dom

^Yup. unbelievable.

But I doubt even Peddie will call off the dogs at this point.

Moog-Type-S

Stamkos!!!

Yumcha

No offense, Moog...but, Stamkos would be better off in Toronto instead of LA.

dom

Why?

fdl

Cuz it's la-la land. Stamkos deserves a real hockey town.

dom

Well ya, but I meant besides the obvious.

Yumcha

It's true.
Same reason why it's kinda a shame that Ovechkin plays for the Caps and not some chartered NHL franchise (i.e. Boston, NY, Chicago, Detroit, Toronto)...

Jonesi

They are in the real Steel Town and staying..!

Jonesi

It's a lottery, you guys still have a shot..

dom

Forget Stamkos. I'm hoping the Leafs get the 2nd overall pick so they take that D-Man who's name escapes me right now and then get next years 1st overall and get Taveres.

Yumcha

^ Um...scuse me. Your Leeks are already loaded on D with Kaberle and McCabe.

Moog-Type-S

Sure LA never had any great players.

Moog-Type-S

Fixed

Moog-Type-S

Deal! Kings will take #1 and you can have #2.

Yumcha

And neither did Anaheim, Dallas, or Carolina...


Fact of the matter is: if Stamkos is indeed going to turn out into a stud player, he'd better off served for the League overall if he ended up in a place like Toronto instead of LA.

Sorry, dude...not hating...just a fact.

Yumcha

Deal. Chicago is back on its way up with the passing of Bill Wirtz.



Red Rising!

fdl

No, it's got to be Stamkos. We already have too high priced D-Men and a couple of good young ones. We need someone for Mats to pass the torch on to. Besides, TSN reported that 6/10 scouts would choose Stamkos over Tavares if they were both eligable in this draft. Stamkos is biggger and a much better skater.

I doubt the leafs will get Tavares next year. But it would be nice.

Yumcha

Is Stamkos in the same caliber as Ovechkin, Malkin, Crosby in regards to potential...?

dom

Who? White and Woznweski suck, Coliacovo can't stay healthy and its too early to tell if Stralman will be any good. Besides, none of those guys are big physical defencemen which is desperately what this team needs.

fdl

No

Maybe Malkin. But not Ovechkin / Crosby level.

Tavares on the other hand broke Gretzky's junior record, so people are speculating about what he could do. He just needs to work on his skating. Then again, Gretzky was never a good skater either...but it was a different era.

Moog-Type-S

...and Gretz coming to LA was not good for the league?

fdl

Colaiacavo will be good. White is still young and has upside. Strallman looks good. I just think the leafs are in more of a desperate need of having a big name guy up front.

But if we were sure we'd get Tavares next year, then ya I'd say get Doughty this year.

dom

/Yummy's argument.

Yumcha

Gretz going anywhere is not a bad thing, is it...? He did put Edmonton on the map after all...

But, you're telling me that if we were to play what-if, and if he were traded to say Boston or Toronto instead of LA that the impact would not have been even bigger...?

fdl

Good for LA, yes. Good for the league? Not really. If hockey had of really taken off in California then yes, I would have said it was great for the game.

Yumcha

/Moog's argument

97BlackAckCL

iTrader: (6)

Pens is where it's at

Moog-Type-S

So adding 2 franchises to CA in addition to the Kings means hockey did NOT take off in CA??? Not to mention one is a Cup winner.

Sure Hockey is far from #1 in CA sports, but it is far more popular than it was before Gretz.

dom

There are several other factors that contributed to Gretz in LA not helping the league. Namely Gary Bettman.

Moog-Type-S

Canada already had a huge hockey fan base...so for the league overall it would have been no different. If Gretz would have gone to NY or Boston, hockey fan base in those areas might have gone up slightly....but coming to LA was vastly different.

Without Gretz coming to LA, there would be no San Jose, Anaheim, Phoenix franchises in the west. ....and possibly you could add Dallas to the list too.

Gretz coming to LA expanded the league and gave the NHL exposure to more non-hockey fans.

Expansion for better or for worse for the league is another issue....and so is Bettman taking over the league.

fdl

Outside of LA, I consider hockey in California to be a big joke. Winning a cup has nothing to do with it. There just isnt the support there.

fdl

I don't see how adding failing franchises back up your argument

Moog-Type-S

San Jose is a failing franchise?
Dallas is a failing franchise?
Anaheim (now that they have a Cup win) is a failing franchise?
Anaheim is a failure in my book

Good franchise expansion is good for any sports league.
More franchises usually means more/new fans to the game.
More fans = a better, stronger league.
Less fans = death of any league.

Gretz to LA brought more fans to the league....and thus expansion franchises.
Sure, the league has gone too far with expansion, but not all of the expansion was a failure.

fdl

I disagree. No one cares about hockey in those markets. Same with the sun belt. I could even argue that Gretsky to LA, not only didnt help the NHL, but even hurt it.

Last time i checked Dallas wasn't in California so to tie Gretsky to that is a stretch.

Moog-Type-S

You really think Dallas would have ever had a franchise if Gretz stayed in Canada?

FWIW the old Forbes list of NHL franchise valuations
Dallas is listed at #4
San Jose #12
Oilers #30

http://www.forbes.com/free_forbes/2002/1223/098tab.html

fdl

Yes I do think Dallas would have a team, just like Florida and Tampa bay would have teams.

I don't know what that Forbes list is based on, but I just don't see the Anaheim ducks as being a positive for the NHL right now. Thats my point.

Yumcha

Well, isn't Dallas having a franchise more to do with the North Stars' previous owner, Norm Green, having $$$ and lawsuit issues and then demanding ridiculous concessions from Minnesota...?

I'm with fdl here...Gretzky being in LA had squat to do with the relocation of the Stars.

Yumcha

Anaheim having a franchise is as great as Raleigh, Columbus, et al having one.

Moog-Type-S

I differ. I think Gretz coming to LA showed that there could be viable Hockey franchises outside of typical "Hockey areas". Sure, Gretz had nothing to do with the North Stars moving....but Dallas as their final destination has alot to do with what I said above.

..and as I stated before not all of the NHL expansion was good, some of it was and is alive and well, in non traditional markets...thanks to Gretz coming to SoCal.

The Dougler

iTrader: (1)

L.A can have stamkos, Toronto NEEDS MASON!!!