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I was randomly browsing GTR prices and saw one for $25k with 43k miles on it. So I clicked on the dealer inventory saw all these crazy prices. You could have bought a F430, GTR, E46 M3, S2000 and a G Wagon for like $60k
The rest of their inventory is amazing. SO MANY air cooled Porsches and even an Enzo
$95,000 for a '91 NSX. Granted it's only got 5K on the odo, but still.
I'll be in the market soon for a toy & had considered a NSX, but given the turn around they've had on the used market, looks like it's out of the question. I'm genuinely curious if you can even get a decent example after '92 for $35-40,000.
The rest of their inventory is amazing. SO MANY air cooled Porsches and even an Enzo
what the what!!!! thanks for pointing that out.
damn that '94 911 Turbo 3.6 would be a good investment at $274K, I think! I think that would appreciate. Wish I could buy it. Sort of. Probably wouldn't unless it was pocket change.
So I didn't want to start a new thread for this, but I am looking at a two cars for a friend.
If you tack all the options on the Mazda 6 it comes out to 33k.
If you get the Accord V6 with Honda Sensing and Navigation it's also 33k.
I've read the Mazda is a better car, but is it really worth dropping the engine down? The only thing I can see that it has that the Honda doesn't is BSI.
Am I wrong for finding the Mazda overpriced? I do think it's the better looking car, but a fully loaded Accord i4 is only 30k.
all the cars in that segment when fully loaded are all around the same price. Altima, accord, Camry, Mazda 6.
I would say to drive them all and pick the one that you like best. Price/value is as subjective as looks as i am sure many current Mazda 6 owner will give you plenty of reasons why Mazda 6 is better.
Also while they might have similar MSRP, but the price paid for each car is very different. I know you won't get as much discount on the accord, than say a Camry V6 or Altima. Probably Mazda 6 will have deeper discount too than Accord.
but Accord probably will have the best resale value among all of them and the lesser discount will be offset when you want to sell your car.
Thanks, I would hope the Mazda would have a bigger discount. The Mazda loads up at 33k where as the Accord i4 loads up at 30k.
However, you're right in that it a lot of it comes down to preference. This is going to be for a lease so in the end its the lowest monthly payments.
However, my thinking is if you can pay the same thing for the V6 with a Honda that you could with an i4 Mazda you'd get the V6.... Unless the Mazda is just that great.
Last edited by Curious3GTL; 05-23-2016 at 03:21 PM.
yah but what if your friend really likes the look of the Mazda 6 and he actually prefer a 4 cylinder?
If you friend wants to lease, it just opens up another can of worms.
While both cars have similar MSRP, the leasing program might be dramatically different that will result in very different monthly payment with similar "drive offs"
yup. There is really no point of searching right now until when he is ready. he might even pick the car he does not like because of lower payment... who knows.
I noticed when quoting leases with Truecar that domestic vehicles tend to have higher payments. I am shopping SUV's (I will update my own thread when closer) and saw that the Pilot was cheaper than the Durango, Acadia SLT, and Explorer. Is this because of the value of the car after the term? I am using similar terms 36 mos, $2000 down, 12k miles.
I would imagine that's why. Are you able to get any discount on the Pilot? I have a coworker that's between that and the highlander and he can't get any discount on the Pilot. It seems the second they hit the lot they're sold, our local dealer only has 2 in stock.
I noticed when quoting leases with Truecar that domestic vehicles tend to have higher payments. I am shopping SUV's (I will update my own thread when closer) and saw that the Pilot was cheaper than the Durango, Acadia SLT, and Explorer. Is this because of the value of the car after the term? I am using similar terms 36 mos, $2000 down, 12k miles.
With the lease, you are basically paying for the depreciation on the car over the lease term (plus interest and fees) so less depreciation = lower payments which is why Hondas and Toyotas lease out so well. MB/BMW/Audi lease a lot because the cars are too expensive for most people to buy outright and also because they turn into money pits once the warranty is over.
With the lease, you are basically paying for the depreciation on the car over the lease term (plus interest and fees) so less depreciation = lower payments which is why Hondas and Toyotas lease out so well. MB/BMW/Audi lease a lot because the cars are too expensive for most people to buy outright and also because they turn into money pits once the warranty is over.
True and in addition, it all depends on how willing the manufactures want to move the car. Example: Audi lease rate vs. BMW (Similar MSRP and residual but the monthly payment are hundreds apart)
The residual value is determined by the bank, in many case it is the bank of the manufactures and the money factor (the interest rate for leasing).
Any one of these will affect your payment dramtically from $30 to $40 a month to a few hundred depends on the cars price.
Residual value is calculated % based on the full MSRP and it is not negotiable . So the more discount you can get off MSRP, the less you pay (Similar to how you purchase a car)
One of the biggest mistakes that many make is because they thought it is a lease, so as long as the monthly lease payment is low then they are happy (what we call a payment buyer). Monthly payment can be manipulated in so many ways in a lease that if that is the only # you are focusing on, you will get "pounded" by the dealer in everything else.
Also Total out of pocket/Drive off and Down payment are not the same thing. You want to pay the drive off up front but you do not want to put $$ down on a lease.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 05-24-2016 at 04:29 PM.
Leasing a Honda, well most of the Honda will end up in profit. I have done this many times with our company's car (Oddy and Pilot).
