakers to turn a profit for the Q ending in June; on the strength of sales of the Palisade and the G80, GV80 and Grandeur in Korea.

Maybe the resident troll should concentrate on what Acura is doing - they were hit with yet ANOTHER class action lawsuit.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2020/acura-class-action-lawsuit-mdx-rdx.shtml

Last edited by YEH; 08-04-2020 at 04:38 PM.
Old 08-04-2020, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by YEH
Ehh, just temporary.

G80 sales are low as production of the old model stopped 4 months ago.

There's 15k pre-orders for the new G80 and GV80 which are significantly more expensive than anything left in the Acura lineup (save the NSX).

In Korea alone, sales of the new G80 blow away that of the TLX, and that's despite being at a significantly higher price point.

Funny how you forgot to mention that Hyundai was one of the very few brands to have seen a YoY INCREASE in sales (Kia saw a slight decline,; would have seen an increase but for a change-over in Telluride production which impacted supply).

H/K/G sales were only 15k less than that for H/A.

With the addition of the GV80, GV70, Santa Cruz, as well as the new G80, Sorento, Sedona, Tucson, etc. - can see H/K/G overtaking H/A in sales.

And oh, sales in Europe and India have largely recovered where H/K have increased market share.

In India, Kia is already the 4th best selling brand just on the Seltos, alone (will be launching a smaller CUV soon).



Which one was CANCELED? lol

Honda is heavily discounting the RLX, even more so than before.

Acura has the 5th HIGHEST incentive spending as a % of ATP after Buick, Infiniti, Chrysler and Nissan.

Meanwhile, Genesis is on par with Lexus.

Supply of the G90 is tight as Hyundai is trying to produce as many of the GV80 and the new G80 as they can.

Plus, the G90 is considerably more expensive than the RLX.

The G90 will still outsell the RLX for the year.
G90 is even more discounted than RLX with 3 year free maintaince and longer warranty. That longer warranty cost $4k in Acura RLX.
Honda does not care about small markets of India and un profitable EU market.
Honda has cornered world largest markets China/US/Japan.. so all your bringing other examples are irrelvent.
Your pre-orders of Genesis SUV will remain paper once MDX is shown up.
it so funny whole Genesis brand cannot compete with Acura TLX which does not even a DWB suspension and is using 20 year old engines.
simple and elegant.


Old 08-04-2020, 05:59 PM
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^ Again with the repeated posting of pics of Acura models we have all seen many times before. lol

Europe is only unprofitable for automakers like Honda, just as the Australian market is profitable for H/K, but not for Honda.

India is the 5th largest auto market and one of the fastest growing (Russia is 6th).

And unlike China, don't have to share HALF your profits with your JV partner.

Korea sales of the G80 and GV80 probably bring in as much profit as the entire US sales for Acura.

And, as usual, you're WRONG about the G90 being discounted more than the RLX.

Genesis has pulled back on incentives for the FL G90, whereas Acura has further increased incentive spending on the RLX.

All part of the equation in Acura having one of the highest incentive spending in the industry relative to its ATP.

The MDX is seeing competition from the top trims of the Palisade and Telluride; it doesn't really compete with something like the GV80, much less when Genesis goes even further upmarket with the GV90.

The top Acura sedan will be the TLX, something that is in the compact/entry level segment.

Genesis, meanwhile, will continue to offer sedans in the 2 higher segments.

The people over on Lexus forums don't see Acura being a competitor (tho, they probably should as Lexus becomes increasingly reliant on FWD-sales), but they see Genesis as a major threat.

Heck, once Mazda launches models on their upcoming RWD platform with the I6, what's the point of getting an Acura?

Last edited by YEH; 08-04-2020 at 06:14 PM.
Old 08-04-2020, 06:25 PM
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Acura barely sells in China and doesn't exist in Japan.

Plus, Honda only sells cheap, low margin models in Japan, unlike Hyundai which sells models like the Grandeur, Palisade, Santa Fe and Sonata in high volume (much less Genesis).

As I've stated all along, Genesis made a mistake in making the rear too cramped in the G70.

But that's not an issue for the Stinger which is selling nearly as well as the TLX, despite its higher price point.

Last edited by YEH; 08-04-2020 at 06:29 PM.
Old 08-04-2020, 06:38 PM
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Wow... talking shit about others when you are selling 1800 units a month of TLX

Seriously that is like students who are getting D making fun of students with D-...

