acura1972

Guys:

My 2010 RDX with 55k miles (not a typo only 55k lol) has started to make intermittent "whir" sounds -- it's so intermittent that the I've heard of it only 2x in the last month (first time was a month ago, last time was last Friday). I couldnt grab a video of anything as I was on the road the first time it happened and by the time I reached my destination, it was gone (prolly a good 1-2 minutes). Last friday was the 2nd time it happened but never thought of video-ing it (ugh!) but managed to pop up the hood on and identify it was somewhere near the serpentine belt area. It is gone again and I've driven over 100 miles on it so far and couldnt replicate it.

So far, my main suspects are either a) alternator, b) power steering pump/need a power steering flush/o ring leak or c) weak battery (causing more draw on the alternator -- does that make sense? - just a theory since my battery is now over 4 yrs old since last replacement and my wife had acura replace it then so I replaced an old acura battery with a brand new acura battery 4+ yrs ago)... Why do I suspect alternator and power steering pump, it's because it SEEMS, based on my read here in Acurazine, that both can cause this noise as shown by these videos/links...

Here's a video from a TL here that closely resembles the super intermittent whining sound that i cant seem to replicate now (it's sounded like this when it happened 2x in the past month) -- here's the link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tig...ature=youtu.be

However, upon further reading, from this link -- https://acurazine.com/forums/second-...ulleys-894015/

and I quote from further reading the thread: "Sorry, I didn't swing back around. After I got to the shop, they all agreed it wasn't the alternator. It was my power steering pump, even though it sounded exactly like the video. Thankfully the pump was fine, the fluid was just filthy. They flushed with new fluid and it's been perfect.

It's worth noting that mine was only happening in colder weather <15° F. It also steers alot nicer than it did before .

The power steering flush was less than $100, so I'll take that over a $400 for an alternator any day."

So, it seems like the sound could be either alternator or power steering pump. WHAT'S FORTUNATE OR UNFORTUNATE IS THAT I CANNOT HEAR IT ALL THE TIME AND THE TWO TIMES I HEARD IT ARE A MONTH APART and so far I can't seem to replicate it. Needless to say, there's no warning light on my dash (eg may not be a charging issue unless of course those indicators don't work as they're supposed to).

So, what do I do? I have 3 options I guess:
a) Take them to Acura and have them test all those 3 -- and hope for the best? (eg it'll probably guesswork for them too since the sound isn't happening all the time yet and most likely will not be there when I go there next week, if I decide on this option)
b) Wait further until that sound is constant on my vehicle (at the risk of breaking down in the middle of the road)
c) Replace battery -- assuming that the whir sound I hear is caused by a weak battery, if that is at all possible -- if that is a wrong hypothesis, then I'll just choose either a or b...

That intermittent whir sound that I heard from the past (similar to the acura tl video above - heck both videos above and in the link) happened both under idle conditions, turning conditions, low speed conditions BUT NOT HIGH SPEED CONDITIONS (eg maybe highway driving muffled it lol)

Many thanks! Bummed if it's the alternator since it's only been 9 yrs and 55k miles... but it is what it is...

thoiboi

take off the PS belt to rule that out. Then take out the drive belt and feel the alternator pulley to see if there's any extra friction.


9 years on an alt isn't too bad.. Get a DENSO replacement on Amazon or RockAuto.com and replace it at an indie shop/yourself to save some money.

acura1972

Thanks thoiboi... I'm not too well versed in these things..

If I take the PS belt out, how will I be able to rule the PS out given that the sound I heard is not happening now (eg it's intermittent and only heard it 2x in the last 4 weeks - last being last Friday, first being 4 weeks ago on a Monday... but it's similar/exactly as that sound / link in youtube for the TL).

I'm actually puzzled as to whether I should wait for the whir to be constant (rather than intermittent and happening weeks/month apart) before I purchase the alternator. However, I did read in this forum that some of these guys heard it as well then there was a traumatic failure thereafter (Eg no warning sign)... *puzzled*...

