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Lol, that’s funny about the instructor being ill. Mine had an iron stomach, I started feeling ill and cut a session short.
some of those track boys are really fast. I only went once to a PCA HPDE at the FIRM, but those guys overall were way slower than the people at Sebring. My instructor had a 2018 gt3 and he had 27k miles if I remember right. He said all he does with it is track (it’s not trailered) but he stays in Florida. It didn’t take much time to see the car doesn’t spend its days in a garage, the front grills were sandblasted from track debris.
I just checked, just over 1200 miles from me to the Glen… easy weekend round trip
My girlfriend saw two drivers pull off the track onto the grass, open the door and they puked. LOL It was on the Driver Developement Track that has very few long straights and plenty of turns. We are pulling good Gs between 1.25 and 1.35 G as a novice. Not an issue here having spent up to 10 hours in the aircraft with students on a daily basis in the past.
I signed my girlfriend up but made sure I can take over since I paid for her one-day Precision course in case she gets sick or if she gets tired.
My girlfriend saw two drivers pull off the track onto the grass, open the door and they puked. LOL It was on the Driver Developement Track that has very few long straights and plenty of turns. We are pulling good Gs between 1.25 and 1.35 G as a novice. Not an issue here having spent up to 10 hours in the aircraft with students on a daily basis in the past.
I signed my girlfriend up but made sure I can take over since I paid for her one-day Precision course in case she gets sick or if she gets tired.
Best mod? Track time!
what sort of car / tires? That’s crazy high for a stock 911 in every day tires.
what sort of car / tires? That’s crazy high for a stock 911 in every day tires.
I am going by the G meter in the MFD to the right of the central RPM gauge that I reset every lap session. I would think it is reasonably accurate as it is used for other functions in the vehicle.
Most of the folks on Rennlist 992 forum love the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S tires vs. Goodyear F1's or Pirelli P Zeroes (only road fitments available). My car was delivered with the Pirellis and I noticed at the Glen, they seemed better suited than the Michelins I replaced them with.
Last edited by Chief F1 Fan; Jun 4, 2024 at 07:42 AM.
I am going by the G meter in the MFD to the right of the central RPM gauge that I reset every lap session. I would think it is reasonably accurate as it is used for other functions in the vehicle.
Stock 992 S or 4S on Pirelli P-Zeros.
I see, the reason for my surprise is, my instructor at sebring on a 2:20 lap (which is good pace for the more advanced groups) using the Porsche built in telemetry (via the track precision app) was only doing 1.4g under braking and cornering was also about 1.4g but with the bumps it bounced as high as 1.6g. This was in a 991.2 GT3 with 27k heavy track miles, some of his ponies left the stable. I believe the lap he showed me was on stock wheels with the factory cup 2 tires (180 tread), but it is possible it was on his 19 inch wheels now on a stickier tire.
I have the Michelin 4S on my TL, great tire!
a friend of mine that goes to sebring very often loves his dunlops but he’s in a gt4, different wheel size, I don’t believe it’ll fit our cars.
I see, the reason for my surprise is, my instructor at sebring on a 2:20 lap (which is good pace for the more advanced groups) using the Porsche built in telemetry (via the track precision app) was only doing 1.4g under braking and cornering was also about 1.4g but with the bumps it bounced as high as 1.6g. This was in a 991.2 GT3 with 27k heavy track miles, some of his ponies left the stable. I believe the lap he showed me was on stock wheels with the factory cup 2 tires (180 tread), but it is possible it was on his 19 inch wheels now on a stickier tire.
Just relating what the G meter reads with left turns showing the highest numbers, 1.34G actually. By the way, braking at 1.2 to 1.3G. I think acceleration was just over 1G from a standstill. Ambient temperature about 75-80F.
On wet pavement in light rain (not a heavy Florida 15 minute downpour), just over 1G. Impressive what street legal tires can do these days. I always like a bit or rain at the end of any track days.
And you do not need ponies to pull Gs. Just go through the turn faster.
It great to experience what the instructor talks about.
