potmilkz

OP better buy the car at the end of its lease because that is the only way its worth it..

jjsC5

I'm not sure why this myth about losing the down payment is perpetuated. You might want to do a little more homework on how insurance and lease payoffs actually work. Then you need to think through what happens if you buy a car and finance 100% of it (which is effectively what a lease is). Also, most leases now actually come with gap insurance which comes into play.

I have a friend who does "one-pay" leases. Pays the entire amount of the lease in one payment up front. Do you really think he is out all the money if the car is totaled or stolen?

I'm not in favor of putting down money on leases btw, but I think that this myth falls under the heading that if enough people say it long enough it must be true.

shurik74

Never heard that someone can do "one-pay" lease...

py0413

Before I bought my TL AWD tech, I was originally going for GS RWD F Sport. However, the dealer wasn't too interest in earning my business. An old salesman (my friend who i bought my last lexus left them earlier this year, so I had to find someone else to talk) told me that they can't offer me a test drive because they don't usually order RWD GS especially in F-sport and they won't give me any discount even I was about to buy my 3rd lexus. Walked away and got a very good deal on a TL a few blocks down the road with no regrets.

EkSoni

iTrader: (2)

Im sorry who the F**K puts anything over 2-3k on a lease??

queens207tl

No myth here buddy. It is NEVER a good idea to put a large down payment on a lease. You will lose most if not all of it. In the first few years of a car, that is when the most deprecation occurs. You will have very little equity if any in those years unless you had put down a very big down payment. In a lease you are just renting the vehicle, any down payment is just a pre-payment of whatever the total cost is to rent the vehicle for that time period. So there is no equity in lease. All you did with a large down payment is paid upfront what you were responsible for anyway. To me its better to keep that money in the bank and allocate that down payment throughout the term of the lease. Of course you will then have a higher monthly payment. The contract in a lease states you responsible for the cost to rent that vehicle for the period and then you have an option to either purchase the vehicle at the residual value or return the vehicle back to them. In the case of total loss, you have no car to return, so you now have to pay for that vehicle. The cost of the vehicle would be the remaining payments (rental cost) + residual value at the end of the lease + taxes on the residual value + any miscellaneous fees. You insurance company will settle these costs with the owner (Financing company). I’ve never heard about the Finance company/Insurance Co. cutting a check to the lessee for any excess (equity) between how much was paid out by the insurance Co. (FMV of the vehicle) and the total cost you owed to the Finance company. Please feel free to provide links which states that they do. And EVEN if they did how much do you really think you would get back?? In this example of the $11K, you would be lucky to get half of that back. So again, it is NEVER a good idea to put a large down payment on a lease. The less money upfront, the less you will lose in the case of a total loss. Perhaps it is you who needs to do some homework.

Gap insurance only comes into play if you owe more than what the insurance settlement paid out. Which is the case in most leases where there is a total loss. But in the case of a $11K down payment, GAP insurance would not apply as your saying the person has equity in the vehicle as a result of the large down payment.

btw.. your friend should definitely find out from the dealer what happens in the case of a total loss. I never knew "one pay" leases existed. I'm not sure why anyone would do that as it defeats the purpose of a lease (low monthly payments).

Blueberryyumyum

ballin on a budget = TL

compewterbleu

The Lexus new front grilles look like a cross between creature from jeepers creepers and a Mitsu Lancer. I'm jus say'n.

types1fan

Just saw the movie predators at it actually looks like the two aliens combined. Just my opinion.

silverrevlis

I too looked at the GS350 F-Sport, but it was when they first came out back in Feb-March. The lease numbers that were given to me were reason enough to run, not walk away from the dealer. Now, lease numbers aside, the interior of the car was very impressive and felt very substantial. I never took the car on a test drive, as the only models available were the non F-Sports. The car looks awesome though. When my lease is up in my TL, the GS will definetly be compared for my next vehicle.

In regards to the $11K down, maybe it's possible the money was used towards multiple security deposits.....I hope!

queens207tl

I was thinking the same thing with the $11K down payment. I do hope it was multiple security deposits to lower the money factor. In which case he should get it back assuming his insurance and GAP insurance covers the cost of the car. Speaking of GAP insurance, from what I understand BMW leases automatically have it built in the lease. Does anyone know if GAP insurance is built into the Acura/Honda leases too? I'm assuming they would be as the dealer would want to cover their ass.

silverrevlis

Yes, GAP insurance is built for Honda and Acura.

