Acura: NSX News
12-17-2008, 10:25 AM
#1961
The sizzle in the Steak
Finally some good news out of Acura!!!!That "supercar" exterior design was soooooo vanilla!
Sure the economy is to blame for some of this, but it will give Acura a chance in the future to do it right.
Sucks that the RWD & engines will be collecting dust.
12-17-2008, 10:33 AM
#1962
The sizzle in the Steak
So with Honda cancelling the NSX....previously leaving F1.....reducing production of vehicles....laying off workers........................................... ..................................
How long before we hear the RL is discontinued?
How long before we hear the MSX is killed?
Will the RDX be dead in 2-3 years?
If the economic conditions continue....perhaps Honda will turn Acura into a 3 model car line-up.
How long before we hear the RL is discontinued?
How long before we hear the MSX is killed?
Will the RDX be dead in 2-3 years?
If the economic conditions continue....perhaps Honda will turn Acura into a 3 model car line-up.
12-17-2008, 10:36 AM
#1963
So with Honda cancelling the NSX....previously leaving F1.....reducing production of vehicles....laying off workers........................................... ..................................
How long before we hear the RL is discontinued?
How long before we hear the MSX is killed?
Will the RDX be dead in 2-3 years?
If the economic conditions continue....perhaps Honda will turn Acura into a 3 model car line-up.
How long before we hear the RL is discontinued?
How long before we hear the MSX is killed?
Will the RDX be dead in 2-3 years?
If the economic conditions continue....perhaps Honda will turn Acura into a 3 model car line-up.
The RL may not see another generation, probably the same for the RDX & MSX may not see the light of day on a dealership floor.
12-17-2008, 10:42 AM
#1964
I can understand the reasoning for this in the short term, but it is utterly STUPID in the long term.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
they could produce a coupe' with a V6 derived from the TSX or TL with less cost and ten time more sells then the V10 NSX,
they posponed the diesel engines year after year, and now is too late.
Nissan lauched the 370Z,
BMW the Z4
Audi the R8 V10
Hybrids? they don't gives nothing more in fuel efficency comparing to the last gen. of diesel from BMW and Audis...
They prefered to loose money in a new CUV, the MSX, in a time when less and less people buys them...
I'm very disappointed, almost depressed.
Dom is right: I could not afford it, BUT the super "wow!!" marketing factor from a such car would have been for Honda even more important and effective for taking their seat on Tier 1 than the cash$$ in their pockets...
12-17-2008, 01:19 PM
#1967
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what?? 
nooo!! nooo!!
well it does say that a NSX replacement with a V10 is cancelled, so maybe there still will be a replacement but with a different engine?
nooo!! nooo!!well it does say that a NSX replacement with a V10 is cancelled, so maybe there still will be a replacement but with a different engine?
12-17-2008, 03:04 PM
#1970
The sizzle in the Steak
Pure genius to produce a low volume - low demand coupe in a market like this.
12-17-2008, 03:19 PM
#1971
I'm still waiting for a diehard Honda fanboy to chime in right about now, something like..... Honda is smart to cancel the NSX, the V10's gas mileage probably wouldn't have helped the NSX's cause much anyway. They always make the best decisions, they were probably planning this all along anyway.
It was kind of obvious that this was coming though. The RWD V8 RL being pushed back to as far as 2015, pulling out of F1, cutting support for the superbike program, etc. Not to say I saw this coming, but I'm not surprised at all.
Acura: Tier-1 vehicles and RWD V8 drivetrains coming to a dealership near you next yea- er, make that 3 years from now.... oops, nevermind, more like a little under a decade from now. Err.... we'll let you know if the RWD program ever wakes up from its coma, til then wait for us, k?
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
I can understand the reasoning for this in the short term, but it is utterly STUPID in the long term.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
It was kind of obvious that this was coming though. The RWD V8 RL being pushed back to as far as 2015, pulling out of F1, cutting support for the superbike program, etc. Not to say I saw this coming, but I'm not surprised at all.
