BDoggPrelude

Unfortunately they're not the RL wheels. They are 19" wheels. Another win for the styling team that makes sure Acura has the blandest wheels on the planet.

Timmy18

Direct Pictures. (Not all of them, but most important ones)

RLX:



Still no Exhaust!?!? >

Still no Exhaust!?!? >






Accord:


OOO













t8/s720/Accord%2520Camo7.png[/IMG]











Accord Coupe:











I posted Accord here too cause of their similarities.

oo7spy

Well, at least there is a place for fogs, and even better, the DRLs are in the bumper!

Timmy18

I think what you think are DRL's in the bumper is just a cheaper FogLight housing, used on the concept model. It could be DRL's but Honda isnt into the Bumper stuff. Not as much here in America like it is in Europe.

oo7spy

So what do you call these in the TL & MDX?

Timmy18

Ok well now I see it. I guess DRL's and Fog lights are all the same now. But the TL's and RLX's DRL's look to be turn indicators as well since they are amber. The TL has a regular housing under the amber lights and the MDX just has white ones.

Timmy18

As long as Acura and Honda doesn't start anything Nissan Juke - like on us, I'm cool.

CFoote

So can I ask a general question to my fellow Acura and luxury car fans?

Todays 'generic' cars, such as Camry's, Accords, Altimas, etc are becoming well equipped vehicles with a lot of luxury amenities -- things like climate control, NAV, heated seats, sunroofs, Xenon lights, wood trim, etc...

10-15 years ago a lot of these features were found only on higher end platforms and brands. Today these features are all becoming mainstream.

What is it that keeps us buying the higher end platforms? It is hard for me to justify the 50-60k of a new RLX when the majority of the features are found on a Accord, Camry or Altima. Yes, I agree the quality of the car is better on a RLX or higher end car, there's no doubt about that...but is it worth double the price?

Does anyone else feel the same way? The gap is not widening, it's narrowing IMHO...

Chris

PS This isn't to say I'm going to trade the RL and get a Camry, Accord or Altima...but the newer cars coming out are pretty well built with good materials and options.

oo7spy

The DRL and fogs are in separate housings within the same bumper cut out on the TL and previous MDX and are not used as blinkers AFAIK. It appears the RLX fogs may have to be to the inside of the DRL.

Timmy18

I feel the same way. What keeps me interested is the power advantages and styling over the more Basic models. But thats about it.. Sometimes I like saying I own a Acura.. But alot of people don't know what that is or means.

wstr75

Great question! Your observations can also be applied to cell phones, computers,cable/satellite TV access, destination vacations, clothing and just about every area that involves today's consumers. There is less and less "stuff" that shouts "WEALTH" that the average person cannot acquire. I have an iPhone 4S with all the latest features and many apps. So does another untold millions of folks who are are across the full range of tax brackets.

Like you, I think about this issue and increasingly find myself settling for the items that have 95% of the features rather than fork out an additional 20% in reaching for the remaining 5% luxury or utility features. There is another cross-current at work, too, involving the ability to add-on after market features that I want like navigation, specialty electronics, etc. It is getting increasingly harder for auto companies to distinguish/differentiate their products in the marketplace. Cars are becoming platforms that you take to aftermarket agencies to customize to one's taste.
wstr75

jhr3uva90

I agree. I guess that's why brands are so important to car consumers. A BMW might have the same features as another car, but it still a BMW, that will never change.

That being said, there are some features that don't "trickle down" so quickly. How many Hondas (or Acuras, for that matter) have the RL's SH-AWD? If I buy the upcoming RLX in the distant future, it will be because that car's engineers found a very clever way to have both 370 HP and 30 combined mpg, along with great handling.

oo7spy

Once again, if you cannot tell the difference between an Accord and an RL or if that difference doesn't mean anything to you, then you should not be buying an RL in the first place, and you are not part of Acura's target audience.

jhr3uva90

True, although many people who drive Mercedes can't tell the difference between a Benz and a Hyundai Genesis or Equus. Many people just know brands and that's it.

oo7spy

I will not deny the ignorance of people's faith in a badge. To be honest, unless your are buying a CLS, S-class, or fully loaded E-class, there isn't much difference between the Hyundai.

wstr75

My sentiments, exactly!

TampaRLX-SH

Indeed mid market and even entry market cars are making big strides with features and content. The high end market, while still introducing groundbreaking features and technologies, is a shrinking market further impacted by current economic climate.

