Honda: Civic News
#3041
Honda Fanboy
Are you really this abrasive? All you could say to everyone asking you for proof is that you don't have anything concrete, but it is to the best of your knowledge they downgraded the materials used.
Ken phrased it just fine, he is a Honda fan and does not get on anyone's nerves. Do you ever wonder why?
![](http://pixelpunchstudio.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/the-more-you-know.gif)
Ken phrased it just fine, he is a Honda fan and does not get on anyone's nerves. Do you ever wonder why?
![](http://pixelpunchstudio.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/the-more-you-know.gif)
#3042
אני עומד עם ישראל
Don't know how many times I've gotta say it, but this is just the internet. If you're gonna let yourself get butt-hurt by someone you've never met, then maybe you're just too sensitive for this place. There are plenty of people here that are more abrasive than I am, yet you've chosen to single me out. Where is your rant for them? It's a tough world out there, get used to it.
![Shrug](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/shrug.gif)
I'm sure you act the exact same way in "real life" yet you still wonder why you have so many problems with people here? Remember you've had next to zero interactions with me and we've both been here for quite sometime. So you reap what you sow baby girl.
You treat people the way you want to be treated, internet, at home or the bath houses you frequent.
![Wave](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/wave.gif)
#3043
Honda Fanboy
Doesn't matter Nancy. You're dealing with people, plain and simple. If you want to be a cocksucker then so be it. All I asked you for was a source, which you can't produce and have been called out by several others. So you have all this jelly, but no toast. ![Shrug](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/shrug.gif)
I'm sure you act the exact same way in "real life" yet you still wonder why you have so many problems with people here? Remember you've had next to zero interactions with me and we've both been here for quite sometime. So you reap what you sow baby girl.
You treat people the way you want to be treated, internet, at home or the bath houses you frequent.
![Wave](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/wave.gif)
![Shrug](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/shrug.gif)
I'm sure you act the exact same way in "real life" yet you still wonder why you have so many problems with people here? Remember you've had next to zero interactions with me and we've both been here for quite sometime. So you reap what you sow baby girl.
You treat people the way you want to be treated, internet, at home or the bath houses you frequent.
![Wave](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/wave.gif)
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
#3044
אני עומד עם ישראל
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
So where's the source about the materials being down graded?
Yeah... thought so.
Last edited by Hapa DC5; 12-05-2012 at 08:41 PM.
#3045
Honda Fanboy
Anyways... I don't have the type of source that you're looking for. But you've had a senior moderator here confirm that he has heard the same exact thing (along with a couple other people) directly from Honda execs AND that it was hinted during a shareholder meeting.
You can believe whatever you want, as long as it goes along with your own beliefs.
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
#3046
אני עומד עם ישראל
That was a response? I'm afraid to see what a jab from you would be.
Anyways... I don't have the type of source that you're looking for. But you've had a senior moderator here confirm that he has heard the same exact thing (along with a couple other people) directly from Honda execs AND that it was hinted during a shareholder meeting.
You can believe whatever you want, as long as it goes along with your own beliefs.![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
Anyways... I don't have the type of source that you're looking for. But you've had a senior moderator here confirm that he has heard the same exact thing (along with a couple other people) directly from Honda execs AND that it was hinted during a shareholder meeting.
You can believe whatever you want, as long as it goes along with your own beliefs.
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
The bolded is all you needed to type and I wouldn't have called you out on it. Remember, have I ever before? I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, you decided to take it to another level. So my question was answered by you and further derailing this thread isn't necessary.
Have a good night.
#3047
Honda Fanboy
Look for my pictures in the member pic thread. You can see what a jab would look like from me. Your keyboard warrior days may come to an end fairly quickly. ![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
The bolded is all you needed to type and I wouldn't have called you out on it. Remember, have I ever before? I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, you decided to take it to another level. So my question was answered by you and further derailing this thread isn't necessary.
Have a good night.
![Thumbs Up](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif)
The bolded is all you needed to type and I wouldn't have called you out on it. Remember, have I ever before? I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, you decided to take it to another level. So my question was answered by you and further derailing this thread isn't necessary.
Have a good night.
![](http://pixelpunchstudio.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/the-more-you-know.gif)
#3048
אני עומד עם ישראל
#3050
אני עומד עם ישראל
#3052
אני עומד עם ישראל
What kind of car do you drive since I have your attention?
