AlpharettaBoomer

I had a chance to take home for 24 hours a base RLX due to my new TL not being ready to be taken home. I was really happy to have the "once in a lifetime" opportunity to test drive this car. Everything inside the car is well done and top notch. Yet, nothing about the car tells me I have to one. The car is a little "floaty" and somewhat soft...... Dont get me wrong, it is a great car and for the right price, I MIGHT consider one for my wife. The technology is very impressive, but I am still a little old fashioned and enjoy my "knobs". I can see the screen going off for some reason or another and everything shutting down......The design is very subdued and somewhat bland. Its a cross between a Genesis and of course the new Accord but on steroids. I think I would rather have a M37 (once revised) or a Lexus GS. Better yet, I rather have my TL...But the electronics are very very good and I think the new TL will have a lot of this technology once it comes out..... Hopefully the design will be edgy and modern. Based on the deals they are offering on the current TLs , I will not be surprised to see an RLX priced in the lows $40's which would make it for a very compelling buy. More of a reason for new TL MUST BE A HOME RUN......

As far as the new Q50, Infiniti will quickly find out nobody is going to want to pay $50K for this car.I honestly believe within 9 to 12 months and beyond, prices will settled close to the deals being offered on the current G37 range. Competition has always dictated this. As much as I like both Infiniti and Acuras, I still believe they will always be considered your "value" premium brand. This has nothing to do with being better or worse or getting more or less. This has to do with perception.

g37guy01

Unless as a manufacturer your aiming for a $90K S class, there has to be some compromise. Your not packaging an S class into a 50K vehicle.

Look at Maxima, heated steering wheels and blinkers in the mirror. Not available on the G. I've seen posts on maxima.org ranking on the G for that omission. If your priorities ina vehicle are a fwd, cvt with a heated steering wheel, the Maxima is your choice.

But I digress. A manufacturer has to package a car in such a way the vehicle appeals to its demographic buyers. To much disintegrated tech kills the car, to little, kills sales.

g37guy01

Really? I don't think you could be more wrong on this.

g37guy01

From my experience, I couldnt disagree more. Maybe Acura has a better radio, but that is a far cry from 'sucking'.

SSFTSX

You can load up BMW 3 series and Audi S4 upto $65k. so nothing unusual about RLX going to $90k provided it give the right technology and reliability. Now instead of 19inch they should have 18inch as standard across the line up. than give sport package option like BMW M Sport or Lexus F sport that is now in LS460 for larger wheels and performance tire setup. even in FWD it needs adjustable suspension setup.
Again your not looking at entry level luxury car that starts at low $30k like BMW 3 or Lexus IS but car that starts closer to $50k (RLX). there is no reason that option band is only limited to $10k extra.

BEAR-AvHistory

The RLX’s best month so far was 617 units. I don't think people are going to pay a lot of money for an Acura when they can buy a tier 1 car for the same price.

Once you get into the $65/70K up class its not content but name recognition that sells cars because they all have good content packages

The Acura brand does not have the same cache or recognition of the other cars in the bucks up class. On the “Brand Appeal” chart Acura is #13 behind RAM trucks & Volvo while the usual suspects are the top 6.

AlpharettaBoomer

Just watch!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

g37guy01

Yep, that's what I'm saying....just watch. If you hop over to infinitiq50.org, you can read about who is ordering the q. If you mean the Q won't be a success, well you must be prescient. I clearly don't know, but Infiniti has committed major resources over the next few years. So they feel confident....why shouldn't I?

AlpharettaBoomer

I did not know say the car will not be a success. I was just commenting on pricing and deals. I happen to think the G37 is a very successful product and there is no reason to think the Q50 will not be either. But not for $50K. The car will discounted in no time

docboy

How do you know Infiniti feels "confident?" There are plenty of small and large businesses/corporations who have spent $$ on products/marketing, and have either failed or not achieve the success they want (ie. the closure of many Alberstons stores, the doom of Blockbuster, Fisker Karma electric car, etc.). I would not ride someone's coat tails when it comes to business models and products just because they are "confident."

torqued

He is right, I did exactly that. I wanted a Q50 but the dealer's unwillingness to budge on MSRP drove me to a TL SH-AWD. The TL was a no brainer with the current deals out there. sealed the deal.

