BEAR-AvHistory

Agree it will not get back to the first decade of the century with the crossovers & SUV dominating the market nobody will. Thing is all the makes have the same issue but are not taking as big a hit. The two brands that were usually # 2 & #3 behind Acura TL are now #1 & #2 in the segment. These two car brands are sold at a higher average price then the TL which should also have impacted negatively them to some extent. It is at the EOC for the current TL & its best was the first full year 4,000 a month. Next year dropped to 3,000 a month & on down to 2,000 a month last year. There is no good reason though to expect the sharp year to year declines after its first year.

Be interesting to know what model it was. The thing on a BMW battery. You can get a suitable AGM type battery with the under trunk vent port at any auto store for under $200. Many will install it free right in-front of the store. A phone app will register it, just match the charge rate number to the battery amp rating number & push OK. What registering is resetting the charge rate. As the battery gets old the cars computer ups the apertage going into the battery to keep it fully charged.

The BMW's a few engine series a few generations ago mostly the base 28 which had water pumps that needed a change out generally around 100,000 miles. Some went down early that is a fact. The counter point is the TLs need a timing belt changed around 100,000 miles & some of them went down. It was also a good plan to do the water pump at the same time.

Lots of antidotal stories but the reports look like:

I skipped years to get as much data in as few pages to show the trend but the trend does hold for all the brands we are talking about. In addition to the raw numbers its interesting to note that the industry average keeps getting better, this is good news for everybody.

The 2020 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study is based on responses from 36,555 original owners of 2017 model-year vehicles after three years of ownership. The study was fielded from July through November 2019.


The 2018 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study is based on responses from 36,896 original owners of 2015 model-year vehicles after three years of ownership. The study was fielded in October-December 2017.

The 2016 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Study is based on responses from 33,560 original owners of 2013 model-year vehicles after three years of ownership. The study was fielded from October through December 2015.

F23A4

JD Power and Consumer Reports do offer perspective on what to expect. I also look at Repairpal.com as well, particularly in consideration of used models.

leomio85

https://jalopnik.com/americas-auto-l...RTcGdhamRjY1Q.

people love spending money they don’t have. This is why people will be driving the new top end 5-series, get a new iPhone every time one comes out and wear designer clothes while not even clearing six figures. Gotta keep up the front, right? Acura doesn’t have the same name/brand recognition as BMW, Benz, Audi or Porsche. This is why price isn’t as big a factor as many would like to believe. Yea, it’s $15k more, but the monthly payment is only $xxx more a month over 72mos! What a deal! Or just lease it ... which is one way for people to drive cars they can’t really afford.

BCOmega

It was a 2011 X3 xDrive 35i with Sport Activity Package (Sport AT, Sport Steering Wheel with Paddles), Dynamic Handling Package (Variable Sport Steering), and Dynamic Damper Control amongst other options. We really liked it but I was disappointed in the things that broke with only 55,000 miles and the cost to fix. I do not have a problem with maintenance items but I do with the cost. Appreciate the info on getting a new battery installed at a lower cost, was not aware of that.

I've been following this thread for awhile as until very recently I have been considering a TLX as a replacement for my 2017 3 series after the factory warranty expires. I really like the styling of the current TLX, the spy shots of the new one look even better, and over the years we've had a great experience with Honda Corp products (motorcycles, Accord, Civic, and RDX). Thanks to this forum I decided I would not be interested in the current generation TLX but could be very interested in the new model. However, I got an offer I could not refuse on a new 3 series, and there was no definitive information on what the new TLX would have and when it would be available, so I just ordered a new M340i.

I'll keep visiting this thread for info on TLX developments and I'm curious to see the details on the new model. FWIW, regarding a turbo V-6 in the new TLX, IMO peak horsepower is interesting but the powerband is also important.

Bruce

BEAR-AvHistory

Jalopnik said:
"We’re talking about seven million individuals that are facing the loss of their vehicle."

eomio85 said:
"people love spending money they don’t have. This is why people will be driving the new top end 5-series"

Really this is supposed to be a hit on luxury cars.

There will always be defaults on auto loans & its created its own industry the Repo Man.

Loans through auto finance companies are more likely to go delinquent than loans originated through car dealerships. According to the data of auto finance loans are more than 90 days past due less than 1 percent of loans originated by Dealerships or Banks are in delinquency.