This is not on my 991.1 GTS but Porsche's 992 at track days.
Just relating what the G meter reads with left turns showing the highest numbers, 1.34G actually. By the way, braking at 1.2 to 1.3G. I think acceleration was just over 1G from a standstill. Ambient temperature about 75-80F.
On wet pavement in light rain (not a heavy Florida 15 minute downpour), just over 1G. Impressive what street legal tires can do these days. I always like a bit or rain at the end of any track days.
And you do not need ponies to pull Gs. Just go through the turn faster.
It great to experience what the instructor talks about.
This is not on my 991.1 GTS but Porsche's 992 at track days.
lol, reason I pointed out HP and ponies was to relate to lap time and imply it wasn’t time gained on the straights but rather time not wasted through corners.
about acceleration, out of turn 7 (Only 2nd gear opportunity) he did 0.9g, turn exits from 3rd gear we’re 0.6g max. Bone dry surface.
funny you mentioned the bit of rain. My one HPDE experience in the wet, when it was pouring down, we only had a fraction of the carnage as when it was drying mixed with very light rain. The guys especially in the fast groups were treating it like a dry surface…
Most of the folks on Rennlist 992 forum love the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S tires vs. Goodyear F1's or Pirelli P Zeroes (only road fitments available). My car was delivered with the Pirellis and I noticed at the Glen, they seemed better suited than the Michelins I replaced them with.
I wish they made PS4S tires for my car.
They only have the PSS tires in the sizes I need. Apparently can go to PS4S if you mess with the sizing outside of stock or go aftermarket wheels.
^ Same, but none of my experience is with any performance models.
The OE set on my Exploder aren't bad, but I'd gladly pay a bit extra for Michelins.
Grandmother's 2x W222 S550s had Cinturatos on them, fine for the short drives I took them on.
I think the sidewalls are stiffer on the Michelins at least that's my impression esp going around the "Outer Loop" while continually accelerating until reaching the braking point for Turn 6. You start accelerating at the "e" in Inner Loop until the "C" in Chute. Track is cambered and downhill from the "O" to the "e" in Toe.
Last edited by Chief F1 Fan; Jun 5, 2024 at 08:43 AM.
Finally got my garage project done which was started last October when the driveway and pad (external) was poured last Thursday. Can't wait to start using it!
That looks great, I also love how green and spacious your yard is. However, recording a video in portrait mode is illegal in all states and territories so..
@Chief F1 Fan Do you have any track mods for your T? Things like camber plate, brake fluid, and pads, etc. I'm wondering how track capable a 100% stock 992 is.
I've got some Ferodo pads on that are high performance street pads which I haven't tracked yet otherwise car is bone stock. No mods needed for car to run balls out.
Do you have any track mods for your T? Things like camber plate, brake fluid, and pads, etc. I'm wondering how track capable a 100% stock 992 is.
I wonder how many have been in a car with a real race driver, one that does it for a living, not your PCA DE instructor. I have and these cars in "stock trim" are far more capable than you can imagine.
So personally, other than a good set of tires, I do not bother with mods.
^ Most cars fall into this bucket to be honest. The best mod to do to any car is the driver, followed by a good set of tires. I'd imagine that 99% of drivers on the road could not extract the full amount of performance from a Toyota Camry let alone a 911.
^ Most cars fall into this bucket to be honest. The best mod to do to any car is the driver, followed by a good set of tires. I'd imagine that 99% of drivers on the road could not extract the full amount of performance from a Toyota Camry let alone a 911.
I wonder how many have been in a car with a real race driver, one that does it for a living, not your PCA DE instructor. I have and these cars in "stock trim" are far more capable than you can imagine.
So personally, other than a good set of tires, I do not bother with mods.
I've done laps with Mario Andretti (Toronto), Roberto Guerrero and Andy Lally (The Glen) and can tell you this comment is dead on.
