Innovative motor mount discussion. **New mount info on page 13**
10-28-2008, 09:24 PM
#843
Lead Footed
I just got back today and did get a hold of Tim. There are 2 different things that we'll pursue at this point.
First, regarding the 3rd gen mounts . . . Tim said these should soften up some so give it a couple of weeks and see if it does. Since I was out for a few days I've not been driving it. Today was just the 3rd day with them, but I can say other than the vibrations, these feel even better than the black ones on the 2nd gen mount, so I'm willing to give them some time and see if it works out.
Secondly, IM is also working on yet another version of the horizontal mount design and I''ll give that a go if the others don't work out.
Sigh, so . . . we're still not there, but I hope that the ones Sentinel has work out. There is one major concern I now have with the horizontal mount is that the stress point is a small surface area hitting on the inside of the bushing when it really should work like the 3rd gen design I now have. My concern is that the bushing will fail prematurely and we could be replacing bushings on a regular basis . . . say 6 months or a bit more.
Ruf
First, regarding the 3rd gen mounts . . . Tim said these should soften up some so give it a couple of weeks and see if it does. Since I was out for a few days I've not been driving it. Today was just the 3rd day with them, but I can say other than the vibrations, these feel even better than the black ones on the 2nd gen mount, so I'm willing to give them some time and see if it works out.
Secondly, IM is also working on yet another version of the horizontal mount design and I''ll give that a go if the others don't work out.
Sigh, so . . . we're still not there, but I hope that the ones Sentinel has work out. There is one major concern I now have with the horizontal mount is that the stress point is a small surface area hitting on the inside of the bushing when it really should work like the 3rd gen design I now have. My concern is that the bushing will fail prematurely and we could be replacing bushings on a regular basis . . . say 6 months or a bit more.
Ruf
10-28-2008, 11:12 PM
#844
What to do, what to think
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I'm giving IM 6 more months with the new design, if it doesn't work out then I'm going to get new OEM mounts. I've been ichin' to get IM mounts
10-29-2008, 07:26 AM
#845
I would just f them & get stock mounts. There designs just don't work with our cars setup.
I think Polly filling the stock mounts is sufficient.
If it wasn't for Ruff & a few others IM wouldn't be messing with this. I really don't see why IM is still trying to work this out. It must be costing them $. And it's trashing their name & customer service having fail after fail designs. It's been almost a year since they starting making them.
I think Polly filling the stock mounts is sufficient.
If it wasn't for Ruff & a few others IM wouldn't be messing with this. I really don't see why IM is still trying to work this out. It must be costing them $. And it's trashing their name & customer service having fail after fail designs. It's been almost a year since they starting making them.
10-30-2008, 02:17 AM
#848
What to do, what to think
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I would just f them & get stock mounts. There designs just don't work with our cars setup.
I think Polly filling the stock mounts is sufficient.
If it wasn't for Ruff & a few others IM wouldn't be messing with this. I really don't see why IM is still trying to work this out. It must be costing them $. And it's trashing their name & customer service having fail after fail designs. It's been almost a year since they starting making them.
I think Polly filling the stock mounts is sufficient.
If it wasn't for Ruff & a few others IM wouldn't be messing with this. I really don't see why IM is still trying to work this out. It must be costing them $. And it's trashing their name & customer service having fail after fail designs. It's been almost a year since they starting making them.
https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-cl-2001-2003-50/polyurethane-motor-mounts-w-pictures-479527/
10-30-2008, 12:54 PM
#849
Kilos of yayo in
I'm with you fuzzy. I believe CleanCL and 02AV6 did the poly filling setup with minimal vibrations at normal idle. here's the thread I searched
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=479527
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=479527
10-30-2008, 06:40 PM
#850
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So i called up IM and told them that the design was definitely improved but since i started to feel vibrations the bushing seems to be the culprit now. They think the red bushings are likely not appropriate for our cars.
Ruf they are waiting for your perception of the verticals and to go from there. Looks like were moving along.
Ruf they are waiting for your perception of the verticals and to go from there. Looks like were moving along.
10-30-2008, 10:37 PM
#851
Lead Footed
10-31-2008, 06:32 PM
#855
Uses turn signals in my
10-31-2008, 09:34 PM
#856
Safety Car
From a practical perspective, the 2G TL and 3G TL mounts are nearly identical except for how the mount bolts to the alumunium bracket.
11-07-2008, 10:42 PM
#857
I put the stock rear & front mounts back on. OMG rides like a new car. So smooth!