#3053
WTF does all this have to do with the Civic? ttribe call off your goons
![Why Me](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/whyme.gif)
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#3054
אני עומד עם ישראל
The following 5 users liked this post by Hapa DC5:
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#3055
Moderator
#3056
Senior Moderator
Will you 2 Donkeys KNOCK IT OFF! If you want to bicker PM each other.
#3057
What's a goon to a goblin..
#3058
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#3059
The Third Ball
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#3060
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
I always miss out on these bashings..
![Bored](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/bored.gif)
#3061
Senior Moderator
Hopefully, no more. ![Bored](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/bored.gif)
Back on topic, guys!
![Bored](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/bored.gif)
Back on topic, guys!
![Rant](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/rant.gif)
#3062
Midnight Marauder
Anybody know why Honda went away from the excellent wheel fitment on the previous gen Civic? I really thought they were onto something back when they decided to do that.
Just compare.
2012
![](http://media.caranddriver.com/images/11q1/387335/2012-honda-civic-si-coupe-photo-393612-s-520x318.jpg)
2007
Just compare.
2012
![](http://media.caranddriver.com/images/11q1/387335/2012-honda-civic-si-coupe-photo-393612-s-520x318.jpg)
2007
![](http://www.todoautos.com.pe/attachments/f6/39438d1186989109-honda-civic-si-2007-53a2456215p.jpg)
#3064
אני עומד עם ישראל
Look at how much more aerodynamic those side mirrors are!
#3065
Safety Car
![Arrow](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/icons/icon2.gif)
Price: From £19,400, Civic (petrol) prices from £16,955
Engine: 1.6-litre four-cylinder turbodiesel
Transmission: 6-speed manual
Power: 120 PS at 4,000 rpm
Torque: 300 Nm at 2,000 rpm
Fuel consumption (combined cycle): 78.5 mpg*
CO2 emissions: 94 g/km*
Top speed: 129 mph
Acceleration (0-62 mph): 10.5 seconds
All real car fans like Honda. It’s very good at engines, and you always have the feeling that it’s just about the most “engineering-led” mainstream car manufacturer. Sometimes, though, you’d have to admit that the product planners and marketing people should probably have been allowed a bit more influence.Engine: 1.6-litre four-cylinder turbodiesel
Transmission: 6-speed manual
Power: 120 PS at 4,000 rpm
Torque: 300 Nm at 2,000 rpm
Fuel consumption (combined cycle): 78.5 mpg*
CO2 emissions: 94 g/km*
Top speed: 129 mph
Acceleration (0-62 mph): 10.5 seconds
Honda didn’t produce its own diesel engine, usually considered essential for success in the European market, until 2003 - although predictably, when it did turn up, it was 1 that set a very high standard indeed. That engine, which had a capacity of 2.2 litres, was subsequently replaced by another of the same size which has been the only diesel engine offered in UK market Honda cars.
While the 2.2 still does a pretty good job, especially in the latest version of the CR-V SUV, the centre of gravity, especially in the market for Golf-sized cars such as the Civic, has shifted towards smaller, lighter lower-emission diesels with a capacity of 1.5 or 1.6 litres, That’s where the big sales are. But Honda, absorbed in fascinating projects like the CR-Z, the only petrol hybrid model with a manual gearbox, and the brilliant low-volume hydrogen fuel-cell-powered FCX Clarity, failed to provide a diesel engine of that size - a big self-inflicted disadvantage, especially in the emissions and taxation conscious company car market.
Until now that is, because Honda has finally bowed to the inevitable and at last introduced its own 1.6. It appears first in the Civic but will also make its way into the CR-V next year. In both cases, it will slot in alongside the existing 2.2, rather than replace it. Like Honda’s original diesel launch back in 2003, the arrival of the 1.6 is long overdue, but history is also repeating itself in one other respect; the new engine makes up for its late appearance by leap-frogging much of the competition. That much is clear even before you try it – with a power output of 120 PS, CO2 emissions of 94g/km and combined cycle fuel consumption of 78.5 mpg, the new engine puts the Civic towards the top of the class for both power on the one hand and economy on the other.
And the on-the-road experience largely lives up to the promise held out by those figures. The new engine is smooth and quiet. There’s no real diesel clatter, but there’s a slight drone in the mid-range, and that’s about it. A stop-start system cuts the engine at rest and a smooth new six-speed manual gearbox makes the most of the power that’s available when you’re on the move.
