komplexZ

Usually DI lets you run lower octane, and since HP really didn't go up from PI model (5hp...lol), I'd really expect to see 87.

graphicguy

Ummmm....all DI is is a more accurate fuel delivery system. I'm guessing the compression ratio is still pretty high to go along with that. That requires higher octane to avoid pinging and detonation issues.

VR1

If the SH-AWD J series can do high 4's..

docboy

I had to go back up and read page 2 and just saw this.

Ugh, why are the LEDs below the headlights gone? IMHO that was one of the "cool" looking features of the TLX in all of its ads (plus its mirrors). That's like showing a child a tasty ice cream treat, letting him/her smell and savor over it, and then taking it away! Cruel to say the least.

Meh, that kind of ticks me off that Acura would deliberately show something desirable, flaunt it in its videos (ie. more than 1 video shows the TLX with the front bumper LEDs) and then take it away! Why in the world would Acura do that???

Goosew

iTrader: (1)

They'll include it in the Mid-Cycle Refresh / MMC

TSX69

Altho the lack of any info regarding changes coming to the RLX concerns me; not to mention the lack of any info on the hybrid that should be debuting anytime now. I see another generation that is left relatively unchanged for many many years.

Tonyware

"3.5L V6 puts out 290hp and 267 torque"

Thats a little disappointing. They can get a lot more out of 3.5L. Did they say at what RPMs?

"Motion Adaptive EPS with crosswind detection"

Finally! I mean after all the TL drivers complaining they can't land the damn thing on their runway with crosswinds Actually the current TL sucks big time with crosswinds so it may help but aerodynamics are tricky and what works under some conditions doesn't work under some other conditions. Crosswinds with blowing snow is what I was thinking...

"They are planning to sell 44,000 TLX'S the first year..."

Is that world wide or just North America?

VR1

Did they say it was 0.5 sec fasterto 60 then the Manual SHAWD TL or the Auto one? Because the Manual TL seems to be ~0.7 seconds quicker then the Auto.

mylove4cars

Like you say (hope and pray for sooner )
Btw. Thank you for the update Corey, it's almost correct

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

This is a matter of good leadership. Smart leadership would be able to distinguish between listening to everyone and listening to those who matter. Considering how well the 3G TL sold, changing what worked for something that cost them some serious market share is a sign of bad leadership making poor decisions.

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

My guess is that the compression ratio is only marginally higher than in the Accord and there are a few hundred more RPMs to wring out the extra HP. It has pretty much the same torque rating so the engine is likely not that dramatically different. If it does in fact need to run premium then it is kind of annoying because the Accord's compression ratio is actually quite low for DI motors.

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

Considering those outputs are barely higher than the 3.5L motor in the 3G TL Type-S and they have had more than 5 years to improve upon it and add more technology to it, it is more than a little disappointing. Heck, it is less than the motor that was in the 4G SH-AWD.

Yes, I realize that the engine power delivery characteristics will play a big part in making the car feel more powerful, but that still does not matter if the stats are not good enough to get people into the dealership to drive the car. We know that the design alone isn't going to do it.

KeithL

Both a bargain, the LED headlights on my A6 are like $2800

KeithL

I'm thinking it will get the same AWD as the RDX and not SH-AWD.

Rocketsfan

Noooooooooooooooooo!

Rocketsfan

See my responses/questions in blue ...

rockyfeller

iTrader: (6)

First of all THANKS so much for giving us this inside info Corey. Second of all, are you sure you don't want to change your screen-name? If that isn't your real name, it still seems too easy to trace who you are. I just hope Acura corporate doesn't give you an issue. In most companies something as innocent as this can land you in hot water. I hope you're safe.

After all the speculation it was nice to hear details that add up and the first thread to make real sense. Everything you mentioned is conceivable and it confirmed most of our notions.