Acura: Tier-1 vehicles and RWD V8 drivetrains coming to a dealership near you next yea- er, make that 3 years from now.... oops, nevermind, more like a little under a decade from now. Err.... we'll let you know if the RWD program ever wakes up from its coma, til then wait for us, k?
12-17-2008, 03:38 PM
#1972
Senior Moderator
I'm still waiting for a diehard Honda fanboy to chime in right about now, something like..... Honda is smart to cancel the NSX, the V10's gas mileage probably wouldn't have helped the NSX's cause much anyway. They always make the best decisions, they were probably planning this all along anyway.
12-17-2008, 05:00 PM
#1973
on autocar.co.uk
Canning the NSX? Honda should be ashamed
Andrew Frankel
Is Honda’s decision to can the next NSX motivated by prudence or myopia? As a fan of the original I bow to no-one, so perhaps my vision is more rose-tinted than it should be, but I incline strongly towards the latter view.
The NSX is the car that changed the supercar landscape. It might not have sold very well over here (even though it did succeed elsewhere and in the US particularly), but the value of such cars can never be counted in sales figures alone. It became the supercar benchmark: when Gordon Murray was designing the McLaren F1, he didn’t look at Ferraris and Lamborghinis, he looked at – then drove, then bought – an NSX, which he then kept as his everyday car for years.
Before the NSX, Ferrari’s staple was the fairly awful 348, which transformed soon afterwards into the really rather wonderful F355, and I have no doubt which car gave Maranello the kick up the backside that it sorely needed.
No one will ever be able to calculate how much kudos the NSX rained down on Honda’s head as a company of outstanding innovation and engineering excellence any more than we’ll ever know how much damage will now be done to that reputation now that its replacement has been killed.
But the bit I really don’t get is why it’s been axed. Clearly the market is in terrible trouble at the moment, but it will recover as it always has, and when it does the cars that enthusiasts with money will want to buy will be lightweight, ultra-efficient and usable every day.
These are precisely the values upon which the NSX set out its stall when it was first shown almost exactly 20 years ago. If it was a three-tonne SUV Honda was culling I’d understand in an instant, but the very fact that Honda kept the old car in production for 15 years – for much of it as a loss-leader – showed how important the light it cast was to the brand.
But today the values upon which the NSX was conceived have been tossed aside in pursuit of what Honda’s boss describes as ‘achieving mass-market penetration as soon as possible…’ It’s an attitude I’d expect from many faceless corporations, but from a company that built a proud and wholly deserved reputation through pure engineering integrity, it makes me shudder.
Read more about Honda's decision to cancel the new NSX
Canning the NSX? Honda should be ashamed
Andrew Frankel
Is Honda’s decision to can the next NSX motivated by prudence or myopia? As a fan of the original I bow to no-one, so perhaps my vision is more rose-tinted than it should be, but I incline strongly towards the latter view.
The NSX is the car that changed the supercar landscape. It might not have sold very well over here (even though it did succeed elsewhere and in the US particularly), but the value of such cars can never be counted in sales figures alone. It became the supercar benchmark: when Gordon Murray was designing the McLaren F1, he didn’t look at Ferraris and Lamborghinis, he looked at – then drove, then bought – an NSX, which he then kept as his everyday car for years.
Before the NSX, Ferrari’s staple was the fairly awful 348, which transformed soon afterwards into the really rather wonderful F355, and I have no doubt which car gave Maranello the kick up the backside that it sorely needed.
No one will ever be able to calculate how much kudos the NSX rained down on Honda’s head as a company of outstanding innovation and engineering excellence any more than we’ll ever know how much damage will now be done to that reputation now that its replacement has been killed.
But the bit I really don’t get is why it’s been axed. Clearly the market is in terrible trouble at the moment, but it will recover as it always has, and when it does the cars that enthusiasts with money will want to buy will be lightweight, ultra-efficient and usable every day.
These are precisely the values upon which the NSX set out its stall when it was first shown almost exactly 20 years ago. If it was a three-tonne SUV Honda was culling I’d understand in an instant, but the very fact that Honda kept the old car in production for 15 years – for much of it as a loss-leader – showed how important the light it cast was to the brand.
