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Yeah, so "worthless" that their data analysis gets cited by the WSJ, NYTimes, Consumer Reports, etc.
Which of the like publications cite your idiotic cherry-picking of a couple of data points (from one market)?
Meanwhile iseecars analyzed 6.5 million vehicles to come up with their data set on depreciation.
Plus, a # of us also cherry-picked used RLXs with ridiculously low resale value (did you just convenientlying FORGET about them like you usually do? ).
And speaking of Consumer Reports, CR's survey in 2019 found that 50% of RLX owners were not satisfied with their purchase - good for 9th highest LEAST satisfaction rate.
But hey, at least it wasn't bad enough to finish in the #1 spot which was taken by the ILX (are you now going to claim that CR's data is "worthless" as well?).
Much less data with regard to ATP and incentive spending which is actually much m important to auto makers.
RLX resale value is comparable to other luxury vehicles sedan in that price range . Infact MMC RLX surpass the BMW and MB.
Sorry, but that's simply not what the data says; sure, there are some German models which are just as bad, but the Germans don't care (since their vehicles actually sell/lease).
ts individual dealers that are dumping Genesis at far below Acura prices.
Not true at all (not that Acura competes head to head with Genesis),
.
If anything, prospective buyers have been complaining about the lease rates compared to BMW and MB.
Did you already conveniently FORGET the data I had provided on incentive spending as a % of ATP?
Where Acura's is HIGHER than Genesis despite Genesis still lacking CUVs.
And esp. since one can get a well equipped MDX for thousands cheaper than the Telluride SXP.
Acura is hardly made in Japan. I am sure Honda Japan has its own products and they make there own standards of money. They are not going to dump critical R&D resources on worthless RWD sedans.
Acura isn't made in Japan for the most part because there is NO market for their vehicles in Japan.
Honda Japan mostly sell tiny vehicles with small margins.
Even something the size of the Civic is being canceled in Japan due to low sales.
Meanwhile, the full size Grandeur is the best selling vehicle in Korea and the G80 is in so much demand that it actually outsold the Sonata.
1/3 of Overseas sales of H/K group comes from US market. It shows you were talking non sense from begining that H/K group is less exposed to US market than Honda. How many Lies i catched? Honda is least exposed to US market as Honda is big in bike market in Asia. Honda is big in China. Honda is big in domestic Japan. Honda is least exposed to French controlled EU who want to throw all asian products from EU/Africa/Middleast. As i said you live in lala land. Never second guess Honda business and product strategies.
Aside from their domestic market, H/K have sizable market share in Europe, India, Russia and Brazil, as well as smaller but still sizable markets like Canada, Australia, Mexico and the Middle East.
Honda pretty much has the US and China (even in Japan, they only sell small vehicles with small margins) and some presence in SE Asia, along with Canada and Mexico (where H/K) outsells Honda).
Aside from desperation, why are you bringing up motorbike sales?
Are we supposed to count Honda lawn mower sales as well? Lol
And gee, isn't the RLX CANCELED (despite the "savings" from being FWD)?
Meanwhile, the G90 is still going, with not only a new model in the works, but Genesis get closer on deciding on doing a G90 flagship CUV.
Meanwhile the MDX is in a battle fighting off the top trims of the Telluride and Palisade.
which one you will want to drive?
Easy, no question the G90 (esp. the FL model).
The RLX doesn't even compete in the FLAGSHIP class and it rates among the bottom in the mid size class.
Plus, it's ugly, its dash design is a mess and doesn't have nearly the interior appointment of the G90, much less the ride quality.
Unlike for the RLX, G90 owners have a high owner satisfaction rate.
Yeah, so "worthless" that their data analysis gets cited by the WSJ, NYTimes, Consumer Reports, etc.
are you sure those WSJ/NYTIME or Consumer reports fact check data from firms. infact I will be weary from computerized data collection methods from digital firms. As digital firms are most depended on virtual products.
Honda does not play this virtual games like Tesla or copy cat brands like Hyundai.
Did Honda ever announce free maintainance or long warranties like Genesis/Hyundai?