Net, based on your experience, are only the alternator/PS pump that would make such distinct "whir" sounds exactly as the video link posted? (65% of me says it's the alternator, 35% PS -- but if PS, then could be a flush needed, o ring replacement or entire pump...) Or should I go overkill and replace them all since it's a 9 yr vehicle anyway... along with the serpentine belt, I suppose and the water pump? (eg is this recommended or just flushing down $?)

Many thanks

Tomtwtwtw

If it were me, I'd start with the p/s fluid - even if it's not the source of the noise, it's still a past-due maintenance item. It's not just about the mileage - time definitely plays a factor, and at 10 years I'd definitely recommend some fresh p/s fluid. If you're feeling slightly handy, it's not hard to DIY and you'll only be out the cost of a few bottles of fluid and some rubber tubing. Easily under $20 and 30-45 minutes of your time to DIY. Otherwise just find an independent Honda / Japanese auto shop and get it done for $100 or less. If your alternator was really bad, you should get a low voltage dash light. If your battery is on its way out, you may notice the car turning over a little slower than normal on a cold start. 4 years is a good life there...I average 18-24 months.

acura1972

Yes, thank you for the suggestion -- it does seem like my PS fluids were NEVER flushed ever (though I read that some never do it either lol) - I kept all my records of maintenance and I don't see any done (eg warranty period at dealership and then after that) -- I guess if the maintenance minders never showed it to be changed, then im 100% sure I never did it since I only did maintenance minder items (and I didn't even do some if the minders showed up -- like rotate tires since I have them rotated and changed at Costco LOL)

I guess the indy shop may (hopefully) see, that if it's a PS issue, then they'll inform me, along with the flush (otherwise, the flush is pointless since later on I'll have to flush again, am I correct?)

Then next step is alternator test... and yes, the sound is so intermittent I don't hear it now, no low voltage dash light either... I do have the RDX service manual so I'll read up more on it but so far, I havent found it whirring all the time... (I got the service manual as a gift 9 yrs ago believe it or not and kept it ever since... 2 grey encyclopediaic RDX books)

I also read the alternator is not necessarily "mileage" dependent... And with winters here so cold and summers so hot, I guess that doesn't help...

acura1972

Ugh, I was in the process of ordering/checking an alternator replacement from rockauto (I want an original since based on what I read here in Acurazine, dont bother with non Acura parts)... Seems like it's NOT available in rockauto... any other suggestions ? (If it's stealership, so be it... I'd rather do it right the first time, if indeed alternator needs to be replaced)

https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...generator,2412

Tomtwtwtw

From my experience, alternators are not one of those things that starts to fade in and out - it'll go when it's ready to go.

In terms of the maintenance minder, it doesn't mention p/s or brake fluid in the regular pop-ups, but they are both items that should be changed every few years or so - more often if you drive a ton, but I'd say no more than 3 years (maybe up to 5 for the original fluid, but a little more frequent for subsequent changes).

acura1972

Thanks Tom! If this is the case then my alternator should have conked out already from the first time this whir sound happened... Hmmm... The first time it happened was around early March and over 1000 miles ago... Next occurrence was last Friday and none ever since... So from the second time it occurred to now, another 100 or so miles... Truly odd... Doesn't sound like it's a pulley eg the TL video link I posted is the exact/very similar whine sound... But in my case, so far, extremely intermittent.

I read about PS flush, seemed simple to do with turkey dropper etc... Will buy the PS fluid next, manual required only Honda PS fluid... Am waiting for the third time to happen and I'm going to take a video of it...

acura1972

Update: happened again, this time since I'm more aware what to look for I observed the following:
A) whir goes louder when I turn wheel while in park, but does not go away (but goes softer)
B) whir goes louder when I press on gas, even If not turning wheels
C) whir sounds like it's from top of area near serpentine belt and PS pump area versus the bottom.(where alternator) is located
D) nothing on the dashboard is lit
E) funnily, it occurred at exactly the same point as where it happened last week and at the same day/Friday at around the same time... I take that route everyday and there was no sound this week until today... Granted it was more traffic on the roads today so engine hotter???
F) ps reservoir was at min fluid level when cold. But now, after I heard sound, and checking it when I parked upon reaching destination, the PS fluid level is above MAX indicator on reservoir...
Is this enough to isolate it's PS? Or can still be alternator? I haven't had the chance to flush PS fluid since busy from the time I got the post... But maybe will bring to dealer since faster for them to do?

