iSeeYouTwo

If anyone needs a palm reading, lmk. I can see the future

xtcnrice

haha yeah I tried my best to ignore your comment

ssjoeboe9

ahhhhhh no haha now you're gunna lose everyone's interest because we started a new page with no pics!

xtcnrice

Story of my life on azine

iCrap

looks badass but how does it perform? stopping distances much better?

xtcnrice

I've been trying to brake very lightly, as per stupid EBC bedding instructions. First 100 miles stop as lightly as possible. Next 100-200 miles, bit harder at higher speeds, but still relatively light. Then eventually do the 10 consecutive hard stops and then cooling it off by driving. So, no idea on its true performance right now.

However, the pedal feels really good. I suspect this has more to do with the fluid flush than the pads/rotors/calipers themselves, though. Also, my pads are squealing when I get close to a full stop. I think it's temperature related... because it doesn't happen on cold start. Pretty annoying lol. Should go away after bedding process is complete.

Not gonna lie I did this mostly for the looks. And even though this comparison isn't scientific at all, I say it feels pretty good so far.

iCrap

oh lol... well after all that stuff see if you can do a 60-0 and get a rough idea of stopping distance. there are some sort-of-accurate phone apps.

which rotors did you put on? 350z ones?

guitarplayer16

iTrader: (8)

RL Calipers are not an upgrade, except for aesthetics.

Upset brake bias = more braking distance.
Nothing you can notice during normal driving, but in the event you need to slam on your brakes, you'll wish you had the stock calipers

You did it for looks though, and it looks amazing.

iCrap

They aren't? I thought they are 2 pot calipers with a much bigger pad?

Jaheri_cbp

^^Yeah dudes are road racing with those rl calipers, I just hear they are a fortune to rebuild in comparison to the tl-s brembos. You could always get the akebono 2 pots found on the type s cu2... But unless you know someone overseas that's your most expensive 2 pot option for factory Honda/Acura calipers.. I just hate that I will have to buy wheels to fit some bigger brakes.. Any of those three factory found two-pots are better for racing all day.. Dude may be saying that our big stock single piston calipers have better initial bite(which is mainly true).. Driving all day spiritually though or going to the track you will start to notice brake fade and glazing pretty quickly in comparison to the 2 pots

Edit: and yes they look hella cooler

guitarplayer16

iTrader: (8)

the bigger caliper/pad will help with brake fade.
nothing you'll experience unless you track the car or hit the windys often.

here's a good read if you're intrigued:
https://acurazine.com/forums/third-g...r-swap-920756/

That's comparing RL to Brembo calipers.
Compare it with base calipers, and it's even worse.

not saying xtcnrice wasted money, because he bought them for looks and that's all.
just wanted to share since you asked about performance

iCrap

hmm so repeated stops / fade will be improved but actual stopping distances are INCREASED.
Interesting.

xtcnrice

Yeah I bought em for looks, no doubt. Way easier/cheaper to swap than getting TL-S brembos on my car that's for sure. Plus, I like the raised Acura lettering lmao

And yeah like I said earlier, I have no scientific test to prove they are better than the stock TSX calipers. The pedal does feel better because I also got my fluid flushed at the same time so, ridconkulously biased haha

Thanks for the kind words all! If you want an actual brake upgrade. I say do what Jaheri suggested and get the Euro Type S 2 pots. But at a minimum, get better pads and SS brake lines if braking performance is your concern.

iCrap

I'm totally happy with my rotor, pad and fluid upgrade. the difference is night and day over the shit stock.