Honda/Acura does not want to devalue there brands. That is reflected in lease rates. and that lease rates are reflective of the Luxury car value. Not some worthless ATP figure that you pull out from behind.
Did they tested MMC hybrid vehicle? https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/acura/rlx/ A high point is the smooth, responsive 310-hp V6 engine. Our tested front-wheel-drive model averaged 23 mpg overall with the old six-speed automatic transmission
This is called Data. of 2014 PRE-MMC. Its quietness is second to none. https://www.edmunds.com/acura/rlx/20...st-specs1.html
Sound level @ idle (dB) 39.0
@ Full throttle (dB) 70.8 @ 70 mph cruise (dB) 60.3
Engine speed @ 70 mph (rpm) 2,150
Post real world test datas. Not worthless opinions from anonymous surveys.
LOWER ATP (the gap will only widen) and greater incentive spending as a % of ATP for the Acura brand.
Worse resale for the RLX as well as having one of the LOWEST owner satisfaction rates.
The RLX being CANCELED - all facts which you cannot change despite what you continuously claim.
C/D ranked the RLX 15th in its midsize rankings and they referred to it as the "wallflower").
The G80 is ranked 10th, but the new model should leap into the top 5, maybe top 3.
The G90 is ranked 4th (actually 3rd since they count the AMG seprate from the regular S Class) in the flagship segment, ahead of 7 Series, LS 500, XJ, the Quattroporte, among others.
Both the G80 and G90 (as well as the G70) have been a C/D Editors' Choice list.
The RLX nor the ILX have ever made that list; not sure about the TLX.
The RLX can't touch the G90, much less the new G80.
Owners on the Lexus forum have discussed in length how the G90 is a threat to the LS; meanwhile they see the RLX as a complete joke.
You can continue to make false and misleading claims about Acura sedans, but the fact remains that the highest sedan remaining in Acura's lineup is the TLX which is an entry level/compact segment competitor.
Acura has failed and is no longer trying to compete in the mid size segment, and they have never competed in the flagship sedan segment.
LOWER ATP (the gap will only widen) and greater incentive spending as a % of ATP for the Acura brand.
Worse resale for the RLX as well as having one of the LOWEST owner satisfaction rates.
The RLX being CANCELED - all facts which you cannot change despite what you continuously claim.
C/D ranked the RLX 15th in its midsize rankings they referred to it as the "wallflower").
The G80 is ranked 10th, but the new model should leap into the top 5, maybe top 3.
The G90 is ranked 4th (actually 3rd since they count the AMG seprate from the regular S Class) in the flagship segment, ahead of 7 Series, LS 500, XJ, the Quattroporte, among others.
The RLX can't touch the G90, much less the new G80.
Owners on the Lexus forum have discussed in length how the G90 is a threat to the LS; meanwhile they see the RLX as a complete joke.
G90/G80 are not threat to any one except Hyundai finances. Keep investing in that worthless uncompetitive platform with worthless ranking with no Test data to back it up.
RLX cancelled because of Honda restructuring in Japan. No point in building vehicle there on old platform and re-export it.
American Acura is going in different direction. It will have its own competitive products. first medium size and than compact sedan. than further SUVs and Tesla like flagship.
Honda pretty much has the US and China (even in Japan, they only sell small vehicles with small margins) and some presence in SE Asia, along with Canada and Mexico (where H/K) outsells Honda).
Japan market has different taste. They get there own volumes. Mexico is export based for Honda.
Honda to Invest $360m in Indonesia by 2022 In its first year of operation, the company recorded total car sales at just under 22,000. Last year the number rose to 199,364, accounting for 19 percent of Indonesia's car market. Honda's success in Indonesia can be attributed to the introduction of several new car models, such as the Mobilio, BR-V, HR-V, Jazz, Brio Satya, Brio RS and the CR-V.
"With the highest [domestic] market share and the fourth highest sales in the world, Indonesia is one of the most important markets," Uchida said.
