Once I get the blower installed will I be able to give (straight line, of course) an M3 or S4 a good run? From a dig I'm sure I'd lose .5 sec on the M3 and maybe more on the AWD S4. How about from a roll or at highway speeds?

 

They will still beat you, they run low to mid 13s in the quater mile. You will run right around mid 13s. Although, you are an automatic vs their manuals. Thus, the driver error factor favors you. Basically, you'll surprise them with the way you keep up, but they will still win, most likely.

 

lose the 19's and get some light weight 18's or 17's with sticky rubber.

 

may be the E36 or older gen STOCK s4

 

for sure the e36 M3.


You might be able to HANG with the e46 M3 but he will still be ahead. IMO

 

in a straight line contest from a stop you will lose

from a roll you should win

and throw in a a few curves in the road you will defintely lose

sidemarker

 

yup

some lightweight forged 17s and some slicks you should do even better...

but if you still dont feel confident you could always a good shot of some NOS

sidemarker

 

I'm betting the biggest factor for me then is driver error w/ the manual trannies. I'm pretty sure most people can't drive like professionals and aren't willing to dump their precious clutches...so I may fair better than we all think. Then again, the SMG should be foolproof.

 

What do these cars trap in the 1/4? Isn't that a good indicator of who has the advantage from a roll?

 

These cars have the advantage of low end torque at highway speeds, so take off pretty fast. My friend's chipped 00 S4 runs 13.0, but I don't remember his trap speed, it was awhile back.

 

I think the M3 only has about 250lb/ft at the crank right? That'll be about the same as me w/ the blower.

 

Peak torque, you have to look at the powerband as a whole.


And the m3 weighs less, and can apply more of the torque to the pavement.

 

Not significantly, the M3 weighs in at 3415 so there is about 100 lbs tops. And the torque output from the J32A2 with blower will be greater throughout comparable rev ranges. The M3 has the advantage of continuing to make power and hold a gear when the CL-S up shifts.

 

The M3 traps in the 105 range from what I recall. The current S4 is around 100. Your blown CL-S 5AT shoudl be able to split the two.

And yes, trap speed is a better indication of what will occur from a roll. In this case you are still behind the M3 but ahead of the S4.

 

I've beaten a stock '02 S4

after the race the guy was like

"damn that shyt hauls ass"

lol

 

My friend's chipped S4 runs a 12.9, you had just better hope the one you race is bone stock ..

 

you will put up a good fight and possibly win if the driver is bad, but in 4th gear you may loose for sure, and from a stop, but as long as its a rolling start you will do pretty well

 

I have alot of respect for the M3. You gotta hand it to BMW for building such a (relatively) affordable supercar.

 

In your dreams. You are trying to match a car built for commute versus one that was racing inspired. The big question is why? Dont you have anything better to do? I hope you are not one of those idiots that race on public streets.

 

Your point is what, that no one should take a vehicle they enjoy and enhance it?? Yes, the CL-S is a commuter vehicle as is the M3 and S4 (especially being a sedan), albeit the later two have a greater performance envelope. The NSX is race inspired, the M3 is a seriously factory modified vehicle with racing in mind. But make no mistake, its chassis origins are from the same lineage as the base models. Which are also great chassis in their own right.

Taking a very comfortable and well appointed CL-S or TL-S, and adding the blower is meant to simply enhance the vehicles capability. It is not to pretend it is an all out race car.

It seems that you have little to no experience in the world of automobiles otherwise you would grasp why people do what they do. It isn't always about time or making one vehicle faster than another. It is about making what you have better and different from others. Be that through powertrain increases or through visual.

The reason for the initial questions was to get an idea of how the car will respond to the modification. References to other aspired vehicles are common as it makes the changes easier to correlate. Now a question for you, why do you care?? Do you keep you cars stock??

 

:noob:


Excellent reply scalbert, sums up everything. We don't modify our CL's because we want them to be the fastest car out there; we all know they never, ever will be. We want them to perform at the absolute best of their ability. This is why we modify our cars in so many different ways. From mild to wild.