It's interesting though how this dosen't decrease stopping distance, I thought it would. apparently something like the StopTech kit DOES decrease stopping distance.. but why? It's the same basic thing right? Bigger rotor, caliper. It also changes the bias. So why does that decrease distance but the RL ones don't. I don't get it lol
Just thinking out loud ^

mrkxu

nice bro ! I bought mine from Markham Acura too lol

xtcnrice

From White Paper - Brake Bias and Performance- Why Brake Balance Matters

FastBrakes offers the 1G TSXs a bracket for the rear brakes to use a larger rotor. However, it uses the stock calipers, so pad size doesn't increase. I wonder if this upgrade has any real benefit when only the rear rotor size increases. I'd be interested in this if they could come up with a bracket for the 2G TSX, but I heard the rear brakes are different between the two cars, unlike the fronts.

edit: realized the product on their site is for "2004-2011" TSX. I guess the rear brakes are pretty much the same... unless there's something different with the parking brake between 1G and 2G.

xtcnrice

Oh yeah I may have missed this. Which pads/rotors/fluid did you get?

guitarplayer16

iTrader: (8)

The StopTech kit is marketed to retain stock braking bias.
It's not just the larger caliper and larger rotor size.

In the quote of my post above, it has to do with the caliper piston size.
The smaller piston size allows for a larger rotor, which I believe is how StopTech is able to retain stock bias.

xtcnrice, you can run harsher brake pads in the rear to help offset the bias.
Nothing really needed for a daily driver, though.

iCrap

Powerstop / posiquiet / Dot 3/4 (forgot the brand fluid, but it was high rated stuff). The difference is insane and 0 fade so far even with the way i drive. I was wanting to test stopping distance to see if that was better... but i forgot to take a measurement before i swapped it. oh well. I can feel for sure though, much.. much better.

So it seems the proper way to do a "real" BBK and decrease stopping distance would be front AND rear rotors and bigger calipers, and possibly even a new master cylinder.

xtcnrice

Yeah probably gonna skip that. I don't track the thing nor do I smash the brake pedal haha.. don't think I'll need it like you said but thanks!

xtcnrice

Finally washed her today... holy hell there was so much brake dust on my front wheels lol. Damn EBC redstuffs. The bite of these pads is great though.

guitarplayer16

iTrader: (8)

nice shots

xtcnrice

Oh gp16, you can't possibly mean that when your shots are literally 10000x better.

Shot with my iPhone lol. And unfortunately, I was too slow lol the Sienna photobombed my sharpest shot

AcuraRolling

+1 on the brake upgrade!

robpp

iTrader: (2)

A good visual of the pads should tell you.

Plan the 10 stop thing well. You need to cool them right after that.

They will smoke and fade some during it but that supposed to happen.

RSB is the best mod for the money.

xtcnrice

Thanks for the tip! I'll likely be doing the 10 stop procedure sometime next weekend. Probably like you said, in the morning on the freeway where the trucks are and just look like a lunatic

BROlando

If anyone is wondering about RL calipers....I wouldn't describe them as a "performance upgrade". But they do look good. And they did cure the brake pulsation on my 1G.

Don't use them on a race track. They'll all laugh at you, and you might crash.

Puppetmaster

Didn't see your updates until now. Really digging the rims, nice look for sure.

Janagan_ua7

looks good mann, beauty

fredster730

iTrader: (1)

Clean! I like

tredog00802

The brakes upgrade looks real nice.

iCrap

so smaller but more pistons = better bias and stopping distance? but wouldn't that still be putting the same amount of force onto the rotor as a larger piston? or no?

BROlando

Force = Area x PSI.

More area with the same piston travel also means more volume. So the pedal will need to travel further to fill the pistons.

A bunch of smaller pistons would put down the same force as 1 big piston...if the areas equal out.

Example: 1 piston that is 4" in diameter has an area of

4 x (Pi) = approx 12.56 sq.in

4 pistons with a 1" diameter = 12.56 sq. in area also.

That 4 piston caliper will retain the same amount of force as the caliper with one big piston. But it will spread the force more evenly over a larger pad area, and presumably a larger rotor. The force is the same...but the torque and friction will be greater.

So you're still moving bias up front. You're just retaining pedal travel (if the pistons don't need to move further), and force distribution.

kostantinos

iTrader: (1)

I installed the RL bbk and I can say there are +/-'s compared to oem.
*Note* even though mine were not a perfect setup because something was wrong they made grinding noises on hard stops (rotors? pads? haven't been able to figure it out.

