DubPK

It's not just marketing, it's pricing. The marketing could be non existent and the natural comparison is still going to be the S4 because you can have it for the same amount of money, maybe a few thousand more with good options. "But DubPK all I can afford is exactly 52,000! I can't spend 55,000 on a the better Audi!!!" if 3,000 dollars breaks you then I have a news flash for you, you can't afford the 52,000 car either.

Anyways. There are other reasons to buy it, such as if you just like the TLX and want the slightly more fun version and don't care about overall performance but for many this thing has been a huge let down.

Shadow2056

So much truth.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

it'll be a great value proposition used in a few years tho!

F23A4

The only caveat to that is the possible context of beancounters at Honda who may have rejected the endeavor from the get go but then later handicapped development costs when corporate gave the go ahead for the project. Might be reaching here but .

leomio2.0

Honestly, 0-60 doesn't mean much to me, but it's an ingrained metric of performance. I think TH hits the nose on the head of why I'm so greatly disappointed in this car ... "just, ignore that Audi S4 overtaking you on the highway." The Type-S's 0-60 times, to me, aren't nearly as disappointing as its top end is. I hope a bigger turbo really wakes this thing up, but we'll have to see a) how much power this drivetrain can take, b) what the fuel system can cope with and c) how much the aftermarket is going to charge for a turbo upgrade seeing as the market will likely be quite small for people looking to swap out their turbo.

When all is said and done, it may simply be cheaper (and more reliable) to get an M340i and throw a tune on it. Time will tell, and hopefully it comes sooner than later ... since I'm an impatient SOB.

fiatlux

As someone already pointed out, this particular segment isn't as price sensitive as I think Acura was expecting them to be. Yes, there are people who are buying this car because they literally cannot afford an extra $50 on their monthly payments (see the FB group), but I'd expect most people who are financially capable of buying this car to not have that type of budgetary constraint. And because of that, it's hard to fight against the S4. I think the Type S felt more dynamic and was more entertaining to drive in the twisties than the S4, but the S4 feels (and is) faster. For a daily driver, I think I'd have to give the nod to the faster car because straight line acceleration is something you can use every day, whereas the handling is something largely relegated to the weekend. And as a weekend fun car, there's better cars, even within the same segment. You just have to pay more, but for folks forking over $60K (or $70K if you're paying ADM) OTD, an extra $5K or $10K is not going to break the bank. And if it does, those folks really should be reconsidering whether they can really afford this car.

Honda430

I hear where you’re coming from, but isn’t it a little early to make this declaration? It’s not like they’re having any trouble selling them at list or list plus. Maybe we should give it 3-4 months before it can be concluded that the car is a sales failure. At this point there simply isn’t enough data points to do so.

ELIN

Not only too early but we also won't be able to tell the TLX 2.0 sales from the Type S sales, will we?

Honda430

Absent Acura providing the data I agree. Same holds for any other car in that segment. I’ve not been able to find a breakout for any of the 6Ts from their 4T brethren. To be honest I don’t think it’s common knowledge as to how big that 6T $50k to $70k market really is. .

Kense

lmao

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

But everyone will claim these are not race cars. Oh well, I guess the SH-AWD or those fancy brakes didn't help either.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CSATPEZnp3Z/

For anyone that doesn't have IG
@BEAR-AvHistory If you weren't able to view it

BEAR-AvHistory

Its not a case if anyone will buy it, its a case of what a total con job it is. They will sell some already have based on the hype not the reality is settling in with some real Head to Head by Sam & TH with the bottom end of the German mid level performance cars. What happened to the guy here who said it will be the BEST IN CLASS with the best in class SHAWD? What happened to the guy who said it is really be underrated at 355BHP & will be 400BHP. What happened to the guy that said 5 second 0-60 were not real the car will do 4.5?

What happened to the guy that called out us "experts" as a derogatory term, when we said that car will not be competitive with the advertising targets? A number of us also it will not do well when matched head to head on a road course. Why didn't the YouTube clowns commenting on the great brakes say or maybe even know Acura has swapped pads on them. The YouTube bunch could not tell they were running performance pads. Acura had never had great brakes out of the factory with stock pads. Great calipers, BREMBO, yes when available, great pads no.

As for the size of the $50,000 to $70,000 market, I really hope that Acura was actually modeling the $46,000 to $50,000 market because they do not have a $60,000 or $70,000 car. A few more of these non Acura controlled tests & the big money generated by BS advertising & controlled events should be & will be History.

Rebates & discounts coming to a dealer near you.

Kense

Man I’m so sick of reading apologists saying it’s not a track car , stop testing it a track. Meanwhile Acura invites everybody to one of the most famous tracks in the world Laguna Seca to test the car LOL .