Originally Posted by SSFTSX
G90 is even more discounted than RLX with 3 year free maintaince and longer warranty. That longer warranty cost $4k in Acura RLX.
Honda does not care about small markets of India and un profitable EU market.
Honda has cornered world largest markets China/US/Japan.. so all your bringing other examples are irrelvent.
Your pre-orders of Genesis SUV will remain paper once MDX is shown up.
it so funny whole Genesis brand cannot compete with Acura TLX which does not even a DWB suspension and is using 20 year old engines.
simple and elegant.

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Old 08-04-2020, 06:43 PM
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Telluride alone shows Hyundai/Kia is better than what the entire Acura/Honda brand combined can do selling at 3-4k above MSRP still.... .. get this... 2 years AFTER its introduction

No... even the new MDX will not be able to do that..

and this is a freaking family SUV... not some niche cars like CTR or NSX...
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Old 08-04-2020, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by YEH
Acura barely sells in China and doesn't exist in Japan.

Plus, Honda only sells cheap, low margin models in Japan, unlike Hyundai which sells models like the Grandeur, Palisade, Santa Fe and Sonata in high volume (much less Genesis).

As I've stated all along, Genesis made a mistake in making the rear too cramped in the G70.

But that's not an issue for the Stinger which is selling nearly as well as the TLX, despite its higher price point.
Honda has so many models in China that it does not need to sale Acura there.

how you know Honda Japan has low margin vehicles?. Do you know when travel around Asia. used JDM vehicles have as much value as new from there factories. They are in different league.
Honda China is going towards 2m production target in China.


https://www.automotiveworld.com/news...on-in-china-5/

Honda sets monthly records for automobile production in China


that Kia stringer look like old Ford Escape SUV.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/ctd...170772699.html







Old 08-05-2020, 02:26 PM
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https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKCN2510PE

Honda sees 68% drop in annual profit as coronavirus slams car sales

August 4, 2020

TOKYO (Reuters) - Japan’s Honda Motor Co. on Wednesday forecast a 68% decrease in annual operating profit to a 10-year low with global demand for cars expected to slide because of the coronavirus pandemic.

The country’s No. 3 automaker expects profit to sink to 200 billion yen ($1.89 billion) in the year to end-March 2021, its weakest since the 2010/11 year and undershooting analyst estimates.

Honda is bracing for a 6% decrease in annual vehicle sales after a 40% plunge in the June quarter, which resulted in a 113.7 billion yen operating loss.

Global automakers are taking a big hit from the coronavirus outbreak, which shuttered vehicle factories this year and has kept customers out of car dealerships.

The maker of the CR-V SUV crossover and the Fit compact hatchback expects to sell 4.5 million vehicles this year, versus 4.79 million last year. It predicts a 16% sales slide in North America, a key market where the United States is struggling to control a surge in virus infections.

“If the current situation continues as is, we think the situation will not get worse (than we saw earlier this year), but it will take time for demand to recover to pre-pandemic levels,” Executive Vice President Seiji Kuraishi told a livestreamed briefing.

Honda sank into the red for the second straight quarter and posted its worst operating loss since the March 2009 quarter.

https://www.autonews.com/manufacturi...-pandemic-pain

Honda plunges into red amid pandemic pain

August 05, 2020

TOKYO -- Honda Motor Co. tumbled to a $1 billion operating loss in the latest quarter amid slumping sales as the COVID-19 pandemic broadsided its key U.S. market.

The Japanese automaker swung to an operating loss of 113.6 billion yen ($1.06 billion) in the fiscal first quarter ended June 30, reversing an operating profit of 252.4 billion yen ($2.35 billion) the year before.

Honda also booked an 80.8 billion yen ($752.4 million) net loss in the three-month period. It had a net income of 172.3 billion yen ($1.60 billion) the year before.

In announcing the results in its Aug. 5 earnings report, the Japanese automaker said revenue plunged 47 percent to 2.12 trillion yen ($19.74 billion) in the April-June quarter, as worldwide sales slumped 40 percent to 792,000 vehicles in the period, led by declines in North America.

Citing the continued impact of the pandemic, Executive Vice President Seiji Kuraishi said operating profit was forecast to fall 68 percent to 200 billion yen ($1.86 billion) in the current fiscal year ending March 31, 2021. Net income is seen taking a 64 percent dive.