@Chief F1 Fan Do you have any track mods for your T? Things like camber plate, brake fluid, and pads, etc. I'm wondering how track capable a 100% stock 992 is.
most important I would say is fresh brake fluid and pads that aren’t on their last breath. Most cars can handle at least a few hot laps. Last September at Sebring a guy was driving a GT86, and that poor thing was overheating. It was a hot day, but he couldn’t run the entire 30 minute session. At another DE, I was really surprised when a guy ran M8 the entire day and he was really moving fast out there. I was convinced that barge would kill its brakes.
Camber, I would only change if I started using the car more on track than street. That way you get a more even wear across your tires. Some cars might need more cooling, but power is definitely the last thing I would add.
Originally Posted by Tech
I wonder how many have been in a car with a real race driver, one that does it for a living, not your PCA DE instructor. I have and these cars in "stock trim" are far more capable than you can imagine.
So personally, other than a good set of tires, I do not bother with mods.
I thought his question was more related to safety and wear, not outright pace.
I thought his question was more related to safety and wear, not outright pace.
I guess it depends on the car you are taking to the track. There are many "sport car looking" cars out there that cannot handle track time and maybe those cars can use a lot of "mods" which I was responding to re Chief's car. His car does not nedd any mods.
In my books, learning to drive is far more important than mods. I am in a box stock 992 S or 4S on the fastest track in North America...no trouble with stock Porsche brakes.
I guess it depends on the car you are taking to the track. There are many "sport car looking" cars out there that cannot handle track time and maybe those cars can use a lot of "mods" which I was responding to re Chief's car. His car does not nedd any mods.
In my books, learning to drive is far more important than mods. I am in a box stock 992 S or 4S on the fastest track in North America...no trouble with stock Porsche brakes.
For a 911 that makes sense. For someone trying to track other cars some more aggressive track pads and new fluid would be wise. Same for better tires. Both will help you go faster but, more importantly, will also help you stay out of the crash barriers.
For someone trying to track other cars some more aggressive track pads and new fluid would be wise.
Which is why PCA DE track events require fresh brake fluid changes every 6 months...or maybe less. Cars need to be inspected by a list of shops or dealers in the region in order to participate in a DE day.
Just finished Day 1 of an HPDE with Trackmasters at the Glen. I have an amazing instructor who is coaching me very well. He's got me doing some things I'm uncomfortable with esp how I treat Turn 10 BUT with braking he is really coaching me well. It is so hard to be full throttle at the end of the back straight at 145 mph and waiting to get to the 400 marker, SLAM on the brakes HARD, downshift from 5th to 3rd, turn in to the Bus Stop Chicane and accelerate again. Any turn you do the same. It's counter-intuitive to driving on the street where you try to be smooth and let off the gas, coast, apply the brakes and stop or release the brakes and proceed smoothly. There is no smooth in this kind of braking. The faster you get on/off the accelerator the faster you will drive. Period. I was getting in to situations today carrying so much speed that I was arriving at my next corner at speeds I was not familiar with but it was fantastically fun.
Chief, does your 992 do a butt wiggle when you slam the brakes hard at higher speeds? At sebring braking for turn 3, a friends of mine that has a GT4 instructed me around Sebring and his directions were to stab brakes. My car always did a little left to right shimmy under initial braking then settled. Another weekend, I was paired with an instructor that has a GT3 just like mine and he said to roll onto the brakes to prevent that side wiggle. I rode with him in his car and his does the same thing if he stabs the brakes. I was just curious if your 992 has a similar behavior.
The brake release and turn in was the biggest thing I had to adjust to with a 911. On the track I’m no where near the car’s limit, but I am a little braver at autocrossing, the lower speeds and lower risk give me a layer of comfort so I push harder. That’s where I realized that turning in without some level of braking results in the most frustrating understeer. For the first couple of years, I was running the car with a full tank of gas to try and weigh down the nose.
As you pointed out though, on track, coming in at 140mph or more, keeping the brakes on while turning in is a different level of comfort and confidence. I always have the sensation that the back end will come around, but it somehow doesn’t…
Enjoy your weekend Chief! Be safe and I look forward to some pictures!
Waiting for my Ferodo pads to arrive so I can get them on.
I was thinking the Rivian and was scratching my head.
