How come the new RL is not selling that well? What would you like to see changed?
07-20-2007, 05:14 PM
#281
Asian07RL
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Originally Posted by TampaRL
I would agree that a significant portion of people who buy for image will be heavily swayed by press and public opinion (even marketing).
Concerning the press: I read it. But more often then not I have found it does not summize what I like. They may feel we all want to drive the best performing vehicle this side of Grand Prix de Monaco, but frankly I find that too punishing for my daily drive. Each time I am stirred by press, I find the car falls short of MY expectations. My TL was the last vehicle I will buy on press reviews (and it was replaced by the RL). The press has been fair to the RL is some manners, and typical in others (needs a V8, blah, blah, blah). I think if people drove vehicles without knowing the cylinder number, I wonder how many would choose based on the feel as opposed to the perception? If the press had its way, we'd all be driving MB or BMW...*yawn*.
Next time I buy a car based on what other's say I should drive, they can write out the check. It is wise to include opinions, but the decision is mine. I cannot say how many people told me I should buy a MB, or BMW. I drove them, considered them and bought what appealed to me....an Acura RL. I don't lose any sleep needing affirmation of my decision. My affirmation is the smile I have everyday getting out of my RL and thinking I could have missed owning this car. My smile widens when I hear associates bitchining about their BMW or MB while riding to lunch in my RL. *suckers!*
Concerning the press: I read it. But more often then not I have found it does not summize what I like. They may feel we all want to drive the best performing vehicle this side of Grand Prix de Monaco, but frankly I find that too punishing for my daily drive. Each time I am stirred by press, I find the car falls short of MY expectations. My TL was the last vehicle I will buy on press reviews (and it was replaced by the RL). The press has been fair to the RL is some manners, and typical in others (needs a V8, blah, blah, blah). I think if people drove vehicles without knowing the cylinder number, I wonder how many would choose based on the feel as opposed to the perception? If the press had its way, we'd all be driving MB or BMW...*yawn*.
Next time I buy a car based on what other's say I should drive, they can write out the check. It is wise to include opinions, but the decision is mine. I cannot say how many people told me I should buy a MB, or BMW. I drove them, considered them and bought what appealed to me....an Acura RL. I don't lose any sleep needing affirmation of my decision. My affirmation is the smile I have everyday getting out of my RL and thinking I could have missed owning this car. My smile widens when I hear associates bitchining about their BMW or MB while riding to lunch in my RL. *suckers!*
No regret here.
07-21-2007, 09:58 AM
#282
Suzuka Master
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i think that people here should keep in mind that enthusiasts are the minority...and Acura didn't want to cater directly to us with the RL. Their plan was to cater to the masses but in turn, designed a "diamond in the rough" for current RL owners. But that's why it is not selling well...because the minority enthusaists are the ones that look at the car for what it is, not what someone or some magazine told them.
i think that the vast majority (non-car people) are heavily influenced by magazines and their "family enthusiast" (you know...the kid with all the exotic car posters on their walls that know next to jack about cars except that anything from Germany is cool).
i think that the vast majority (non-car people) are heavily influenced by magazines and their "family enthusiast" (you know...the kid with all the exotic car posters on their walls that know next to jack about cars except that anything from Germany is cool).
07-21-2007, 10:04 AM
#283
Suzuka Master
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Originally Posted by TampaRL
Yes and No.
The Legend was designed to be a Honda showcase car with global market tolerances. Acura had quite a bit of input into how to make the LEGEND appeal more to US flagship expectatons, however, much of that conflicted with other global markets. Primarily the engine. So what it came down to was content that was supposed to appeal to the US market and could be altered for other markets. But the primary engineering (styling, drivetrain, tranny) were compromised as to not require multiple foundations of the LEGEND.
The Legend was designed to be a Honda showcase car with global market tolerances. Acura had quite a bit of input into how to make the LEGEND appeal more to US flagship expectatons, however, much of that conflicted with other global markets. Primarily the engine. So what it came down to was content that was supposed to appeal to the US market and could be altered for other markets. But the primary engineering (styling, drivetrain, tranny) were compromised as to not require multiple foundations of the LEGEND.