I put a link of Honda Connect R&D venture in China. you didnot respond to that link. . so better withdraw from this thread with dignity before further embrassment.
https://news.ru/en/technologies/huaw...pment-centers/
Once Hyundai is thrown out from Chinese market. you are pretty much done in rest of the world as next generation vehicles will depend on connectivity and independent data.
@YEH you're engaged in an argument with an ignorant, stubborn person (that I'm convinced is nothing more than a troll). You'll keep going around in circles with him. It's best to just point and laugh at his stupidity instead of wasting your time writing a well thought out response.
@YEH you're engaged in an argument with an ignorant, stubborn person (that I'm convinced is nothing more than a troll). You'll keep going around in circles with him. It's best to just point and laugh at his stupidity instead of wasting your time writing a well thought out response.
she cannot ignore it. It has been years she showed up every month after sales figures.
than start polluting BS about RLX resale value.
It is not a rocket science showing him the stale designs of Genesis.
@YEH you're engaged in an argument with an ignorant, stubborn person (that I'm convinced is nothing more than a troll). You'll keep going around in circles with him. It's best to just point and laugh at his stupidity instead of wasting your time writing a well thought out response.
No worries cd - am well aware that he is the resident troll, but just like toying with him (still can't get my gender correct despite having informed him numerous times which is par on course).
Edmunds has the private party price of a base 17MY RLX only $2k more than the base G80 of the same year, which isn't good since the RLX starts at $7k higher.
Another auto data analysis company, CarEdge, has the current price of a 17MY RLX that listed at $59,109 all the way down to $26,318.
Yeah, I know these data sets won't change the mind of someone so delusional that he claimed that Honda wanted to keep RLX sales low for the "exclusivity" factor. Lol
He's still trying to make his asinine arguments despite the RLX (and not the G80 or G90) being canceled.
The G90 has been very profitable for Hyundai (will surpass 100k units before the next gen model arrives); there are variants like the Stardust edition which goes for $111k, and that's not even a LWB version of the G90.
Despite having already explained this to the troll, still doesn't understand that the cost of a RWD platform is spread out across numerous models, garnering economies of scale.
The GV80 and GV70 (and likely a GV90) joining the G90, G80 and G70, as well as the K9/K900 and Stinger (Kia is contemplating doing a lux CUV as well).
Not to mention garnering a higher price point.
The MDX starts at $44.5k while the GV80 starts at $49k.
For the 1Q, Acura's incentive spending avg'd $5,523 per vehicle according to kbb.
Considering that ATP during that time was $40,307 - that's a big chunk.
first You cannot compare the starting price of MDX which is based on old platform and 25 years old engine to new vehicle with still in opening deposits. where are the on the Road pictures of GV80 in consumer hands despite creating hype for Six months?
. if you are not stupid and can read dimensions. The next TLX is wider and has longer wheel base than current RLX. This give you idea each vehicle going upscale in line up. TLX is US made so more easy to invest in it in domestic market.
Your entires Genesis brand monthly sales are less than TLX sales.
There is nothing special about Genesis resale values.
Genesis are the low quality fit and finish stale designs. and i am sure next generation will be the most unreliable vehicles in there class once out of warranty.
The RDX is making good $ for Honda, the rest of Acura's lineup - not so much at this time.
how do you know which car is making money? or another random number pulled out.
The only car that is making money with Acura badge is RLX. it has Japanese industrial efficiency behind it. thats the reason the Cheapest Hondas/Toyotas had rear cameras, push button starts and 8 airbags decades ago in Japan.
As i said a some people cannot be educated. The Current RLX is related to JDM Accord/Euro Accord/Spirior platform developed in early 2000. That R&D done that point of time and than much later SH-AWD introduced in MDX/TL. Now that factory workers are reconfigured for other products. The price point Japanese can make money is much different than what US factories do. Some decisions are political to favour big markets like China and US in terms of factories.
That $5 to $10k incentive dont matter in big scheme of things from MRSP. when MRSP of older RL is 50% higher than TLX.
Keep playing around with low grade Genesis. as you have no understanding of high quality product.