The other notable thing about the new Honda diesel is that it’s very light for its type, which means that the Civic escapes that nose-heavy feeling that affects most other smallish diesel cars.
For the rest, the Civic is pretty much as before. Its unusual interior, in particular its split level, space-ship-style part digital/part dial-based instrument panel is a bit of an acquired taste, but this car is also, as the old estate agent’s cliché has it, deceptively spacious. In fact Honda reckons it provides more room for passengers and their luggage than just about any of its competitors, a claim that seems unlikely given the Civic’s distinctly flowing, unboxy appearance but which does seem less implausible once you start poking around in the luggage compartment and trying out the rear seat.
The new 1.6 diesel engine will provide Honda with a big boost, especially in the company car market, but now the company needs to turn its attention to another pressing issue. Like the other Japanese manufacturers, Honda has been caught napping by the European car-makers’ advances in the down-sizing and turbocharging of petrol engines in Golf-sized cars, and it has nothing to rival Ford’s 1.0-litre 3-cylinder EcoBoost engine, or Volkswagen’s 1.2 TSI power unit. But we know Honda is working on it and we know from past experience that in this area too, Honda’s effort, while late, is likely to be very good indeed.
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#3066
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
![what](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/what.gif)
I doubt it will make it to our shores.
![Why Me](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/whyme.gif)
#3067
אני עומד עם ישראל
That even looks really good! I bet it has superior ground clearance to the stupid Elantra
![:O](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/embarrassment.gif)
#3068
Senior Moderator
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#3069
You'll Never Walk Alone
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yea...few problems with having diesel here.. from http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars...diesel/4330313
1.) Diesel get taxed higher than gasoline in the US (opposite in Europe)
2.) Diesel is slightly more expensive than gasoline on average in the US (opposite in Europe)
3.) Diesel engines cost much more to manufacturer -> increasing overall vehicle price. The time it takes to "pay back" the $1500 to $3000 cost premium of a diesel engine with fill-ups at the pump, is very long at current U.S. fuel prices ($2.65). Consider a hypothetical $20,000 gas car that gets 30 mpg (3.33 gallons per 100 miles). Check the diesel engine option for $1500 and you'd see a 30 percent efficiency improvement (39 mpg or 2.56 g/100m). Over a 15,000-mile year, the diesel will save about 115 gallons. With our fuel prices, it would take more than four years to make back that $1500 investment. At six bucks a gallon for Euro diesel versus seven for gas, the payback is less than two years.
4.) According to Toyota, it's cheaper for them to develop a Prius hybrid system than a 50-state diesel engine. The opposite is true for Audi. In general, European makers are better at making diesel engines, while the Japanese are better with hybrids
5.) Reputation. Hybrid is considered as green for most. Diesel is considered as...not so clean. It will take time to convert people
6.) US emission regulations are stricter (i.e. The 50-state light-duty vehicle limit for emissions of nitrogen oxides is 0.07 grams per mile. In Western Europe, the limit is 0.29.)
Urea is usually needed. But that adds cost and a longer pay back period. My understanding is that the US regulations will get progressively even tighter.
1.) Diesel get taxed higher than gasoline in the US (opposite in Europe)
2.) Diesel is slightly more expensive than gasoline on average in the US (opposite in Europe)
3.) Diesel engines cost much more to manufacturer -> increasing overall vehicle price. The time it takes to "pay back" the $1500 to $3000 cost premium of a diesel engine with fill-ups at the pump, is very long at current U.S. fuel prices ($2.65). Consider a hypothetical $20,000 gas car that gets 30 mpg (3.33 gallons per 100 miles). Check the diesel engine option for $1500 and you'd see a 30 percent efficiency improvement (39 mpg or 2.56 g/100m). Over a 15,000-mile year, the diesel will save about 115 gallons. With our fuel prices, it would take more than four years to make back that $1500 investment. At six bucks a gallon for Euro diesel versus seven for gas, the payback is less than two years.
4.) According to Toyota, it's cheaper for them to develop a Prius hybrid system than a 50-state diesel engine. The opposite is true for Audi. In general, European makers are better at making diesel engines, while the Japanese are better with hybrids
5.) Reputation. Hybrid is considered as green for most. Diesel is considered as...not so clean. It will take time to convert people
6.) US emission regulations are stricter (i.e. The 50-state light-duty vehicle limit for emissions of nitrogen oxides is 0.07 grams per mile. In Western Europe, the limit is 0.29.)