I still question some of the things that Honda/Acura does...such as include cooled seats in the CANADIAN version of the RL but not the U.S. version. does anyone have an answer why yet, or is it one of those mysteries out of Honda? Or does the equator cross through way up north in Japan?
07-21-2007, 10:14 AM
#284
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
I still question some of the things that Honda/Acura does...such as include cooled seats in the CANADIAN version of the RL but not the U.S. version. does anyone have an answer why yet, or is it one of those mysteries out of Honda? Or does the equator cross through way up north in Japan?
I suppose they looked at the competition and the price range of such, and built and priced the RL accordingly. Acura must have decided the RL could not compete in the $60k price range in the U.S. so they had to eject some features to hit a price point. If I'm right about all this, then they probably made the right decision.
07-21-2007, 10:14 AM
#285
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
I still question some of the things that Honda/Acura does...such as include cooled seats in the CANADIAN version of the RL but not the U.S. version. does anyone have an answer why yet, or is it one of those mysteries out of Honda? Or does the equator cross through way up north in Japan?
07-21-2007, 12:12 PM
#286
07 RL (non-tech)w/06 Nav
I have owned a lot of leather seat cars...this is my first perforated leather seats. For me, these are the coolest temp seats. (I have never sat is an air cooled seat) I have the parchment color and they may help avoid the solar heat gain.
As for heated seats, all future cars of mine will have heated seats
As for heated seats, all future cars of mine will have heated seats
07-21-2007, 01:17 PM
#287
Suzuka Master
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I have heated/cooled seats in my M45.
The heated part sucks because it's blowing warm air at your ass instead of using hot pads or whatever.
The cooled setting works good though. It actually blows cooled air at your ass as opposed to just "ventilated" seats that blow ambient air. We had a s500 rental in switzerland a couple weeks ago that had "ventilated" seats, i guess it's better than nothing, but not work the extra cost if it's not actually cooled.
The heated part sucks because it's blowing warm air at your ass instead of using hot pads or whatever.
The cooled setting works good though. It actually blows cooled air at your ass as opposed to just "ventilated" seats that blow ambient air. We had a s500 rental in switzerland a couple weeks ago that had "ventilated" seats, i guess it's better than nothing, but not work the extra cost if it's not actually cooled.
07-21-2007, 05:04 PM
#288
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
I don't know the real reason, but if I had to place a bet, I'd say it has an economic reason. Everything in business boils down to that somewhere. Let's not forget, the RL in Canada sells for a substantial premium from the U.S. I think it's in the high $60's You want cooled seats? I guess you can go over to canada and buy one for $60k. Also, there are other nice features you get with the Candian version. Multi stage CMBS settings (if you have that feature), headlight washers, etc. Some of those mystery "blank buttons" on your RL are for those Canadian features. I have a top line RL with the CMBS package. I still have several blanks on my car
I suppose they looked at the competition and the price range of such, and built and priced the RL accordingly. Acura must have decided the RL could not compete in the $60k price range in the U.S. so they had to eject some features to hit a price point. If I'm right about all this, then they probably made the right decision.
I suppose they looked at the competition and the price range of such, and built and priced the RL accordingly. Acura must have decided the RL could not compete in the $60k price range in the U.S. so they had to eject some features to hit a price point. If I'm right about all this, then they probably made the right decision.
check it out here
At that price point it BETTER have cooled seats. By the way, there is a slight exchange rate difference but I think it's very minor (1/2% or less)
07-27-2007, 11:10 PM
#289
Kang Ho
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Wow, what a long thread. Good read though. The RL will be on my list the next time I buy a car 
Obviously I will need to do some mods, because it just looks like an old-man car.
Obviously I will need to do some mods, because it just looks like an old-man car.
10-03-2007, 06:22 PM
#290
Blind?