Story here is sub prime 620 credit score people who should not be buying a car, can't get a loan through the dealer or a bank & go to some shlock finance company that account for most of the defaults. Its not the Super Prime people buying $81,000 Suburbans with dealer 0% financing causing the problem its people buying $10,000 used cars @ 19% interest.

FORBES Financial: Headline
Debunking The Auto Loan Delinquency "Crisis"

"The share of auto loan borrowers who were three months behind on their payments peaked at 5.3% in late 2010. The share is actually lower now—4.5%—because the total number of borrowers has risen so much in the past several years."

On BMW, the other German & one Japanese Luxury builderBMW's demographics read like the Holy Grail of the auto industry.

In the U.S., the mean household income across the BMW line is $163,000, ranging from $140,000 for 3-series buyers to $260,000 on the 7-series.
Most Luxury car buyers are past the age of high loan delinquency & well above the nation average income of $89,930.70.





On knocking leasing as for people who can't afford their luxury car, Experian the credit reporting company said:
The top 10 leased cars in the US are

1 Honda Civic
2 Chevrolet Equinox
3 Honda CR-V
4 Honda Accord
5 Toyota RAV4
6 Nissan Rogue
7 Jeep Grand Cherokee
8 Jeep Cherokee
9 Chevrolet Silverado 1500
10 Ford F-150

BEAR-AvHistory

Congrats on your new car. Drove one when I was out looking & its a nice upgrade from the F series. Great dash layout. Agree, the power number does not have a lot of meaning its all about how it actually goes. Your new car is the pick of the litter in that category.

leomio85

It wasn't. It was on the people who buy luxury cars. The fact that you associate one as the other is on you.

Quote:

There will always be defaults on auto loans & its created its own industry the Repo Man.

One economist's opinion on the matter. There are many more who are on the other side of that coin. WSJ, Bloomberg, Fortune, etc. Peruse those sources as you see fit.

Quote:

On BMW, the other German & one Japanese Luxury builder

Cool. Where's my BMW? In a few years, guess we can go ahead and blow money on a 7-series. Fun tidbit to know.

Wait. The most popularly sold vehicles are also the most leased? Mind. Blown.

It's older, but I'd wager my left testicle that the graph hasn't changed much. Luxury vehicles are leased at over double the rate as most of the automakers on that "Top 10" list.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...nly-purchased/

People who lease luxury cars don't do so merely because they can't afford them. People who can't afford luxury cars use leasing to "afford" them. There's a distinction. It wasn't a knock on luxury car owners, but the degenerates I have the pleasure of dealing with who have no business driving one while collecting f*cking social welfare.

fiatlux

Now now, there's no need to stereotype Infiniti owners.

CheeseyPoofs McNut

While we've drifted off into several interesting subjects let's try to keep the posts on topic (or close to topic) and relevant to the upcoming Type S.

ACCURATEin

To me, it does make sense the TLX will debut at NYIAS. That's when I first saw the RDX in 2018 being displayed. I guess we will find out!

fiatlux

Assuming we even get a NYIAS. It was just announced this morning at the Geneva Motor Show has been cancelled for this year.

CollinR4

Wow, that's massive, I know GTI, A3 (Hatch) and several other releases were scheduled to be unveiled.

Anyone know what manufacturers do in this situation where their scheduled release is cancelled? I would think they would still want to get their products to market at the same time since they are likely already producing the car and want to make sure it is in the public's eye.

Might be a good time to get a deal on a car as well.

Tony Pac

Or may be postponed to another date.
COVID-19 F***!

fiatlux

Acura marketers are probably breathing a big sigh of relief right now.

"Woohoo, we have a free pass if we need to delay things again!"

BEAR-AvHistory

Maybe not the time, the industry looks like a whole bunch of new iron for 2020! The Camry was always a floaty marshmallow barge but with the introduction of the new BMW powered & suspended Supra looks like they also want to up their various major players games.

Just saw a current edition of MotorWeek & one of the cars tested was an upgraded Camry TRD. It's pretty much what the 3G A-Spec was. It has bigger rotor multi piston brakes, stiffer springs and stiffer, larger-diameter anti-roll bars (27.0 millimeters thick versus 25.4 millimeters on the XSE) & 0.6-inch-lower ride height, with heavier underbody braces and V-brace behind the rear seats. The TRD19-inch wheels are lighter than the standard 19" XSE wheels mounting Bridgestone Potenza summer tires. Complete body kit & wing (really a big wing) & custom interior complete the package. About $33,000

Still uses the same N/A 3.5L V6 @ 301HP like the regular car so its still looking at only an upper 5 second 0-60 but it did run away from the XSE on the road course. Excellent brakes stopped from 60mph in under 100 ft.