What stood out to me the most is that the 4 cylinder powerplant is underpowered. Perhaps they will market the "TURBO!" concept heavily, lol. Weight and acceleration suggests it is probably adequate but if it pales heavily to the 6-cyl version, then it will be a problem. Perhaps a few "appliance drivers" (driver's who just want a commuter. They just want the badge and don't care much about the trim.) may buy it. But people who research carefully won't. I'll give an example of this: The Jaguar XF came only as a V8 this is overkill and a gas-guzzler for most people. They then introduced a V6 which is PERFECT for 90% of the market. Now they have a pathetic anemic 4cyl. I drove it, BLAH the turbo-lag is ridiculous. This was a bad move, they can't move these cars off the lot, nobody wants them. It's as if they made this model just to be competitive and offer options. It's obvious on the redesign this will be dropped. It is clearly underpowered and takes away from what the brand is about. The 4-cyl in the TLX should have bought at least 230hp to be marketable. Perhaps once I drive it I can say for sure but I doubt it.

SH-AWD ILX?? I think that is a risky move. There doesn't seem to be much of an ILX market in the first place. And that's not because of a lack of SH-AWD. A fully loaded ILX is not exactly a bargain and an SH-AWD model will take the top extent of prices even higher. I don't see that helping. The car itself is actually a GREAT car and under-rated, particularly the 6-speed model, which basically drives like a Civic Si. It will surprise you how fun it is to drive, I think it is the MOST fun to drive Acura in the entire present lineup. If they are going to now share that 4-cyl engine with DCT, they are surely going to drop that 6-speed model. It's not selling and partially so because most people don't even know it exists. Sad. What is killing this car is the bland styling. That's it. Good thing jewel lights are coming, that means a refresh with it hopefully. They need to make that car look aggressive. Otherwise it's dead in the water with SH-AWD.

Rocketsfan

Beach109's first post in his thread :

https://acurazine.com/forums/5g-tlx-2015-2020-415/tlx-trim-level-color-lineup-906998/

and in the same thread on the 2nd page:

https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...1&postcount=73

Miss.Acura

Fold down rear seats!!!!! And many other upgrades.....Now I want to trade in my TL! Thanks for the info!

ZCL

What previous gen did 0-60 in 5.2-5.5?

My Auto Advance SH-AWD was lucky to do it in 6.7.

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

3G TL-S 6MT was known to crack off 5.5s 0-60 times. Official times were around 5.7-5.8 seconds.

Current gen 6MT is about the same to a hair slower because of the weight.

rockyfeller

iTrader: (6)

The fact is people are lazy. They don't want to change a flat. They think calling a tow truck is expensive and there is a wait. A kit gets you back on the road in 15 minutes. They get more trunk space too. The manufacturer touts this as a "feature" and value but in reality it's a way to cut corners and saves costs. Overpricing the spare is a no-brainer to them. Any of us with brains will just get one from EBay.

I once had 2 flats in 1 week. Thank God I didn't have to replace both. Anyone that knows about cars knows that many flats are fixable with a patch, especially for a simple nail. Sometimes it is just a leaky stem. This would save $$$ on a replacement tire. If you use a tire repair kit you ruin the tire and it's as good as garbage. I used to sell tires, I can't tell you how many people would ruin their tires because they drove on them or tried to repair them with a kit/spray. Others you could fool or take for a ride and make them buy a set of 4 new tires for little to no reason. (Not that I ever did but some I worked with were evil.) Fixing a flat is $20. And most shops don't offer to do it, they do it when specifically asked to do so.

Run-flats are for a different grade of dummy that doesn't know what to do with their money, lol. Once flat you HAVE to replace them, as said they cost an arm and leg.

One thing on this TLX that is ingenious is tire-fill assist. TPMS has been around for awhile so I'm surprised this wasn't featured long ago. Since the unit is already measuring the pressure it simply beeps once the proper air pressure is reached. No need to fiddle with a gauge.

docboy

The 4G TL 6MT and the 4G TL SH-AWD automatics are different beasts.

The 4G TL 6MT has documented 0-60 from 5.2-5.5 (give or take).

I can't seem to locate the link to the test that had the 4G TL 6MT 0-60 at 5.2, but here's one that has it the 0-60 at 5.3 http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...t/viewall.html

Rocketsfan

Other manufacturers seem to be going the "no spare tire" route. I believe in the Q50 it's something like a $200 option. They also have run-flat tires, too. Some of it may be a weight-saving option to increase mileage, too. Or so they say ...

BEAR-AvHistory

Hopefully the new generation of run flats will ride better then the last. Got rid of mine on the 335is at 1500 miles.

BTW most run flats are dead after a flat & need to be replaced. Much more economical to just patch a get flat.

justingerard

I'm glad to see the fuel economy going up, for me that was always the biggest "but" when it came to the SH-AWD TL 4G.

