xtcnrice

haha we don't have a stock twin turbo we can up the psi on!

xtcnrice

New update:

Sounds like I can use the base map, and/or copy the values directly from Dime Feng's map over to an 11-14 map.

So for anyone who plans on flashing a 11-14 map onto their 11-14 TSX using FlashProManager V1.9.5/V1.9.6, note that the indices on the Ignition High tables are functionally equivalent to the ones from the 09-10 maps. They appear to be incorrect as the values of the indices are not the same to the naked eye, but this is apparently not the case. I have double confirmed with Spunkster from Hondata, here. However, Spunkster has noted several times NOT to edit the indices themselves (i.e., do not EDIT nor ADD new ones yourself, as the value specified by you may not (almost certainly won't) correspond to the actual RPM value. If you're worried about screwing something up, simply wait for the next beta release. I'm not responsible for your exploding engine!

You can expect the next beta version to correct this, and the tables should look exactly the same between 09-10 maps and 11-14 maps.

iCrap

wait so you can copy the entire table over and it'll be fine, but if you directly edit an index it won't work correctly? wut?

xtcnrice

You can copy the values over (i.e., the numbers in the coloured cells). But, you shouldn't edit the RPM indices (i.e., the 550, 650, 720, etc. in the 11-14 map) because of a visual bug. The 550, 650, 720, ... from the 11-14 map actually corresponds to 500, 750, 1000, ... from the 09-10 map. So, editing an RPM index on an 11-14 map or adding your own with a value of say, 500, will very likely not actually correspond to the true 500 RPM value.

edit:
Notice how the coloured values between the stock maps are exactly the same, and that the only thing that differs is the first column; the RPM indices? The first column being different is purely a cosmetic bug. It's in actuality the same as well.

xtcnrice

Man.. the 11-14 maps are plagued with bugs. I've found another discrepancy that's hopefully also just another cosmetic bug.

On the Closed Loop > Lambda page, the ECT (degrees F) values for Closed loop target lambda low load and Closed loop target lambda high load are way wrong. The last value of the set is 176 degrees F? My oven easily gets hotter than that! The Lambda (:1) values are the same across the board between maps.

09-10:


11-14:

(differences highlighted in yellow)

Once again, I've noted the issue in the Hondata forums, here.

ssjoeboe9

Those closed loop lamda Temps don't matter as much to you.. especially the high ones cause you are not boosted.

GameOver69

Hey guys,

just purchased a FP today, and should be in by tomorrow. I decided to check out the FP manager for the PC, and saw that there were no real filters besides stock for my 2012 TSX. For the time being... until i get an e-tune, do i just flash the stock base map? Also, should i hold off from what i am reading in this thread, since there seems to be issues with the latest beta? I am completely new to this, and even though i read up a bit in preparation, its very overwhelming!

Let me know... because i seriously cannot wait until i get this thing tomorrow lol.

iCrap

Since you have a 2012 the cals posted here won't work ... yet. So for now you will want the basemap.

if xtc gets it to work and uploads his converted 2011+ cal then you will be able to use that

optimusaccord

It's funny seeing the maps with just vacuum....

Got to have boost yo....

GameOver69

So no need to worry about the bugs i have been reading about for the 11-14 maps?

Also what can i expect from a completely stock basemap, besides the removal of rev hangs... (which like ssjoe, i have not noticed on my tsx).

thanks!

iCrap

- increased rev limiter
- car is quite a bit smoother
- rev hang thing

It didn't feel any faster at all though on the basemap


No need to worry about the bugs if you are not planning on modifying the calibration yourself

xtcnrice

well.. I discovered a couple more bugs. I've posted in the Hondata forum a few days ago, and decided not to post back here until I at least got an answer to the previous bug I mentioned.

The first of the two might be cosmetic, but I cannot confirm. The second, appears to be pretty bad. I have no idea if this is purely cosmetic... cuz if it is, it's still quite the fuck up:

Bug 1:

The Throttle page's Overrun injector restart tables:
The RPM values for the cut and recover tables appear to be switched around in the 11-14 map. See below for details.

09-10:


11-14:



Bug 2:

The Throttle > TPlate Normal table:
The values, including the TPS indices, don't appear to make sense on the 11-14 map. It doesn't make sense to me how at a particular RPM (say 2500 RPM), there can be many different values for Throttle (%) when the TPS is at 100%.

09-10:


11-14:


Questions I had for Hondata:

• Is this also a cosmetic bug, or are there more issues in this case?
• Are the values still somehow equivalent between the 09-10 maps and the 11-14 maps, despite what the table is showing?
• I'm not planning on modifying this table, but I'm just wondering if it's still safe to flash my ECU with the provided 11-14 stock equivalent map.
• Would it make sense to re-add the TPS indices from scratch here, and have the values reflect the 09-10 map?

iCrap

wow... they must have done no debugging and testing at all.

You are their beta tester now lol.
I have to wonder if they have even tested the basemap on a 2011+ TSX. I doubt it..

xtcnrice

That's exactly what I thought. I doubt they tested on a CU2, since this is such a low priority/market platform for Hondata anyway, IMO. And yeah seriously... wtf is up with these bugs. Zero testing/debugging for sure. How the hell could you have multiple throttle % values for the same pedal position + RPM combo? Makes no sense at all.

