OK, i know this subject has been beaten to death and most of you know where i stand, but today i actually had a chance to compare mike's and richie's pipes side to side. my jpipe was out while installing some PCD's and my buddy had his new RV6 at the shop.

DESIGNS:
first off, looking at the two side by side, you can clearly see the difference in designs. with just a glance, its a no brainer which is superior. go to any reputable hi performance muffler shop with this pic and get there opinion, you'll see what i mean.


ATLP > RV6

MERGES:
like ive always said, THE MAIN THING that seperates the two is in the merge collector (or in RV6's case, lack of)
take a look at the RV6 merge, freeflowing you say?? i dont think so shoving one pipe into another is NOT the way to do it. the circle shows just how tight it is where the exhaust gases collide and then pushed through the 2 1/2 secondary.



now the ATLP merge, HUUUUUUUUUuuuuu HAAAAAAAaaaaa.. it can breathe! look where the prmaries end and where the 2 1/2 secondary starts, big difference you say? you bet!!

ATLP > RV6

U BENDS:
whats up with this U bend on the RV6!?! not very smooth and well thought out IMO. might as well of used a straight 90 degree elbow :/


mike uses a TRUE U bend, and isnt spliced in anyway.
ATLP > RV6

GROUND CLEARANCE:
the two measure the same when i comes to this. both are slammed friendly
EVEN

QUALITY:
both are outstanding quality. my only gripe about richies are the welds for the flanges, that come straight off the precats. ive bent a few bolts tightening them down, since the cant lay completey flat. mikes are welded on the inside, so you wont run into this problem PLUS it gives a smoother transition for the gases when passing through.
EVEN

PERFOMANCE:
well, cant say much on this one, cause i dont own a RV6 V2, but did own a V1 and to be completely honest with you, your not going to gain anything switching from V1 to V2. until he implements a merge collector, his pipe will always be second best, (or third if you include XLR8) for me, the difference i felt going from stock to RV6, was the same difference i felt going from RV6 to ATLP. yes, it flows that much better. people are so caught up with "peak" numbers, rather than the gains in low to mid end HP/TQ which should be the main focus IMO. ive dyno'd with both pipes and the gains low/mid gains with the ATLP were substantial over the RV6, (respectively)

PRICE:
ATLP jpipe is 399.00, while RV6 packaged with test pipe is 360.00
RV6 > ATLP

what people dont understand, is richies is made overseas, so of course labor is much cheaper, hence the lower price. one of the key things that makes the ATLP more expensive. ever shop around for a SS 2 1/2 Y merge collector?? they are not cheap!!! 80-100 bucks depending on where you buy it also, those of you wasting your money on the test pipe (which will only give you 1whp tops) changing out the precats is the best thing you can do. then if you choose to go that route, than i suggest keeping your stock 3rd cat so you wont be completely catless.

CUSTOMER SERVICE:
both are EXCELLENT business men and its a pleasure to deal with either one. they will bend over backwards to make you happy
EVEN

this is my 6th jpipe in 3 years. ive had every design imaginable that you can fit under our cars, most of them being custom made. just remember a jpipe isnt just a jpipe. maximum flow should always be your goal when seeking perfomance mods


hope this answers alot of questioins you guys have between the 2 pipes

 

Damn in the time it took you to type that you coulda got ur whip on the ol' dynojet...

 

very nice comparison

 

props for you!!

 

So running precats with the OEM third cat will cut down the smell? Not a huge problem for me, but others. Plus, I don't want cops smelling the gas. And running precat deletes w/ OEM cat > OEM cats and test pipe, right? With precats and the OEM cat, I won't pass the 'sniffer' test will I?

 

+rep for you sir! This should be garaged.

 

NIce reviews, what about xlr8 and atlp?

 

You forgot the BLING catagory.
RV6 > ATLP

Haha ok maybe bling doesn't really matter.

Nice writeup and nice pics!

 

I noticed that the flex pipe on your atlp is ripped.

My rv6 v1 has the same issue. Are you noticing any exhaust leaks?

