Norse396

Guys, he plays this game on every forum. When he gets banned he moves on to another one. Where he starts all over again until he gets banned yet again. Also, 99.9% of all his posts are edited if there is a response within the 5 min limit, this way he can adjust his comments or arguments.

If he was interested in fact he would agree more than 1% of the time with people, which he doesn't, if you ask him that's because 99% of the time everybody is wrong and he is right.

shodog

You guys are too much. When anyone has anything negative to say about the TL you jump all over them. Call them names and accuse them of being a troll. What I read here and in other threads is feuding and name calling which might be advantageous in an argument among 3rd graders but accomplishes nothing here. Imagine how boring this board would be to read a poster say, the 6mt is the coolset version of the TL and then read 10 people say, yes it sure is. Disscussion and divergent views are what makes a message board worth reading.

Threads get hijacked all the time. Not only here but on other boards also. It's the nature of the beast.

Swat Dude

Half the links you put up you don't understand so maybe you should take your own advice and start reading more of them.

Swat Dude

Nothing like jumping in when you are totally clueless about the HardDrivin situation. It has nothing to do with negative comments on the TL. Heck, 90% of the arguments aren't even about the TL.

Norse396

1le has earned this level of dis-respect, we didn't just jump on him and as I said, this happens in every forum he has ever used that screen name on. Do a search for anobody elses name here and see if they have been banned from every forum they visit.

You a buddy he called up to defend him? Seems you're only seeing one side of the picture here.

If you're saying this to all including the guy you feel needs defending then fine, we can agree to a point, if not, then I'll just take it that you're a friend of his and thats fine, you're doing a good job for him.

I thought he was only presenting facts and we were unfairly jumping on him.... you're right though, this does happen on every board, usually because there is someone just like 1le on that board doing it.

shodog

Nope sorry I'm not a friend of his. I just signed on to this list to get a feel for the TL. I was thinking about one for the wife.

UminChu

Sorry, but I disagree. I don't have a problem if someone prefers another car over a TL and chooses according to their own tastes. I generally find their reasons and opinions interesting and engaging. This forum is full of interesting, cooperative dialog, differing opinions and occasional debate. I don't begrudge HD for not buying a TL at all. He had his own reasons for choosing an Accord instead, and that's fine. No skin off of my nose, it's a big enough market for both of us to be happy. It's his insistance that his choice was the only sensible, logical, intelligent choice, and no one else is entitled to an opposing view. Same with his Camaro. There's nothing wrong with his choice of a Camaro or his devotion to it. The problem is that he refuses to accept different priorities for different buyers. He posts, reposts and force feeds the same things over and over and insists that everyone is wrong but him.

Or, leave his TL debunking out of it and look at his other threads or posts. Petty arguments, one and all. Pick any discussion he's chosen to participate in. In no time flat, it ceases being a friendly debate and suddenly deteriorates into a multi-faceted feud. Does he ever so much as acknowledge anyone's right to a contrary opinion? Ever? Nope. He comes barging in, all piss and vinegar, taking on all comers, and before you know it, the original topic is not only long gone, it no longer even remotely resembles its roots, and another thread is flushed straight down the toilet (kind of like this one).

I do, however, respect the patience and tolerance you offer him.

harddrivin1le

That's because SOME people get angry when they are proven wrong and when a host of 3rd party sources are offered to support the correct set of facts.

That anger turns to frustration as their "opinion" disintegrates and that feeds even more anger.

TLover

That's probably true but I would have to say the same for you, too, no? Believe me, I'm wrong all the time. I have no problem admitting it.

harddrivin1le

Name a major topic of debate that's occured on this forum in which you choose to take "the other side." Be prepared to offer valid, 3rd party sources to back your point of view.

Aluminum heads...ram air...torque converters...gearing theory...suspension components...

Name it.

Show me how "wrong" I've been.

TLover

You're right, HD. You are NEVER wrong; everyone else is ALWAYS wrong. My apologies.

apwalsh

No, some people get angry when someone tries to prove their "OPINION" wrong. Opinions can not be correct or incorrect, and you should have learned this fundamental lesson somewhere back in elementary school, my friend.

Further, you start blasting everyone with your opinions and/or 3rd party sources related to the topic at the beginning of your posts, which is fine with everyone, I'm sure. The problem is at the end of that post (not every time) you will add something completely off topic seemingly just to show how "smart" you are. Essentially you are throwing all this info at people who did not ask or talk about it in the first place.

And then there is the occasional insult at the car that most people here are driving, which you are entitled to not like for whatever reason you choose. But that does not mean that it's a piece of crap, uhh because I have something else.

Swat Dude

I think you have that backwards. I think the fact that you can't learn or admit you are wrong and you twist your statements around when you realize you are wrong leads to frustration. Then, you amplify their frustration by being even more boneheaded and then their frustration turns to anger.

harddrivin1le

Scientific realities are NOT "opinions."

