oonowindoo

say what? you sure it is not 95 years or 102 years? I mean i am sure Bill Gates can't afford one because he is not 100 years old yet...

00TL-P3.2

Also, I'm sure the average Honda dealership has probably 2-3x the inventory of the average JLR dealer.
I know the closest Honda dealer to me has a very large inventory, while the comparatively small JLR dealer looks like they have maybe 50 cars on the lot.

JLR also has fewer models to stock, so no need to have such a large inventory. Plus, I'd imagine many are built to order, and at a typically higher ATP.

Honda: 19 models each with probably 4-6 trim levels
Jaguar/LR: 7 (J) & 7 (LR)

SSFTSX

the could have located the dealarship in cheaper place. but they wanted next to 101 with two exits on either sides for ease of entry and exits for customers with two entrances.

Not even AutoBahn Motors that big MB dealership has two exits on either sides. you know peak traffic before the Covid on this Peninsula.

This end result of building unreliable crap. first destroy financials with unrealistic leases.

YEH

^ LMAO!

You make it seem like Honda has never had its own rounds of cost-cutting, which every maker automaker does periodically, including when times are good (to increase the ever important margins).

Honda's most recent cost-cutting includes the planned closure of its factories in the UK and Turkey and the reduction and restructuring of its Australian operations - all planned BEFORE the pandemic hit.

Honda is also reducing costs by trimming model lineups (bye Fit, Civic coupe!; in Australia, no moreFit/Jazz, City and likely the Odyssey) and/or trims.

And to further reduce costs, Honda and GM have just announced that they are at the beginning stages of entering into an alliance for NA, sharing platforms and powertrains (including ICE).

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a33913152/honda-general-motors-alliance/

So Ford and VW were in the process of deepening ties and now, GM and Honda.

YEH

Taking a deeper dive into the nos. for GM and Honda in NA (Honda's largest market)...

Q2 Marketshare
H - 10.2%
GM - 16.85%

ATP
H - $29,497
GM - $42,795

$20,001-$30,000 (% of sales)
H - 54.8%
GM - 27.02%

$30,001-$40,000
H - 28.1%
GM - 25.31%

$40,001-$50,000
H - 12.8%
GM - 25.53%

$50,001-$60,000
H - 1.9%
GM - 14.45%

$60k+
H - 0.1%
GM - 5.9%

At the $50k+ price point, Honda is at a measley 2%, with GM at over 20%.

At $40k+, Honda is at around 15%, with GM at around 46%.

SSFTSX

Honda is responding to long term structural changes so decisions are taken years ahead of time.. Turkish and Australia currencies decline alot. honda is among first to practically abondon diesel engines.
while German has sudden collapse in both final assembly line and Tier-1 suppliers. the more RWD and complex vehicles German produce the greater will quality problem and real losses not just paper financial losses.
Honda can expand cheaply into Truck business in US market with GM deals. as i mentioned before that it is not limited to electric vehicles and honda is not interested in electric vehicles currrently. so you now have to eat your words that Honda only went to GM for electric vehicles. how stupid were your predictions. as i said you know nothing.

SSFTSX

Thousands more. warning signs for building overpriced unreliable non standardized crap. only Honda standardization can achieve reliability and efficiency.

https://www.eenewseurope.com/news/sc...s-back-germany

Schaeffler cuts back in Germany

After Continental and Hella, automotive supplier Schaeffler is also announcing job cuts well into the four-digit range and site closures.

SSFTSX

i wonder how long German can give discounts when Euro is getting higher and whole industrial chains cut down. production will go low down.

https://www.dw.com/de/corona-krise-z...gen/a-54891296
The current considerations include the reduction of up to 9,500 jobs in Germany and Austria as well as worldwide across all corporate divisions," announced the subsidiary of the commercial vehicle holding Traton , which is part of the Volkswagen Group .

oonowindoo

Can you create a new thread about Honda Vs. Tesla? I would like to see you and Comfy go at it ....

SSFTSX

Tesla is small firm. only selling 11000 vehicles per month in China while Honda selling 150K per year.
it is not a competitor to Honda. As far as US and Chinese market concerned.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

why did Honda partner with GM to create EV's if Tesla wasnt a competitor?

SSFTSX

Honda will make local alliances with every one that make its industrial supply chain competitive. Partnership with GM is not limited to EV.
Honda do EV and non EV partnerships in China but EV is very small portion in China.
Similar with GM. EV will be small portion for next 10 years alteast.

00TL-P3.2

Math-check:

150k/yr = 12.5k/mo, not a significantly higher number than your claimed 11k/mo for Tesla.