Corey, was there any discussion of price?

VtectiveTL

Sounds awesome! Maybe awesome enough to trade in the 2012!

graphicguy

Accord V6 compression ratio is 10.5:1

ACURA 3.7 V6 compression ratio is 11.2:1

I'm betting the Acura TLX 3.5 V6 compression ratio is at least as high as the current 3.7, recommending premium fuel as a result. Running regular will cause spark retard and less MPG (and eventually some deposits you don't want).

rockyfeller

iTrader: (6)

I am the biggest cynic of big corporate entities and their interests. Having worked for plenty and doing sales for many years have had me see plenty of evil. I'm really good at sales, I just don't gel with those job roles anymore. The advantage of a corporation is the manpower and capital to get big projects done and market them to masses. That's about it. Otherwise real quality, trust and service in the business world is always with the small business model. I own one so I can relate. Whenever possible I deal with the little guy if he can do it better, even if it costs more.

When I was in sales the salespeople that make numbers were only of 2 flavors: The evil satan ones that know full well how it all works and don't care. They want the commission. They can sell toasters for all they care. These are the majority. The other type are the nice ones that buy into the kool-aid. I was once this type but woke up. The salespeople that make bad numbers didn't matter, they were the next to get laid off. Management's job is to motivate everybody regardless of which type they are so they will appeal to both flavors. I hope what I said doesn't offend you, I can tell you are a good person with good intentions.Most of my nice friends in sales are so in LOVE their product/company because of the way the company has pitched it to them. It's not that they are naive but management knows that in order to make salespeople motivated you have to sell it to THEM too. They don't want you to see too much behind the scenes to let you know how it all really works. The corners they cut, the unethical stuff, cheating, stealing, politics, etc. Why not? It's those evil ones that get higher faster in this company. I know this sounds negative and I wish I could find an exception to this, I really haven't. Hence why many of us think that dealers/corporations are evil. So I am always on the defensive and want to be a informed customer. I ALWAYS do my homework on every purchase and do what suits me instead of being "sold to". I wouldn't have known as much without having been a salesman myself.

I commend you for speaking up to the designers, what you said is sensible and nearly anyone would agree it's the truth. Obviously they are not listening to you or us. You see how your GM shut you up? The rule is always to go along with people in influence higher than you. They always want to promote that guy.

As you said they don't give a rats ass about the enthusiasts. Not surprised at all. In the 50s cars were designed with bold and wild imagination. They could afford to take risks, the American auto industry boomed. Look at Porsche or Ferrari today. They don't have to spend so much on TV commercials. They can make a car with a soul and design directly to a niche market. Acura is trying to stay afloat and keep the lights on. When a company is desperate they want to take the "safe route". As you said volume and numbers is all that matter and the number crunchers have their calculators out. These guys upstairs can be out of a job otherwise. This car HAS to sell without question. But in times of desperation can either come incredible success or massive failure. I only see a Type-S coming out only in 2-3yrs if this car is a hit. Otherwise forget it.

I've also said in past threads the 6MT is dead at Acura. DCTs are the present technology and offering a manual is like going backwards according to this company's direction. I think it's sad that BMW seems to be the only one committed to offering them. I don't expect that to stick around too long either, that is one company that has been getting soft lately too.

winstrolvtec

As usual, you are correct Doc. 5.2 was C&D. http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...ad-test-review

R&T got a 5.9 out the 5AT, although the autos have been all over the place in terms of acceleration stats even as low as 6.9 or worse, so don't know what is going on with autos and that spread, seems very high. Was some talk about brake torque issues, don't know the extent of it, few probably do. However the 5.9 for the 5AT was replicated at an actual track by TOV, think the rest was 14.3-4 at 98 or 99.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-revi...cc-36l-4motion

The 6AT was listed as 5.5 or so in a few places unofficially and many owners have commented that it does allow for some and maybe even full brake torquing. It has also been officially listed as worse in the low 6's, again don't know why the spread, the autos have been nowhere near as consistent as the 6MT's FWIW.

Acura has gone on record and declared the 6MT .7 tenths faster to 60, based on their extensive testing, than the former 5AT version if that helps makes sense of any of it.