GameOver69

So is it not safe to flash the stock basemap yet?

xtcnrice

I'm not exactly sure because the last 2-3 bugs I reported I haven't gotten an answer back yet. Feel free to post in the Hondata forum I linked to spark some interest/demand, or even try and PM one of the Hondata guys. I've been working with Spunkster from the Hondata forum on these bugs.

iCrap

I don't think it's safe to flash it

xtcnrice

Is there an external bug tracking system at Hondata? The latest FPMan officially supports the 11-14 TSX right? So I should get support if I bought the FP. They're taking their sweet ass time in replying to me likely because it's the wrong avenue; the forum.

ssjoeboe9

You guys are running beta version that supports 11+ TSX? I'm not surprised there are still bugs. Full production version doesn't yet support right?

xtcnrice

Latest version is not beta, and includes 11+. Hondata also updated their FlashPro section of their site and the TSX FP now supports 11+ as well.

edit:
and no, this version did not fix any of the bugs I've reported. I'm using the latest FP Man right now.

iCrap

I wouldn't even call that a beta... clearly nobody even looked at anything at all before the software was released. Pretty ridiculous.

GameOver69

http://www.hondata.com/updates/Flash...1-9-7-Full.exe

New beta out that supposedly resolves the issues for 11-14 TSX.

Can anyone take a look at it?

xtcnrice

I will take a look tonight, thanks Game.

One off topic question.. did you install your PCD and HFC all at once? Or HFC afterwards? I kinda want the HFC... but it won't provide nearly as much gains as the PCD. I'm just wondering how much of a gain there really is.

GameOver69

Yes both at same time.... The gains were huge.... Hoping after a proper tune... It will be even more so!

iCrap

I want to see a dyno of stock vs only HFC. I doubt it'll do anything at all.

MrHeeltoe

iTrader: (1)

Based on our testing, in general, stock converters are really restrictive. The metal cores in high flow cats really do open things up a lot.

xtcnrice

nah it should do something. HFC is more like a test pipe than it is like the stock cat.

I know most of the bottleneck is at the precat, and I do see gains there. But I'd also like to see a dyno showing stock vs HFC, or PCD + OEM 2nd cat vs. PCD + HFC

iCrap

hmm yeah maybe there will be gains. maybe a few hp.. but nothing like the 15-20 from the pcd.

2011 TSX

Attached my latest tune to this reply.
See my thread here if interested about the tune.

iCrap

Awesome, thanks for sharing.

What are you mods as well?
edit: nvmd I read it in the other thread.

GameOver69

Thanks for posting your calibration. Question as I am new to all this... Does flashing a calibration that only pertains to part of your setup have a negative affect? For example I have only the rv6 downpipe... With HFC not test pipe. I have other mods that this user doesn't.... Will I still see a benefit? And/or can this be possibly damaging with my setup.

Thanks in advance. Just anxious to flash something that will increase car performance before I finally get a proper e-tune.

iCrap

You can still flash it. won't damage anything but you might not make the same power he does obviously.

Do you have auto or manual? the calibrations are supposed to be interchangeable but I remember joe had lots of errors when he flashed a auto cal to his 6mt.... but then I had no problems when I flashed a 6mt cal to my auto. It's weird.

ssjoeboe9

Hey since you have already shared your calibration publicly could you upload it the Hondata Flashpro repository? It's called the "Vault" in your FP Manager.

This would help everyone so that they don't have search through many pages to find a single post where someone uploaded a Cal.

ANDDD

Does anyone know if it's possible to datalog using just the FP but still see that data on your laptop? I used to always log data via my laptop but Vit is requesting using only the FP to datalog since it is apparently faster. So can I hit the datalog button then plug into my laptop and just view the data live via the "lightning bolt" but still record using the FP unit?

GameOver69

Manual

xtcnrice

iCrap you should try out 2011 TSX's cal and compare with Dime Feng's!

iCrap

I never tried doing both but I would guess it won't work. but worth a try.

Yeah i'm gonna give it a try. I wonder if it'll give errors though since its a MT cal. It shouldn't... but ssjoe got errors for doing auto on MT.

ssjoeboe9

iCrap can you try it out and tell me? Im still trying to figure out why my pump stays on even when the car is off.

xtcnrice

I never tried, but I'm pretty sure you can datalog without the laptop, then view the log later when you plug it back into the laptop. You cannot view the log at the same time it's logging if it's not plugged in to your laptop.

xtcnrice

V1.9.7 (21 Nov 2014)

· FlashPro firmware updated to version 69.

· [RDX] Added P0234 boost cut min IAT & ECT.

· [2006 Civic Si] Fixed datalogging MAP above 255 kPa.

· [2006 Civic Type R] Added radiator fan control, TPS WOT determination tables, MAP to high/low error enable, and VTEC activation conditions.

· Added 2011-2014 model TSX.

· [S2000] Fixed old calibrations loading wrong fuel pressure

· [TSX 2011+] Fixed ignition high RPM index, overrun injector restart tables, and AT throttle table

I have verified these bug fixes. Only issue (non-issue?) outstanding is the AFM fuel table in the Fuel tab, where the values >= 1000 mg of Air are not the same as the 09-10 maps. However, Hondata did say that for an N/A application, we will very, very unlikely see such levels of air so it won't matter, and if you're boosted, said values will need to be tuned anyway.

So all in all, I think we're good to go 11+ folks! And on the plus side, my TSX FP came in the mail (opened and confirmed). Thanks Marcus et al. from HeelToeAuto for working closely with me in getting this resolved.

I've since plugged in my FP, it asked me to update the firmware, and it has apparently updated without any problems. I will continue mapping over Dime Feng's map to a 11+ calibration and eventually test it on my car (screw the base map!). I will be starting from scratch just to be safe, however.

xtcnrice

btw, even tho Hondata claims AT and MT maps are interchangeable, I'd probably agree with Vit and simply assume they're not. There are some settings in the calibration that are gear specific, like Overrun fuel cut delay, which has timing per gear for example. I wouldn't be surprised if there are other things that are gear number dependent or are tailored towards MT/AT trannies.