But today the values upon which the NSX was conceived have been tossed aside in pursuit of what Honda’s boss describes as ‘achieving mass-market penetration as soon as possible…’ It’s an attitude I’d expect from many faceless corporations, but from a company that built a proud and wholly deserved reputation through pure engineering integrity, it makes me shudder.
Read more about Honda's decision to cancel the new NSX
12-17-2008, 05:05 PM
#1974
tonight I feel nostalgical... a sad day.
A great article (english one) from end 2005. It explains WHAT a fantastic car the NSX was.
Sorry if it's LONG, but I think it's worth of your attention.
Honda stopped making its iconic NSX – one of the 20th century’s most important supercars – after 16 years. A nostalgic Andrew Frankel took one out for a farewell thrash
It shouldn't have been like this. This was the last time we would meet, the final fling of an affair 16 years in the making.[/intro] I wanted, needed even, my closing encounter with the NSX to be an epic: how else to do justice to a car that influenced and informed a generation of supercar constructors?
I had it planned to the last detail. We’d go back to the mountain where we’d first met, I’d listen to its V6 whanging off its walls one last time, and find the spot where the photographer had told me to slow down, grow up or find another way home. And we would have a ball.
Except it didn’t work out like that. Indeed the fact that the mountain was shrouded in fog was almost a relief, for this was not the NSX I had come to drive. From the moment I first peered excitedly through its window, it all went wrong. For where there should have been a short and stubby gear-stick – my gateway to heaven – there instead sprouted a grotesque T-bar.
This was the automatic NSX. The NSX that dares not speak its name. The bastard son of the NSX that should be seen but never, ever driven.
The clunking, clip-clawed, four speed slushtronic wretch of an NSX, with its hateful electric power steering and, most cruelly, its detuned engine. I didn’t even want to sit in it. But I have children to feed so I devised a strategy. As I drove this NSX, I would use the familiarity of its environment to rekindle the memories of all those proper NSXs whose sheer genius changed the way fast cars were made. And do you know what? It worked.
Before the NSX, supercars were crap, and I mean that in the nicest possible way. My predecessors never said as much because, until they drove the NSX, they could never have known. But you didn’t need much time in the lightweight, all-aluminium wonder from out East to know it made the likes of Ferrari’s malevolent 348 and the already ageing Lotus Esprit Turbo look pretty sick.
It was at least as quick as the Lotus and not only out-handled the Ferrari (not difficult) but sounded better too (almost unbelievable). But that was just the start: it also possessed the build quality of a 911 and the reliability of, well, a Honda.
It even had a decent boot, for heaven’s sake. In short, it brought the piano lid crashing down on the fingers of the established European supercar constructors and things would never be the same again.
How important was it? Well, I have no doubt for instance that, were it not for the NSX, the Ferrari F430 would not be the paragon of supercar virtue it is. For all the wonderful things it did on the road, perhaps the greatest service the NSX ever did for the true enthusiast was to jolt Ferrari out of the complacency that had brought us such mediocrities as the 348, Testarossa and Mondial.
But the NSX was not perfect. Deep within the warm, inviting folds of ever BSX there lies a shard of ice just where you’d expect to find a heart of gold. It’s there to catch the unwary.
I can remember watching a road tester throw an NSX deep into a field while trying to make it perform for the camera and I can remember others skittering off race tracks when their intrepid pilots have played fast and loose with the traction control button.
I’ve had a fair few of what are known round these parts as ‘NSX moments’ myself. Last year I drove one 4500 miles in five days and forgot about the NSX’s phenomenal appetite for rear tyres until I found myself negotiating a wet right-hand curve on an Italian autostrada on half a turn or more of left-hand lock.
Even the strange, 16-year-old beast pictured here with its two pedals and bigger wheels from the later 3.2-litre version contrived to spit me sideways out of a corner when a rear tyre brushed the dry painted white line at its perimeter.
Back then, back when the NSX was merely the freshest face on the block and mine the spottiest in the office, I knew none of this. I knew only of a car with a redline higher than that of any Ferrari, a driving position I could actually work with and a gear-shift with an action of military-spec precision. I wanted to drive it forever, sell my flat and live in it. I can remember bundling friend after friend into its passenger seat and howling off up the road, simply because I didn’t want them to die without first hearing that noise.