Global volume is forecast to decline 6.1 percent to 4.5 million vehicles for the fiscal year.

Honda’s dismal results come as the global auto industry reels from the impact of the pandemic and the resulting falloff in demand and regulations ordering factory closures.

Honda said the pandemic took a 440.0 billion yen ($4.09 billion) bite out of the bottom line. Without that hit or the impact of a sizeable foreign exchange rate loss, Honda would have booked a profit increase in the fiscal first quarter, compared with a year earlier.

Honda expects the pandemic to dent earnings by a total of 665.0 billion yen ($6.19 billion) for the full fiscal year. Cash is getting tighter, but Honda said it sees no liquidity crunch.

North America, Honda’s second-biggest market after Asia, booked a regional operating loss of 77.8 billion yen ($724.5 million) in the period.

North American sales plunged 68 percent to 159,000 vehicles in the quarter. Honda expects North American sales to finish the fiscal year 16 percent lower, dropping to 1.54 million vehicles.

European sales fell 53 percent to 16,000 units in the quarter, even as regional operating profit improved to 4.8 billion yen ($44.7 million), from 2.6 billion yen ($24.2 million) a year earlier. European sales are seen falling 21 percent to 105,000 units for the full fiscal year.
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Old 08-05-2020, 05:04 PM
  #5010  
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^ And unlike Honda, Hyundai was one of the very few automakers to pull off a profit for the last Q on the strength of high margin vehicle sales (G80, GV80, Palisade) in Korea.

Funny how the troll dismissed the European market which actually made a profit for a Honda last Q.



Honda has so many models in China that it does not need to sale Acura there.
Hondas are lower margin products compared to Acuras, and that's on top of splitting profits in China.


how you know Honda Japan has low margin vehicles?. Do you know when travel around Asia. used JDM vehicles have as much value as new from there factories. They are in different league.
Are you daft (that's a rhetorical Q)?

Already told you that Honda in Japan primarily sells small/budget models like the Jazz/Fit - which are low margin.

Every automaker, including Hyundai, was affected by the pandemic, but Hyundai was one of the few that managed a profit last Q on the strength of high margin sales like the G80 and GV80 in Korea.

Honda could have done the same by selling high margin vehicles in Japan, but they don't.

All this talk about China and Honda still recorded a major loss last Q. lol

For the last Q in the US (let's bring it back to THIS market), Acura's incentive spending was a hefty $6k in relation to an ATP of $40.6k.

Acura's ATP is pretty much smack in the middle between that for Hyundai and Genesis for now; once the GV80 and new G80 launch, Genesis will pull even farther away from Acura.

Last edited by YEH; 08-05-2020 at 05:09 PM.
Old 08-05-2020, 05:52 PM
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it was the April Month that was way down in US. Nothing to do with Europe. Europe is small market for profits.
and you cannot deduce from one quarter the yearly trend. as some quarters can have alot more R&D expenses.
These are artificials sales moved up. Honda hasnt produced alot of Hybrids and Electric especially SUVs and they spending alot more on R&D than collecting leftover German engineering.
Hyundai, Kia Suffer Sharp Drop in Q2 Earnings on COVID-19 Impact | Be Korea-savvy
“Robust sales of new models in the domestic market and a reduction in individual consumption taxes helped the company fare better than its global rivals,” Hyundai Motor Vice President Lee Dong-heun in charge of the carmaker’s global market research group said in a webcast.


https://business.inquirer.net/301218...st-consumption


S. Korea to extend tax cut on passenger cars to boost consumption

$8.6B on R&D. and further investments to boost operating margins. It is not short term dance like Tesla.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Aut...une-from-virusTo help rebuild the automobile business, Honda absorbed most of the automotive operations at unit Honda R&D in April. It aims to cut production costs by 10% and development costs by 30% by 2025, and to boost the group operating margin to 7% or 8%. But there are concerns that the coronavirus could delay such efforts.

Investment in next-generation vehicles, such as autonomous and electric cars, will also be critical. Honda is expected to spend a record 860 billion yen on research and development this fiscal year, though some market watchers think the company needs to cut costs further.
Old 08-05-2020, 06:02 PM
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I think SSFTSX has finally succeeded....

So much irrelevant information has been posted by him that i cannot link the whole conversation together anymore...

First it was said US and Japan and China, no one else matters... the South Korean was involved somehow.