Nexson

You can't really say the TL is a better built car then the gs350. Just saying. I have owned both. Not AWD though.

pimpin-tl

True but you didn't own the 2012 which had many refinement changes which make it very close to the quality of the Lexus.

I sat in a gs350 at the autos how yesterday. I so want one but can't get over the fact that it needs buttons as I hate that stupid mouse for all the controls.

Nexson

I have had plenty of 2012 tls while my 10 was in the shop for service to know there is not a whole of difference between the 10s and 12s. The 350 blows the tl out of the water as I am sure the new tl will blow the gs out of the water when it comes out.

pimpin-tl

I agree the GS does. It is no doubt a nice car. My friend owns one just like yours with the F sport package. I want one so badly but at the 45k~ price it's at, and no discounts, I had to get my TL for now (38k with discounts). The 2012 though since we own a 2009 and a 2012 is MUCH better. Just driving loaners isn't going to point out the difference. You need to drive them more. It's much quieter, stiffer suspension and steering, solid feeling, less rattles, upgraded interior and exterior parts. If it wasn't for all the upgrades I would have not gotten one. Our 2009 has been solid since getting it with no issues other than a weird brake pressure issue the dealer just can't figure out right now. But other than that, it's been fine.

Nexson

There is no such thing as a 45k gs. I wish!! I got mine for around 52. On the website they say starting at like 45k but there is no such car made. In fact it is a stripped down version. Trust me I was not to happy about this and almost settled for a white '12

I need to post some pictures up of the gs. I just bought a new wheel. I Rashed it

pimpin-tl

Here is the one I saw at the autoshow. I'd post it without a link but on the ipad so can't without tapatalk.

http://russz.smugmug.com/Car-Stuff/O...8941&k=Z78vs9p

Glashub

Drove the GS 350. Has oodles of tech but although the engine is responsive, the car feels underpowered. The interface control knob is quirky and hard to aim. No back button either. The sport, normal, eco modes worked well. The steering feels nimble but really light. A great rich luxurious car that at over 2 tons is not really a luxury sports car imo.

omaralt

That's almost my exact sentiment. When comparing between the gs350 and 535i the BMW felt a lot more responsive and you can really feel that extra torque down low. The idrive is also a lot better than the Lexus interface. The mouse thing was hard to use, no back button, and no full screen option.

kc1953

I am a prior owner (meaning I paid cash) of a 2009 TL-Tech SH-AWD. A great car and a great value. Now own (again paid cash) a 2012 BMW 535i sport pkg. About a $20k difference in price. The TL was a great car. Sportier and a better handler than the BMW. But the Bimmer is in another class as far as luxury, smoothness, power. I have been told that the new GS 350 is competitive with the 535i but personally I can't get over the grill. By comparison, the front grill on the TL looks good. While I liked the TL, I love the BMW. But again, I will not bad mouth the TL as it is a very good car and as many said, a very good value.

Glashub

When I closed the door on the GS I couldn't believe how heavy and solid it was. If I had a magic wand my car would have the ride/handing characteristics of the TL SH-AWD and the sound proofing and luxury appointments of the GS (minus the mouse). I'd pay 12G more for that and no I don't think the RLX is going to fit that bill.

fryrice

I test drove the new gs350 f sport and the base model on the performance tour around september of 2012 @ metlife stadium. I must say the car is very capable, the test drive allow you to drive the car hard around in a closed cone track. The non f sport model had a lot of body roll, in order to get better response u have to turn the dial knob all the way to sport+.

f sport model handled much better, less body roll and the throttle response seems better in sport+ mode. Steering response is not as "loose" as its more tighten. I can't comment much on the rwd because they only had awd.

Compare this to a friend of mine 2012 TL...the TL is more of a drivers car, i feel the road and the steering is more precise. But the interior (leather, widescreen navi, comfort, soft touches on the dash and doors, etc) and quietness is WAY better than the TL.

Maybe that is where your $15k is going towards all the comfort creatures...But compare that to the new 335i....BMW will win lol thats another story.

Not sure what the resale value of the gs vs TL but im sure both cars should sell well.