 

:noob:

 

you tell him scalbert

IMO you would have a chance to keep up with E46 M3 on stick due to driver error... not on SMG with the highest sport mode. the SMG shifts faster than the best expert professional driver can shift with a manual (or so i read in the BMW manual) thats why im plannin to trade in my 2001 330xi next year for a used E46 M3 with SMG... by then hopefully i'll have saved up enough money for the transaction.

the S4... although slower than the E46 M3 (but not by too much) might be an ok race straight line. with the blower that is. add ina few twisties, forget about it. AWD vs FWD on a curve... you know how i tis.

IMO if there was a kit to make the CL-S AWD or RWD i would get it. but it would probably cost just as much as the CL-S itself. lol

 

quit the whinning and just race him hehehe..

 

are u gonna run the hbp??

 

wow these new noobs lately are really bitchy and got attitudes, i say we regulate on sum of these noobies

 

Not sure. Ya know, I keep telling my wife after each mod I buy that "this one will be the last." But...here I am again. I guess for the price it would be worth it.

As for the noob questioning my intentions, I rarely do any street racing. But I simply LOVE entering an open highway w/ my CAI and VTEC screaming! The SC whine is gonna be just as nice I'm sure.

Thanks for coming to my rescue Scalbert!

 

i think a 6 speeder with a blower and all the goodies might give the e46 M3 a good run.

 

Actually...it will be even nicer. And what your car lacks in whine it will make up for in power. By all means get the HBP while you're at it.

 

with 369whp the m3 has no chance and if he starting pullin on me i could always turn my wheel in and play bumper cars but dollar for dollar its still cheaper with all the mods vs the m3 and nobody knows what you have till they here zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

Been down that road many times.

 

just to add some info....stock S4's trap between 97-99 mph. Chipped S4's trap 104+ mph depending how agressive the software is, and if they have other mods like intake, exhuast, better intercoolers, downpipes and if they are running race fuel. I've seen a seen a stock turbo S4 (race chip, front mount intercooler, intake, exhaust, downpipes, stripped interior) run a 12.5@113 on an 80 something degree night. He also ran a 13.8@98 bone stock.


I think the blown CLS will take the stock S4 from a roll. I think a chipped S4 will be too much. Although there seems to be a lot of difference in one chipped S4 to another. The S4 has great low end and mid range, so they are pretty strong from a roll even with the AWD penalty. I've seen most put over 300 ft lbs of tq to the wheels chipped....and that's at about 2500 RPM. Good luck.

 

Hey Scalbert, <p>

"Your point is what, that no one should take a vehicle they enjoy and enhance it?? Yes, the CL-S is a commuter vehicle as is the M3 and S4 (especially being a sedan), albeit the later two have a greater performance envelope. The NSX is race inspired, the M3 is a seriously factory modified vehicle with racing in mind. But make no mistake, its chassis origins are from the same lineage as the base models. Which are also great chassis in their own right.

Taking a very comfortable and well appointed CL-S or TL-S, and adding the blower is meant to simply enhance the vehicles capability. It is not to pretend it is an all out race car.

It seems that you have little to no experience in the world of automobiles otherwise you would grasp why people do what they do. It isn't always about time or making one vehicle faster than another. It is about making what you have better and different from others. Be that through powertrain increases or through visual.

The reason for the initial questions was to get an idea of how the car will respond to the modification. References to other aspired vehicles are common as it makes the changes easier to correlate. Now a question for you, why do you care?? Do you keep you cars stock??"

I apologize for my late replies but I have plenty to keep me busy. Anyhow...

Both the M3 and the NSXs are racing inspired. Different classes of racing. Have you heard about the M3-GTR? They dominated Porshes so bad that they had to be banned from racing. Well guess what? They now have a limited production M3 GTRs that are street legal. Try pitting you super-charged whatever against that. Bleh... My point is, do whatever mod with your car but dont stroke your own c*ck makin unfair comparisons. Like a stock M3 against a rocket propelled CL. Don't get me wrong. I love my CL. I just think its stupid to mod it and try to beat faster cars on the street. Not only that it is dangerous, it is a waste of money. If you really claim to get joy out of working on cars to make them fast, take them on the track and test your skills there.

 

"Excellent reply scalbert, sums up everything. We don't modify our CL's because we want them to be the fastest car out there; we all know they never, ever will be. We want them to perform at the absolute best of their ability. This is why we modify our cars in so many different ways. From mild to wild."