But you could never do full justice to an NSX on any single journey for the sheer sense of occasion offered by a Ferrari over a given distance was always going to make up for its dynamic shortfalls. However good an NSX was to drive, it was always going to be far better to own.
Not, of course, that I ever managed to do that, though I have probably spent more cumulative time at the helms of NSXs in the last 16 years than many who have actually gone out and splurged on one.
Honda may not have sold too many of late but, like James Dean, it’s legend will only truly come alive after its death. And then it will become known as the most influential and important supercar of the late 20th century, the one that helped make all the others better.
Which is why I’m not going to let this toothless NSX end one of the most important chapters of my automotive education. I’m going to find another – I don’t care if it’s a 3.0-litre or a 3.2, whether it has five speeds or sic, so long as it has work for my left foot.
And when I do, believe me, we won’t go out with a whimper, but snarling, howling and shrieking through the gears, hitting 8000rpm in every last one of’em. In an NSX there should be no other way.
A great article (english one) from end 2005. It explains WHAT a fantastic car the NSX was.
Sorry if it's LONG, but I think it's worth of your attention.
Honda stopped making its iconic NSX – one of the 20th century’s most important supercars – after 16 years. A nostalgic Andrew Frankel took one out for a farewell thrash
It shouldn't have been like this. This was the last time we would meet, the final fling of an affair 16 years in the making.[/intro] I wanted, needed even, my closing encounter with the NSX to be an epic: how else to do justice to a car that influenced and informed a generation of supercar constructors?
I had it planned to the last detail. We’d go back to the mountain where we’d first met, I’d listen to its V6 whanging off its walls one last time, and find the spot where the photographer had told me to slow down, grow up or find another way home. And we would have a ball.
Except it didn’t work out like that. Indeed the fact that the mountain was shrouded in fog was almost a relief, for this was not the NSX I had come to drive. From the moment I first peered excitedly through its window, it all went wrong. For where there should have been a short and stubby gear-stick – my gateway to heaven – there instead sprouted a grotesque T-bar.
This was the automatic NSX. The NSX that dares not speak its name. The bastard son of the NSX that should be seen but never, ever driven.
The clunking, clip-clawed, four speed slushtronic wretch of an NSX, with its hateful electric power steering and, most cruelly, its detuned engine. I didn’t even want to sit in it. But I have children to feed so I devised a strategy. As I drove this NSX, I would use the familiarity of its environment to rekindle the memories of all those proper NSXs whose sheer genius changed the way fast cars were made. And do you know what? It worked.
Before the NSX, supercars were crap, and I mean that in the nicest possible way. My predecessors never said as much because, until they drove the NSX, they could never have known. But you didn’t need much time in the lightweight, all-aluminium wonder from out East to know it made the likes of Ferrari’s malevolent 348 and the already ageing Lotus Esprit Turbo look pretty sick.
It was at least as quick as the Lotus and not only out-handled the Ferrari (not difficult) but sounded better too (almost unbelievable). But that was just the start: it also possessed the build quality of a 911 and the reliability of, well, a Honda.
It even had a decent boot, for heaven’s sake. In short, it brought the piano lid crashing down on the fingers of the established European supercar constructors and things would never be the same again.
How important was it? Well, I have no doubt for instance that, were it not for the NSX, the Ferrari F430 would not be the paragon of supercar virtue it is. For all the wonderful things it did on the road, perhaps the greatest service the NSX ever did for the true enthusiast was to jolt Ferrari out of the complacency that had brought us such mediocrities as the 348, Testarossa and Mondial.
But the NSX was not perfect. Deep within the warm, inviting folds of ever BSX there lies a shard of ice just where you’d expect to find a heart of gold. It’s there to catch the unwary.
I can remember watching a road tester throw an NSX deep into a field while trying to make it perform for the camera and I can remember others skittering off race tracks when their intrepid pilots have played fast and loose with the traction control button.
