Why no Direct Injection Engine yet for Honda...
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
Team Owner
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From: Los Angeles
what? end of what story?
1: IS250, IS300, IS350 were/are NEVER FWD.
2: What makes IS350 AWD so much faster then IS350 RWD? or FWD in your term.
3: IS350 whatever Wheel Driver is slow? if you consider G37/335 slow then yes it is slow because they are all in the same performance category.
Team Owner
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From: Los Angeles
As in beat the 2.0T Turbo in acceleration?
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
otherwise my buddy would have run away from me.
You'll Never Walk Alone
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As in beat the 2.0T Turbo in acceleration?
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
Accord V6 6MT 2003:
Zero to 60 mph: 5.9 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 15.2 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 31.1 sec
Street start, 5-60 mph: 6.3 sec
Standing 1/4-mile: 14.5 sec @ 98 mph
Top speed (drag limited): 135 mph
Braking, 70-0 mph: 181 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.82 g
C/D-observed: 23 mpg
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/..._v-6-road_test
Sonata 2.0T:
C/D TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 6.2 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 15.1 sec
Street start, 5–60 mph: 6.7 sec
Standing Ľ-mile: 14.7 sec @ 99 mph
Top speed (governor limited): 153 mph
Braking, 70–0 mph: 180 ft
Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.79 g
C/D observed: 24 mpg
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
It will be really close though in stock form. And if his Accord is modded....then it will take the Sonata with ease.
You'll Never Walk Alone
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From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
As in beat the 2.0T Turbo in acceleration?
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
How fast is your Accord?
I ran my '03 TL Type-S with a whole bunch of mods against a brand new Sonata Turbo (like 10 miles on the odometer new). We were door to door all the way up to 100+ when we shut down. My TL ran 14.4 in the quarter trapping at 99 mph with a 2.1 60' time on a warm Alabama evening.
Banned
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From: MTL, Canada
Hyundai could have used their V6 276HP found in the Santa Fe.... it already gets a great 20mpg city in AWD. The same engine in the lighter Sonata platform + the addition of direct injection would allow it to be at least the equal or better compared to the 2.0T.
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^if/when Honda harnesses the true potential of the technology, it'll likely spread to the rest of their lineup. You know, like the 6-speed automatic.
and WOW, the person who bumped this has it so wrong on so many different levels.
^
there are just so many things wrong going on in those two posts that I'm at a loss for words.
and WOW, the person who bumped this has it so wrong on so many different levels.
okay i may not know everything about fuel economy, but what im certain of is:
a small v6 compared to a big I4 is a joke..
everyone knows that a small block v6 2.7L will out preform and have better fuel economy then big block I4 2.5L...
This is proven every day yet... ppl never smarten up.
doesnt matter what tranny, 4 spd 5 or 6...
if you look at an old rx6 mazda and a new vw city golf.. whos got the better numbers ?? haha
but anyways,
now on the matter of FI to DI .. its simple.. although DI technology and actual use in vehicles has been around for years. Its just not perfect yet. where as FI has no draw backs. Yes DI is said to save on fuel and increase power..but currently these engines are known to require a large increase in maintenance expense...
a small v6 compared to a big I4 is a joke..
everyone knows that a small block v6 2.7L will out preform and have better fuel economy then big block I4 2.5L...
This is proven every day yet... ppl never smarten up.
doesnt matter what tranny, 4 spd 5 or 6...
if you look at an old rx6 mazda and a new vw city golf.. whos got the better numbers ?? haha
but anyways,
now on the matter of FI to DI .. its simple.. although DI technology and actual use in vehicles has been around for years. Its just not perfect yet. where as FI has no draw backs. Yes DI is said to save on fuel and increase power..but currently these engines are known to require a large increase in maintenance expense...
there are just so many things wrong going on in those two posts that I'm at a loss for words.
Team Owner
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From: Los Angeles
^if/when Honda harnesses the true potential of the technology, it'll likely spread to the rest of their lineup. You know, like the 6-speed automatic.
and WOW, the person who bumped this has it so wrong on so many different levels.