Sales are sales... and it is not Honda hasn't produced a lot of hybrids. The more accurate statement should be they have tried many times over and over and got its ass kicked by Toyota many times over and over
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Old 08-05-2020, 06:17 PM
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Lexus and Toyota has been selling hybrids in alot of vehicles especially SUVs.
Honda just started CRV hybrid. MDX/RLX hybrid is too high priced and in very limited quantities.

Old 08-05-2020, 06:18 PM
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3000+ posts, 3 likes.

SSFTSX is a goddammed hero.
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Old 08-05-2020, 06:28 PM
  #5015  
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Lexus and Toyota has been selling hybrids in alot of vehicles especially SUVs.
Honda just started CRV hybrid. MDX/RLX hybrid is too high priced and in very limited quantities.
and why do you think that is?

and whose fault is it that Honda and Acura dont offer the Hybrid model that people want?
They keep making crap that no one wants and refused to offer things that buyers want.
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Old 08-06-2020, 05:02 PM
  #5016  
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it was the April Month that was way down in US. Nothing to do with Europe. Europe is small market for profits.
and you cannot deduce from one quarter the yearly trend. as some quarters can have alot more R&D expenses.
These are artificials sales moved up. Honda hasnt produced alot of Hybrids and Electric especially SUVs and they spending alot more on R&D than collecting leftover German engineering.
And ONE MONTH (in the US) shouldn't have so negatively impacted Honda for the entire quarter, much less for the prior Q.

Honda has had 2 consecutive Qs in the red, whereas, Hyundai, similarly impacted in the US, has been in the black for the past 2 Qs.

Toyota managed to pull off a profit for the past Q (albeit not as much as Hyundai).

Hmmm, so maybe my saying that Honda was too reliant on the US market has credence?

And Hondas losses for the past 2 Qs would have been even worse, but for the profit from the motorcycle division.

S. Korea to extend tax cut on passenger cars to boost consumption


Market conditions are market conditions; there have been other countries which have cut taxes or placed other incentives to spur automobile purchsdes.

And it's not like Genesis doesn't have plenty of competition from the Germans.

The BIG difference is that Genesis, within its domestic market, has been competing against the Germans, and with the GV80 and new G80 has pushed ahead.

Acura doesn't exist in Japan and Honda doesn't sell any higher end/higher margin vehicles there in any significant volume.

Toyota is the #1 selling automaker in the world and is doing a lot better in China than Hyundai (Lexus sales have also been on the upswing in China).

And yet, despite all your harping about the China market (which wasn't significantly impacted the past Q), Hyundai bested Toyota's financial performance by a good margin and totally blew away that of Honda.

Hmmm, so maybe there is truth to my assertion that selling high margin models (particularly in the domestic) market is very important?



Last edited by YEH; 08-06-2020 at 05:04 PM.
Old 08-06-2020, 06:39 PM
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Tesla also has two quarters of profits. with barely any production wit pitfull R&D.
Honda R&D approaching Toyota despite Toyata three time larger firm on vehicle sales, with 6 times more diverse vehicles to support and upto 10 times more engines to support.
so decline is sales impact Honda Profit alot more as R&D costs are already there.
Plus honda is taking advantage in down time in dealerships due to pandemic to recall and do all the warranty work.


https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Bus...f-of-companies

https://global.honda/newsroom/news/2...ng.html?from=r

Isuzu and Honda Sign an Agreement to Conduct Joint Research on Fuel Cell-powered Heavy-duty Trucks


Last edited by SSFTSX; 08-06-2020 at 06:44 PM.
Old 08-06-2020, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Plus honda is taking advantage in down time in dealerships due to pandemic to recall and do all the warranty work.
WTF does this have to do with anything?
Old 08-06-2020, 07:16 PM
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nothing, he is always moving the goal posts.
Old 08-06-2020, 07:22 PM
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Local troll hungers

Village feeds him forever

"Why does he do this?"
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Old 08-06-2020, 07:58 PM
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Old 08-07-2020, 08:58 AM
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Old 08-07-2020, 12:46 PM
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SSFTSX is one troll i dont mind feeding... he is entertaining and consistently inconsistent

Unlike other trolls, he doesnt get personal... pretty cool dude other than some logical issues.
Old 08-07-2020, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Tesla also has two quarters of profits. with barely any production wit pitfull R&D.
Honda R&D approaching Toyota despite Toyata three time larger firm on vehicle sales, with 6 times more diverse vehicles to support and upto 10 times more engines to support.
so decline is sales impact Honda Profit alot more as R&D costs are already there.
Plus honda is taking advantage in down time in dealerships due to pandemic to recall and do all the warranty work.


https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Bus...f-of-companies

https://global.honda/newsroom/news/2...ng.html?from=r

Isuzu and Honda Sign an Agreement to Conduct Joint Research on Fuel Cell-powered Heavy-duty Trucks

Hellz yeah!