I’ve had a fair few of what are known round these parts as ‘NSX moments’ myself. Last year I drove one 4500 miles in five days and forgot about the NSX’s phenomenal appetite for rear tyres until I found myself negotiating a wet right-hand curve on an Italian autostrada on half a turn or more of left-hand lock.
Even the strange, 16-year-old beast pictured here with its two pedals and bigger wheels from the later 3.2-litre version contrived to spit me sideways out of a corner when a rear tyre brushed the dry painted white line at its perimeter.
Back then, back when the NSX was merely the freshest face on the block and mine the spottiest in the office, I knew none of this. I knew only of a car with a redline higher than that of any Ferrari, a driving position I could actually work with and a gear-shift with an action of military-spec precision. I wanted to drive it forever, sell my flat and live in it. I can remember bundling friend after friend into its passenger seat and howling off up the road, simply because I didn’t want them to die without first hearing that noise.
But you could never do full justice to an NSX on any single journey for the sheer sense of occasion offered by a Ferrari over a given distance was always going to make up for its dynamic shortfalls. However good an NSX was to drive, it was always going to be far better to own.
Not, of course, that I ever managed to do that, though I have probably spent more cumulative time at the helms of NSXs in the last 16 years than many who have actually gone out and splurged on one.
Honda may not have sold too many of late but, like James Dean, it’s legend will only truly come alive after its death. And then it will become known as the most influential and important supercar of the late 20th century, the one that helped make all the others better.
Which is why I’m not going to let this toothless NSX end one of the most important chapters of my automotive education. I’m going to find another – I don’t care if it’s a 3.0-litre or a 3.2, whether it has five speeds or sic, so long as it has work for my left foot.
And when I do, believe me, we won’t go out with a whimper, but snarling, howling and shrieking through the gears, hitting 8000rpm in every last one of’em. In an NSX there should be no other way.
12-17-2008, 05:41 PM
#1975
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so i guess honda lost its balls now? pulled out of Formula 1 and now no more NSX? whats next on the chopping block the replacement for the S2000?
starting to sound like toyota.
starting to sound like toyota.
12-17-2008, 05:44 PM
#1976
Safety Car
talk about cutting your loses. they dumped big bucks in development and kept it so hush hush that they didnt even profit from advertising their "intuitive" halo car to the gen. public.
12-17-2008, 05:53 PM
#1977
12-17-2008, 07:46 PM
#1980
You'll Never Walk Alone
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Soichiro Honda must be mad now and gonna come back alive. haha. From this, I'd say Takeo is obviously not a car enthusiast himself.
Krio, I think fuel efficiency is not the only reason why they are going after hybrids, for example, they also want to reduce PM pollution. Also, not every country has clean diesel (I believe clean diesel is defined as diesel fuel with less than 15ppm of sulfur). If I remember correctly, currently in China, the sulfur content in diesel fuel is like 2000ppm. I think there's a proportional relationship between sulfur content and PM pollution. I'd imagine beside supply and demand, another reason why diesel fuel here costs more than before is the money it takes to make clean diesel fuel.
Krio, I think fuel efficiency is not the only reason why they are going after hybrids, for example, they also want to reduce PM pollution. Also, not every country has clean diesel (I believe clean diesel is defined as diesel fuel with less than 15ppm of sulfur). If I remember correctly, currently in China, the sulfur content in diesel fuel is like 2000ppm. I think there's a proportional relationship between sulfur content and PM pollution. I'd imagine beside supply and demand, another reason why diesel fuel here costs more than before is the money it takes to make clean diesel fuel.
12-17-2008, 07:56 PM
#1981
The Third Ball
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As an enthusiast I am going to be the one to say THANK GOD!!!
The entire idea of the new NSX was just wrong. front engined, crappy concept design, etc.
Keep it to the roots. To the mid engined car that forced major exotics to rethink the way their cars drove and handled.
This was the right move. I had been smelling huge disappointment from this project for a long time.
The entire idea of the new NSX was just wrong. front engined, crappy concept design, etc.
Keep it to the roots. To the mid engined car that forced major exotics to rethink the way their cars drove and handled.
This was the right move. I had been smelling huge disappointment from this project for a long time.