The old farts barge Avalon is getting the same mods, but normal spoiler, about $46,000. See Gramps in a bright red blacked out trim Avalon.

Given their size & price should match up against most TLX versions outside of the DOHC S series.

TVL65

I have little faith in the Type S, Acura will NOT give it 380 Hp, I'm guessing 350. Why? That's just not how Acura is, rather than try to really up their game they just want to suffice buyers at this point. New TLX will have 310/320 Hp & Type S 350 maybe.

stevenpsu

So when do expect to see this new design from Acura? Will they release any teasers before the auto shows? I am assuming we will see something soon if they want to release it this summer. Any inside knowledge on that?

CollinR4

I know we are all frustrated with the lack of news so I thought I'd chime in with a couple of thoughts on the direction Acura is headed in. My wife just got a 2020 RDX Advance with SH-AWD two weeks ago and I drove Columbus to Pittsburgh and back this past weekend. I know some have said they do not like the infotainment system but after just a few hours of driving I'm finding it to be very intuitive and a significant step forward from the dual-screen setup of the prior model and current TLX both in responsiveness and sharpness (As should be expected). Also, the speech recognition is very accurate if a little slow to process the request for directions. For me, the biggest positive is the seats. As a slim person (5'9 155), I find the adjustable bolsters to be a significant improvement in terms of holding me in the seat whereas the last RDX she had felt more like seats in a school bus. I like that they provided that feature on both front seats compared to the G70 that only have that and the thigh extension on the driver seat (Feels like a place where the corners were really cut). Acura also didn't cheap out on the heated steering wheel (all the way around), unlike my Lexus that doesn't heat the top section just the perforated leather sections on the sides. I also preferred the heating/ventilating on the seats over my Lexus which lightly blows air and the seats barely get warm enough to be noticed. I did find the engine to be a little sluggish until it spooled up but was then very quick to provide acceleration even at lower RPMs, I assume it should feel a little more responsive in the TLX if it is lighter (RDX is listed at 4,026 lbs for the advance package with SH-AWD on Edmunds). I do think the efficiency left something to be desired as I averaged 24.4 MPG over the drive there and back using cruise control most of the time (In Comfort mode, not the default Sport). That said, I found the RDX to be a great highway cruiser with the RPMs around 2K at 80 MPH the car is very quiet. I also like the personality of the engine felt like what I expect from Honda/Acura products with the way it will freely rev in a natural way. My IS350 feels bipolar in that it wants to loaf in the highest gear possible or it wants to be above 5K RPM screaming, there is no in-between that I've always felt like Honda/Acura products do much better and happy to see that wasn't lost with the turbo. I also I really like the new ELS system, I could feel the bass after tweaking the setting to my liking and streaming music from my phone. The HUD is nice but if I wasn't sitting directly head on it definitely cuts off the edges more than I've seen in other cars.

After spending time in the RDX I am remaining optimistic in the TLX but they do need to get it out soon otherwise I'm going for the G70.

pyrodan007

That's the problem with Acura, they leave their fruit way too long on the table. They should mimic others and release details with their styling. Concepts are no longer exciting based on past history.
Kia and Hyundai killed it this year with all the refreshes and new models. And they release them soon after. No fairytale waiting.

Jiten Patel

You guys want to know my theory as to why this debut might have been delayed? Yes maybe it is the testing but I also believe there are other external factors.

The new RDX redesign was debuted with it's prototype at the 2018 North American International Auto Show in Detroit. At the time the NAIAS was held every January but starting 2020 it is moved to June. This may have affected the roll out for the TLX as they could've shown the prototype in January but instead have to reschedule their whole reveal. The next biggest auto show would be the New York International Auto Show so it is forcing them to probably save the reveal for this show which is scheduled for April. So we either may get a full reveal or a prototype. And if it is the latter then we would probably see the production version at the 2020 NAIAS which is now moved to June.

Just my theory

ZipSpeed

If I were Acura, I wouldn't even bother showing a prototype of the base model. We already have a good idea what the next TLX will look like by looking at the Type-S prototype. Just imagine the Type-S without all the aggressive bits and voila!

EDIT: Not to mention all those hidden pictures found in the RDX infotainment system.

jjsC5

While I have no doubt there are plenty of those people, it's a long way from being a fair stereotype. I have a "high end" five series and two close friends have or have had several BMWs. One just took delivery of a new 2020 M8 Gran Coupe Competition that listed for $151,000. None of us fits any of the description you have stated.