As i said a some people cannot be educated. The Current RLX is related to JDM Accord/Euro Accord/Spirior platform developed in early 2000.
Which is exactly the POINT of why Acura struggles to sell vehicles (particularly sedans) at higher price points, and why its ATP is $10k lower than Lexus, Genesis and even Infiniti. (and the gap will only grow with Genesis as they add CUVs).
The Aviator has an ATP just under $76k; you think the MDX's ATP is anywhere close?
And if it is so cheap to develop the RLX, along with it having a fat profit margin, - then why did Honda discontinue the RLX with NO plans for a next gen model? Lol
Because it so good with best tires and Higher ride height than competition. Honda engineers are best in world and were bored, so they cancelled it to keep crap Hyundai and Genesis guessing. Factory workers had bionic arms attached to belly buttons so they build other things. Like world best generator. No incentives! But 10k incentive sometimes. Only because car sell so well!
Your stupidity have no bounds. Honda has more plans for factory that built Acura RLX. They already recoup from that platform over decades. it has nothing to do with US market.
TLX much cheaper built here as it will be sharing engine with RDX and MDX. TLX is now the new RLX for now. untill Honda built next generation electric vehicles.
The lease of RLX is not cheaper than BMW or Audi. Honda/Acura not losing money as RLX has strongest resale values in its segment.
Infiniti and Genesis are at bottom of heap. So dont BS around ATP values.
Genesis also has to pay for free maintainance and longer warranties .
Your stupidity have no bounds. Honda has more plans for factory that built Acura RLX. They already recoup from that platform over decades. it has nothing to do with US market.
TLX much cheaper built here as it will be sharing engine with RDX and MDX. TLX is now the new RLX for now. untill Honda built next generation electric vehicles.
The lease of RLX is not cheaper than BMW or Audi. Honda/Acura not losing money as RLX has strongest resale values in its segment.
Infiniti and Genesis are at bottom of heap. So dont BS around ATP values.
Genesis also has to pay for free maintainance and longer warranties .
Think the people here know who has been the epitome when it has come to stupidity.
Even when accounting for decades, not going to recoup when there are little by the way in sales.
It costs $ to engineer and tool for a different size platform (which is why Toyota didn't bother to extend the WB for the RX-L), much less tooling overall (which is why GM imported the Envision from China rather than tool a factory here despite projecting 40-50k in annual sales).
Of course Honda has plans for the factory capacity that was taken by the RLX (can't leave capacity idle, not that there has been the need for much production of the RLX), but if the RLX had been selling in any sort of volume, there wouldn't be a need to find something to take its place as the RLX (according to you) is supposedly one of their higher margin models (it should be by virtue of being the "flagship" sedan).
So, if it were selling better, Honda would be keeping it around.
ATP is what it is - there is NO denying that unless one is actually stupid.
So a vehicle that starts at $33k is the RLX replacement? LMAO!
Now, you're being even more desperate than usual.
Having a $33k sedan be your flagship sedan is being at the bottom of the heap.
Considering that the Q50 will be Infiniti's flagship sedan, guess Acura has company (at least the a Q50 starts at $3,400 more than the TLX), and Infiniti sells a decent amount of the 67k+ QX80.
Acura is more apt to be compared to Buick than the Germans (and why something like the MDX is being threatened by the top trims of the Telluride and Palisade).
have you travelled around Europe. There BMW 5 series and MB E class priced closer to Honda Civic . Honda CRV is more expense than BMW X3. starting prices have nothing to do with flaghsip.
Acura NSX starts at $150K and end up at $250K. 70% price variation very normal. If TLX start at $35K and end up at $60K. there is nothing odd about it.
The same factory produced Honda Inspire/Acura TSX/ and Honda Legend. Each of the cars were dropped with time.
Acura TSX was dicontinued early 2014 for US market and but it was sold in various places untill middle 2015. Alot of components have long lead times and each has separate manufacturing bays. and some time new model development take too long so there is no replacement to build new model. so they continue with the current model. now they have much bigger TLX coming so no need to continue with RLX with similar size car.