Anyone paying 50k now will regret it when folks are getting the same car for 45 by spring, if not year end. That said, I'm sure the same will be true for the first months of the TLX arrival.

There is a price for being the first on the block with the latest but a price I'll say no thanks to.

g37guy01

I believe Infiniti feels confident Because they committed multi-billions of dollars to a revamp of their lineup. Successful managers don't commit that type of capital on a whim hoping with a wet finger in the air, the marketing and execution plan is sound. My feelings about their success mean nada, except for discussion.

Now Acura also commited capital to their product upgrade. The jury is still out.

KeithL

The BT phone quality in my M and both my buddies G37s sucked, the quirky nature of how the lights work, put the fogs on and the auto headlights no longer work, The naivi is god awful at how you program it, they lock out touch screen I get that, but when driving and I voice I can't do a more or next option to see more than the first few entries, and on and on. Also while I was not able to find a car with the tech option I hope they improved the tech on on the Q50. The M tech adaptive cruise has issues since it uses a single radar sensor in the lower facia, the rain sensing wipers while decent most of the time, have mindind of their own.

SeismicGuy

When it comes to buying anything, especially cars, folks have a preconceived notion of what something is worth (or at least what it is worth for them to pay). For example, our friends, who have had a string of Lexus ES300 were recently in the market to replace their 2005 ES350. As it turned out the newly restyled Mercedes C-class had caught their attention which was basically in the same general price range as the new Lexus. They ended up with a new C250 at a price that was $5K below sticker and I am sure the thinking went something like "for what we would have to pay for a new Lexus we can get a new Mercedes instead". Frankly, the C250 does not strike me as being as much car as a new ES350 but once the perceived "lesser" marque reaches the price as the entry level "more prestigious" marque, practicality goes out the window.

AlpharettaBoomer

Could not agree more!. Just like you, I came out of a G37 lease and I was NOT willing to pay $50K or even $44K (Less features) for the new Q50. Not when I can a TL for far less which is really what I ended up doing. Even the G37 can be had in the low to mid $30K's.

Anyone who pays $50K for a Q will be regretting it. Same for the lease. Infiniti wanted over $650 a month ( here in Georgia). I am also not a fan of first year models.... Let somebody else deal with the bugs.....

KeithL

Most dealers will not budge on MSRP on a brand new model until inventories are up and the initial "gotta have it first" crowd gets done.

BEAR-AvHistory

Significant discounts on a brand new model mean you are in deep s**t. Main reason I am sitting out the next 12 months to order the new StingRay is to clear the early adopters out of the market.

Edward'TLS

All except the Acura RLX !

g37guy01

I never had an issue with programming the nav while moving using voice. Stationary, meh, it works. My lights don't behave in a quirky manner; it has worked the same since day 1. The stalk operation though is stuipid. BT works flawlessly. I can be heard clearly and the sound in the car is clear. Voice operation works like it should.

I can't speak of the advance tech...I opted not to buy it.

g37guy01

It's true what people say about first year models, but it's not always true there are insurmountable problems. I never went by that thinking anway. I suppose y'all would say the same about the RLX and TLX? Avoid them, let someone else work out the bugs.

SSFTSX

There is no such thing as Tier 1. No one will pay $60K for Audi S4 if it become slower and handles worse than Accord V6. Germans bring unqiue customization and driving experiance at that price point.
It is either electric Carpool access vehicles like Tesla or higher perfomance versions Germans.
Acura does not need cache it need content and performance. FWD RLX is not faster than Accord V6 nor it handles better. and there is not much customization.
Lexus/Germans has alot of colors, options, packages, engine, transmission, suspension, rims choices. BMW also has free 4 year maintainance. consider deep discounts. Germanic cars are better value at $60k Plus value.