Never again with these. Here's a pic of the messed up rear mount bushing..
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
Never again with these. Here's a pic of the messed up rear mount bushing..
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
11-08-2008, 12:38 PM
#859
Senior Moderator
I think the mount location has a huge effect on the problem. There needs to be something higher up to help keep the motor from moving so much and destroying the mounts and eliminate a lot of the engine motion Thats what some one needs to work on
11-08-2008, 01:50 PM
#860
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
are you volunteering kris? 
seriously though, any specifics to your recommendation? do you know any 2nd gen cl or tl ppl who live in your area?
seriously though, any specifics to your recommendation? do you know any 2nd gen cl or tl ppl who live in your area?
11-08-2008, 08:08 PM
#862
Safety Car
I am "this close" to taking mine out of my 3G. Now that the newness has worn off (honeymoon period), I am questioning if the benefits are worth the vibration and drooning.
11-15-2008, 02:59 PM
#864
Senior Moderator
As for specifics, if you ever opened the hood on a GM FWD car they have "dog bones" in front of the motor to help quell the rocking motion of the motor. It works and works well. Im thinking of trying something like that.
Unfortunately there arent many near by. one CL guy (which i havent met in person yet) the rest are over a hr away.
11-15-2008, 05:24 PM
#865
'03 ABP YA4-S 6MT
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I may actually try something i have in mind as soon as im done painting my dads truck.
As for specifics, if you ever opened the hood on a GM FWD car they have "dog bones" in front of the motor to help quell the rocking motion of the motor. It works and works well. Im thinking of trying something like that.
Unfortunately there arent many near by. one CL guy (which i havent met in person yet) the rest are over a hr away.
As for specifics, if you ever opened the hood on a GM FWD car they have "dog bones" in front of the motor to help quell the rocking motion of the motor. It works and works well. Im thinking of trying something like that.
Unfortunately there arent many near by. one CL guy (which i havent met in person yet) the rest are over a hr away.
and if GM uses it on their 5.3L V8 (which produces MUCH MORE torque than our cars) how would you fabricate that onto another engine though? haha..
11-15-2008, 05:35 PM
#866
Lead Footed
sigh . . . 
yes and a bit more. I've tried getting a hold of IM the end of last week and then again this week. Left 2 messages and no return calls yet.
So, with the current state of my problems - in case you missed my posts about this else where . . . my tranny is going south and I'm taking it in Monday to have it confirmed and replaced.
While they are at it, I'm going to check on having them replace the rear mount with an OEM mount. I'd normally do it myself, but the rear OEM is a
to remove and install.
That's my thought at this point. That's based on an assumption that the vibration problems with the rear (and this car) won't be fix . . at least soon enough for me to deal with the constant delays. It's been about 1 year since we started with this and we've only solved 2 of the 3 mounts.
The only good news out of this is that the side mount and front mount help a bunch, but I will reconfirm that once I get the OEM rear installed and then see how it all works out.
I will update ya'll early next week . . . the Fat Lady is warming up.
Ruf
yes and a bit more. I've tried getting a hold of IM the end of last week and then again this week. Left 2 messages and no return calls yet. So, with the current state of my problems - in case you missed my posts about this else where . . . my tranny is going south and I'm taking it in Monday to have it confirmed and replaced.
While they are at it, I'm going to check on having them replace the rear mount with an OEM mount. I'd normally do it myself, but the rear OEM is a
to remove and install. That's my thought at this point. That's based on an assumption that the vibration problems with the rear (and this car) won't be fix . . at least soon enough for me to deal with the constant delays. It's been about 1 year since we started with this and we've only solved 2 of the 3 mounts.
The only good news out of this is that the side mount and front mount help a bunch, but I will reconfirm that once I get the OEM rear installed and then see how it all works out.
I will update ya'll early next week . . . the Fat Lady is warming up.
Ruf
11-15-2008, 05:42 PM
#867
Lead Footed
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
that doesn't make sense. I can remove and install both mounts in less than an hour with basic tools. They must be doing something wrong.Now, if they were referring to the removal of the OEM mount, then I'd agree that is a pain.
Anyway, sorry they had problems as you ended up paying extra for it. By the way, that's why I may have the dealer install the OEM rear while they are doing the tranny . . . assuming they don't
on the cost.Ruf
11-15-2008, 10:29 PM
#868
Uses turn signals in my
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
11-15-2008, 11:40 PM
#869
Lead Footed
I recall Scalbert or someone made a tension based bar to reduce the amount of engine movement. But I think I recall that the placement of the mounting was not ideal. The tension design has some merit as it reduces the amount of movement, but isn't a rigid bar that would likely result in some vibration.