 

Nice write-up!

 

The RV6 pipe wasn't available when I got my ATLP pipe, but upon seeing it when it did come out, I thought the exact same things as you with regards to design, merge, and quality. Had they both been available at the time, I still would've gotten the ATLP. And I'll also add that the j-pipe was one of the most noticeable mods I did to the car, which kind of surprised me, honestly.

 

Great review! Definitely helps in the decision process.

 

Done, thank's for the contribution!

 

riche is a cool guy, his strut bar rules, but j pipes arent his thing

mike's j pipe design is perfect. MUCH more free flowing

 

What is the difference and performance with ATLP and XLR8

 

its just the skin thats torn. underneath is the flex pipe itself, which should be fine

running any 3rd cat, along with the PCD's is always a good idea. im currently running a 3rd procat and it does a good job on keeping the smell down. i imagaine a stock 3rd cat will work that much better.

i remember back in the day when i first purchased my car, a member over at v 6 P dyno'd his car, then on the 3rd run they took off the 3rd cat and installed a megan test pipe. he didnt gain anything from it. on a good day, you'll maybe gain a 1-2 hp tops, but nothing that your going to feel. opening up the cats coming right off the head is the most important part, because the transition coming off the casted manifold to the substraint part of the cat is very badly bottlenecked.

what do you mean? the ATLP V2 against the xlr8? if so, i would say they are even, because they both have that nice transition. the only difference is that the ATLP is drop friendly

 

very nice write up. now it'll be nice with dyno comparo showdown

 

04accord... thanks for answering my question. Where are you located? California? I'm assuming I won't pass the 'sniffer' smog test only with the OEM 3rd cat will I? Any input or experience on that?

 

i have no idea. my guess is yes, since most older cars rely on just a single cat. the only way to find out is run it on a machine. my first smog comes next year feb, but i have a guy who can give me a "special" smog check, when that time comes

 

Good thread, I was always wondering about this comparison. Good knowledge for my quest to do it right the 1st time. Thanks for the effort.

 

@04accordcpe.....all rv6 fans were pissed u started this in his thread LOL....now they wont have a reason since u made a new thread LOL !!!!.....

but none the less....great write up !!!! i think after reading ur post before u made this thread i made my mind up about rv6 precats and atlp jpipe

 

Thanks for the write-up. Wish I would have seen this before I ordered the rv6 but overall im happy with their work. If atlp's site was working and if it wasnt so expensive maybe I would have gone that route. I got my j-pipe for 349 shipped from richie compared to the atlp one is almost 460 after shipping to me on heeltoe.

 

Nice writeup! I'm glad we have you making posts on the TL forum. Accords are our cousins!


I'm also glad to see the ground clearance has been improved. About 2 weeks after I installed the ATLP version 1, a manhole was no match for the entire exhaust system on my TL. Ripped right out from under the car! I've been running the oem j-pipe ever since because i just haven't felt the need to spend another 400 again.

 

I think your post sums it up. The ATLP pipe probably has better gains, but for an extra +$100 it is not worth it for some people. Speaking for myself only, I am cheap and could barely justify richies.

 

+1 thank you for this!

 

This reply is intended to be just a casual discussion for us regarding jpipe design based on theory and conjecture.

There is something more important than just a free flowing jpipe. For the ultimate torque production in a normally aspirated engine, the engine relies upon exhaust scavenging. Scavenging is produced by a long primary pipe (green lines in pics) having a properly tuned diameter. Let's agree that the various jpipes have the same diameter pipes. Now, that leaves just the length (green lines in pics) as a variable.

Let's also agree that the TL's jpipe is not really a true header primary pipe. But, it is the closest thing that we have to a true header primary pipe, and the concept of scavenging will still apply to some extent.

I have created an illustration for us to use. I tried to size the pics so that the pipes would appear to be the same relative size for comparison purposes.






Here is how I see the Jpipes thru my eyes.