Tomtwtwtw

Do the flush, drive around the block a few times, and see if noise is still present. What you're describing definitely sounds like the pump, and the noise is more often associated with old, gunky fluid than an issue with the pump itself.

Quick steps (suggest Youtube search as well):

1. Lift front - ideally off the ground, but at least enough to pull most of the weight off the tires.
2. Pull p/s reservoir cap and use a cheap turkey baster or other syphon to pull as much fluid out as possible (at minimum, drain to below the return hose). Alternatively, you can remove the mounting bolts and try to pour out the cap into a cup. It's tight, but can be done.
3. Remove return hose and connect securely to some plastic tubing that flows to some container on the ground. I want to say it was 1/2" inner diameter, but I'd have to check what I have at home.
4. (best with 2 people) Start car and slowly turn steering wheel from lock to lock until no more fluid is coming out. Someone work the wheel and the other watches the fluid and makes sure nothing spills.
5. Re-connect return hose and fill with fresh fluid to the top line
6. Start car again (your new fluid will get sucked down). Slowly turn wheel again while keeping the fluid level between the min/max marks. Once the fluid level is stable and it's no longer burping out bubbles, cap it off and kill the car. You're all set.

acura1972

Thanks Tom! Here's the video -- I managed to upload it at home now... Sound is gone again!!! ugh... thankfully, now I have video... the sound in the video changes due to 2 things:

a) I turn the wheel from side to side -- left to right, right to left, while on park... (you can hear sound will change -- it starts with wheels straight and in idle position)
b) I also press accelerator but dont move the wheel (self explanatory -- the sound goes louder)...

Let me know if this sounds familiar or I am still barking at the wrong tree...

BTW, I'm not sure if i got enough video to see if my hoses/orings are leaking... but i think there's a hose that attaches to the reservoir thats in the video, not sure if that part is leaking or not...
Many thanks!

Tomtwtwtw

I can't view the video at the moment (stupid work internet filter), but both situations you're describing are in line with a pump that is struggling. Turning the wheel puts load on the system, and revving the engine spins the pump faster (regardless of load) since it is powered by the accessory belt. The fluid tends to thin out a bit once warm, so hearing it only on cold starts or cold weather is within reason. Most likely it will eventually be a constant noise if not addressed soon.

The hose itself is not likely to spring a leak, but you never know. Most common places for the p/s system to spring a leak would be at the pump or within the rack.

acura1972

Hi Tom

Actually, the 3-4x the sound happened so far in a span of one month (with today being the latest) happened only after the engine was warm... when cold, it's nothing...

I managed to finally get a video as the sound was still there when I reached the destination, so fortunately, I have audio/video... I will do the PS flush first since thats the easiest, but I dont have wheel jacks to lift car, would just using a turkey baster and refill numerous times, suck and refill do the trick eventually?

Let me know what oyu think when you get to see/hear the video...

many thanks and have a great weekend! now time to buy a turkey baster and genuine acura PS fluid....

acura1972

also, now im kinda worried if i havent flushed for 9 yrs already and it's at 55k miles, and im just doing it now, will my PS pump have been compromised already? anyway, noise is so intermittent (3-4x in the last month) so hopefully it's ok and not too late for me to flush it... i truly was ignorant about such flushes... hopefully a not too painful way to learn...

acura1972

Update: bought a) Acura PS fluid, 3 bottles... b) Turkey Baster, c) Lucas Oil PS fluid with "sealer"...
Done so far: suck and fill PS fluid acura... 3 bottles worth... the whole system is 0.9L per Service manual... Reservoir capacity is 0.3L... havent placed in Lucas Oil but will do so if whir/whine persists... So far, so good, but since my whir/whine were intermittent to begin with, with it occuring at least 1-3 or 4 weeks apart from before, will post any new updates...