Urea is usually needed. But that adds cost and a longer pay back period. My understanding is that the US regulations will get progressively even tighter.
#3070
Senior Moderator
Sure...but, in my opinion and what I've read, diesel >>>>>>>>>> hybrid.
Period.
Period.
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#3071
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I wasn't really saying if diesel is better than hybrid, or if hybrid is better than diesel. I'm mostly talking about the challenges in bringing diesel engines over for the long term, especially for companies that don't have as much expertise in it.
#3072
The Third Ball
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Diesel has become very popular in the states in the last couple years.
And its quite clean...CA emission has made sure of that.
Hell, even the engines last longer (less moving parts)
And when gas spiked at $5 gal here in CA, Diesel was cheaper than 87.
And its quite clean...CA emission has made sure of that.
Hell, even the engines last longer (less moving parts)
And when gas spiked at $5 gal here in CA, Diesel was cheaper than 87.
#3073
Chapter Leader (Southern Region)
These fuel efficient diesels aren't on our roads for political reasons. Hopefully someday we'll get them.
#3074
The sizzle in the Steak
^^ Plenty of German makes are building them and putting them on our roads
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#3075
The Third Ball
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#3076
The sizzle in the Steak
Plenty of diesels here and on the way.
2013 Diesel Cars in the USA: Here’s the Lineup
http://www.practicalenvironmentalist...the-lineup.htm
2013 Diesel Cars in the USA: Here’s the Lineup
http://www.practicalenvironmentalist...the-lineup.htm
#3077
Race Director
The really long term (20+ yrs) answer is some sort of diesel. When fossils get too expensive to burn in an engine, man made biofuels (not hydrogen, nor electric nor any other "green" alternative) will be the only alternative. Those typically will need a diesel cycle engine. The diesel markup is likely to become less as more makers use DI in the gas engines (take out the spark plug from a DI gas engine and you have a diesel engine) - the only extra is the NOX emissions reduction surcharge.
With Obama in for another 4 years it is unlikely the much stricter EPA mileage rules will be postponed/removed. To get thsoe kind of numbers (fleet avg of around 50MPG) diesel will have to be in the equation even before the above happens. This 1.6D will likely make it's way to NA in the not too distant future.
With Obama in for another 4 years it is unlikely the much stricter EPA mileage rules will be postponed/removed. To get thsoe kind of numbers (fleet avg of around 50MPG) diesel will have to be in the equation even before the above happens. This 1.6D will likely make it's way to NA in the not too distant future.
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#3078
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It really comes down to what each manufacturer is good at I think. Toyota and Honda will continue focusing on hybrids while the Europeans will focus on Diesel tech that will be future proof (i.e. pass future emission regulations without significant costs).
#3079
They say sales can triple. this will make it lower cost.
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/articles...-diesel-driven
Honda has certainly taught this new i-DTEC to take small sips from the fuel tank though. It returns 75mpg. This isn’t a figure taken from the brochure; I did actually see figures near to this on my test drive which was split between the motorway and winding mountain roads.
This diesel is extremely quiet too, thanks to some Honda-trickery in cleverly separating engine components that share the same resonant frequency. Additionally, there’s a lot of soundproofing between the engine and the cabin, and what’s more, inside there’s even a noise cancelling sound system, making this one of the quietest diesels to sit in and drive currently on sale.
Honda has certainly taught this new i-DTEC to take small sips from the fuel tank though. It returns 75mpg. This isn’t a figure taken from the brochure; I did actually see figures near to this on my test drive which was split between the motorway and winding mountain roads.
This diesel is extremely quiet too, thanks to some Honda-trickery in cleverly separating engine components that share the same resonant frequency. Additionally, there’s a lot of soundproofing between the engine and the cabin, and what’s more, inside there’s even a noise cancelling sound system, making this one of the quietest diesels to sit in and drive currently on sale.
#3080
Senior Moderator
Since we've digressed a bit onto the subject of Diesel vs Hybrid, here was an interesting head to head comparing the 2011 Volkswagen Touareg V6 TDI vs. 2011 Touareg Hybrid, albeit not a particularly mainstream vehicle.