But content does not alone make a great car. New cars are ultimately fantasy products. They sell mostly on perceived quality, status and promise of a particular ownership experience. Except for repeat buyers, you buy a new car with hopes and expectations it will deliver all that after the new car smell wears off. That is the risk we all take.

Though I can easily see the difference in an Accord vs. RL, or even more challenged comparison a TL SHAWD vs. RL, I can see where content and feature lists alone may serve to make them appear more similar than different (excluding the sport / luxury vs. luxury/sport comparo). I can see where impressionistic consumers have difficulty differentiating them and justifying the cost gap.

To further complicate matters, my clarity of this is based on more than initial impressions to buy one over the other. Only AFTER owning and driving the RL over time did it grow on me more after the sale instead of waning. Only AFTER owning the RL over time did I see the level of detail and thought that went into the engineering and materials. Only AFTER owning an RL over time did I find how amazingly well it wears. Only AFTER owning the RL awhile did I find how little maintenance and low cost to own it has been. And none of the attributes were on my radar when I decided to trade my TL for the RL. And none of those attributes were beholden with my TL.

Yes, brand perception and luxury attributes are mostly intangible. But the post purchase experience is certainly intangible to a buyer looking at a mid level car with latest technology and super quiet ride seemingly trumping the luxury model.

But I have yet been in a 6 year old Camry, Altima or an Accord (even TL for that matter) that has worn as well as my RL and pleases me as much after 6 years of ownership. No car I have ever owned after 18 months of wear compares (assuming all are equally cared for) to my 6 year old RL. No rattles, no squeaks, still buttery smooth, still tickle-my-ribs fun on a back road twistie and a mirror finish that looks like liquid glass. And yes, my RL still has a new car smell. There is something very timeless and Zen about this car and it is all very intangible. And I think that has what has been missed by those who dismiss the RL as sales reflect.

That said, the leap the RL(X) will make with S-SHAWD and likely some new features does have my eye. Whether it will be enough to make a $60K leap from my current RL.....well the jury is out. The luxury market may be shrinking, or at least consolidating and will have to make greater leaps with fewer models.

And if the consumer is a 'new car every 3 years' type, it would probably be wiser to aim for a loaded mid model or near luxury car. But the stats are we are holding onto our cars longer, in trend.

The RL(X) or any comparible car certainly has two very comfortable, beloved shoes to fill.

CFoote

I guess I should sell my RL tomrorrow! I feel slammed man! Not sure I agree with you there. Here is what I can see in the differences between the two cars:

1) Styling

2) Interior quality

3) Powertrain differences

That's not to say those are not big differences, however the mid-range sedans are becoming increasingly competitive with the features and amenities offered. I think the newer Camry has a 268hp V6 now? That's not too bad considering.

I realize you are a huge Acura fan and I think thats great (I'm actually a big BMW fan, owning a Z4M and a X5 with a V8 ). Back when I bought my X5 in 2001, there were so many things that differentiated it from the pack of SUVs out there. However, I continue to see strides in build quality, style, and value with generic cars like a Camry, Accord or Altima that are narrowing the gap between high-end luxury cars like an RL or a 5 series.

Whether you like it or not, it's great for the consumer as it puts pressure on the higher-end models to bring better innovation and technology. Let's just hope we see some of that along with some reliability!

Chris

neuronbob

I think cfoote presents a cogent point. However, the RL is about tech features that appear there first and eventually trickle down to the other Acuras, then Hondas.

370 hp with 30/30/30 mpg in a lux package with SH SH AWD (e.g. it's probably heavy) is an amazing achievement and just having that cool factor could be worth the price of admission for some. We'll see.

CFoote

BTW, I wasn't trying to slam the RL or any Acura -- I was simply making an observation that cars are getting good -- really good. I would have turned up my nose at what I think is a 'generic' sedan years ago -- now they are pretty well featured and provide a good value.

I, like the rest of you, appreciate good style and engineering (otherwise I would have purchased something generic) however the newer cars are impressive...

Let's see what the RLX retails for and let's get a year or two under its belt to see what its all about...