Oem 2 piston have issues, they tend to warp or have build up resulting in vibration in steering and they don't stop all that great, but they have decent initial bite.

The RL I think are a little better overall because they stop better even though they have a little less bite upon startup. I don't think they are a major difference that you can say WOW!!, but they are better overall.

(My friend put AMG brakes on his e300 and when you hit the brakes, you literally lifted up and off of the seat, that's how powerfull they were. those I could say wow!!)

Many people did the rl swap with no issues using generic pads and rotors, I used Stoptech rotors and oem pads. Since I didn't want to mess with my RL setup anymore, I bought the Stoptech 328mm kit so I will let you guys know how that is compared to stock and to the RL swap.

BothKneesDown

Hey guys I'm considering upgrading my brakes but have a few questions:

1) what year RL bbk are you using? (what years can be used?)

2) the same question as #1 but applied to the TL Type-S bbk

3) where are you guys buying these? can you throw out some websites?

4) do these bbk's impact the wheels? did you have to buy different wheels to fit the bbk upgrade?

muchas gracias amigos!

iCrap

Well so the RL brakes won't actually increase stopping performance / decrease stopping distances. If that's what you want then you don't want this.

waaasobe

you guys just wait I'm going to xcc's house and robbing his setup tonight

BothKneesDown

i'm primarily concerned with looks. so my decision tree is looks, cost, then performance.

so what year RL and TL S bbk's should i be considering?

robpp

iTrader: (2)

the RL calipers are 06-12 IIRC.

then you need brackets. FFC is about 150 for a set.

if calipers need rebuild, each side SEAL KIT from ACURA is about 50 dollars best price.
could cheap out with china parts if you wish.

need a bigger rotor. 06 350Z with BREMBO PACKAGE is what I bought.

and most of the comments about NOT any difference are from peeps that do not have the BBK installed.

its a much larger pad area. a bigger stopping surface. cant be any worse. and looks

xtcnrice

robpp pretty much nailed it in the head. Except, I got it rebuilt not using OEM Acura RL seals. I went with the Carlson ones, which are much cheaper (~$10 shipped per caliper).
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Disc-Brake-Caliper-Repair-Kit-Front-CARLSON-15385-fits-05-12-Acura-RL-/301660264148?hash=item463c5a56d4&vxp=mtr
Not sure where they're made from; perhaps China. But, I doubt they will give you any problems. Rebuilding is highly recommended if you get your calipers off a junkyard RL that's been sitting around for a while, or an RL that has a lot of miles. Otherwise, it won't be necessary.

I also went with 350z brembo rotors (12.8" diameter), along with EBC redstuffs. The EBC redstuffs squeal pretty often (not all the time), but I suspect this is due to brake dust. I've done the bedding process recommended by EBC and it didn't improve. I Googled it and many cars using the redstuffs have the same issue even after bedding, so it's not an RL conversion specific problem. I added brake quiet paste to the back of the pads (the shims) and the squealing went away for like 3 days, but came back. I suspect it only went away because I wiped off the brake dust from the shims, and after 3 days the build up was significant enough to squeal once in a while again. If you want quiet and not dusty brakes, I suggest going with RL OEM pads. I'm not sure which brand these are though. You can check with your dealer.

DD braking has improved. However, I wouldn't recommend these if you plan on tracking your vehicle (which from the sounds of it you are NOT), as the brake bias is worse than the OEM setup I believe. This whole brake bias business I believe is only relevant for mashing on the brakes as hard as you can (with ABS of course). With daily driving, braking will feel improved as robpp mentioned that there's greater pad area.

I don't know much about the TL-S brembos, except the following:
- requires TL-S knuckles as they are not plug-and-play with a simple bracket
- brake bias isn't great on these either if you plan on tracking, but should be slightly better than the RL setup
- much more expensive setup compared to the RL setup
- the 3G TL brembos are not exclusive to the 3G TL-S; the 04-06 3G TL dynamic (basically 6MT) comes with the same brembos as well, but Type S wasn't offered until 07+