PS fluid sucked out was, uhhh... dirty lol... dark coffee is how I'll describe it lol. no metallic bits nor any bits, just straight fluid that looked nasty... given this just a few questions:

a) do i have to do coolant and transmission change then? maintenance minder has not called for changes in such -- 55k+ miles and 9 yrs vehicle... what about brake fluid? (not sure if and when i did all those, but if no maintenance minder, i dont think i/dealer or my mechanic would have done it)

Thanks a bunch!

thoiboi

Brake fluid needs to be done every 2-3 years regardless of mileage due to it being hygroscopic and attracting water.


PS Fluid should be done every 30K miles or so.

Coolant can wait until you do your Timing Belt.


I would have skipped the Lucas snake oil additive.. unnecessary.

Tomtwtwtw

Timing belt?

Also, if you're on original coolant at 9 years, change that asap regardless of mileage.

acura1972

I thought RDX uses timing chain which needs minimal change/maintenance...

As an aside, I guess maintenance minder is useless for coolant changes (never got the minder for that so far thought it was a "5" service). Will just get both coolant and brake fluid flush done. Anything else needed at 55k miles and 9 yrs worth of driving? Transmission?

Fwiw, since rear differential comes up on the minder, I'm sure I've done that (or at least the dealer has done that lol). I just relied on maintenance minder and brought it to dealer to assist me as I'm now a car audiophile... Dealer, it seems, as never inspected any of the fluid for changing recommendation... Will bring it to independent mechanic from now on... Thanks guys...

Tomtwtwtw

Correct on the timing chain, that's why I was questioning that particular comment. And coolant does show up as #5 on the maintenance minder, but I doubt that it's time-sensitive, so someone that drives very little may not see it light up. I have a 2010 at 156k miles, and I think mine lit up one or two cycles ago - I'd have to check my log to see when exactly. At 55k you probably have not yet triggered a transmission service either (my first transmission service popped around 90k miles). Not 100% on differential service (I'm FWD), but I think it pops a little more often, but it's definitely possible that you're on original fills for both. That said, your other gear oils don't degrade the same way that coolant does, and because those units are sealed very well, changing them out based on time vs mileage isn't as critical as coolant. Still, with so few miles, it wouldn't be a bad idea if you're planning to keep the car for a while.

If it were my car, I'd get coolant, brake, tranny, and differential (unless recently completed) done at the local shop. The shop by me would charge me 250-300 for all 4, but of course YMMV. Assuming you're still at a ~5k miles per year pace, I'd probably adopt the following maintenance schedule:

Once a year (unless prompted sooner) - oil change, check filters
Every 3 years - brake fluid and coolant
Every 5 years - transmission, differential, power steering

Engine air and cabin filters probably every 5 years as well, but more often if you're in a really dusty area.

acura1972

Thanks Tom! You were the one who advised on PS fluid which helped! I'll do the rest next week! So did I get right? In order of sensitive fluids, coolant is most needed to change and then brake, tranny and PS? I'm sure differential was done twice already so I think at 55k I'm good on that

PS of course oil is most impt every year but that is on the owner's manual actually... PS tranny and coolant are not mentioned at all in owners manual hence I was confused

Tomtwtwtw

I wouldn't say any one fluid is more critical than the other - they all have the potential to leave you stranded if neglected (ok, maybe power steering will just ruin your day and give you Popeye's forearms if you ignore it too long). But certainly different fluids have different change intervals that depend on a combination of time, mileage and driving style. Knowing that helps you find an effective schedule for each that also helps avoid changing some fluids too often, which is just a waste of time and money.

