I'm sitting at the dealership trying to get a newly ebay purchased #2 driver key fob programmed. They can't program it because a code comes back that another key fob is detected. They can't call Acura because it's Saturday. Me and 3 techs searched everywhere for the old #2. No luck. I bought the RL with only a #1fob. Does anyone have any experience with this?

 

It's likely in your car. Check the guide rails of the front seats and under the back seat. Does the car start with no fob in the car?

 

I bought my RL with 2x remotes, and lo and behold, lost the driver 2 fob the day I purchased it, haha. Luckily I got one for cheap off of eBay, brought it in, and the dealer's only concern was that the fob had too much memory on it, and in order to program it, they would need to reprogram both of my remotes. After a little haggling and sweet talking, I got the price down from $180 for programming to $50. Hopefully they resolve your issue, but oo7spy is onto something; they probably wouldn't be able to program the car's remote(s) if one is present in the car without your knowledge.

 

No the car will not start with no fob. The dealer says that even with a dead battery in the hidden #2, it will still be detected therefore not allowing the new one to be programmed. But I tell you we looked really hard. We even did the hand check and of the 4 the guy with the smallest hand got to feel under the seat. I can't seem to reach everywhere and I'm contemplating trying to loosen the seat bolts to better check. Maybe a strong magnet???

 

I assume you have looked in the "hidden" manual compartment at the top of the glove box

Does the car have remote start? Wondering if the reprogram issue is with chip in the key portion of the fob? Then you would be looking for a key rather than a whole fob

 

Yup, I checked the hidden box in the glove box. But I did have one of those door keys that will only open the door in the car but they aren't chipped, right?

 

no the chip is in the key

so, you must have the key out of the missing fob, but I'm still unclear whether the key (chip) is preventing programming or the fob. Hard for me to believe that a fob with bad battery can be detected

 

So there is a chip in the door access key? This key I have does not fit into the fob, it will only open the door.

I asked the dealer how a dead fob could be detected and he said it could but I'm not so sure he really knows.

I'll call the dealer tomorrow to explain the access key before he calls Acura.

 

the key does not fit into the fob?
never heard of a door access key

In the fob1 that you have that works, can you push the button and pull out a key from the fob? this is the key that has the chip

 

This access key does not go with the fob and doesn't fit a fob. I have the key for the fob. This is different and the dealer made this for me years ago to get inside the car without a fob. It looks like a regular key.

 

ok, got it. custom key. Doubt if it has chip in it then

so the other fob (or key from that fob) has to be in the car somewhere

 

The physical key in the fob has an RFID chip in it that is different than the fob chip. This chip doesn't have a replaceable battery, so I can believe that a dead fob battery won't change the affect of the physical key chip. However, if the car can't pick it up, how can the HDS? Their story doesn't add up.

Megatron knows the most (that I know of) about the HDS and fobs around here. Shoot him a PM and see if he can clarify.

 

After reading the whole thread, I have to agree with everyone that there has to be a fob in the car. A custom physical key that only opens the door will not be detectable by the car. The physical key that is a part of the fob (the one that can actually start the car) has an immobilizer chip in it that works without a battery, but it can only be detected by the immobilizer antenna in the ignition switch. In other words, having just the physical key in the car somewhere will NOT stop the HDS from programming the fob. In fact, it is a 2 step programming process... one is to program the fob to allow it to open/lock the car and keyless start. Second is to program the physical key to allow the immobilizer to recognize it to also let it start the car. You can do only one of the two if you want.

The 1st step in the programming of the fob is to remove ALL fobs from the car. If it detects any fob inside (programmed to your car or not), it will error out and not let you continue. This is what it sounds like is happening. Since you can't start the car without your fob in the car, there is either an unprogrammed fob in your car somewhere OR it could theoretically be a screwed up ECU... although I would tend to believe the former.

So bottom line is... they are the dealer. They should be able to figure it out! But I would search high and low in every seam. Take out the rear seat bench (not too hard to do) and unbolt the front seats if you have to. It's gotta be in there somewhere.

Good luck!

By the way, the bit from the dealer about the car being able to detect the fob even if the battery is dead is BS. If the battery in the fob is truly dead, the car CANNOT detect it. It's not like the passive physical key. The FOB can be detected ONLY when it has power. Problem is, it's unlikely the batteries in any fob would wear down any time soon if it's just sitting in the car.

 

I was thinking about the spare (dumb) key last night. If the immobilizer needs the passive chip to start the car, the spare key won't start the car alone (what Megatron said stated differently).

OP, when you say the car won't start without a fob, how did you check this? Using the knob? If that is the case, then the spare would indeed have to have the passive chip.

 

OP - thought of another place to look as I was cleaning out my RL.

There's a false bottom in the front center drink holder. There's a button at the front of it that will release the bottom and it folds up. Not entirely sure if the bottom will close with the fob in there, but looks possible. (I didn't try it)

 

OP, when you say the car won't start without a fob, how did you check this? Using the knob? If that is the case, then the spare would indeed have to have the passive chip.[/QUOTE]

I just try to start it with the #1 away from the car, if I understand your question.

 

I am aware of that spot.