I'll take a look this coming week and check and see if there are any good placements for something like that. If there is, I may approach IM and have them finalize a design for the front. . the sides good now, and then see if they can create some sort of tension bar for us. And then offer it free to those who bought the full sets. I think something like that with OEM rear and IM front and sides could be just the ticket.
Ruf
11-16-2008, 03:17 AM
#870
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I'm inclined to agree. I'm believing more and more that these cars design are why Honda came up with these fluid-based mounts that provide a soft shock/vibration absorbing function, and then firm up when under acceleration. A slick design to eliminate vibrations, but poor when it comes to taking the power.
I recall Scalbert or someone made a tension based bar to reduce the amount of engine movement. But I think I recall that the placement of the mounting was not ideal. The tension design has some merit as it reduces the amount of movement, but isn't a rigid bar that would likely result in some vibration.
I'll take a look this coming week and check and see if there are any good placements for something like that. If there is, I may approach IM and have them finalize a design for the front. . the sides good now, and then see if they can create some sort of tension bar for us. And then offer it free to those who bought the full sets. I think something like that with OEM rear and IM front and sides could be just the ticket.
Ruf
I recall Scalbert or someone made a tension based bar to reduce the amount of engine movement. But I think I recall that the placement of the mounting was not ideal. The tension design has some merit as it reduces the amount of movement, but isn't a rigid bar that would likely result in some vibration.
I'll take a look this coming week and check and see if there are any good placements for something like that. If there is, I may approach IM and have them finalize a design for the front. . the sides good now, and then see if they can create some sort of tension bar for us. And then offer it free to those who bought the full sets. I think something like that with OEM rear and IM front and sides could be just the ticket.
Ruf
But seriously, my vibration has become worse. My side mount is flawless no playdough whatsoever but sorry i have difficulty uploading 7MB pics for the view of the front mount. I'm almost sure its the rear thats causing the vibration the front doesn't look too bad.
Best of luck for those that invested time and money to this cause.
Hopefully we can get some OEM product replacement for this if its found to be better. Would the mounts pose a problem for the warranty on the tranny?
Last edited by TheSentinel; 11-16-2008 at 03:20 AM.
11-16-2008, 11:56 AM
#871
Senior Moderator
i know what you are talking about, when we were looking at cars the salesman actually pointed it out saying it was an 'upgraded mount' (but all of the GM's had it)
and if GM uses it on their 5.3L V8 (which produces MUCH MORE torque than our cars) how would you fabricate that onto another engine though? haha..
and if GM uses it on their 5.3L V8 (which produces MUCH MORE torque than our cars) how would you fabricate that onto another engine though? haha..
I'm inclined to agree. I'm believing more and more that these cars design are why Honda came up with these fluid-based mounts that provide a soft shock/vibration absorbing function, and then firm up when under acceleration. A slick design to eliminate vibrations, but poor when it comes to taking the power.
I recall Scalbert or someone made a tension based bar to reduce the amount of engine movement. But I think I recall that the placement of the mounting was not ideal. The tension design has some merit as it reduces the amount of movement, but isn't a rigid bar that would likely result in some vibration.
I'll take a look this coming week and check and see if there are any good placements for something like that. If there is, I may approach IM and have them finalize a design for the front. . the sides good now, and then see if they can create some sort of tension bar for us. And then offer it free to those who bought the full sets. I think something like that with OEM rear and IM front and sides could be just the ticket.
Ruf
I recall Scalbert or someone made a tension based bar to reduce the amount of engine movement. But I think I recall that the placement of the mounting was not ideal. The tension design has some merit as it reduces the amount of movement, but isn't a rigid bar that would likely result in some vibration.
I'll take a look this coming week and check and see if there are any good placements for something like that. If there is, I may approach IM and have them finalize a design for the front. . the sides good now, and then see if they can create some sort of tension bar for us. And then offer it free to those who bought the full sets. I think something like that with OEM rear and IM front and sides could be just the ticket.
Ruf
11-16-2008, 02:13 PM
#872
Lead Footed
If you think about all the cars and trucks that hit pot holes, railroad tracks, poorly maintained road and so on would seem just as bad. That said, I do think it would result in more dash rattles, CD player problems and other electronic compents in the dash. Anyway, let's hope not.