I can also tell you that nearly 30 years ago I bought an Acura Legend (my second Acura). It had plenty of brand recognition and was astatus symbol for upper/mid-level managers. Acura made some stupid decisions and reversed there own status and brand recognition.

Rocket_man

My opinion.... pretty simple, something major is screwed up. The only question is what is it and did they actually fix it. In the case of the current TLX, it was the transmission and no, they did not fix it when the car was released. maybe reduced the 'badness' of it, but they had committed to release a car and so they did. Good or bad. So what is screwed up on the next gen TLX? Who knows, could be the new infotainment system (do they have any recent experience screwing up an infotainment system? RDX?) who know, but we all want to know if it is fixed. That we are not likely to get answered until a year or so after the Beta testers have documented the issue and Acura says 'it is supposed to be like that.'

NJToyMan

In April 2014, I went to the NY Auto Show to see the debut of the 2015 TLX. The car was on a blocked-off rotating platform. The car's doors were closed, and you were not allowed to get up close to see the interior (but the glass was not blacked out). They handed out preliminary brochures, which were fairly light on details and specifications. In early August, 2014, the new TLX started appearing on dealer's lots. I was one of the first to get the new TLX in mid-August, and then had the unfortunate honor to need and be one of the first to get a replacement transmission!

CollinR4

As we continue to wait for any morsel of news on the new TLX, Genesis drops official photos of the G80 with an interior mirroring the GV80.

https://www.motor1.com/news/402399/g...-g80-revealed/

BGR

Between this and the GV80, they've completely taken my mind away from the angst of the Type S.

PredatorWH

The grills on those genesis cars! Yuck!!! Worse than the old Acura grills. They seem to be great cars though.

BGR

stevenpsu

That looks great. I am assuming its the Type S model as it has 2 exhaust on each side. Also, no panoramic sunroof that I can tell. Other than that the body looks good. Did you just take these? Would love to see the interior.

fiatlux

I'm glad to see Brembos (or similar) on the front.

On the other hand, more money spent on brakes probably means less money spent on power.

fiatlux

A couple sales reps are now saying that their managers told them the new TLX won't be released until August:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Acura/comme...ugust_release/

jhb31

Both JD Powers and CR need to be taken with a grain or two of salt. Years ago I weighed CR ratings very heavily. While some of their top rated like toyota/lexus are rated at a level I would agree with anecdotally I don't get cadillac, ford, buick and bmw as being better than Honda/Acura. Of course that's on my own experience and friends who have other makes.

dmski

Makes sense for August release now with April preview at New York auto show. However, if they don't show up you can scratch August release date, more like fall with June preview in Detroit.

jhb31

I agree with your HP estimates for both models. To me if the type S is 350hp mated to a great trans that gets up and goes when you hit the pedal I am fine with that. The old type S was 286hp and felt like much more. Rather have a fast feeling 350hp car than a 380hp car with that feels like a 330hp car due to bad trans pairing.

KeithL

Yup, I see my wife and I going Genesis next round. She is waiting on GV70 and I will either do G80 Sport or GV80. Wife is not liking her 19 RDX AWD Advance and I am so fed up with my TLX death trap. Again today went to quickly swing into next lane as car was coming to a halt, punched pedal and car just bogged as I rolled into next lane with Mustang barreling down my ass. Her 19 RDX ride is so unrefined it is amazing. I don’t see either of us in another Acura, probably forever as as we get closer to retirement we are each starting to plan our final car buy for some time.

KeithL

I agree exactly, could care less what or when they release next TLX. Acura has been asleep at the wheel for too long.

Jiten Patel

This looks amazing. Finally got a good glimpse of the tail lights. Those quad exhaust look deadly. It'll definitely be around 350HP and priced pretty high.

ACCURATEin

Things that changed from the concept:
- rear diffuser delete
-side splitter delete
-shark fin add
-b pillar add
-side mirror increase
-caliper placement relocated

Hopefully the rear quarter window angle, or the fake one is retained from the concept.

Tony Pac

All I can say this car looks very handsome but I am super upset that we can’t get a real glimpse of it.

I hope this car does the same magic of G3. Of course it won’t be able to sell 70K units as the market is different but at least consistent 40-45K units.

CheeseyPoofs McNut

How long before a car is released do they wrap up the "driving in camo" testing?