There's nothing that can stop the combination of Honda and Isuzu from total and complete world domination. GM, Ford, and VW should just pack it up and go home. Don't even get me started on that little flea called Tesla, they got nothing on this partnership.
Old 08-07-2020, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Honda R&D approaching Toyota despite Toyata three time larger firm on vehicle sales, with 6 times more diverse vehicles to support and upto 10 times more engines to support.
I see that as Honda is so far behind Toyota that Honda needs to spend massively on R&D to play catch up.


Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Plus honda is taking advantage in down time in dealerships due to pandemic to recall and do all the warranty work.
Honda quality/reliability so bad, they need to do lots of recalls and warranty work, hence why they need to spend heavily on R&D to improve reliability of future products.


Originally Posted by SSFTSX
https://global.honda/newsroom/news/2...ng.html?from=r
Isuzu and Honda Sign an Agreement to Conduct Joint Research on Fuel Cell-powered Heavy-duty Trucks
If Honda is so great, why does Honda keep partnering with other companies?
Old 08-07-2020, 02:39 PM
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...profit-outlook

Toyota Keeps Profit Goal Intact, Defying Pandemic and Rivals

August 5, 2020

(Bloomberg) -- Toyota Motor Corp. reported a surprise operating profit and kept its outlook for the full year intact, showing its resilience to the global automotive slowdown that has forced other major carmakers to post deep losses.

Japan’s biggest automaker reported a profit of 13.9 billion yen ($132 million) in the April-June quarter, even though analysts projected, on average, a loss of 207 billion yen. For the fiscal year through March, Toyota kept its operating profit outlook of 500 billion yen.

Although slim for an automaker with an annual output of 10 million vehicles, the results deliver on President Akio Toyoda’s vow to remain profitable during the pandemic. Volkswagen AG, Ford Motor Co. and other automakers have reported billions in losses as the pandemic decimated demand, underscoring Toyota’s expertise in containing costs during both good and bad times. Tesla Inc. was another rare example of a profitable carmaker, with Elon Musk’s company benefiting from market-share gains and capacity expansion.

“There clearly are winners and losers,” said Tatsuo Yoshida, an analyst at Bloomberg Intelligence. “Toyota’s progress has been really good” compared with other Japanese automakers, he said.

The pandemic has forced dealers to close showrooms and manufacturers to idle factories around the world, with global auto sales declining 22% in the first half to 4.16 million units. Toyota’s revenue for the quarter fell 40% to 4.6 trillion yen, slightly exceeding analysts’ prediction for 4.4 trillion yen.

For the full year, Toyota kept its sales forecast at 24 trillion yen. Analysts are projecting, on average, annual revenue of 24.7 trillion yen.

“Toyota was already more profitable than other automakers,” said Seiji Sugiura, an analyst at Tokyo Tokai Securities, adding that the company also rolled out new models. “They should return to normal by the fourth quarter.”
Old 08-07-2020, 04:01 PM
  #5027  
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Honda R&D approaching Toyota despite Toyata three time larger firm on vehicle sales, with 6 times more diverse vehicles to support and upto 10 times more engines to support.
so decline is sales impact Honda Profit alot more as R&D costs are already there.
Plus honda is taking advantage in down time in dealerships due to pandemic to recall and do all the warranty work.


https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Bus...f-of-companies
What does Honda have to show for that R&D spending?

Who's ahead on BEVs? H/K or Honda?

Who's ahead on FCEVs?

Who's ahead on autonomous driving assist systems?

H/K's is considered to be better than MB's or BMW's.

And how much of that R&D "spending" is merely the billions Honda has invested in GM's SuperCruise system and their BEV platform and Ultium batteries?

Honda isn't even going to be manufacturing its next slew of BEVs, GM will be building them for Honda and Acura at its plants.