I love the LS 460 but the back does look like a Camry
Originally Posted by Rob L
Umm the LS430 sold well because it had killer luxury and reliability...you know, that is WHY PEOPLE BUY THESE CARS. Oh and it WAS more upscale than a Benz.
As for the current LS460 looking very much like the Camry...I see some say this and wonder if they need their eyes checked. The similarities between the two are that they have 4 wheels and doors and tailights and headlights and are both cars. To say they look alike is to say Kate Beckinsale looks very much like Naomi Watts, meaning they don't aside from both being females. I think both the Camry and LS460 look good but they don't look alike just like I think Kate and Naomi look good but not alike.
Oh and the reason they are getting interest in the LS460 is probably because it is the most luxurious and technologically advanced "real" production car (maybach and Bentleys excluded) out there. Show me another luxury car that is more advanced than the LS460.
See, the problem with Acura fans is they have no clue why people buy luxury cars and think it is based on looks or handling when it is usually because of the LUXURY or the prestige/name. People at car forums need to clue in that they aren't the majority and think in the mind of most buyers.
The RL is not selling well simply because it is an Acura. If it was under any of the big name luxo brands it'd be selling very well.
As an RL owner I for one don't care if it is selling well as I like it being unique. However, if I had the cash I'd trade it in a heartbeat for the new LS460 L if/when they put AWD on that car because there the new LS looks like it easily trumps the RL in terms of luxury.
As for the current LS460 looking very much like the Camry...I see some say this and wonder if they need their eyes checked. The similarities between the two are that they have 4 wheels and doors and tailights and headlights and are both cars. To say they look alike is to say Kate Beckinsale looks very much like Naomi Watts, meaning they don't aside from both being females. I think both the Camry and LS460 look good but they don't look alike just like I think Kate and Naomi look good but not alike.
Oh and the reason they are getting interest in the LS460 is probably because it is the most luxurious and technologically advanced "real" production car (maybach and Bentleys excluded) out there. Show me another luxury car that is more advanced than the LS460.
See, the problem with Acura fans is they have no clue why people buy luxury cars and think it is based on looks or handling when it is usually because of the LUXURY or the prestige/name. People at car forums need to clue in that they aren't the majority and think in the mind of most buyers.
The RL is not selling well simply because it is an Acura. If it was under any of the big name luxo brands it'd be selling very well.
As an RL owner I for one don't care if it is selling well as I like it being unique. However, if I had the cash I'd trade it in a heartbeat for the new LS460 L if/when they put AWD on that car because there the new LS looks like it easily trumps the RL in terms of luxury.
10-03-2007, 09:01 PM
#291
I have to chime in to get this off my chest.
My family has bought lexus cars for the past 10 years and when I told the g.m., who's a family friend, he told me, "Acura thinks they're luxury, but the company is confused. They're kind of inbetween in a no mans land. If you want that then go for it. But it's no LEXUS (with a proud arrogant tone)."
After I bought my TL-S I called him to say, "I got a TL-S instead of the IS350 and I love it, and when I go snowboarding in the mountains I'll really love it"
I would never ever buy an RL though. My perception of the RL is an old man's car. Compared to other cars for the price there is no fun factor like BMW's M, no prestige if I wanted it like Benz or Lexus, and like someone said before the back looks like a civic. Just my honest opinion.
My family has bought lexus cars for the past 10 years and when I told the g.m., who's a family friend, he told me, "Acura thinks they're luxury, but the company is confused. They're kind of inbetween in a no mans land. If you want that then go for it. But it's no LEXUS (with a proud arrogant tone)."
After I bought my TL-S I called him to say, "I got a TL-S instead of the IS350 and I love it, and when I go snowboarding in the mountains I'll really love it"
I would never ever buy an RL though. My perception of the RL is an old man's car. Compared to other cars for the price there is no fun factor like BMW's M, no prestige if I wanted it like Benz or Lexus, and like someone said before the back looks like a civic. Just my honest opinion.
10-03-2007, 09:46 PM
#292
07 RL (non-tech)w/06 Nav
let me tell you something young man, i may be an old man but I am cool and so is my AK. don't look, but I bet you there is a lot of people that feel the same way i do!