^ there are just so many things wrong going on in those two posts that I'm at a loss for words.
and WOW, the person who bumped this has it so wrong on so many different levels.
^
there are just so many things wrong going on in those two posts that I'm at a loss for words.
Transmission and gear ratio play just as big role as the engine itself..
Are you talking about Mazdaspeed3?
Visit Mazdaspeedforums.org and check out some threads there regarding multiple methods of cleaning/preventing carbon build up. It's pretty easy and cheap to do this thing.
Eat before you talk son.
Visit Mazdaspeedforums.org and check out some threads there regarding multiple methods of cleaning/preventing carbon build up. It's pretty easy and cheap to do this thing.
Eat before you talk son.
Sorry, I'm just so hungry right now that I'm being extremely sensitive on everything.
Yes, our DISI engines get some crazy carbon build up, that's for sure!
Last edited by JS + XES; Jun 28, 2011 at 11:56 AM.
Drifting
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From: Carlsbad, CA
Honda has sometimes been slow adapting technology that other makers have had and fuel delivery is something I remember from the past. It took Honda until 1986 to make a fuel injected car when VW had this technology 10 years earlier. I would hope Honda will have DI sooner than 2020, but you never know.
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Honda has sometimes been slow adapting technology that other makers have had and fuel delivery is something I remember from the past. It took Honda until 1986 to make a fuel injected car when VW had this technology 10 years earlier. I would hope Honda will have DI sooner than 2020, but you never know.
I don't think people really mod or race Sonatas.... at least not that I've heard of, yet. But it's already got good power for a 4-cyl, even with F/I considered. Just comparing small bolt-ons and no tune, I can see a V6 6MT Accord hanging with a Sonata Turbo. Still, almost any F/I car can make decent power very cheap once you get a freer flowing exhaust, up the boost and get a tune.
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From: Maryland
Honda has sometimes been slow adapting technology that other makers have had and fuel delivery is something I remember from the past. It took Honda until 1986 to make a fuel injected car when VW had this technology 10 years earlier. I would hope Honda will have DI sooner than 2020, but you never know.
When VW did go back to FI they used the Bosch mechanical K-type fuel injection in 1977. The Honda FI was slowly adopted, it took ~3 years until 1988 that all Honda in North American vehicles had fuel injection. By that time VW had gone back to electronic fuel injection with the Bosch Montronic system.
Honda's old fuel injectors looks very similar to the Bosch injectors, I know GM purchased and licensed the Bosch injectors but I don't know about Honda. I believe Kihei make Honda's injectors who also used to make their carbs.
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From: Maryland
Also forgot to mention the 2nd generation fuel injection system that MB/Porsche/Audi/VW used was also problematic. Not as bad as D-type but K-type had issues with quality of gasoline causing deposits on the mechanical metering valves.
So in some ways it took the VW three attempts to get their fuel injection systems to a fairly reliable system. So perhaps Honda is using the same approach with DI and working a better solution?
So in some ways it took the VW three attempts to get their fuel injection systems to a fairly reliable system. So perhaps Honda is using the same approach with DI and working a better solution?
I kid.
Burning Brakes
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From: Richmond, BC
From what I heard, Ford and Lexus solved the problems with DI carbon build-up in their engines. I don't know how Ford did it, but I heard Lexus cleans the valves by having a separate injector spray a small amount of fuel into the intake manifold.
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I don't think they have solved the issue. They have mitigated the problems.
Here's an example of the Ford Eco-Boost:
http://www.bgfueltest.com/?paged=2
Here's an example of the Ford Eco-Boost:
http://www.bgfueltest.com/?paged=2
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2008
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Several people are confusing DI with GDI. They are not the same. The first is low pressure injection into the intake manifold. The second is high pressure into the cylinder.
GDI has a reputation for producing more carbon and mixing gasoline with the oil.
GDI has a reputation for producing more carbon and mixing gasoline with the oil.
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