For someone who likes to attack others for not knowing anything about the auto business, you sure as heck have been WRONG about pretty much everything.

1. All this repeated blubbering about China sales...

Didn't prevent Honda from experiencing a humongous LOSS for the Q.

2. Dismissed the European market, and yet it was one of the few money makers for Honda.

And Honda, unlike H/K, doesn't sell much in Europe.

3. Claimed that overseas markets like Europe, India, Russia, etc. would continued to be severely negatively impacted by the pandemic.

Most of them have largely recovered.

HMG, in fact, is in talks to purchase a GM plant in Russia so that they can build more CUVs for that market.

4. Claimed that Honda has high margin sales (in volume) in Japan and yet cannot name any.

Unlike Honda, HMG has the G80, GV80, Palisade, Grandeur, Cadenza, Santa Fe, Sorento and Carnival sales.

5. All these things led to a HUGE loss by Honda last Q and decent profit by Hyundai.

Despite not having any pickups and BoF SUVS (yet) like Toyota (which have continued to be big sellers around the world despite the pandemic), Hyundai made more $$ last Q than Toyota.

Hyundai had an operating profit of $493 million despite global retail sales being down 33%.

That’s what having high margin vehicle sales like the G80 and GV80 can do, and like stated, H/K do not yet have high margin pickups and BoF SUVs like Toyota.

And Hyundai still managed to make a decent profit despite spending a lot of $$ on a slew of new models (GV70, eG80, eGV70, Santa Cruz, BoF pick-up, dedicated BEVs for both Hyundai and Genesis) as well as on replacement models (new Elantra, Tuscon, etc.), as well as new N models.

Last edited by YEH; 08-07-2020 at 04:12 PM.
Old 08-07-2020, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by AZuser
I see that as Honda is so far behind Toyota that Honda needs to spend massively on R&D to play catch up.
Honda always has higher R&D expenses relative to sales. so it impact profitability in downturn. thats the way Honda operates. They are not going to change.
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/c...pment-expenses
Honda research and development expenses for the twelve months ending March 31, 2020 were $7.398B, a 1.87% increase year-over-year.


Honda quality/reliability so bad, they need to do lots of recalls and warranty work, hence why they need to spend heavily on R&D to improve reliability of future products.
Honda has the highest resale value of any brand and they dont give that 2 years 25000 mile free maintaince of Toyota nor Honda expand its line up.

Lexus has UX, NX, RX, GX, LX
Acura still stay with RDX and MDX what was 15 years ago.
Lexus sports cars production closed after 500 copies while Acura NSX will continue for a decades. This how it creates brand identity for sustainable sales.





If Honda is so great, why does Honda keep partnering with other companies?
Its companies that need Honda R&D.
Old 08-07-2020, 04:48 PM
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Old 08-07-2020, 04:49 PM
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The impact of this R&D will be shown on next Acura TLX with its 3.0T litre engine beat 3.5L of Hyundai.
i have no doubt SH-AWD can pull more Gs than any Hyundai AWD system with same set of tires.
Old 08-07-2020, 05:14 PM
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Old 08-07-2020, 05:25 PM
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Old 08-07-2020, 05:58 PM
  #5033  
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Honda always has higher R&D expenses relative to sales. so it impact profitability in downturn. thats the way Honda operates. They are not going to change.
That's an incredibly STUPID way to run a business; should invest in R&D that will maximize ROI.

Honda has the highest resale value of any brand and they dont give that 2 years 25000 mile free maintaince of Toyota nor Honda expand its line up.
Already explained that resale value doesn't really impact automakers; otoh, things like incentive spending and ATP do.

And Acura has one of the highest incentive spending relative to ATP (up there with Infiniti).

And speaking of ATP, Acura's ATP is significantly lower that for Genesis and Lexus (and even Infiniti), much less for BMW and Mercedes.

Lower priced models deprecate less than higher priced models like the S Class and GLS.

Congrats!

Acura is sure to retain the resale value "crown" now that the entry-level TLX is its flagship sedan (no more high depreciation RLX; but hey, with the cancelation of the RLX, you can now crow how it will be even more "exclusive" - lol).

Think Mercedes will gladly trade the higher depreciation hit on something like the S Class Maybach for the fat margins.

With the big discounts on the MDX, Kia probably makes more on each Telluride sale.

Lexus has UX, NX, RX, GX, LX
Acura still stay with RDX and MDX what was 15 years ago.
And who's fault is that?

