My 3.7 mani, ZDX TB, and pnp runners build thread
#281
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I think there will be a difference in the flow characteristics of the ZDX manifold and the TL manifold....think the ZDX should gain a little more in low end TQ
#282
Green Machine
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t0talacuratl, any ideas why you didn't gain much power? I was thinking maybe it was because you had a ported stock manifold, but so did Sonnick.
#283
Racer
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OK, after reading this thread I got motivated to pick up the J37 manifold. After looking over the parts illustrations I decided to take a chance on the ZDX manifold. Just got it today and it looks just like the TL manifold but unpainted. So I saved a few bucks, but I think I would have preferred the TL manifold! Anyway, just wanted to post up in case anyone else doesn't care so much about looks. And yes, it is magnesium.
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hondazex (12-11-2012)
#284
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^^^ the manifold is sealed by some kind of glue...you can try to take it apart but it will be a lot of effort....it will definitely create a ton of mess....I did go at it with a mallet and screw driver and no luck...
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^^^ the human heart and mind always wants more
#288
All motor
I'm sure opening up the individual runners inside the manifold would help, but who knows. I do know that my manifold was done by P2R and that only the opening and lower ports were ported; nothing else. The opening is 68mm and the lower ports are I believe 1mm larger than stock. Internally, the manifold is stock. I believe Moore's Performance goes a step further and ports the inside as well, but I could be wrong.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
#290
Suzuka Master
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I'm sure opening up the individual runners inside the manifold would help, but who knows. I do know that my manifold was done by P2R and that only the opening and lower ports were ported; nothing else. The opening is 68mm and the lower ports are I believe 1mm larger than stock. Internally, the manifold is stock. I believe Moore's Performance goes a step further and ports the inside as well, but I could be wrong.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
Best bet on the stock 3.2 manifold is to just cut the top open, port it and then have it re-welded. I'd like to see a stock Maxbored TB and stock intake done this way vs the 3.7 setup on a flow bench, side by side.
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Sonnick (12-05-2012)
#291
Pro
Maybe the 3.7 TB isn't giving any more power than a bored 3.2 TB at 66/71 mm or even a completely stock 3.2 TB (doubtful). Maybe Moore's did a really good job on Total's and that's why he only picked up a few hp, or the few hp he did pick up came from the larger TB alone.
Best bet on the stock 3.2 manifold is to just cut the top open, port it and then have it re-welded. I'd like to see a stock Maxbored TB and stock intake done this way vs the 3.7 setup on a flow bench, side by side.
Best bet on the stock 3.2 manifold is to just cut the top open, port it and then have it re-welded. I'd like to see a stock Maxbored TB and stock intake done this way vs the 3.7 setup on a flow bench, side by side.
#292
Racer
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Maybe the 3.7 TB isn't giving any more power than a bored 3.2 TB at 66/71 mm or even a completely stock 3.2 TB (doubtful). Maybe Moore's did a really good job on Total's and that's why he only picked up a few hp, or the few hp he did pick up came from the larger TB alone.
Best bet on the stock 3.2 manifold is to just cut the top open, port it and then have it re-welded. I'd like to see a stock Maxbored TB and stock intake done this way vs the 3.7 setup on a flow bench, side by side.
Best bet on the stock 3.2 manifold is to just cut the top open, port it and then have it re-welded. I'd like to see a stock Maxbored TB and stock intake done this way vs the 3.7 setup on a flow bench, side by side.
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hondazex (12-11-2012)
#293
Suzuka Master
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Sounds good. I think you'll need the P2R adapter for the TL-S manifold? And you'll likely need to open up the mouth on the TL-S manifold to 71-72. Not sure what it measures stock. I know my 3.2 manifold was ~ 65-66 mm at the opening; just slightly larger than the stock 64mm TB.
#294
Racer
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Sounds good. I think you'll need the P2R adapter for the TL-S manifold? And you'll likely need to open up the mouth on the TL-S manifold to 71-72. Not sure what it measures stock. I know my 3.2 manifold was ~ 65-66 mm at the opening; just slightly larger than the stock 64mm TB.
Yes i'll have to get the P2R adapter and will open up the opening size of the manifold and the P2R adapter to match the new TB size.
#295
Originally Posted by swoosh
I think there will be a difference in the flow characteristics of the ZDX manifold and the TL manifold....think the ZDX should gain a little more in low end TQ
#297
Green Machine
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I'm sure opening up the individual runners inside the manifold would help, but who knows. I do know that my manifold was done by P2R and that only the opening and lower ports were ported; nothing else. The opening is 68mm and the lower ports are I believe 1mm larger than stock. Internally, the manifold is stock. I believe Moore's Performance goes a step further and ports the inside as well, but I could be wrong.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
Still strange that total didn't gain anything, considering he has the TB too. Idk.