Sorry, didn't mean to derail the RLX discussion, but I think its an interesting point with regards to luxury cars in general...

oo7spy

It's the details that make the difference. The Accord is the car for the masses. It is built well enough, but cheap enough too, for everyone to think that they have a "nice" car but can also afford to drive it. However, does it have:
1) paddle shifters
2) 4 fully automatic windows
3) a motorized rear sunshade
4) 10 way power driver's seat
5) dual power seats
6) cooled seats
7) a motorized telescoping steering column
8) Xenon bulbs
9) AFS
10) SH-AWD
11) GPS climate control
12) dual climate control
13) BlueTooth audio
14) keyless start
15) parallel park assist mirrors
16) perforated leather seats that aren't crap
17) collapsible rear head rests
18) protected trunk hinges
19) 6 gears
20) CMBS
& 21) ACC?

While new cars may be "impressive" I think that is only compared to what they were before. So, they have improved; good for them. Still, a 2012 Accord is still not as impressive as a 1995 Acura Legend when it comes to the quality of the car and attention to detail.

If you are impressed with an Accord or a Camry because of the car standing alone and not because of what it was 10 years ago, then I understand why you wouldn't want to spend the extra $$$.



Oh yeah, one last thing. What's the difference between a BMW and a porcupine?

Ah, nevermind...

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

:cantbelievewearedefendingtheRLvsanAccord:

TSX69

Production-Ready Acura RLX Revealed in Patent Images

Acura’s push for more radical, independent styling could be over before it starts. These pictures, which were made public this week in a European design patent database, show an RLX sedan that’s been dulled down from the only slightly edgier concept version presented last April. The RLX will arrive in early 2013 as the replacement for the RL as Acura’s range-topping sedan.

The lower front and rear clips on (what we presume is) the production RLX have been changed from the concept car, with a standard rounded lower air intake up front and integrated exhaust outlets in the rear. These bookend a generally uninspiring shape, with the front looking rather like that of a current RL or TL, and the side and rear reminiscent of everything from a Lexus GS to a Chevy Cruze to a BMW 7-series.

Although Acura will undoubtedly promote the RLX as a fun-to-drive, high-tech showcase, the truth is that this car is aimed squarely at aging Baby Boomers. RLX customers are more likely to be cross-shopping the RLX with a Cadillac XTS, we think, than an avant-garde Audi A6. As such, Acura has said in the past that the RLX’s interior is significantly more spacious than in the company’s previous cars—despite its size, the RL has always had compromised interior packaging.

The only major U.S. auto show left on the calendar for 2012 is Los Angeles in November. Acura could pull the sheets off of the production RLX there, but an earlier non-auto-show debut is always possible.

getakey

I'm betting it looks better in person!

TampaRLX-SH

I like it. I still cannot say I lust for it. I think I still favor the elegant flow of the 2005-2008 RL whereas this seems to more obviously styling componentscopied from other cars.

I like the integrated exhuast in the rear, but looks copied. Although the front of the auto show model cried for something below the bumper, this looks to simple. I think it could have been more unique and elegant. Sexy LEDs could work, but maybe detract from the Jewel headlights as the signature.

Still I will look at in in detail and drive one before ulimately deciding.

TiggaMan909

^^^ I don't think that's in integrated exhaust. None of the spy shots have any exhaust tips showing. I'm thinking its just a reflector, similar to whats on the TSX.

Based on whats I've seen so far, it looks ok. Nothing jaw dropping about this. Over-hyped and under delivered in my opinion.

TampaRLX-SH

In the above post from TSX69 concerning the Patents...

The lower front and rear clips on (what we presume is) the production RLX have been changed from the concept car, with a standard rounded lower air intake up front and integrated exhaust outlets in the rear. These bookend a generally uninspiring shape, with the front looking rather like that of a current RL or TL, and the side and rear reminiscent of everything from a Lexus GS to a Chevy Cruze to a BMW 7-series.

TiggaMan909

haha, i stand corrected....

neuronbob

Still looks OK. I hope (but won't hold my breath) that Acura offers the auto show body kit package, minus the wheels, as an upgrade package. That'd be

lindros2

Yeah, so how many RL's did Acura sell last year? This year? 2010?

As a former TL, TSX, RL, RDX, and current MDX owner, I think your comment is idiotic.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

So you cut off the part about them comparing Accords to RLs and decide to call names then pick a fight out of no where?

Do you feel better now that you've showed your ass?...

neuronbob

OK, guys, time to calm down.

Serenity now! *breathes deeply*

It's only a car.

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

I'm good, just not sure the intent here

BDoggPrelude

I'm going to save most of my scrutiny until I see the new RLX in person but from everything I've seen thus far I would call it very underwhelming. I've been a Honda/Acura enthusiast since before I could even drive a car but they're starting to lose me. Almost every new or upcoming model is "evolutionary" rather than "revolutionary". They are so intent on resting on their laurels and it is going to be the death of them. Look at the new Civic, CR-V, RDX. If you have to actually pay attention to details to determine whether it is the new generation or the previous generation model something is wrong.