12-17-2008, 07:58 PM
#1982
^ I wasn't liking the way the new NSX was heading anyway.
I wasn't liking the way the new NSX was heading anyway.
12-17-2008, 09:08 PM
#1984
Senior Moderator
on autocar.co.uk
Canning the NSX? Honda should be ashamed
Andrew Frankel
Is Honda’s decision to can the next NSX motivated by prudence or myopia? As a fan of the original I bow to no-one, so perhaps my vision is more rose-tinted than it should be, but I incline strongly towards the latter view.
The NSX is the car that changed the supercar landscape. It might not have sold very well over here (even though it did succeed elsewhere and in the US particularly), but the value of such cars can never be counted in sales figures alone. It became the supercar benchmark: when Gordon Murray was designing the McLaren F1, he didn’t look at Ferraris and Lamborghinis, he looked at – then drove, then bought – an NSX, which he then kept as his everyday car for years.
Before the NSX, Ferrari’s staple was the fairly awful 348, which transformed soon afterwards into the really rather wonderful F355, and I have no doubt which car gave Maranello the kick up the backside that it sorely needed.
No one will ever be able to calculate how much kudos the NSX rained down on Honda’s head as a company of outstanding innovation and engineering excellence any more than we’ll ever know how much damage will now be done to that reputation now that its replacement has been killed.
But the bit I really don’t get is why it’s been axed. Clearly the market is in terrible trouble at the moment, but it will recover as it always has, and when it does the cars that enthusiasts with money will want to buy will be lightweight, ultra-efficient and usable every day.
These are precisely the values upon which the NSX set out its stall when it was first shown almost exactly 20 years ago. If it was a three-tonne SUV Honda was culling I’d understand in an instant, but the very fact that Honda kept the old car in production for 15 years – for much of it as a loss-leader – showed how important the light it cast was to the brand.
But today the values upon which the NSX was conceived have been tossed aside in pursuit of what Honda’s boss describes as ‘achieving mass-market penetration as soon as possible…’ It’s an attitude I’d expect from many faceless corporations, but from a company that built a proud and wholly deserved reputation through pure engineering integrity, it makes me shudder.
Read more about Honda's decision to cancel the new NSX
Canning the NSX? Honda should be ashamed
Andrew Frankel
Is Honda’s decision to can the next NSX motivated by prudence or myopia? As a fan of the original I bow to no-one, so perhaps my vision is more rose-tinted than it should be, but I incline strongly towards the latter view.
The NSX is the car that changed the supercar landscape. It might not have sold very well over here (even though it did succeed elsewhere and in the US particularly), but the value of such cars can never be counted in sales figures alone. It became the supercar benchmark: when Gordon Murray was designing the McLaren F1, he didn’t look at Ferraris and Lamborghinis, he looked at – then drove, then bought – an NSX, which he then kept as his everyday car for years.
Before the NSX, Ferrari’s staple was the fairly awful 348, which transformed soon afterwards into the really rather wonderful F355, and I have no doubt which car gave Maranello the kick up the backside that it sorely needed.
No one will ever be able to calculate how much kudos the NSX rained down on Honda’s head as a company of outstanding innovation and engineering excellence any more than we’ll ever know how much damage will now be done to that reputation now that its replacement has been killed.
But the bit I really don’t get is why it’s been axed. Clearly the market is in terrible trouble at the moment, but it will recover as it always has, and when it does the cars that enthusiasts with money will want to buy will be lightweight, ultra-efficient and usable every day.
These are precisely the values upon which the NSX set out its stall when it was first shown almost exactly 20 years ago. If it was a three-tonne SUV Honda was culling I’d understand in an instant, but the very fact that Honda kept the old car in production for 15 years – for much of it as a loss-leader – showed how important the light it cast was to the brand.
But today the values upon which the NSX was conceived have been tossed aside in pursuit of what Honda’s boss describes as ‘achieving mass-market penetration as soon as possible…’ It’s an attitude I’d expect from many faceless corporations, but from a company that built a proud and wholly deserved reputation through pure engineering integrity, it makes me shudder.