SSFTSX

Accord Coupe is good starting point for TLX. with Front taken from Accord PHEV.
They need to make car smaller slightly larger than Lexus IS. Another large boat like current TL will not succeed.

KeithL

They did not budge the first month or 2, I called and tried, they all quoted MSRP.

KeithL

Programming by voice works, but if you get a list of item and you can only select from what is on the screen at the time. What is the point of the list having 20-100 items if all I can go is select form the 5 or 8 on the first page only. It would be nice for the voice command to have an option of saying "more" or "next" and display the next page. Also Infiniti voice command suck compared to Acura. You can control so much in an Acura by voice where the Infiniti is so limited. I like my Infiniti, but Acura tech is far better.

KeithL

I have owned several year 1 models 04 TL, 09 AWD-TL and 11 M37S and all were virtually flawless except a few squeaks and rattles, except the 09 AWD TL which was perfect, never an issue of any kind, it was one of the best built cars I have ever owned.

g37guy01

I don't know if you know this, but in the early nav models there was the option to control almost every aspect of vehicle operation. Radio, climate control, etc. Those features were removed for whatever reason.

Programming an address by voice should allow you to speak the destination like: "1600 Pennsylvania Ave, Washington DC".

Obviously Infiniti doesn't do this. I don't know if Acura allows this. But anything less than the above is sub-par anyway. So debating about which tech is better is like debating about which is better to eat: a rotten apple or a rotten orange.

SeismicGuy

This is a bit off topic but I just love the latest TV commercial they have running for the new Q50. The setting is some futuristic factory-like setting where a bunch of metrosexual men and urban sophisticated women (all looking basically the same) are on an assembly line being outfitted with the "appropriate" upwardly mobile grooming and clothes and then at one spot they are offered their vehicle keys (a quick shot shows all the keys are Mercedes or BMW). One of the men who obviously is uncomfortable fitting in is told to check his pocket whereby he pulls out a different looking key. He makes a run for it going through a level of parked vehicles (you can see all are BMW) until he sees a lone car and hits his key fob. The headlights go on, he sees it is something different, hops in and jets away, with agents in close pursuit. One of the last shots is a closeup of the Q50s badge on the back of the car followed by a front view of the car.

Really an inspired commercial that succeeds in making fun of the mind-numbed German buyers while introducing the sharp-looking Q50! It is sort of reminiscent of the famous Apple Macintosh commercial from years ago.

BEAR-AvHistory

Acura respectfully disagrees with your statement.

“For the first time, we’re now ready to take Acura to Tier 1,” he tells journalists at the North American International Auto Show here. “This involves the retail network, the product and, frankly, our mindset as an organization.”

Acura Changes Direction...No Longer Shooting for a Tier 1 Luxury Brand

Acura has been trying to change its portfolio to become more of a Tier 1 luxury brand, but it looks like those plans have changed. Acura had been working on developing new high-performance vehicles and its first V8 engine, but those plans have been canceled.

Prior to the collapse of the economy Acura had plans to finally match the other top tier luxury brands with its first V8 engine and rear-wheel-drive, but those plans have been scrapped sending engineers back to the drawing board.

SeismicGuy

This doesn't seem to have stopped any of the other manufacturers who are all going gangbusters introducing new models and significantly updating existing ones.

KeithL

I knew that, I believe it was the early 07 G37 when it came out that had more commands. I missed the Acura where you could change radio station, set temp, etc. I wonder what the Q50 does, you would hope Infiniti figured this out by now.

draph

With the 9th generation Accord out for the better part of a year, and, given the 2014 4G TL going into production in Sep is still based on the old Accord platform, that tells me the TL is not running on the same line, or their production infrastructure is impressively flexible.