Having owned the 3G 6MT, the TLS 6MT and now the 4G 6MT, I will only comment that based on feel and "various driving circumstances and comparisons" that hp to weight are very similar, the heft doesn't hurt anything much unless we are talking about speeds 100 mph+ or from roll speeds in the mid to high range. The AWD and shorter gearing move the car along just fine in comparison, actually better in the lower gears and off the line, of course with the new autos that should be another story completely.

docboy

Well said.

Agreed the tire-fill assist is ingenious. Practical and valuable feature. It's little things like this that doesn't cost much (or at least I think it doesn't) yet gives a product great value.

Here's hoping for more practical stuff, like a bigger glove box, a more comfortable/adjustable armrest, padded sunglass holder, etc...

Treblig

Speaking of the little things, glad to have the one touch up/down feature on all 4 windows again. It is the small things....

Rocketsfan

One thing I just remembered : was there any mention of Apple's CarPlay, Google's Open Automotive Alliance, or Microsoft's Windows in the Car support?

CoquiTSX

Funny you said that. Last weekend I was @ Costco getting new tires, and one of the employees told two different customers that using the "Fix a whatever" tire sprays voids the manufacturers warranty.

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

Sorry, was talking about the I4, not the V6.

The current Accord I4 has an 11:1 compression ratio, same as the K24 in the TSX.

Mazda's SkyActiv-G series of engines, which currently permeate it's line-up, run 14:1 compression ratios and run regular. Seems like Honda is still sandbagging on the engine technology front.

graphicguy

NP...It's always a dance for engineers to balance MPG, power, smoothness, what the market will bare, etc. I'm sure power would be down on the 3.5 if they allow for regular gas (as in the Accord).

It wouldn't surprise me if they decide to save a little for a TLX-S version with more HP somewhere down the road. Can you imagine how the VTEC faithful would react to a new S model, given the 4G didn't have one?

I think there's more of a propensity to need the higher detergent additives that come with Premium gas. That said, I get all of my fuel at Costco. They just passed the "Top Tier" fuel tests. And, their gas is always cheaper than anything else....sometimes as much as 50¢-70¢/ gal. So, burning premium is OK by me. That allows Acura to program the timing of the ECU to get more power without pinging.

That 2.4 in the base TLX sounds interesting. But, I just love the inherent smoothness of Honda/Acura V6s. IF they're saying 0-60 in ~5 sec, while getting 25-3- MPG, I'm all in.

George Knighton

Marketing. What can you do.

All in all, though, very encouraging so far. :-)

kareshi

Not sure if ODMD is a good thing. I think the most useful features from the advanced trim are CMBS, Blind Spot Indicator and Forward Collision Warning. The other features are just nice to have. I wish they can bring SH-AWD back though. Put the TLX SH-AWD on RDX !

George Knighton

Sales-wise, overall, the RDX changes have worked for them.

It looks like people who'd shop for an RDX-type of vehicle are less interested in handling and more interested in safety and reliability.

Nedmundo

Great post, but it's important to remember that Porsche can afford to offer niche performance models largely because the Cayenne SUV has been so successful. It's Porsche's biggest seller, and apparently Porsche believes the new smaller Macan crossover will sell in even higher numbers. According to Autoweek, in 2015 a full 63% of Porsche's sales will be CUV's, and when you add the Panamera, almost 75% will have four doors. The 911 will be only about 14% of sales. The Porsche faithful weren't exactly thrilled when the Cayenne arrived, but its success has allowed the company to keep spending on development of the zillions of 911 variants.

Given the current market, you might be right about the 6MT disappearing at Acura. I've always thought it would eventually appear in the TLX, at least the four cylinder version. I've figured Acura wants to get the high volume models out first, and advertise the high MPG of the 8DCT and 9AT without a lower mpg 6MT diluting the message. If the MT does arrive, I expect it to be available in a limited range of colors and trim levels, much like the TSX and TL.

BMW has kept the MT flame burning, but you're right that it's on the decline there too. BMW apparently wants to dispense with MT on the M cars in favor of the higher performance DCT's, and possibly on other models as well. The 6MT was offered on the current M5 to appease U.S. enthusiasts, but I don't expect that to last much longer. I bet an MT won't be available at all on the next generation 5 Series, but it will probably stick around for the 3 Series.