SSFTSX

Tesla has 60K sales in China in first 8 months. How it is Honda competitor when Honda selling 140K avg in a month.
https://cleantechnica.com/2020/09/09...-3s-in-august/

Honda produciton is reaching 180K a month in China. give it tremendous flexibility in Exports.

https://www.benzinga.com/pressreleas...s-and-in-china

YEH

^ You're correct for once - Honda is not a competitor to Tesla.

But (as usual) for the wrong reasons - Tesla is a luxury brand and sells at significantly higher prices.

And one can't get much dumber comparing ICE sales to BEV sales (BEVs still haven't attained mainstream adoption).


LMAO!

You don't think other automakers haven't been doing the same?

With a good # of them performing a good bit better than Honda over the past 2 quarters, if not being in the black.

So Honda doesn't have the resources (or the guts) to develop their own products in certain segments and will go back to rebadging the work of others.

Note how Nikola formed an alliance with GM and not Honda for access to the Ultium batteries, the skateboard platform, as well as fuel cell tech.

And Honda would not necessarily be closing their plants in the UK (altho Brexit pretty much made it unfeasible) or Turkey if they actually had sales volume in Europe, instead of declining on what tiny volume they have.

SSFTSX

Germany has non-diversified economic system. 40% of its R&D in Auto business and if Chinese push them slightly the whole Germanic Auto system collapses.
hundreds of thousands of German jobs on line now.
most of Tesla sales are in $35K Chinese Model 3. For $35K you get DWB suspension Tesla model 3.
while for DWB suspension car you have to upgrade to Acura TLX.

Nikola is not alliance. Its a joke. It will Honda that will be driving US market once Germans are ousted from North American market and GM get downsized.

Honda is the best managed Engineering firm. It has full support of Japanese banking system with Strong Yen. when Chinese out of picture than it will be Japanese that will become largest dollar holders and they will influence alot of corporate decisions around the world.

SSFTSX

Another embrassment.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-d...KBN2651NJ?il=0
SEPTEMBER 14, 20204:08 AMUPDATED 2 HOURS AGO

Daimler to pay $2.2 billion in diesel emissions cheating settlements

YEH

^^ Remains to be seen if the Nikola alliance is a joke, but the fact remains that Nikola partnered with GM and NOT Honda to get access to the Ultium batteries, the skateboard platform, etc.

In actually, there isn't that much difference between Honda and Nikola with respect to GM.

Both will be using what are essentially GM components with GM even doing the manufacturing.

And Abe's halting of exports of chemicals needed for chip manufacture has backfired.

It's not like South Korea couldn't produce those chemicals at the purity levels needed, but it simply was cheaper for Samsung and other companies to buy from Japan than to build up domestic production.

But that's exactly what they ended up doing - South Korea is now producing those chemicals, so Japan has lost a market forever.

There have been other repercussions as well, such as a boycott of Japanese autos in Korea, which among other issues, forced Nissan/Infiniti out of the Korean market with Honda struggling.

Only Toyota/Lexus still has sales level which warrant continued business.

SSFTSX

You are writting non-sense. GM alliance is not core Honda R&D spending. Honda will buy whole GM industrial chains and gave much higher wages to what ever technical people Honda can find for them that are best fit.
Honda is the key to Japan Technical power thats why it is number 2 in R&D in whole Japan corporate sector.

GM is selling Indian plant to Chinese. GM is too dysfunctional and disorganzied that they can compete with Honda wealth and quality.
GM has no focus. randomly throwing dats.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/...of-india-plant

GM faces unexpected bills as India-China tensions delay sale of India plant

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/12/gm-f...ct-ending.html
AUTOS

GM facility to continue building ventilators after completing $489.4 million government contract

YEH

^ GM made moves to get out of $-losing or minimal profit markets before Honda strated to do so.

Despite heavy investment, GM's loss last quarter was only a little higher than that for Honda.

Doesn't change the fact that what the industry sees is Honda using what are essentially GM components for its future electrics, with GM also manufacturing them for Honda and not the other way around.

SSFTSX

Honda loss is due to higher R&D spending relative to sales. we dont how industrial supply chain will pan out over next two to three years. and which firm will better support the supply chain. Honda will buy R&D of GM if it fit its long term programme.

YEH

^ You make it seem like Honda is the only automaker investing heavily in R&D, and there have been those that have been able to invest heavily and still limit their losses, if not make a profit during the pandemic.

Where's the fruit of this R&D spending for Honda?

HMG will have new dedicated electrics hitting the market next year, while filling out the Genesis lineup (which will include electric variants of ICE models as well as separate dedicated EVs), which will get a L3 autonomous driving system.