It is used for all high end R&D. now Honda China has become alot bigger in sales. so they have much more high end R&D going in networking and connect services.
you should worry about Hyundai that is thrown out from Chinese market just like Samsung and stop worrying about RLX and Honda. They know what they are going.
Hyundai/kia SUVs cannot match low grade built Honda Pilot/Passport sales. Next MDX is not bothered by it.
So not only did Genesis in Korea OUTSELL Acura in the US, it was at a significantly higher ATP with fatter profit margins.
And let's not even talk about Europe where Honda is a non-entity.
Wouldn't be surprised if Honda in Europe under-goes a restructuring like it just did in Australia, slashing the # dealerships and reducing the # of models sold.
Meanwhile, when Hyundai and Kia each get their BoF pick-up and SUV, they will be able to threaten Toyota for the sales crown in Australia, as well as vastly increasing sales worldwide.
Again. why would Honda make dedicated platform to sell 15K vehicles whose resale value will crater at end of lease. You are bringing worthless examples from Korean domestic market.
Genesis are RWD while Hyundai are FWD.
The fact of matter is that Honda revenues are twice of H/K group. Honda is demolishing Hyundai in China market which will have Global impact.
Honda does not give long warranties nor free maintainance. Try buy extended warranty from Acura dealer to 100K miles on $50K vehicle. It add $3K to purchase price. Honda/Acura cars lasts longer thats why dealers always have work.
Honda bike sales are reaching in millions in rest of the world. Acura can afford its dealership network in US.
Australia is very small market. and Australian dollar has depreciated. It isnt even profitable.
You got NOTHING and you know it, which is why your attempts have gotten lamer and more idiotic.
Don't know why you keep on posting pics when everyone already knows what the RLX looks like (not exactly the type to win design awards), but then again, it has long been one of your strategies to deflect and obfuscate.
I had to confirm with google, but 99 billion is in fact not 88 billion multiplied by two.
Honda/Acura cars lasts longer thats why dealers always have work.
Translation: Hondas and Acuras are in the shop often (which is true)
Honda does not give long warranties nor free maintainance. Try buy extended warranty from Acura dealer to 100K miles on $50K vehicle. It add $3K to purchase price.
Translation: Honda/Acura do not stand behind their product. And when they do, they make sure it's a third party that's overcharging you.
Alex on Autos give A+ on ride and A- on handling and A+ on Cabin noise. and that only due to tires. A on fuel economic. Only car that he ever tested at time that got so many As.
$143b through 4 revenue streams - auto, motorcycle, power and financial services.
Hyundai reported 88 billion from their auto business alone. The Hyundai Motor Group (which is comprised of their passenger car brands along with financial and construction businesses) made *checks notes* $224,000,000,000 in 2018 (can't find 2019 revenue).
$143b through 4 revenue streams - auto, motorcycle, power and financial services.
Hyundai reported 88 billion from their auto business alone. The Hyundai Motor Group (which is comprised of their passenger car brands along with financial and construction businesses) made *checks notes* $224,000,000,000 in 2018 (can't find 2019 revenue).
So, uh...yeah. Hyundai is fine
Construction business has no relationship with motor busiess.
Honda makes small cars for Japan and Asian market. it has more engineering resources shared.
Honda untill recently has $6b net income per year. https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/c...nda/net-income
Hyundai facing significant downside in business where it is most exposed in Asia and EU.
Acura TLX sales are better than entire Genesis brand.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...301104673.html FOUNTAIN VALLEY, Calif., Aug. 3, 2020 /PRNewswire/ -- Genesis Motor America today reported sales of 1,257 units in July 2020, a 20.7 percent decrease compared with the prior year.
Acura TLX sales are better than entire Genesis brand.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...301104673.html FOUNTAIN VALLEY, Calif., Aug. 3, 2020 /PRNewswire/ -- Genesis Motor America today reported sales of 1,257 units in July 2020, a 20.7 percent decrease compared with the prior year.
07-05-2020, 03:53 PM
July 2020
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