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

Only a few experts as keyboard heros sitting at their desktops with their Acura capes on. It's easy to cut and paste things from the interwebs to seem bright and make claims as if they got their hands dirty before. Funny the same ones have no build threads here or any credentials to back up their non sense ramblings.

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

Acura be like this:
Here jump in the TLX-S.

Journalist:
Who left this money here?

Acura:


Journalist:
Ah Gotcha Fam, say no more.

loki

I've heard that same argument/excuse since 2008. With the exception of RLX Sport Hybrid, every single car was over promised and under delivered. The 3 year Type S hype was the final nail in the coffin. They CGI'd a drift in Type S promo video. Tragicomical.

BEAR-AvHistory

Thank you When people looked at the specs, not the advertising videos, do you think anyone beside a very few questioned a 2 ton+ car with 355BHP advertised at a low 5500RPM doing the stuff they recorded? The TH guys are competent even if the COBRA scared them to drive pretty much any production car quite well. The guy was busting his butt trying to get the understeering S to drift & could not do it. Match that against what Acuta was showing in some of the videos. There are a few very long drifts in them, how did they manage to do that in a stock production car?

Kense

lol

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

I had a tard on youtube reply to my post about the TLX-S dynos at 284 wHP and he respond with 355**



There's your answer.

mike03a3

The magic of computer generated images.

jwtarbaj

So now TH are saying exactly what the naysayers have been saying. Acura marketed it as a world beater and it came in last place in class. Failure for Acura, huge disappointment. It's better than the standard TLX but a few mods to the 2.0T and it may be giving a stock Type S a run for the money.

KAZAL

[Well I'm waiting for all the Know it all that bet me and guaranteed me that the type S would be a 12 second car you clowns 🤡
I knew long ago this car would struggle to break 13.90s so far I have yet tonsee one break intonthe 13s at any local tracks 14..10 @103.9 is the best. So there you have it a nearly 60 k car to go 14s ... this will be a one and done as a total failure.. it's a PIG....

QUOTE=CheeseyPoofs McNut;16721266]The embargo ends at 9:00 Est - this stream goes live 10 minutes early. Have fun!!

[/QUOTE]

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

Well Acura is doing something people like… I called the dealer the other day to check inventory and all 11 type s vehicles have been sold with ADM fees. Unfortunately I don’t see this car going on sale anytime soon if the demand is that high. It’s still mind blogging that anyone one would pay a markup on a depreciating asset such as general release vehicle.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I think you're discounting the "gotta have it's"

some people just gotta have it...the latest and greatest from whatever brand.
wouldn't matter if it's from acura or not, some people just gotta have that freshest item.

at the current moment, it's not the value play. but in a few years, used type-s' will be the rage.

why did I pick a used acura rather than the competition, because a used acura is the value play.

F23A4

30+ years (and counting) of working in corporate America, I’m in the middle of this stuff everyday. Hence, my post.

someguy11

I think this is going to be a perpetual issue with the Type S. Even if it's rare simply for lack of production, having the Type S badge makes it special to many. Most of the people buying these aren't watching the scathing reviews like the one from TH, who as politely as possible, called it out for being a nice daily driver that happens to be too underpowered, overweight and lazy to be a real sports sedan. But the badge means it's faster and better than the regular TLX. If I were looking at an Advance and a Type S side-by-side, I know which one I would buy. Well, maybe not. It would be hard to spend MSRP or MSRP+ADM on this car. Fast forward 3 or 5 years, same two cars side-by-side, the Advance will be a dime-a-dozen premium/luxury/value family sedan, while the Type S will be a Type S.

Let's be real for a second. When I see 3G TLs on the street, I look at the rims or trunk to see if it's a Type S. And it's cooler to see ones that are than aren't. It's just a cooler, rarer car. No reason people won't be thinking the same thing as me with the TLX Type S in 10 or 20 years from now.

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

the got to have it applies to every brand no matter if it’s an Acura, bmw, Audi or Benz but those number still count and is driving up sales as evidence by Acura’s pervious months sale numbers. No matter if you dislike this car for its performance or not, Acura did make a well balanced vehicle that’s a blend of performance and comfort. Is it top in class… far from it. The tlx is selling and that’s all that matters hopefully before the numbers die down there would be a nice refresh in the making.

someguy11

I'm glad you said this, because I wanted to point out that while Hondacura has all the resources and capabilities to make a world beater, they consistently chose not to over the last 20 years. I think that's where the Type S disappointment comes from. The ads, videos, press releases, track events, etc. all pointed to this thing restoring Acura as a performance brand. Rather than hang with the S4 or M340i, it puts out lap times that barely beat a Golf and Miata. Ouch. But Hondacura couldn't care less about the drag races or lap times, they only care that it's selling, which frustrates a lot of former fanboys like me. The beancounters are winning the war with engineering over at the headquarters. I'd rather see it the other way around.

