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Quality has been a frequent topic of discussion here lately, so I thought the latest JD Power Dependability rankings would be of interest. For those unfamiliar with JDP, the survey ranks automakers my number of reported problems per 100 vehicles. Since these results apply to 2021 model year vehicles, the supply chain issues were likely a factor in the below rankings. Although the data is real (sorry if that's not what you read on the internet - it's true), one criticism I've had of the survey is that the "problems" aren't weighted in any way. A broken transmission and a glitchy infotainment system both count as one problem, even though I think we'd all agree they're hardly equal.
And for comparison purposes, below is the 2023 rankings
Is that the same Kia that can't seem to have a single model without enginge setting on fire up on the list? Yeah...I don't know about that.
Yeah the credibility of anyone who puts out these lists anymore is pretty much dead now. As someone who also owns a Toyota, they've been vastly overrated for decades. More stuff breaks on our Rav4 than any other car I've owned in my life, except for maybe my wife's old Mini Cooper, haha.
Is that the same Kia that can't seem to have a single model without enginge setting on fire up on the list? Yeah...I don't know about that.
If the Kia owner doesn't actually experience a fire and the recall is taken care of during a scheduled maintenance visit, it's very possible the customer doesn't consider it a problem at all. But if they do, it's still just one problem - the same as an Acura owner experiencing CarPlay connectivity issues. Throw in a rattle in the dash and noisy brakes, and the Acura has three times the number of problems as the Kia. Like I said, it's not fair that the problems aren't weighted.
Technology is a big factor in these surveys. The Germans tend to be at the forefront of new technologies, and oftentimes they'll roll out a feature that's half baked. My GLE is a great example. I haven't been invited to participate in JD Power, but if I did I would have reported 14 problems in the 2-1/2 years I've owned it. The vast majority of those problems are tech-related/non-mechanical, and some of them only occurred a single time. In contrast, our GLC has had two problems in more than seven years. Still, I have absolutely no doubt why MB is ranked so poorly despite showing a notable decrease over their 2024 results.
Yeah the credibility of anyone who puts out these lists anymore is pretty much dead now. As someone who also owns a Toyota, they've been vastly overrated for decades. More stuff breaks on our Rav4 than any other car I've owned in my life, except for maybe my wife's old Mini Cooper, haha.
Many consumers might not find the results credible, but the automakers sure do. I believe Tesla is the only volume automaker that doesn't subscribe to JD Power results. We don't see the detailed reports they receive, but the information is invaluable for any brand interested in improving their quality.
“The study examines how 2020 model-year vehicles are currently performing in terms of quality, component replacement and appeal.” And,“The study was redesigned in 2022 to include features and technology that are available in current vehicles. It now covers 184 specific problem areas across nine major vehicle categories: climate; driving assistance; driving experience; exterior; features/controls/displays; infotainment; interior; powertrain; and seats.”
The criteria Appeal and Driving experience seem extremely subjective to me. If someone taking the survey states “I need to take my eyes off the road for too long when I use the track pad,” does that count as a problem? Seems like a complaint to me.
Also, can someone double check my math? I took the average of the 2024 results, which excludes the “study Average of 190” and Tesla’s score of 252. I calculated an average score of 207.17, not 190 as JD Powers states. My math could be wrong, but I don’t think so. If JD Power can’t calculate a simple mean correctly, they have no credibility with me. For the record, my 2021 Acura has experienced ZERO problems. But wait, I hated the artificial, piped-in engine noise and disconnected that fake signal from underneath the center console. Does that count as a problem?
Also, can someone double check my math? I took the average of the 2024 results, which excludes the “study Average of 190” and Tesla’s score of 252. I calculated an average score of 207.17, not 190 as JD Powers states. My math could be wrong, but I don’t think so. If JD Power can’t calculate a simple mean correctly, they have no credibility with me.
You are trying to average a ratio, which doesn't work. Your calculation only works if the sample size for EVERY car make was 100 cars (it wasn't). Remember that the number we are looking at is "Problems per 100 cars"!
Originally Posted by Baldeagle
For the record, my 2021 Acura has experienced ZERO problems. But wait, I hated the artificial, piped-in engine noise and disconnected that fake signal from underneath the center console. Does that count as a problem?
Yes, it becomes a problem if you're ever in for warranty work and are denied because there was "tampering by the owner". If you ever need an example of gamesmanship by an Acura dealer, TSB work was denied for an RDX owner whose moonroof shattered due to "inappropriate" use of a canoe on the roof rails.
You are trying to average a ratio, which doesn't work. Your calculation only works if the sample size for EVERY car make was 100 cars (it wasn't). Remember that the number we are looking at is "Problems per 100 cars"!
Toyota and Lexus continue to be number 1. Its true, Lexus is a damn reliable car. My other car ES350 is 12 year old with 140K miles and had zero problems. The only thing its very boring to drive, but its rock solid.
02-09-2024, 12:25 PM