Also have ladder-frame pickups and SUVs in the works, as well as having already begun delivery of FCEV semis and mass transit buses.

Meanwhile, the electrics that are being developed in conjunction with GM are still a couple of years away, and Honda invested in Cruise instead of trying to develop their own autonomous driving system.

So what will Honda have to show for its R&D spending (that's not in conjunction with anyone else)?

The new TLX, MDX and ILX? lol

That's just standard updates of existing models.

SSFTSX

Honda is the only firm that has highest R&D spending relative the sales. Thats why its Vehicles have highest resale value and best in category.

for example Honda E is best is in its category. Shortest turn radius for city driving with best ride quality and wind suppression.
Honda Type R is best handling FWD car ever.
Honda Ridgeline and Honda Passport best in class.

YEH

^ What that shows is just piss poor ROI for what Honda is spending on R&D.

Honda E is the only thing you can cite? LMAO

There's a reason why Honda isn't developing higher end EVs on its own and has to rely on GM; plus other automakers are bringing new small EVs to market (which won't sell in any large nos. here, that is if they are ever offered in this market).

For all that spending, Honda couldn't even be bothered to recalibrate the transmission in the new TLX so that it shifts quicker than in the Odyssey. lol

SSFTSX

Beijing Auto will show Honda Electric vehicles for China. 2022 Honda electic vehicle in Europe coming.
NA American market can wait.

https://www.carscoops.com/2020/09/ne...-ev-for-china/Judging by the proportions, Honda’s EV concept could be a sedan or possibly a crossover coupe, but we’ll know that for sure on September 26 when the official debut takes place.

Electric concept vehicle aside, Honda’s booth at Auto China 2020 will include the CR-V PHEV, the brand’s first vehicle equipped with a plug-in hybrid system to be introduced in China. Various types of electrified models will be on display too, along with all-new mass-production models.

SSFTSX

Monthly drill.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...301144250.html
FOUNTAIN VALLEY, Calif., Oct. 1, 2020 /PRNewswire/ -- Genesis Motor America today reported sales of 1,128 units in September 2020, a 27.6 percent decrease compared with the prior year.

https://hondanews.com/en-US/honda-co...in-3rd-quarter

TSX69

https://acuranews.com/en-US/releases...in-3rd-quarter

Strong September Sales for Honda and Acura Adds to Momentum Gained in 3rd Quarter

• Release
• Photos

October 1, 2020

• Honda brand sales climb 11% as trucks set September record with 20.4% jump
• Honda Passport and CR-V set September sales records, gaining 48.1% and 29.6% respectively
• Acura September sales increased 16.6% on strong performances from MDX, RDX and ILX

American Honda Q3 Total

388,433
-9.5%
Cars

156,266
-17.6%
Trucks

232,167
-3.1%
Total

39,664
+1.6%
Cars

10,047
+3.9%
Trucks

29,617
+0.8%
Total

348,769
-10.6%
Cars

146,219
-18.8%
Trucks

202,550
-3.1%
American Honda September Total

127,058
+11.5%
Cars

50,819
+1%
Trucks

76,239
+19.9%
Total

12,941
+16.6%
Cars

3,357
+16.5%
Trucks

9,584
+16.6%
Total

114,117
+11%
Cars

47,462
0%
Trucks

66,655
+20.4%



“September marks a high-water mark for Honda sales this year with double-digit gains and our first month in positive territory since the pandemic began,” said Dave Gardner, executive vice president of National Operations at American Honda. “Powered by the strong performance of our Honda and Acura SUV lineups, we’ve been building momentum throughout the third quarter and early indications from dealers and customers are that the just-released 2021 Acura TLX is a real winner. So we’re optimistic for a strong close to 2020.”





BRAND REPORT
Sales Highlights

Honda trucks enjoyed a strong summer in the 3rd quarter of 2020, capped off by a record September with sales increases across the lineup.

• CR-V set a new September record, climbing 29.6% on total sales of 33,572, while CR-V Hybrid recorded its best month as sales topped 3,200.
• Passport set a new September record, jumping 48.1% on sales of 4,281.
• Pilot, Ridgeline and Odyssey also gained positive momentum in Q3.
• Civic sales were strong, posting its best quarter of 2020, despite limited supplies of the Civic Hatchback.

Model Notes
Civic is on track for its fifth straight year as the retail #1 car in America and its 10th straight year as the retail #1 compact car.



BRAND REPORT
Sales Highlights

Acura’s stellar SUV lineup continue in a starring role for the brand in September, helping it net a double-digit gain for the month.