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

In this internet age people are watching reviews my friend it’s not like the average age of Acura owners are in their 70’s. And honestly watching someone review a car without you forming your own opinion is stupid. yes take what they say with consideration but form your own opinion and test drive the car. I would take a type S over a S4 any day but maybe not an S5. If that was the case I wouldn’t own half of the things I got now. Adavance vs a type s are two different models and reach two totally demographics plus at the rate that the type s is being produced the type s would obviously be more valued. 3g tl is nice but I won’t argue with a subjective opinion like that.

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

I still believe Acura has an excellent platform to grow on. Just look at how the m340l and the c43 transition. That c450 wasn’t a stellar car but now look it and it’s near the top of its class. Imagine if Acura reduced the weight and add it just a few extra horsepower and torque, this thing has the potential to be surpass the competition. Will that ever happen? Who knows but i never expected Acura to outperform much of the competition as they have a history of being conservative. I still think the type S is a better daily than the S4 even though it won’t out perform it.

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

When I do decided to take sleeping beauty out of her resting, I get a lot of people asking me what year my TL is. They are mind blown when I say it's a 2004. They think it's a new Acura but can't figure out what model.. It says a lot that a vehicle nearing 20 years old can turn more heads and grab that much more attention than something current other than the NSX. While truth me told, when I rented a 2020 NSX from Turo, it was sad to see how many people didn't know what it was other than a fancy yellow sports car.. It's sad the once well known king on top of the world to be unknown in today's world.

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

again, not impressed with the 3g tl. It’s nice but not striking as the current tlx which I think will age better in time. You’re car is clean btw.

but anyways, seeing some of the new prototype concepts of the A/S4 is already looking like the tlx when be behind again.

ELIN

Used cars are like wine. There are good years and bad years. The fact that the '21 Type S is barely better than the last Type S arguably makes the 2021 a "bad year" down the road. It's not competitive now and will be even less so a couple years from now when folks are considering it as a CPO.

I think Acura may have just killed the Type S legacy!

ELIN

You do know that the latest fully decked out A4 is faster and cheaper than the Type S, right?

djhtsx

iTrader: (2)

Is that the only thing that sales cars?? If you read my review on the previous pages you will see why I disliked a4. I’ve actually had more seat time with the a4 compare to all of these? Have you driven an a4?

ELIN

Not a recent A4. My last Audi was a 2015 A6 3.0.

Point is the Type S should have been faster than the car that is a direct competitor of the 2.0 TLX.

Shadow2056

Working in car sales:

Yes. The Type S should be a LOT faster than a direct competitor to it's slower little brother with a 2.0.

A lot of people don't pay too much attention to those kind of specs. They don't care about the 0-60. They don't care about the other car has 30hp more than this one. It's which one is a better value. How much more can they get for their money. All of us here, or most, are people who modify their cars so performance is a primary factor to us. It is a little embarrassing that Audi has a competitor to the TLX 2.0 that can beat the Type S. You tell a customer "This car can do 0-60 in 4.9 seconds", unless they bring up performance specs, they can care less about it's HP and 1/4 mile times. Comfort. Value. Looks. Not in that order.

Now here? Oh here, 95% of the people talking about the Type S are concerned about it's 0-60, it's weight, how much better it's competition is. Main thought is "I can get this more HP for $3-5k more, I'll get it."

With me. I'll never buy a Mercedes. I hate the way the dash and interior is set up. The only BMW I would ever buy is an F80 M3 because I love the looks over the 320/335i. Audi looks great. Performs great too! I'd love to have an RS3 or RS5. Would I get any of them over the Type S? The M3 I would. Not the others though. I like the look of the Type S better.

ELIN

Agreed that people want what they want. Which is the reason why the ADM is still in effect and not entirely killed off by a handful of YT videos.
The true victims are the ones that stuck with Acura all this time but forced to pay ADM to get what they want. The ADM is the price of Acura loyalty.

Kense

But the type s is supposed to be about performance. I don’t understand why some of you say people don’t care? Aren’t those the people who will buy the Regular A spec? It looks nearly identical. The type s was supposed to be for those who do care about 0-60 or speed etc. Acura said the type s will have blistering speed so why wouldn’t people looking at a type s care about that?

fiatlux

Some people just want the better or best version of a particular car, even if they have no interest in what makes it better. Although, that type of mindset usually leads them to BMWs and Mercedes so maybe it’s not as relevant for the Type S.