You put $0 down, but pay about $800 drive off that will include fees, registeration, and 1st month payment.
Lease term is 36 months/12k miles (Honda does not offer 10k lease) If you drive "normal" mileage, and keep the car clean as you should with your own car. very often, you can sell it to Carmax after 2 years (24 months) for a profit in the thousands. This is extremely helpful if you dont like the car or your mileage is somewhat high for the lease term or you just want get something else.
Leasing a Honda, well most of the Honda will end up in profit. I have done this many times with our company's car (Oddy and Pilot).
You put $0 down, but pay about $800 drive off that will include fees, registeration, and 1st month payment.
Lease term is 36 months/12k miles (Honda does not offer 10k lease) If you drive "normal" mileage, and keep the car clean as you should with your own car. very often, you can sell it to Carmax after 2 years (24 months) for a profit in the thousands. This is extremely helpful if you dont like the car or your mileage is somewhat high for the lease term or you just want get something else.
Yep, my dad leased his 2010 Accord and drove it for the three years. After the lease was over, he had ~28k on the clock (36k lease) so he bought it out and immediately sold it for a profit since the residual was precalculated as if he drove the 36k miles.
This obviously wouldn't be the case with many other cars but it works well with Hondas.
Yep, my dad leased his 2010 Accord and drove it for the three years. After the lease was over, he had ~28k on the clock (36k lease) so he bought it out and immediately sold it for a profit since the residual was precalculated as if he drove the 36k miles.
This obviously wouldn't be the case with many other cars but it works well with Hondas.
You know he did not have to buy it then sell it. he could have just sold it directly Carmax or any other used car dealers while he is still on the lease and he did not have to wait for the lease to mature. He could have sold it months if not years before the maturity date. Carmax will deal with Honda Financial directly with the transition. So you dont have to deal with the private buyers (hassle) and less risky.
Wow great tips! I figured RV wasn't negotiable but didn't realize it was a % based off the price. So I'd still haggle price to get them to lower RV. Here are the terms from Truecar:
2016 Honda Pilot 2WD EX (no Sensing nor accessories)
Price: $31,941 (4.6% below MSRP)
Payment: $411
Down Payment + Trade in: $0
12k miles for 36 mos assuming 680 FICO
APR: 6.22% residual value: $21,762
U.S. Bank Lease. $425 sec deposit
Tax, Title, License not included.
According to edmunds.com right now the money factor is around .00165 which is an interest rate of 3.96%. You convert MF to interest by muliplying by 2400. Not sure why they're saying 6.22%? Seems high to me.
My only guess is that they raised the APR since people were searching for a payment amount. Is that allowed on leases where they make a premium on the rate?
Wow great tips! I figured RV wasn't negotiable but didn't realize it was a % based off the price. So I'd still haggle price to get them to lower RV. Here are the terms from Truecar:
2016 Honda Pilot 2WD EX (no Sensing nor accessories)
Price: $31,941 (4.6% below MSRP)
Payment: $411
Down Payment + Trade in: $0
12k miles for 36 mos assuming 680 FICO
APR: 6.22% residual value: $21,762
U.S. Bank Lease. $425 sec deposit
Tax, Title, License not included.
Incorrect. You cannot lower RV by negotiation. It can only be lowered or raised by mileage per year (things that can affect resale values if you will). and it is calculated based on % of the MSRP, not the selling price.
What you can negotiate is the selling price and money factor (to verify if dealer is not jacking up the rate from the lowest available from the bank. Can be verified from Edmund)
The Pilot above, you probably could save some more $$ if the FICO score is a little higher. But you cant do much about that.
If you remove money factor and other variables out of the formula. The simpler math is (MSRP - Negotiated discount - FIXED RV value in dollar amount)/ terms in month
Bold area is where most of the negotiation happens and other things like money factors/bank fees are all verification.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 05-25-2016 at 01:07 PM.
Wow great tips! I figured RV wasn't negotiable but didn't realize it was a % based off the price. So I'd still haggle price to get them to lower RV. Here are the terms from Truecar:
2016 Honda Pilot 2WD EX (no Sensing nor accessories)
Price: $31,941 (4.6% below MSRP)
Payment: $411
Down Payment + Trade in: $0
12k miles for 36 mos assuming 680 FICO
APR: 6.22% residual value: $21,762
U.S. Bank Lease. $425 sec deposit
Tax, Title, License not included.
So you got $1470 discount off MSRP?
I am not sure what is a typical discount is like for the new pilot, you should check Edmund discussion forum and the pilot forum to see what are other people are getting.
Without a benchmark you have no idea if the $1470 is good or bad. Maybe others are getting $3000 off... then you should go back and ask for more. If others are paying MSRP, then take the $1470 and run.
also did you check the money factor from Honda financial? if it is lower than what US bank offers, then you could save more. Also why is there $425 security deposit?
Also, have you checked 2WD MDX? because based on the number above, you are very close to lease a MDX just FYI.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 05-25-2016 at 01:08 PM.
My only guess is that they raised the APR since people were searching for a payment amount. Is that allowed on leases where they make a premium on the rate?
If they can ask for more than MSRP on certain cars, then what is there to stop them from jacking up the rate.
Ask the dealer to provide a lease structure based on what Honda Financial offers. and compare.
05-16-2016, 03:56 PM
Hello Mr. Hennessey