If you aren't interested in the realities contained in my posts then I suggest that you IGNORE THEM.

harddrivin1le

The majority of people who "talk cars" - in ANY forum (including real life) - have little-to-know idea of what they are talking about.

harddrivin1le

How's the Joule-Thompson effect been treating you?

You don't have an engineering degree, despite the fact that you CLAIMED otherwise.

Norse396

And so he continues to prove everybodies point... congrats 1le, you must be the single most knowlegable person on the planet.

You know everything about cars, stereos, electronics, biology, physics, engineering and opinion doesn't matter when you the all knowing on every subject post links to web sites that prove your opinion is fact and can't be disputed in any way shape or form. Even their links when posted mean nothing to you because only you know the real deal, where the real facts are, how dare a person bother debating you when they are so out-gunned? Why, you must be an upper life form and us lowly humans can't measure up..

Yeah that's it, or maybe the truth is you can't handle dissagreement in any way so you argue a point until the other person gives up or tells you to go to hell.

How is the Mensa membership been treating you?

TLover

Your arrogance is unbelieveable.

harddrivin1le

That's fact.

And it's proven on here time and time again.

Aegir

:lol1: ROTFLMAO! Your honesty is refreshing!

Norse396

harddrivin1le,

You really are that arrogant aren't you. Rarely do you post an opinion, you post things you copied from links then post links to back them up as if you had clue one about the subject matter.

This doesn't mean you know anything except how to copy and paste. When you can debate an issue based on opinion without using someone else's words, that will be a welcome day.

People have tried very hard to be civil with you, yet you argue everything.
What color is blood? Can you answer that without a 30+ page argument?

(to the bandwidth, no this won't turn into a debate, it's a test, which I'll explain after he answers.)

brahtw8

I was also amused by that post. Obviously he was referring to his earlier statement:

Originally Posted by harddrivin1le
The majority of people who "talk cars" - in ANY forum (including real life) - have little-to-know idea of what they are talking about.

Nevertheless, as a single post read on its own, it would appear that he is acknowledging his unbelieveable arrogance. Unforunately, that would be very hard to believe.

I also thought his phrase "little-to-know" was either an intellectual mis-step (should have been "little-to-NO") or a very weak pun.

Norse396

It gets better....

Swat Dude

I can't believe you would even say that after you so pathetically showed your lack of mechanical engineering basics that anyone who had been through a 4-year program would know.

I also like how you never responded in the Chrysler thread when you were blatantly proven WRONG! You realized your mistake and the fact that you didn't know what the heck you were talking about, using so called "valid" 3rd party sources and "facts". You can put up all the links you want and it doesn't mean you know anything.

Finally, I was in law enforcement for 10 years and it took me about 5 minutes of studying the psychrometric chart when I went into HVAC sales before it all started to come back to me, and I graduated in 1989, and you supposedly have an ME degree and you were dumbfounded by my elementary question regarding the chart. Yeah, I'm buying you have a degree and that 1986 was so long ago you just couldn't remember. But then again, you show you can't remember alot a elementary principles from your engineering days.

Swat Dude

Physician heal thyself!

Formula 350

Back to the thread.......

The 6MT handles better than the 5 auto. By how much, who knows?

and my OPINION is that the TL is a great car, much better than an ACCORD and I can not be proven wrong

DrSm0kE

My G/F has '04 5AT. I have '05 6MT. I find that handling isn't too different with respect to suspension. The "pull" of the engine seems much greater with the MT, however, and therefore gives the impression of better handling when accelerating out of a corner/turn. I always prefer driving my car to hers. I feel that I have to pull out a whip and "lash the ponies" to get moving with even remotely the same vigor as my car when in hers.

HiG4s

The HPTs are a factory option not available on the auto, of course a buyer could change their tires after they buy the car. Or many dealers will change them as a dealer option.

I test drove an auto, a manual, and a manual with a-spec. Noticable but not drastic diffence from auto to manual. (the brakes feel much better on the manual) and the A-spec was a litter tighter yet, but to harsh for my tastes.

HiG4s

That should have said auto, manual with HPT and manual with A-spec

I imagine the A-spec would be much more noticable on an auto

My manual with HPT after having it awhile is harsher than I hoped it would be.. I have read that the all season Pireilli Zero Nero tires have as good a handling as my Potenzas in the dry, better in the wet, and are much quieter, and last longer. So I will try them when the time comes.

pettydw

I own a 6MT and have driven a few AT loaners and have to say there is a considerable difference between the handling character of the two cars. The sway bars make the 6MT considerably more agressive in tight corners,at the expense of highway ride. The AT is much more composed cruising on lumpy interstates.

My opinion is much of the torque steer difference comes from the MT's ability to hook up better (no fluid interface - torqe converter). The LSD seems to have a very mild power distribution, since a single wheel on ice will still spin considerably if the other wheel is on pavement.