It seems the last 4 generations of TL were all introduced within 1 year of the new Accord. It is really surprising me that the 5G TL isn't coming out sooner, just for business reasons to maximize production efficiencies gained from using a common architecture. Optimistically, a major decision was made to deviate from the normal release schedule: TLX architecture is much more differentiated from Accord architecture than TLs of the past, requiring extra development time, or the originally planned production version had to go back to the drawing board for whatever reason to ensure it will be a hit.

jshaw

The moment you mentioned the essence of the commercial, I thought of this one Ford has been running since late spring/early summer.


The new Infiniti commercial.

BEAR-AvHistory

Excellent flexibility like most modern computerized plants. Ohio has two production lines & a Honda plant info blurb says the Accord can be built on both.

Was at the BMW plant in SC when they still made the Z car there along with the X versions. Line was mixed with both Z's plus the X3 & X5 being assembled. They came through in batches of the same car.

Real interesting thing: Car goes into the paint shop to get painted when it comes out the doors, hood & trunk lid are taken off & go their own way through the trim shop. Further down the line in final assembly they all come back together.

They do this so that the paint is a perfect match on all parts of the car,

SSFTSX

Acura statement does not say RWD/V8 is tier 1 but more dealer network imporovment, product improvement and mind set.
Acura new products are more expensive than old one. compared Integra price with ILX or new RLX with old RL etc. Acura hasnt devalued the brand with free maintainance and too many leases unrealistic leases. There is still far less color choices in Acura.

Its myth Acura working on V8. both toyota & nissan sells alot more V8 globally than any other brand. see there SUV sales. There is no Honda comparable product in development.

g37guy01

Actually the Q commercial makes me want to get one.

JM2010 SH-AWD

Saw a new Q on the road last week. I only caught a short glimpse, but it looked good. I also saw a RLX and a '14 MDX. They both looked nice too. Lots of options out there today for car buyers.

I love the new Q commercial. Very funny and it presents the car in a good light.

MtnMan

"Just give me an AWD TSX"...

The other day I went to an "Invitation only", "The Ultimate Driving Experience" where I was going to "Test drive BMW against the competition". Long story short, the traveling tour didn't have the 335i, so I went out with a sales rep in a dealer car. I was very impressed. Of course this one was spec'd out the way I'd like it - M Sport, all the bells/whistles, and about $60k.

The 335i xDrive was way more fun than I expected - no sign of EPS issues on my end. The sales rep really made me push it through twisties and interstate on ramps. When we returned I was told that the tour didn't have any competition for the 335i to drive...imagine that.

So I went over to my Acura dealer. I've known the GSM for over 16 years - sold Acuras with him back in the 90s. The TL I drove was impressive, but the suspension was a bit harsh. It didn't compute as I assumed the BMW would be stiffer. Alas, this one was 15k less money which made me scratch my head. I liked it, but it left me wondering if a slightly lighter and smaller TLX could be more nimble.

At any rate, as one of those who is all over the map when it comes to my next car, I'm going to wait it out in order to to drive the 435, the Stingray, and perhaps the TLX. In the meantime, I'll go drive the S5/S4. My boss swears by his S6, but confirms that you don't want to own one out of warranty.

Maybe the TLX will be the AWD TSX I've been waiting for...

jshaw

It also shows a complete lack of creativity from Infiniti - especially when it's going to be remembered as openly aping a commercial Ford has run for a few months, already.

BEAR-AvHistory

So the president of Acura USA knows less about his company than you do when he said

“For the first time, we’re now ready to take Acura to Tier 1,” he tells journalists at the North American International Auto Show here. “This involves the retail network, the product and, frankly, our mindset as an organization.”

Agree there are no V8's in the works, the projects were shut down when Honda bailed out on pushing a Tire 1 product, just like they said.

g37guy01

You may not like it, The public may not like it, but I found it amusing. I haven't seen the commercial you are referring to.