 

Thanks Megatron, I have looked everywhere. I think I got the front seats well looked at but will pull the back seat bench. I searched the trunk as best I can but I'm worried about the two removable access panels on each side. If they dropped a fob in there it would be difficult to find. Maybe my daughter has small enough hands to reach around inside. Eeewww, Dad! Too bad there isn't a fob finder instrument! I appreciate any other suggestions on where to find a hidden fob.

I don't understand if their computer recognizes it, why won't it start the car? It's so unlikely it would be a non-programmed fob.

 

I will not be in the trunk. The RL will not permit the trunk to close with the fob inside. It will sound an alert (a few rapid beeps) and the trunk will open.

Further, the transmitter (fob) is operational inside the cabin of the car. Per the manual:

The engine may not run, and some
malfunctions may occur, if the
remote is:
The engine may not start if the
remote is subjected to strong radio
waves.
Also, the engine may not start if the
remote is too close to the windows.
Outside the vehicle.
On the dashboard.
On the rear interior panel.
In the glove box.
In the door pockets.
In the trunk, etc.
Keyless Access System
Ignition Switch Operating Range (inside cabin)

Make sure you know where the remote
is when you are inside the vehicle.
Remember that you can start the engine
without using the built-in key when the
remote is inside the vehicle.
Make sure you always carry the remote
with you.
If you lose your remote, call Acura
Client Services at (800) 382-2238 (U.S.
models


The fob is a transmitter the car must recognize, but that frequency alone is no secure. The fob + the chipped key must be inside the cabin for the combination that unlocks the ignition. Think of the fob as your debit card and the chipped key as the PIN. The car needs both to crank.

Perhaps the previous owner tried to rig some sort of remote ignition device and hid the fob under the dash but removed the internal chipped key.

 

Tampa - I believe the remote start scenario is the opposite. Requires the chipped key to be hidden without the fob

 

I understand and agree, which is why I said they may have tried to 'rig' something.

I have read some pretty convoluted attempts to make a remote starter override the RLs security controls.

 

If the fob is not programmed to the car, the trunk will let you close it in.

 

good point, but I cannot find any documentation supporting that. Shall we get Q on it?

 

that would be not "programmed" as opposed to not "paired"

can't see how original fob could get locked in trunk in this situation

 

Try looking inside the plastic covers on the base of the seat, and where the reclining mechanism is. Could imagine it sliding out of a pocket.

Assuming you checked the door pockets, and seat back pockets as well (probably about 50 times by now!).

Many years ago I had some keys slip out of my pocket in my '95 Legend, and it took more than a half hour to even find them -- and I was there when it happened. There are many strange places a key fob can hide in a seat mechanism. Plus its dark under there.

Waiting to hear how this turns out.

 

I will look inside the covers, again. I hope to get time tomorrow to look under the dash again. What a pita. I sweated it out with only one fob for a long time, now I get another and can't program it. I will really be up the creek if i lose my only functioning #1 fob.

 

Looked again, no luck. Very discouraging. I was unable to lift the back seat bench out. Any suggestions on how? Tricks? Usually I can just pull up from where it snaps in.

 

Are you positive the Dealer knows what he is doing?
As I understand it, you cannot start the car without having your known fob in the car. However, Dealer says there is another lost fob that is recognized in the car when they try to program new fob.
Thus, the lost fob has the chipped key removed from it or the fob is not programmed. Seems unlikely that damage would cause fob to become unprogrammed but still recognizable.

That seems odd to me.

 

Well that's what I'm thinking, the lost fob has to be deactivated due to dead battery or whatever. But how is it as the dealer says the car won't recognize it but their HDS does?

 

exactly - as megatron pointed out, fob with dead battery will not be recognized, thus has to be fob that was not programmed which seems highly unlikely

 

https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-rl-audio-bluetooth-electronics-navigation-90/diy-amp-wire-backseat-removal-813630/

 

I had one fob slide down past lid on the cup holder. had the dealer remove the center stack and retrieve it

 

So the dealer contacted me today. They have found out through Acura that their HDS can deprogram the lost FOB and my two FOBs then reprogram #1 & #2. I didn't ask what that would cost me but they handled my dilemma well up till now, so hopefully I won't get bent. I hope it works, it's a 300 mile rt to town with frost heaves as big as houses.

 

Man thanks for the link. If I had pulled up any harder I would have broke those plastic clips.

 

If they say they can do that, it means they didn't know what they were doing the first time and there really is no other fob detectable in the car. The HDS will absolutely not allow you to program any fobs if it detects one in the car. I have personally done this on the HDS many times. Think about it, if during programming, there are 2 live fobs in the cabin, how would it know which it should program?? The process to add fobs can be done one of two ways... You either simply add a fob in which case it keeps all existing and just adds one or the other way is it wipes all known fobs from memory and you program new from scratch. Sounds like they are doing the second method. In both cases, the first step in the process is to remove all fobs from the car.

Anyways I hope they succeed and there really is no hidden fob in the car. Good luck!

 

I don't know if they can but I gotta try it. I'll give a report in a week or so after I come up with some excuses to go to town. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

 

So a week turned into a couple months but I finally got in to the dealer. Their solution was to deprogram all fobs and start over. That included the lost or hidden fob. It worked and I am a happy camper. They also cut the new fob key. It all cost about $125. They gave me a discount, some kind of geezer program or vintage car discount program.