10-03-2007, 09:50 PM
#293
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by spiike
I have to chime in to get this off my chest.
My family has bought lexus cars for the past 10 years and when I told the g.m., who's a family friend, he told me, "Acura thinks they're luxury, but the company is confused. They're kind of inbetween in a no mans land. If you want that then go for it. But it's no LEXUS (with a proud arrogant tone)."
After I bought my TL-S I called him to say, "I got a TL-S instead of the IS350 and I love it, and when I go snowboarding in the mountains I'll really love it"
I would never ever buy an RL though. My perception of the RL is an old man's car. Compared to other cars for the price there is no fun factor like BMW's M, no prestige if I wanted it like Benz or Lexus, and like someone said before the back looks like a civic. Just my honest opinion.
My family has bought lexus cars for the past 10 years and when I told the g.m., who's a family friend, he told me, "Acura thinks they're luxury, but the company is confused. They're kind of inbetween in a no mans land. If you want that then go for it. But it's no LEXUS (with a proud arrogant tone)."
After I bought my TL-S I called him to say, "I got a TL-S instead of the IS350 and I love it, and when I go snowboarding in the mountains I'll really love it"
I would never ever buy an RL though. My perception of the RL is an old man's car. Compared to other cars for the price there is no fun factor like BMW's M, no prestige if I wanted it like Benz or Lexus, and like someone said before the back looks like a civic. Just my honest opinion.
here it is, far from an old mans car
10-03-2007, 10:23 PM
#294
cheifin
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Originally Posted by csmeance
Old mans car, have yo useen the Mugen RL????
here it is, far from an old mans car
here it is, far from an old mans car
10-04-2007, 05:25 AM
#295
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by spiike
My perception of the RL is an old man's car.
Go to the Photo Gallery and look. And as to the Mugen RL posted above, the body kit and wheels are indeed available for purchase.
10-04-2007, 08:42 PM
#296
2nd Gear
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- bigger trunk
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
10-05-2007, 06:10 AM
#297
07 RL (non-tech)w/06 Nav
Originally Posted by kirko
- bigger trunk
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
The only reason this is an "old mans car" is that the young punks can't afford 40k to buy one. Old mans car list....Crown Victoria, Lincoln Town Car, Buick Lucerne, Buick LaCrosse, almost all Cadillacs, E series MB,
I hate to mention this to the group but I did come to the conclussion that the second generation TL was a "women's car". In my area 75% are driven by females. As for the RL I have seen about 50 so far in my travels, only one was driven by a woman.
10-05-2007, 06:45 AM
#298
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
Originally Posted by larrynimmo
The only reason this is an "old mans car" is that the young punks can't afford 40k to buy one.
I am amused by posters who seek out forums where they post a slam or a backhanded compliment to a topic or community they claim they have no interest / desire / affinity. The motivation behind it is soley self serving.
10-06-2007, 05:11 AM
#299
Instructor
While I might be pushing 50, I sure don't feel old, and sure as heck don’t drive like an old man,
I love that the RL is stealthy, but more importantly, that it has very, very good performance for a 4000 Lbs. luxury car.
It can be thrown into curves at speeds that rival what I can do in my WRX
The benefits SH-AWD confers to the performance equation is often underappreciated, as many drivers, especially during a test drive, never get to really experience the magic it can do.
The balance of performance and fuel economy is also important to some of us. Yes, I lust after the motor in a BMW M5 or Audi S6, but I'm happy with 300HP AND >22 Mpg avg.
This motor lets me go more than fast enough on my routes, and lets me execute passing maneuvers with short runways with no concerns.
The MPG over a V8 saves me over $800 a year in gas costs, or more if gas keeps going up.
And for the tree-hugger inside, it’s a ULEV vehicle.
The big plus: it's not a cop magnet. I can be doing +15 MPH, but it's the bimmer behind me that gets nabbed
Oh, and insurance, its unbelievably cheap on this car. Go check what insuring that M5 would cost you, jeez.