Despite a later start, Genesis will have 3 CUVs before Acura here.

They will also have 3 BEVs by the end of next year, with more to come the following year.

And u don't think the NSX is a $-loser for Honda? LMAO

Its companies that need Honda R&D.
Yeah, I'm sure that's why Honda has invested billions in GM R&D. lol


Last edited by YEH; 08-07-2020 at 06:04 PM.
Old 08-07-2020, 06:16 PM
  #5034  
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[QUOTE=YEH;16611795]That's an incredibly STUPID way to run a business; should invest in R&D that will maximize ROI.
QUOTE]

No, we are the stupid one... we are not smart enough to understand how it operates.. just like we will never understand the superiority of honda's bhp... we just have to believe...
Old 08-07-2020, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
Its companies that need Honda R&D.
Attachment 97272

From https://acurazine.com/forums/automot.../#post16275766

Originally Posted by AZuser
https://www.wsj.com/articles/honda-took-pride-in-doing-everything-itself-the-cost-of-technology-made-that-impossible-1533484840

Honda Took Pride in Doing Everything Itself. The Cost of Technology Made That Impossible.

The car maker outsources key tech for electric vehicles and autonomous driving to fight high R&D costs

Aug. 5, 2018 12:00 p.m. ET

TOKYO—A semiautonomous Honda SUV was traveling down a test track at 20 miles an hour in March last year when a child-size test dummy moved into the middle of the road. Oblivious, the Honda mowed it down.

It was part of a brutal day of Japanese government testing for Honda Motor Co. HMC 1.81% , whose vehicle was equipped with a camera and sensors that were supposed to detect obstacles and apply brakes to avoid a collision. The SUV scored 0.2 out of a possible 25 points in the pedestrian portion of the test, the worst among tested vehicles.

With its long heritage of technical prowess, Honda was determined to do better—and it did. But Honda engineering didn’t get it there. The car maker turned to an off-the-shelf sensing kit from Robert Bosch GmbH, the companies said. With the Bosch technology, the new Honda Civic took the same test in November and scored 24.4 out of 25.

Honda’s decision to go shopping points to a radical culture change at one of Japan’s proudest companies, where founder Soichiro Honda in the 1960s said, “We refuse to depend on anyone else.” The struggle at the entrepreneurial success story cuts deep into Japan’s sense of itself as a global leader in technology.

Honda once used staff technicians to design new technologies ranging from engines to the shape of the suspension arms. Today, Honda believes rapid shifts in technology mean it can no longer afford to keep pace working solely on its own.

Car makers around the world are under stress from the huge investments needed to develop new technologies used in electric vehicles and autonomous driving. To trim costs, most are leaning on megasuppliers such as Bosch, Continental AG and Denso Corp. , as well as smaller companies with cutting-edge technology such as Intel Corp. subsidiary Mobileye.

“We want to work with those that possess the best technology, regardless of whether they are Japanese suppliers or American ones or European ones,” said Honda’s chief executive, Takahiro Hachigo, in an interview.

Honda, which prides itself above all on its engines, is farming out the development of an electric motor.

In recent years, the challenges of competing with bigger companies with higher profits — in particular Toyota Motor Corp. — have dogged Honda. Bigger companies have an advantage in absorbing the high cost of developing technology. Honda’s R&D budget was about 5% of revenue last year, compared with Toyota’s 3.5% of revenue.

Mr. Ito sought to rein in the independence of Honda’s powerful research and development arm in an effort to trim spending on projects with no obvious commercial benefit — a past project had researchers studying the cockroach nervous system , according to former engineers and executives.


[ . . . ]
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Old 08-08-2020, 12:35 PM
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it does not change the fact Honda increase R&D regardless of sales volume and it does not prevent Honda R&D alliances with other firms.
Old 08-10-2020, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by SSFTSX
it does not change the fact Honda increase R&D regardless of sales volume and it does not prevent Honda R&D alliances with other firms.
Dude...you read my mind. No one on the planet spends the amount on R&D as Honda does.
Old 08-10-2020, 12:54 PM
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Honda and Acura are actually developing their own self-driving cars. The industry's worst kept secret, but SSFTSX probably knew all this already





















































Old 08-10-2020, 01:04 PM
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Jeez, even Asimo won't drive an Acura.
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Old 08-10-2020, 02:19 PM
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