Companies like Hyundai and Kia are absolutely surging right now. The big three are making a big comeback. I think Honda will see their market share shrink drastically in the coming years if they don't change something. They can no longer rely on their history of reliability to sell cars. Almost all prospective new car buyers are drawn to a car first by its exterior design. The average consumer could drive a new Sonata back to back with a new Accord and hardly tell the difference in the way they drive. Options are similar between the two, (I think the Sonata is actually better equipped these days). And the Hyundai is a hair cheaper too. The main difference to the average consumer is that the Sonata is years newer in design. That's why car manufacturers completely redesign their models every 4-6 years but all of these "evolutionary" steps for Honda just mean their "new" models already look 5 years old before they even hit the showroom floors.

Honda can call it evolutionary all they want. I call it lazy. I think it's time to axe the entire exterior design team at Honda/Acura and start all over fresh before it's too late.

Who cares how well equipped and technically advanced the new RLX is. If the styling is so bland that prospective buyers never even take a test drive it's all for not. People have a lot of options in this kind of price range, they want the total package and I don't think Acura is going to deliver.

oo7spy

I am not sure what RL sales have to do with anything. Maybe you could elaborate on your insinuations?

While you're at it, answer me this. Why didn't you buy an Accord, CR-V, Pilot, or 350/370Z instead of the cars you chose?

What is the RL's target audience?

Why would Acura make a car that costs $20k more and sells in the single percents of Accord sales if they were trying to sell it to people who don't care about the differences?


The only problem I have with this post is that the Sonata looks terrible IMHO. I don't care for the Accord's tail lights at all, but the Sonata is an all around brown bag special.

Also, I don't think Honda sales will take that big of a hit. Acura, very possibly, but the people buying Hondas are not enthusiastic enough about cars to worry about the stuff you pointed out. When someone is going to spend $20k+ on a depreciating asset, they are going to go with what is familiar, not chance that much money on an up and coming brand. Still, that is all just my opinion.

TampaRLX-SH

I think the RL(X) does very well on the engineering and content side. It is a big leap with powertrain, lots of great feaures for the price point and even the contraversial FWD config brings in 4 wheel steer.

The styling is where it is most difficult to hit the home run. It can be very subjective. Or it can be risky to vulgar as was the power phlegm. The RL(X) is intended to appeal to a more conservative and sophisticated buyer, even if a smaller market. I think they recoiled from the beating they took over the power phelgm and excess of keen edge styling. But instead of risking a new design school theme, they took the safe route and watered it down while introducing design features already successful on other cars onto the RL(X).

AT least Acura finally ADMITS what a mistake power phlem was. I am still awaiting a written apology (on fancy paper with a wax sealed envelope).


"We concede that we went a little overboard at some points," Minami said in a recent interview. "We actually had pretty bad feedback on this initially from different directions. But we are not going to buckle under that pressure."

Read more: http://www.autonews.com/article/2012...#ixzz1yWjbGZcH

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

CFoote

But do all those features add up to a car thats worth 30k more? You tell me. Maybe to you it does, but not to everyone. Value is perception, and that perception is changing. If GPS controlled climate control and protected trunk hinges gets your heart thumping, have at it man.

BTW, thanks for throwing the jabs in, they are humorous Still in your 20s, 007?

Chris

P.S. The leather in Acuras suck.

oo7spy

$30k more? I bought my RL at 3.5 years old with 27k miles for $26k. The comparison I was making was to a fully loaded EX-L Accord V6 with Nav. If you want to go to the $30k price difference, that list goes off the page.

You picked two things in the list that aren't important to me, so to answer your question, "". However, there are at least 5 features on that list that do matter to me, so is the price worth it? Every bit.

Age is nothing but a number. Perception and wisdom are not always correlated with age. I missed the jab in my last post, however I can easily find yours. If you are talking about the joke, lighten up. I don't get offended when people ask me if VTEC didn't kick in, yo.

jhr3uva90

I have a 2005 Acura RL. Girlfriend has a 2005 Honda Accord. Yes, the cars resemble from the outside. However, I can tell the difference as soon as I sit inside her car. And I can REALLY tell once the car starts moving. Was it worth the price difference? Yup!