#298
All motor
^ You were still on the stock exhaust? Ahem...that could have been part of it.
Anx: A member of v*6*p removed his butterflies. There was no before/after, but I'm assuming the same principle applies.
Anx: A member of v*6*p removed his butterflies. There was no before/after, but I'm assuming the same principle applies.
#299
Suzuka Master
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Sonnick, what principle is that? Never really researched it much, but recall something about a torque dip somewhere?
I think Total had a modified Greddy cat back if I'm not mistaken.
I think Total had a modified Greddy cat back if I'm not mistaken.
#300
All motor
^ Yea, there is a dip in torque below 4K RPM. It was substantial on my dyno. Although the manifolds were different, there were only minimal gains under 4K. After 5K is where the manifold really came alive, but I lost 12-15 hp/tq before 4K with the deleted butterflies.
#303
All motor
^ What exhaust did you end up doing?
#304
Suzuka Master
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Ok, this rev hang is getting fukcing annoying. It only does it under load however. If I'm cruising along in say 6th gear at 60 mph, push in the clutch and rev to any RPM, it drops right back to idle. I've tried this probably 75 times just to confirm...no issues when it's not under load. If, however, I'm accelerating heavily and then shift to the next gear, it'll drop to 4.5k and fluctuate 2 or 3 hundred RPM either way, then drop to 3.5k and do the same thing, then around 2.5k, then down to wherever it should be.
I've reset the ecu twice and then let it idle both times for 15-20 minutes (cold idle is a bit higher than with the stock setup, but once warmed up it's fine)
I've checked all hoses etc.
Unplugged and checked main TB, IAC and MAP connectors. Also switched back to stock MAP sensor.
Re-tightened TB nuts/bolts.
Re-tightened manifold cover bolts.
Next step is to pull cover and make sure the manifold to runner bolts are tight.
Then pull TB off and make sure butterfly is ok.
I just can't wrap my head around the fact it only does it under load, which would logically rule out a standard vacuum leak....maybe.
Also, I'm not getting any codes!
I've reset the ecu twice and then let it idle both times for 15-20 minutes (cold idle is a bit higher than with the stock setup, but once warmed up it's fine)
I've checked all hoses etc.
Unplugged and checked main TB, IAC and MAP connectors. Also switched back to stock MAP sensor.
Re-tightened TB nuts/bolts.
Re-tightened manifold cover bolts.
Next step is to pull cover and make sure the manifold to runner bolts are tight.
Then pull TB off and make sure butterfly is ok.
I just can't wrap my head around the fact it only does it under load, which would logically rule out a standard vacuum leak....maybe.
Also, I'm not getting any codes!
#305
Ok, this rev hang is getting fukcing annoying. It only does it under load however. If I'm cruising along in say 6th gear at 60 mph, push in the clutch and rev to any RPM, it drops right back to idle. I've tried this probably 75 times just to confirm...no issues when it's not under load. If, however, I'm accelerating heavily and then shift to the next gear, it'll drop to 4.5k and fluctuate 2 or 3 hundred RPM either way, then drop to 3.5k and do the same thing, then around 2.5k, then down to wherever it should be.
I've reset the ecu twice and then let it idle both times for 15-20 minutes (cold idle is a bit higher than with the stock setup, but once warmed up it's fine)
I've checked all hoses etc.
Unplugged and checked main TB, IAC and MAP connectors. Also switched back to stock MAP sensor.
Re-tightened TB nuts/bolts.
Re-tightened manifold cover bolts.
Next step is to pull cover and make sure the manifold to runner bolts are tight.
Then pull TB off and make sure butterfly is ok.
I just can't wrap my head around the fact it only does it under load, which would logically rule out a standard vacuum leak....maybe.
Also, I'm not getting any codes!
I've reset the ecu twice and then let it idle both times for 15-20 minutes (cold idle is a bit higher than with the stock setup, but once warmed up it's fine)
I've checked all hoses etc.
Unplugged and checked main TB, IAC and MAP connectors. Also switched back to stock MAP sensor.
Re-tightened TB nuts/bolts.
Re-tightened manifold cover bolts.
Next step is to pull cover and make sure the manifold to runner bolts are tight.
Then pull TB off and make sure butterfly is ok.
I just can't wrap my head around the fact it only does it under load, which would logically rule out a standard vacuum leak....maybe.
Also, I'm not getting any codes!
#306
All motor
Anx, when you let off the gas, does the car lurch forward as if you had 300 broken motor mounts? Mine does this all the time. If I let off the gas, the nose dives and bounces a few times before leveling out. It's very frustrating. It does this when shifting as well.