Read more about Honda's decision to cancel the new NSX
Interesting points. Its what happens when bean counters take over the business.
12-17-2008, 09:30 PM
#1985
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HSC?
12-17-2008, 09:30 PM
#1986
6G TLX-S
Is Honda in trouble ?
It has reduced production twice this year. It is suffering from falling sales. It is suffering from falling profits. It is pulling out of F1. It is trying to stay independent.
Now that the Tier-1 driving NSX replacement is dead. Might as well just completely shut down the Acura division. This way it'll save even more money by focusing on just one non-true-luxury (=economy) auto division.
It has reduced production twice this year. It is suffering from falling sales. It is suffering from falling profits. It is pulling out of F1. It is trying to stay independent.
Now that the Tier-1 driving NSX replacement is dead. Might as well just completely shut down the Acura division. This way it'll save even more money by focusing on just one non-true-luxury (=economy) auto division.
12-18-2008, 01:32 AM
#1987
You'll Never Walk Alone
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I guess if Honda doesn't take those actions then they will be in trouble. They are acting now before it's too late.
I think a lot of companies are reducing production (even several times), suffering from mediocre sales, and some are even losing money. Porsche and Audi are pulling out of Le Mans as well, especially for Audi, it has been having so much success in Le Mans, yet it's quitting, that says a lot about the economy.
I don't think they will shut down Acura. The fact that it is a "Tier-2" brand is actually a good thing right now IMO. At least most of the cars, if not all, are based on another Honda, which means a lot of cost saving. If it were to go Tier-1 now, with independent platforms and engines, it would get pretty screwed.
I think a lot of companies are reducing production (even several times), suffering from mediocre sales, and some are even losing money. Porsche and Audi are pulling out of Le Mans as well, especially for Audi, it has been having so much success in Le Mans, yet it's quitting, that says a lot about the economy.
I don't think they will shut down Acura. The fact that it is a "Tier-2" brand is actually a good thing right now IMO. At least most of the cars, if not all, are based on another Honda, which means a lot of cost saving. If it were to go Tier-1 now, with independent platforms and engines, it would get pretty screwed.
12-18-2008, 03:07 AM
#1990
6G TLX-S
12-18-2008, 04:58 AM
#1991
Race Director
I didn't see anything mentioned about the Acura start up in Europe. I would have thought that would be an obvious way to save money. Wasn't this NSX successor supposed to be the car that starts Acura in Europe?
As I mentioned a few times now - don't believe any future car pronouncement till you see it in the showroom.
As I mentioned a few times now - don't believe any future car pronouncement till you see it in the showroom.
12-18-2008, 06:27 AM
#1992
Senior Moderator
I can understand the reasoning for this in the short term, but it is utterly STUPID in the long term.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
They already paid for all the investment and research that went into this. If they postpone it or just push ahead and finish it, they can still "trickle" down and recoup the costs, maybe not in the short term, but surely in the long term (5-10+ years from now).
but instead, they CANCEL it so all costs that went into the development are pretty much lost in both the short and long term. I mean, these were projects that SHOULD HAVE BEEN completed while times were still good...but i guess Honda's plan of "keep them talking about us by releasing information about plans we'll never follow through on" should be expected as usual.
I have lost just about all hope with any thing good coming from Honda motor company in the near/distant future
12-18-2008, 09:09 AM
#1994
Senior Moderator
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo........ 
I think Honda is concentrating on being an independent Honda right now in the face of a dramatic worldwide downturn that is expected not to leave quickly. I do think canceling the NSX was a good business decision. Yes, they put a lot of money into development, but it will likely be used at a future date....like when the economy isn't tanking and there's an actual market for a supercar like the NSX.
As far as those saying they might as well kill off Acura....maybe not. I still think Acura's marketing sucks and that maybe they should reinvent themselves as the Japanese Audi, or as the luxury company that cares about the environment. If they can't do that, maybe the time HAS come for Honda to kill off Acura and concentrate on their top-of-the-line, market-beating economy cars. They have been successful with those cars for 40 years in this country and as long as they innovate the economy car, they will continue to be successful there.