Ruf
11-16-2008, 03:15 PM
#873
Trolling Canuckistan
11-16-2008, 08:35 PM
#874
Instructor
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well i sent an e-mail to innovative here's the e-mail:
Hi there, i just want to know if the problem with the engine mounts of the acura 3.2 cl MT or AT is fine now...
There has been a lot of talking (the biggest thread ever) on acurazine about the mounts.
Iam myself a CLS 2003 6 spd owner and i want to buy those mounts...
when are the mounts are gonna be fine?
Thanks
P.S link to the thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=492237
THE ANSWER...
Sales à moi
afficher le détail 21:32 (il y a 2 minutes) Répondre
We currently have zero issues with this kit.
Hi there, i just want to know if the problem with the engine mounts of the acura 3.2 cl MT or AT is fine now...
There has been a lot of talking (the biggest thread ever) on acurazine about the mounts.
Iam myself a CLS 2003 6 spd owner and i want to buy those mounts...
when are the mounts are gonna be fine?
Thanks
P.S link to the thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=492237
THE ANSWER...
Sales à moi
afficher le détail 21:32 (il y a 2 minutes) Répondre
We currently have zero issues with this kit.
11-17-2008, 08:06 AM
#876
Yeah I would go ahead & just use stock mounts on the 6MT.
Tim claimed to also have no issues reported with them. To which I was dumbfounded to hear.
They will soon be getting my trashed mounts back.
The mounts I feel are just a waste for what you give in driveabilty.
My car is so smooth & quiet now. Feels like a brand new car. On the 6MT you had to give the car a lot more gas on takeoff. It rattled & vibrated. Buzzed, & just could not get a smooth takeoff.
All the class & pleasure of the car is gone with the IM mounts.
Tim claimed to also have no issues reported with them. To which I was dumbfounded to hear.
They will soon be getting my trashed mounts back.
The mounts I feel are just a waste for what you give in driveabilty.
My car is so smooth & quiet now. Feels like a brand new car. On the 6MT you had to give the car a lot more gas on takeoff. It rattled & vibrated. Buzzed, & just could not get a smooth takeoff.
All the class & pleasure of the car is gone with the IM mounts.
11-17-2008, 01:01 PM
#877
MP90 uninstalled
I put the stock rear & front mounts back on. OMG rides like a new car. So smooth!
Never again with these. Here's a pic of the messed up rear mount bushing..
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
Never again with these. Here's a pic of the messed up rear mount bushing..
Also a note for any south FL people. Cartek tuning said they are done with taking the innovative mounts out of the CL/TL. Took them 3 hours to get it out on my car. Soured them & cost me $340!
They know about this site & wanted me to pass it along. They will install them but not take them off.
My rear mount looked exactly like this but slightly worse. I removed the rear mount and put the stock back in and it fixed the problem. I like the front and side IM mount. I still have mine screwed rear mount. The vibrations were horrible and everything in the car rattled. It was awful. I have not done anything about the rear but I still have it and like yours it is destroyed. I dont understand why they made the collars in the mounts more narrow than the stock mounts. My brackets had to flex and I was scared they may crack with the rear and side IM mounts.
11-17-2008, 02:54 PM
#879
MP90 uninstalled
I think alignment of the IM mounts is also an issue. I did every trick in the book just to get them to bolt up. I had to loosen everything to get them to line up enough for me to get the bolts in. Lack of alignment is easily enough to cause massive vibrations, it even says so in the shop manual under the mounts section. There is a procedure for the sequence of install which I followed to make sure they were lined up correctly and still got the damage and extreme vibrations. I don’t think the weight of the motor alone is enough to damage the bushing like that. I think these mounts need a bottom up redesign. They should be identical in geometry at neutral to a stock set of mounts and mine were not from the start. I know I have the latest fresh redesigned batch they have made so this is still an issue. I am a 6 speeder also. Its so dissapointing since the performance gain was huge with all three installed but the vibrations and associated noises were horrid.
Last edited by jproy; 11-17-2008 at 02:56 PM.
11-17-2008, 03:02 PM
#880
MP90 uninstalled
It was much worse than like cars I have ridden in with mounts of a much more stiff composition. I think the heart of the issue here is the alignment of the IM mounts then the composition of the bushing. I pulled my rear out over two months ago and it is still deformed identical to the one pictured. Notice how the collar is not touching the bushing and there is a 1-2 mm gap between the two strait through the mount around ~40-50% of the collar circumference