Imsooy

I own 12 sh-awd and have also test drove 13 gs awd f sport extensively (including pushing to 150km on freeway).
there is fundamental difference between two company's drivetrain and engine how the power is delivered.
Gs feels like more of a tweener naked sporty bike that takes the high perf engine of a superbike but detuned so that makes more torque on low rpms and buttery trans. awd system is very transparent too. sport mode is also nice makes your dash turn red and hear the exhaust a little but, that a little would be like hearing stock TL exhaust.
TL feels engine comes alive after 2500 rpmish. trans has more urgency to it than it is not as smooth as Gs's. awd system is not as transparent as Gs's but, def more bang and more smiles. everybody probably agrees with this. when you corner on awd TL. car feels like it is pushing you to the direction you want to go.
interior and all the plush luxo stuff aside, I don see a value in the price increase.
It's like choosing iphone vs galaxy 3 or note 2
one's got more refined UI, the other got more nerdiness to it. they all do the same thing and gets same thing done at around same time.
I use note 2 so, my choice was TL awd advanced. LOL

BEAR-AvHistory

A bit confused on the lease thing. A guy puts $2,500 down & pays $700 a month. Another guy puts down 12,500 & pays $200 a month. What is the difference outside of the opportunity cost on the $10K?

TeamAcura

The guy loses out on $12,500 and whatever else he already paid monthly for the lease as opposed to just $2,500+ in the event of a total lost. Either way he's screwed but worse if he puts more money down. Then you have to factor in how long he leased it or how much money he paid before the total lost. So if he totaled it within a month and had put down $12,500 plus the first month's payment then he's out $12,500+ already as to just $2500+. I hope I got that right but someone correct me if I'm wrong.

BEAR-AvHistory

If he buys the car puts 12K down, maybe as a trade, to get the loan & totals it in one month what is the difference?

Regardless of how its financed the insurance company is going to pay out the same amount of money for the loss + leases have gap insurance to cover any shortfall.

g37guy01

Right. When a car is totaled the lienholder has to be made whole. The insurance company gives you the value of the totaled car from which the loan/lease is paid off. If you put $12,500 down or $500 down the difference is opportunity cost.

Granted with leases essentially you are paying to use up a fixed value of the car based on lease mileage. But I my thinking is if I could afford to do a one lease pay, I might was well not lose the opportunity cost of the money and put a smaller down payment.

And for the record you can get gap insurance on a finance deal also. Gap insurance policies provide protection if the owner/lessee is unable to make the payments.

BEAR-AvHistory

So the bottom line is its six of one half dozen of the other.

kaw55titi

Acura TL SH-AWD 2009
« Zut! » Nous imaginons les dire autour de la fontaine d’eau Cadillac. « Acura nous battre à la CTS 2012! »

D’où est-ce que sa vient? Depuis la pert peu RSX 2002, la division Acura de Honda a été pelleter toujours plus profondément dans la bouillie de style de grilles confuses et les flancs mous (les sceptiques, s’il vous plaît voir le RDX, MDX, et TSX). Juste au moment où nous nous sommes arrêtés soin où cette séquence conduirait, nous obtenons ce TL fascinante, décisive sculpté faire appel à votre Batman intérieure.

SilverJ

If I were to drive an automatic, I would choose the GS over the TL everyday. But then again, its 15K more so its not really a fair comparison. But because I only drive manuals, I would STILL choose my TL over an auto GS. I dont think the GS comes in a stick.

flunder

Agreed, GS fell off my radar due to the lack of MT. On the flip side, TL would not have been on my radar if it weren't for the MT...

Mekkanox

I test-drove an IS350 F-Sport AWD before buying my TL, back in March 2014. It's not a GS but it's smaller, with the same tech, drivetrain, and engine.

Pros:
* 8-speed auto had quick shifts and good responsiveness.
* Engine was more powerful than what its numbers said.
* Seats were surprisingly comfortable.
* More of a cockpit-feel when driving.
* Dat LF-A gauge cluster... *drool*

Cons:
* Smaller inside than the TL (obviously since it's not a GS)
* The Lexus infotainment system is... just, nope.
* At the time these were flying off lots so Lexus dealers didn't have to budge much at all on prices.

In the end I went with the TL which I was able to get for $38K flat plus tax, title, & tags. Last model year incentives

SilverJ

Interesting. I feel my TL has a cockpit feeling. I feel tightly surrounded by tech and leather when driving, which I love. Hard to imagine another sedan even more cockpit-like.

Mekkanox

Don't get me wrong - the TL's interior is fantastic and after almost 2 years and 20K miles is holding up really well. It's more because of the gauge cluster, steering wheel, & paddle shifters in the IS/GS F-sport. Altogether, they really make the car feel like something else. I'd say though that IS is a bit more snug just because it's smaller, which makes it feel even more like an actual cockpit.