Please notice the blue line. We can use the blue line as a common reference point on each pipe. Which jpipe has the longest primary pipes? Easiest way to see is by looking for the longest green line extending past the reference blue line (in the direction of flow). As can be seen, the XLR8 has the longest primary pipes by a healthy margin.

What I really like about the XLR8 jpipe is shown with the red arrows. Notice how the distance shown with red arrows is so much shorter on the XLR8 than on the ATLP. XLR8 is utilizing all available length. The XLR8 design took advantage of all the available length to make the primary pipes as long as possible and the y-collector transition as smooth as possible. Even to the extent of using a mini flex section.

And for me, the deal cincher for the XLR8 jpipe is that the XLR8 is manufactured by Billy Boat Performance Exhaust (click here).... And the detailed craftsmanship shows!

In closing, I would like to say the following. We should appreciate that we TL owners have companies that are willing to produce performance goodies for our small market. As such, I try to point out the strengths of each company's product. The strength of the ATLP J-pipe (Version 2) is that it is slammed-friendly, providing more clearance for a lowered suspension.

 

i think the red arrow in the XLR8 if off by a little bit....

i think atlp ver 1 had the same long primary pipes but replaced with this so that it can sit higher and allow a lot more slamming....

if we modify the hanger on the XLR8 i think it will sit a lot higher as well....and with the long primary pipes.....you will have the low end torque u need !!!!

 

weird thought.....

plus people with innovative mounts who say their engine sits 1/2" higher than it used to, the XLR8 pipe might just prove the be it !!!!

 

although i agreee with everything you posted, up above was the deciding factor for me. ATLP is a perfect compromise of performance and functionality for us slammed guys

BTW, how much is your car lowered??

none of the above... this one does


i still kick myself in the ass for getting rid of it. it was by far the BEST performing jpipe i owned and the clearance was great too.

 

04accordcpe,

If I recall correctly, you are the master of jpipes. You have made several homemade jpipes and tried nearly every commercially available jpipe that has or had existed.

Thank you for giving us some empirical data to which we can "hang our hat". For those not familiar with that phrase, thanks for backing-up the notion that long primaries make a better jpipe.

 

so you guys are pointing towards XLR8.....also.....

do you think a change in the hanger will make the pipe sit a little higher allowing us a little more clearance !!!! ???

 

Each jpipe has it's advantages.

For most hp, get the XLR8 J-pipe. Designed for max power, but might scrape if your suspension is lowered drastically.

For being slammed-friendly (lowered suspension), get the ATLP Version 2 J-pipe. Be sure it is the Version 2, not the Version 1.

For a good $ value with decent hp gains, get the RV6 J-pipe. RV6 is slammed-friendly also.

 

^^^^ thanks a lot for the pic....make a lot of sense !!!!

anyone can compare the gains !!!! i know this topic is beaten to death.....but just some numbers.....on a 5AT non type-s

XLR8
ATLP jpipe ver1
ATLp jpipe ver2

I know the most difference is oing to be 1-2 WHP and WTQ and also the dyno numbers differ and all the jazz, but just some rough numbers !!!!

 

Sean, did that custom Jpipe fill up the 3rd cat space too? It looks MUCH longer than the other Jpipes, and very sexy

 

about the extra length. Good eye Sonnick ! The rear flange is for-sure extending past the inlet for the 3rd cat.

 

yes, with primaries this long, you definitely have to delete the 3rd cat. heres couple pics of it on my car,






this design TOTALLY transform the sound of my comptech exhaust too. very loud, very raspy, but in a good way heres a little sound clip.


IMO, i thought it kinda sounded M3'ish.... and if you listen carefully, you can hear a 3rd gear chirp

 

nice vid !!!

 

That sounds absolutely awesome! You don't have to listen carefully to hear the 3rd gear chirp

You can also hear TC kicking in at the top of 1st haha. I think I'm gonna have to go custom on the Jpipe...if it makes that much of a difference and sounds like that!!

 

Did the longggg primaries help top end as well? I know you said low/midrange was serious, but what about top end?

 

This is a great thread...thanks for the research and info. Definitely worth noting.