With this news, I can't possibly see the next gen RL being RWD and V8. In fact, I don't see them releasing it at all given the dismal sales and the current environment. My next car will almost certainly either be either a Honda Accord or, if I choose to continue purchasing luxury cars, the Germans and Lexus will be all that are left. (I can't see myself buying my dream CTS-V anymore with increasingly dismal news from GM).
I think Honda is concentrating on being an independent Honda right now in the face of a dramatic worldwide downturn that is expected not to leave quickly. I do think canceling the NSX was a good business decision. Yes, they put a lot of money into development, but it will likely be used at a future date....like when the economy isn't tanking and there's an actual market for a supercar like the NSX.
As far as those saying they might as well kill off Acura....maybe not. I still think Acura's marketing sucks and that maybe they should reinvent themselves as the Japanese Audi, or as the luxury company that cares about the environment. If they can't do that, maybe the time HAS come for Honda to kill off Acura and concentrate on their top-of-the-line, market-beating economy cars. They have been successful with those cars for 40 years in this country and as long as they innovate the economy car, they will continue to be successful there.
With this news, I can't possibly see the next gen RL being RWD and V8. In fact, I don't see them releasing it at all given the dismal sales and the current environment. My next car will almost certainly either be either a Honda Accord or, if I choose to continue purchasing luxury cars, the Germans and Lexus will be all that are left. (I can't see myself buying my dream CTS-V anymore with increasingly dismal news from GM).
12-18-2008, 12:45 PM
#1995
The sizzle in the Steak
YOU want an Acura coupe....but clearly Acura does not need one in their line-up. They have been doing fine without one for years now.
At this point Acura is hoping to still be around in a few years.
12-18-2008, 12:53 PM
#1996
Some dude
Saw this on some site and saved it. Its nice to see that people that DON'T work for Honda are the only one's that can make Honda's cars look good.
12-18-2008, 02:20 PM
#1999
kind of contradicting yourself there.
acura is forgetting about its huge enthusiast market. you think the rsx would have sold so well if it wasn't for the integra? there was a huge market for the integra that acura became famous for with the enthusiasts. that market moved to the rsx and now since acura doesn't have any more enthusiast cars rsx guys are moving to subaru, bmw, infiniti, etc..
maybe we dont need an integra replacement but give the acura faithfuls something to look forward to thats not a complete bore and there will be sales.
12-18-2008, 02:34 PM
#2000
The sizzle in the Steak
you say acura has been doing fine and then you say they're hoping to still be around in a few years.
kind of contradicting yourself there.
acura is forgetting about its huge enthusiast market. you think the rsx would have sold so well if it wasn't for the integra? there was a huge market for the integra that acura became famous for with the enthusiasts. that market moved to the rsx and now since acura doesn't have any more enthusiast cars rsx guys are moving to subaru, bmw, infiniti, etc..
maybe we dont need an integra replacement but give the acura faithfuls something to look forward to thats not a complete bore and there will be sales.
kind of contradicting yourself there.
acura is forgetting about its huge enthusiast market. you think the rsx would have sold so well if it wasn't for the integra? there was a huge market for the integra that acura became famous for with the enthusiasts. that market moved to the rsx and now since acura doesn't have any more enthusiast cars rsx guys are moving to subaru, bmw, infiniti, etc..
maybe we dont need an integra replacement but give the acura faithfuls something to look forward to thats not a complete bore and there will be sales.
No contradiction. Acura has been doing well with a coupe. The CL sales were all Acura needed to look at to understand that the coupe was not for them.
Now Honda is scrambling like the rest of the automakers around the world.
The dead weight will be cut. Acura has a good amount of dead weight in the line-up. The RL, RDX are prime examples.....and now with the "beak" design....the big seller TL and TSX are in danger. In this economic environment there is not much going for the Acura line-up...and combine that with a horrible design direction as of late....it's a one-two punch of devastation for Acura.
Acura cares ZERO about the "enthusiast" market. Acura has not had that market for years. Acura does not want the RSX or Teg crowd. Those peeps can go buy civics for all Honda cares.
Acura has and is slowly loosing the "faithful".