I can respect this. It is different from someone saying, hey can I beat an M3 if I put on a supercharger? If you want to make your car different, fine. I know a lot of people that do and I respect them for it. The idiots I hate are the speed hungry bastards that race on the streets and highways...

 

"wow these new noobs lately are really bitchy and got attitudes, i say we regulate on sum of these noobies"

*rolls eyes*

And how do you propose that? Are you gonna round up your 2fast2furious crew and try to put a beat down on me? You should check and see if Vin Diesel is available. You should respect peoples opinion without having to "regulate" them. How old are you?

 

no way in hell you can keep us with EITHER an E46 or an S4.



Most older S4's are modded,

Newer one's are V8 runnin' 13's, low 13's...

 

Are your parents aware you are using their computer to post about their car?? Your mannerisms suggest that to be a true statement.

So you are saying that since the M3-GTR ran in the AMLS that the base version (325i) is race inspired?? The car is based on a production vehicle with commuter values, the 330Ci and 325Ci. BMW is just a fine manufacturer of vehicles which lend themselves both ways. The NSX was designed from the ground up as a race vehicle but livable.

Regardless, this is not an issue of what car has what origins. It was a simple comparison between cars which could accelerate at a similar rate. We are not talking about over all dynamics which obviously the M3 is far superior.

You seem to have a hard time reading or comprehending what was stated. People are not modifying the CL to make it faster than other cars. It is to make it faster than what it came form the factory. If this was a real speed competition there are far better cars to start with. Most just want to enhance what they currently have. If you don't feel it is worth it or cannot afford to modify your vehicle, there is nothing wrong with that. Nor is there anything wrong with changing what you have to suit your needs or satisfy a want.

You still can't get the concept through your feeble mind. It is not to go on a road course to challenge whatever vehicle. One more time, it is not about making the car faster than another car. The question was posed to gain a reference point in the change of performance.

Anyway, you need to get some statements correct. Although the M3-GTR was dominating Porsche, it was removed from competition after the 2001 season since it was not for sale on two continents within twelve months of the rules being issued.

 

"Are your parents aware you are using their computer to post about their car?? Your mannerisms suggest that to be a true statement."

How the f*ck did you come to this conclusion? Everyone else, please pardon my french. FYI, I'm using my own computer and no my parents are not aware. Do yours?

For your info, the three series platform is indeed race inspired. I suppose if you put sports seats on any production car then one can claim that it is indeed race inspired. Well enough of that because we can go on and on about this and not go anywhere. Point is, you saw multiple M3 GTRs spanking Porshes on the track and I haven't seen a CL (regardless of what mods) do the same. Do you ever stop and think that the smart engineers at Honda thought about this already? I'm sure those guys would just love to see their work beat the crap out of BMW.

"You seem to have a hard time reading or comprehending what was stated. People are not modifying the CL to make it faster than other cars."

Uhhh read the topic title buddy. It says "Will I give a M3/S4 a good run?" You are the one who lacks comprehension. Notice I didn't post on a thread about some guy adding spoilers or rims to his car. Those mods are cool with me.

"You still can't get the concept through your feeble mind. It is not to go on a road course to challenge whatever vehicle. One more time, it is not about making the car faster than another car. The question was posed to gain a reference point in the change of performance."

Feeble mind. And you are supposed to be a director of engineering? Hey directors here at my work drive Porshes and BMWs. Why are you wasting your time with a CL? See I refuse to name call but you had to resort to it. I still wont go there. So how do you suppose people should benchmark the increased performance injected by mods? Dyno and track perhaps? If so, cool. But if you start posting on boards talking about beating M3s/S4s out on the street, then I think your ass deserves to get locked up... for a long time. Peace..

 

oh and who cares what you got under the hood..... run what you brung! so what if the m3 is stock and the cls has all the goodies.

 

The parent statement was in response to your brash statements.

Comparisons will be made and are for reference in most cases. Since the original poster has not yet installed the blower they cannot go to a dyno or a track. They are left to hypothesis which involves other vehicles as a benchmark.

I do not condone serious street racing and it should be taken to the track. But even there the vehicles discussed could match up and is relevant for a pre-install comparison.

You are making assumption that the modifications are simply to go street racing. Where that is the last thing that vast majority are considering.