• Robust MDX sales of 4,920 brought a 28.4% gain for the month.
• RDX sales gained 6.4% in September, with 4,664 deliveries.
• ILX continued to serve as an important gateway to the Acura brand in Q3, posting a 27.7% increase in September.

Model Notes
The all-new 2021 TLX is arriving at dealers now as the quickest, best-handling and most well-appointed sedan in Acura’s 35-year history.


RDX was the first core model based on Acura’s Precision Crafted Performance DNA. It’s now the retail best-selling compact luxury SUV and third-best selling luxury model overall.



# # #
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YEH

What will you do when Genesis starts to more than double sales? (Will you keep posting the monthly sales? Somehow I doubt that. )

No surprise that the G80 is way down as the new model is about to launch, and the G90 is in that lull period switching over to the '21MY.

Genesis hasn't been advertising as there's no point until the new models (and MY) hit the lots.

Meanwhile, can lease the MDX for as little as $466/month with $0 down.

The base Palisade leases for a little less than that and the top trim for a lot more.

SSFTSX

MDX has various trims from FWD to AWD all the way to Aspec and Advance packages. which one is $466? just random numbers you are pulling without content of vehicle. and dont compare 2020 with 2021. its like one year old.
for over one year i continously embarass you with Genesis sales. not single month goes with out it. doubling sales from what number?

YEH

^ The base model, which is the same for the Palisade.

Can get an Advanced/Tech MDX for less than the Telluride SX-P (used SX-Ps are going for more than MSRP).

The ILX, TLX and MDX can all be had with significant discounts, which is why Acura has one of the highest incentive spending in relation to ATP.

Even the new TLX will launch with nearly $3k in incentives (not usual for new sedans these days).

SSFTSX

there are not many Advance and Aspec models for sale in MDX. i doubt you get same lease deals like Hyundai.
Tech package is low content in MDX.
Acura has lowest incentives relative to price thats why any used Acura carries highest resale value relative to MSRP. there is no contest.

YEH

^ Which means not much demand for the higher trims.

Kia has been pumping out as many SX-P and Nightfall Tellurides (drastically increasing production) as their suppliers allow them to do so, and they still can't keep up with demand.

SSFTSX

Just look at resale values of higher trims MDX. It is much higher than BMW X5 and Audi Q7.

BMW outside warranty same model and mileage. Asking is already $5K lower. there are tons of example of like it.

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...8119/overview/



https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...8486/overview/

YEH

These are the nos. that auto manufacturers actually care about.

ATP
BMW - $59,733
Acura - $39,933

Incentive % of ATP
BMW - 10.2%
Acura - 14.6%



And only a complete moron would care about where the dealerships are located (or how big or old they are) and not what actually sells.

An Acura is a rare sight in uber wealthy neighborhoods like Atherton and Hillsborough; otoh, Range Rovers are a dime a dozen.

Acura can't even carry Tesla's purse when it comes to sales in these neighborhoods.

Relatively small volume Porsche vastly outsells Acura in these areas.

See more Cayennes than all Acuras combined, and give another month or so of sales will be more Taycans than Acuras.

SSFTSX

Are you sure about Hillsborough and Atherton? or for that matter Sand Hill road.
you pulled number from your ass. Just look around the used BMW and Porsches how they sell. it will tell all about why they are disposed off.
these are not actual transaction prices when almost 90% of BMW are leases? so if you cannot pay upfront on cash than dont assume the transaction price. there is alot manipulation in free maintaince, interest rates, lease return, residual values.

SSFTSX

you see alot of Mercedes, Lexus SUV and BMW. It is these kinds of dealership Acura is traded in. Acura is acceptable to most high end vehicle dealerships to its high resale value and sound financial strength of buyers.
Most of time Audi and Porsche dealerships are next to each other.

SSFTSX

https://www.newswire.ca/news-release...11.htmlMARKHAM, ON, Oct. 6, 2020 /CNW/ - The proven popularity of Acura's top-selling SUV over the last two years has been solidified as the exclusive 2021 RDX PMC Edition pre-sold its 30 unit Canadian allotment in a stunningly fast 24 hours.

Consumers were invited to visit https://www.acura.ca/future-vehicles/pmc/ on Sept. 22 at 7pm ET to place a reservation with an Acura dealer. It took just 1 day for all 30 Thermal Orange RDX PMCs to be accounted for by Acura enthusiasts across the country.

kurtatx

Given raw odds, that means there is at least one woman who is a match for you

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

00TL-P3.2

Reservation =/= Purchase