Bottom line, I'll stick with anonymous styling and a V6 in exchange for all the other benefits.
I love that the RL is stealthy, but more importantly, that it has very, very good performance for a 4000 Lbs. luxury car.
It can be thrown into curves at speeds that rival what I can do in my WRX
The benefits SH-AWD confers to the performance equation is often underappreciated, as many drivers, especially during a test drive, never get to really experience the magic it can do.
The balance of performance and fuel economy is also important to some of us. Yes, I lust after the motor in a BMW M5 or Audi S6, but I'm happy with 300HP AND >22 Mpg avg.
This motor lets me go more than fast enough on my routes, and lets me execute passing maneuvers with short runways with no concerns.
The MPG over a V8 saves me over $800 a year in gas costs, or more if gas keeps going up.
And for the tree-hugger inside, it’s a ULEV vehicle.
The big plus: it's not a cop magnet. I can be doing +15 MPH, but it's the bimmer behind me that gets nabbed
Oh, and insurance, its unbelievably cheap on this car. Go check what insuring that M5 would cost you, jeez.
Bottom line, I'll stick with anonymous styling and a V6 in exchange for all the other benefits.
10-06-2007, 06:42 AM
#300
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by kirko
- bigger trunk
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
- more torque
- touch screen
- iPod integration (actually more like iTouch integration)
- solid state (flash) harddrive and wifi connectivity, having a DVD-ROM in the trunk is ridiculous
Almost bought the GS... but it laked the styling.. and was thinking seriously about the M35
Yup. That's a fair laundry list. The trunk needs to be a little bigger, and LOW-end torque needs improved.
Don't worry about the touch screen, you'll get used to the knob soon enough. It's not bad at all, though after I've been driving our Pilot (which has a touch-screen navi) there is an adjustment required.
You can plug your iTouch into your 2007-up RL with the RCA port included in the center console. I do get your point, however--it'd be nice to have an iTouch-like system in the navi, AND have it as touch screen.
Given that we have 8 GB SD and SDHC cards (e.g. enough to hold all the current navi information), I think that step is coming.
I also strongly considered the M35 and chose to stay in the Acura fold. I chose all-around feature set over low-end torque and more aggressive styling.
10-06-2007, 08:33 AM
#302
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
Originally Posted by NavyDoc333
.... how about making one that doesn't burn oil. Sorry... beating a dead horse. I'll stop now! 
Doc, ya gotta do what ya gotta do. I hope you won't be a stranger here.
I'm sorry your RL had issues, it doesn't seem to be the norm, and unfortunately your experience has not been the same as most here. I feel disappointed for you.
In all fairness, every mass produced vehicle with have flaws and some percentage of lemons. I agree that Acura brushed you off. But Lexus, though coddling in the Service arena is not all altrusitic either. In my family, we have had 2 tranny failures with current models of Toyota and Lexus. One of which was a GS. That was sis' car....and Lexus did not acknowledge there was a problem after 4 service calls and until the GS had her stranded on the side of the road. I remember her ranting that no amount of expresso would compensate for Lexus denial of the tranny issues.
She now drives an RL, and although the service dept only offers Starbucks and muffins, she has had no need to go in for service. Next up, the Avalon LTD is treading on thin ice. I am taking my brother to car shop this weekend. The RL is on the list! We could be a 3 RL family (from an admitted Toyota / Lexus cult) before long.
No model or brand is perfect. Sometimes you just have to decide what makes you happy, bite the bullet and move on. Doc, I truly hope the GS gives you no problems and you are giddy with the car and the Lexus experience. You deserve it.
10-06-2007, 09:45 AM
#303
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by TampaRL
Doc, ya gotta do what ya gotta do. I hope you won't be a stranger here.
I'm sorry your RL had issues, it doesn't seem to be the norm, and unfortunately your experience has not been the same as most here. I feel disappointed for you.