My buddy replaced my mounts so it's not that, and my struts aren't blown either. He suggested that it could be because the AFR is so off partial throttle. The car is now seeing SO much more air than previously and without a tune, it can't adjust for partial throttle. So once the gas is let off, there is much more air in the TB than before, so it can't compensate. Could this potentially be a similar problem to a similar cause? What he said made sense to me.
He suggested we try the 09 TL MAP sensor, but you said you switched from the TL sensor to stock and it made no difference?
My buddy replaced my mounts so it's not that, and my struts aren't blown either. He suggested that it could be because the AFR is so off partial throttle. The car is now seeing SO much more air than previously and without a tune, it can't adjust for partial throttle. So once the gas is let off, there is much more air in the TB than before, so it can't compensate. Could this potentially be a similar problem to a similar cause? What he said made sense to me.
He suggested we try the 09 TL MAP sensor, but you said you switched from the TL sensor to stock and it made no difference?
#308
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Sonnick, I didnt experience too much of a rev hang with the 05 MAF sensor but every once in a while it would freak out on me....when i went to the SHAWD MAF sensor, it was a very smooth ride....
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
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Sonnick, I didnt experience too much of a rev hang with the 05 MAF sensor but every once in a while it would freak out on me....when i went to the SHAWD MAF sensor, it was a very smooth ride....
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
#311
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^^^ I used the SHAWD sensor....I just had to dremel the "guidelines"
here is the pic:
here is the pic:
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t0talacuratl (12-12-2012)
#313
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i dont see why it wont
#316
Suzuka Master
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Didn't it do it before the manifold swap? On my stock accord it will not go back to idle, instead it does these steps before it goes to idle. Its supposed to do this on purpose. Say you do a 2nd gear pull push in the clutch when its close to red line. Notice it drop quickly to 4,500 like you say and stay there. then to 3,300 and stay there. These are pre-programmed shift points so when you do a pull like that and want to skip shift to 4th or 5th, you can let the clutch out at these points and it wont wear the clutch at all. It'll be at the exact rpm it needs to be.
Anx, when you let off the gas, does the car lurch forward as if you had 300 broken motor mounts? Mine does this all the time. If I let off the gas, the nose dives and bounces a few times before leveling out. It's very frustrating. It does this when shifting as well.
My buddy replaced my mounts so it's not that, and my struts aren't blown either. He suggested that it could be because the AFR is so off partial throttle. The car is now seeing SO much more air than previously and without a tune, it can't adjust for partial throttle. So once the gas is let off, there is much more air in the TB than before, so it can't compensate. Could this potentially be a similar problem to a similar cause? What he said made sense to me.
He suggested we try the 09 TL MAP sensor, but you said you switched from the TL sensor to stock and it made no difference?
My buddy replaced my mounts so it's not that, and my struts aren't blown either. He suggested that it could be because the AFR is so off partial throttle. The car is now seeing SO much more air than previously and without a tune, it can't adjust for partial throttle. So once the gas is let off, there is much more air in the TB than before, so it can't compensate. Could this potentially be a similar problem to a similar cause? What he said made sense to me.
He suggested we try the 09 TL MAP sensor, but you said you switched from the TL sensor to stock and it made no difference?
Sonnick, I didnt experience too much of a rev hang with the 05 MAF sensor but every once in a while it would freak out on me....when i went to the SHAWD MAF sensor, it was a very smooth ride....
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
i almost wanna blame the ZDX TB....all of us are using the SHAWD TB....the ZDX TB/Manifold have different part #'s and am thinking maybe its something to do with wiring
Yep, just file down the plastic ridges like in Swoosh's pic. Won't run any differently though, but at least it's a new sensor. For that reason alone, I'm going to swap the new one back in this week.
#317
All motor
I'm gonna try switching the MAP sensor. If that stops the bucking I will be ecstatic. This sympton occurred prior to the manifold/TB installation, so maybe my MAP sensor was bad? I feel like I would've gotten a code though. Or maybe that could be the P0174 code I'm getting on & off?
I_love_cars: Sup bro? How's your setup doing? We're totally hijacking the sh1t out of your thread....
I_love_cars: Sup bro? How's your setup doing? We're totally hijacking the sh1t out of your thread....
Last edited by Sonnick; 12-12-2012 at 09:35 AM.
#318
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is it the MAP sensor or the MAF sensor? I think the MAF sensor goes in the TB and the MAP would go in the manifold
#319
Suzuka Master
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It's MAP, which is exclusive to speed density systems. Our cars aren't MAF, which I think is part of the reason our cars respond pretty well to intake mods. MAF is pretty finicky when you start adding more air without a tune.
#320
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so I have been writing it wrong though out
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Sonnick (12-12-2012)