The MID is certainly useful because it factors in more than just miles, but it's still based on someone that drives near the average of ~13-14k miles per year. If you're way above or way below that, you should alter your maintenance schedule accordingly. For example, if you have a highway queen and drive 50k miles per year, you can probably get away with coolant and brakes every other year (100k miles), but maybe your transmission and power steering will be every year or even more often.

acura1972

Ok thanks, I'll follow you guidelines then for non mentioned item in owners manual like PS fluid, tranny and coolant... I'm surprised that Honda didn't take low mileage drivers into the computer/owners manual... A line or two printed on the manual would have saved someone not well versed in these things some panic grief when the whine on the PS happened (how this post all started!) Lol. Manual was silent on PS fluid too! How was I supposed to know? Lol. Anyway, I'll ignore maintenance minders for transmission and coolant from now on and just changed based on years... Thanks again! This thread can be finally closed

CSmoney28

Don’t forget the spark plugs and ignition coils!

acura1972

Thanks, at what interval should I change? I thought I read that maintenance minder pops up for spark plugs... my vehicle currently has 55k+ miles so am not sure when I should change them too... also do you suggest do everything at once or a few at a time? eg coolant, spark plug, coils, etc etc etc -- at this rate, vehicle needs a major overhaul lol

CSmoney28

I usual do a couple things with each oil change for a budget reason. If I do it all at once it will put me in a hole 🕳.

Tomtwtwtw

Plugs should be fine to 100k unless you do a *lot* of city driving and idling. Really, highway-heavy cars can likely go 150k+ on a set of plugs. I personally wouldn't change coils unless they are bad, and you'll know if one goes bad (lower rpm/high load misfires often point to spark/coil issues). Had to replace them on my wife's Fit - both of her Fits actually - but bad coils are a common issue on those cars. But as preventative maintenance...I feel like it's a waste of money. I'm closing in on 160k, still on original coils and 2nd set of plugs.

CSmoney28

I just recommend it when you already have them out because you’re doing the spark plugs. Also, mileage isn’t the only factor for changing things, age is as well.

BuiltRDX

Just as an update to this thread for anyone that looks this up later and after watching the video the op posted what needed to be replaced here was the PS feed and return line o rings on the power steering as well as the fluid. This happens on honda/acuras all the time and its a very simple fix for only a few dollars.
Part #'s are
91345-RDA-A01
&
91370-SV4-000

These will cost you about $3 from any local honda or acura dealership and they will always have these in stock. DO NOT buy these from amazon or ebay they are always knock offs and always too small. The red one goes on the black tube on the bottom (connected to the reservoir) and the black o ring goes on the high pressure upper tube. Its as simple as removing the 10mm bolts and pulling the hose out of each, using a small flathead and getting the old one off and put the new one on and reinsert. The bottom one reqiures that you move your coolant overflow to get better access at the bolt. As long as you replace them fast enough you wont even need to add more fluid (op) since you already changed yours out. Anyone else needs to use the turkey baster method to change fluid. After your done turn the steering wheel lock to lock a few times while holding revs at about 3k rpm to bleed the air out. I just did this myself and had the same noise and took a video on the subject but havent uploaded it yet to youtube. When i do ill edit or update with a link.

CSmoney28

Thanks for the info

acura1972

Thanks for the info... Hmmm... I'm not too well versed in these things -- maybe I should just ask my mechanic to help me out change this the next I bring my vehicle for A or B service... I'll order these parts before hand and show him this thread... As an update, so far so good on what I've done (eg change fluid using turkey baster) so I dunno if I have to change the o-rings... either way, good to hear it's a quick easy fix (though since I'm not handyman on vehicles, I will just have someone else do it)... Obviously if the sound comes back again, I'll have to do it ASAP, for now, I will probably just wait for another few months to just do it all at once with what I think is a B service due anyway... Thanks for the additional insight. As an aside, how did you find out these were the culprit parts and not just a dirty PS Fluid?

Steve1

It's a well known issue with a lot of Hondas and Acuras. The fact that it was occurring when it was colder outside is indicative of the problem. The O-rings shrink with the cooler temperatures, and the pump starts to suck in some air causing the groaning and whirring sounds. It is probably the easiest and cheapest DIY fix you can do for your car.

BuiltRDX

Replied to your PM man and like Steve1 just said its extremely common on all honda acura vehicles starting around 150k or so you always tend to see these o rings start fatiguing and or failing and letting air in on heat cycles and thus need to be replaced. Being such a cheap fix and easier of a lot of things it tends to be a DIY type of job if you have the knowledge in locations and such.

Steve1

Different Acura, but same idea:
Not a hard job at all.