In all fairness, every mass produced vehicle with have flaws and some percentage of lemons. I agree that Acura brushed you off. But Lexus, though coddling in the Service arena is not all altrusitic either. In my family, we have had 2 tranny failures with current models of Toyota and Lexus. One of which was a GS. That was sis' car....and Lexus did not acknowledge there was a problem after 4 service calls and until the GS had her stranded on the side of the road. I remember her ranting that no amount of expresso would compensate for Lexus denial of the tranny issues.
She now drives an RL, and although the service dept only offers Starbucks and muffins, she has had no need to go in for service. Next up, the Avalon LTD is treading on thin ice. I am taking my brother to car shop this weekend. The RL is on the list! We could be a 3 RL family (from an admitted Toyota / Lexus cult) before long.
No model or brand is perfect. Sometimes you just have to decide what makes you happy, bite the bullet and move on. Doc, I truly hope the GS gives you no problems and you are giddy with the car and the Lexus experience. You deserve it.
I'm sorry your RL had issues, it doesn't seem to be the norm, and unfortunately your experience has not been the same as most here. I feel disappointed for you.
In all fairness, every mass produced vehicle with have flaws and some percentage of lemons. I agree that Acura brushed you off. But Lexus, though coddling in the Service arena is not all altrusitic either. In my family, we have had 2 tranny failures with current models of Toyota and Lexus. One of which was a GS. That was sis' car....and Lexus did not acknowledge there was a problem after 4 service calls and until the GS had her stranded on the side of the road. I remember her ranting that no amount of expresso would compensate for Lexus denial of the tranny issues.
She now drives an RL, and although the service dept only offers Starbucks and muffins, she has had no need to go in for service. Next up, the Avalon LTD is treading on thin ice. I am taking my brother to car shop this weekend. The RL is on the list! We could be a 3 RL family (from an admitted Toyota / Lexus cult) before long.
No model or brand is perfect. Sometimes you just have to decide what makes you happy, bite the bullet and move on. Doc, I truly hope the GS gives you no problems and you are giddy with the car and the Lexus experience. You deserve it.
I'm not trying to make you feel bad, but I'm trying to speak to anyone else who might find themselves in that same situation in the future. This is a machine. Don't love it or hate it, because it can't love or hate you back. In other words, don't let emotion drive your decisions.
10-06-2007, 03:49 PM
#304
Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
Yea, we all surely wish you luck with the switch, but, I can't help thinking you jumped the gun a bit Navy. First, the car was still fully under warranty. Second, this benign problem wasn't effecting drivability. Third, you could always have sold it just before warranty expired and accomplished the same thing with less out of pocket cost. Fourth, it cost you a lot of money to sell that car only to trade it in for something with almost twice the mileage.
I'm not trying to make you feel bad, but I'm trying to speak to anyone else who might find themselves in that same situation in the future. This is a machine. Don't love it or hate it, because it can't love or hate you back. In other words, don't let emotion drive your decisions.
I'm not trying to make you feel bad, but I'm trying to speak to anyone else who might find themselves in that same situation in the future. This is a machine. Don't love it or hate it, because it can't love or hate you back. In other words, don't let emotion drive your decisions.
I hear you spicy, but, for me, money isn't as big of an issue as serentiy. I looked at my Acura as a 18mo lease. When I was driving my new car this morning... I had a huge smile on my face, and that's what I've been missing. My last GS was 11yrs old when I sold it, and I still loved driving it... maybe I'm just a 'Lexus guy'. This was an emotional decision, but so was my decision to marry my wife...and that one worked out pretty good so far. After all... she did let me get my Lexus back.
10-06-2007, 05:32 PM
#305
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by NavyDoc333
I hear you spicy, but, for me, money isn't as big of an issue as serentiy. I looked at my Acura as a 18mo lease. When I was driving my new car this morning... I had a huge smile on my face, and that's what I've been missing. My last GS was 11yrs old when I sold it, and I still loved driving it... maybe I'm just a 'Lexus guy'. This was an emotional decision, but so was my decision to marry my wife...and that one worked out pretty good so far. After all... she did let me get my Lexus back.
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