Depends on how bad the dealer wants to sell the car. The 80K Shelby has been sitting there for 6 months at that price.

I think that if the dealers price the GT-R high, many people will look elsewhere. In the end, it's a Nissan and not a Porsche. My friend's dad has a 996 TT and I asked him if he was going to consider a GT-R as a replacement (he gets new cars all the time). He laughed and said he would never be caught dead driving a Nissan. He races cars professionally and knows the specs, but will not pay that money for a Nissan.

 

Well to me it sounds like your friend's dad is more worried about the name of the car he drives and his image. And the fact that he races professionally doesn't mean squat in this scenario and honestly doesn't make me think any higher of him especially if "knows" the specs of the car but can't appreciate it for what it is (since he laughed at your question).

The nissan gt-r fan won't care if they pull up to the line against a porsche, lotus, ferrari or other exotic with a car that has a nissan badge. You [should] drive a car because you like it, not because the badge puts you at a higher level.

It's just unfortunate that many people in the U.S. buy cars only to improve their image or to get laid.

 

The badge doesn't matter, he just dislikes Nissan. I owned a Nissan before and wasn't impressed with the quality of the vehicle, so I've been a bit turned off by the Nissan brand. I can tell you he can care less about badges, since he's owned numerous Vettes and Mustangs too. There is something about a Porsche that really makes people passionate about them. You have to drive one to understand. Nissan doesn't do that to the people that can afford this car, which is going to be an older demographic. Like I said earlier, if the price of the GT-R is too high I believe people will be turned off.

 

and I always thought you were a Nissan guy, from your name.. hehe.

would be funny if the dad with the 996TT takes his car to a track event and gets smoked to all hell by a GT-R..

 

I hear ya on the porsche thing, I've never driven one, but if/when I can afford a uber sports car, it'll be a porsche even if I can afford a more expensive exotic.

As for the GT-R, all OTHER nissan's aside, the old GT-R had a great reputation for affordable sportiness. Unfortunately, Nissan couldn't do the same with the new one.

Is the GT-R worth $120K+? Hell no, but that's all a matter of perspective, your silver is someone else's gold.

 

and

 

Sold my Maxima 3 years ago for a 05 Mustang GT.

He doesn't drive the Porsche on the track much. It's only used to drive guests around. It's not fast around a road course, but that's relative I guess. I got a ride in a C6R last fall and it's skewed my mentality of what's fast!

 

Illegal to sell over MSRP in

Although it will likely MSRP here at 90k.

 

I am just curious, has any credible source verified the GT-R's Nurburgring claims?

 

In Nissan's defense the GT-R is a much better car.

When Ford rolls out a GT500KR and it has the discs from a V6 base Mustang on it, a $80k Mustang is going to become a permanent fixture in the dealer's showroom.

 

I don't understand why this is any different than when the PS3/Wii came out? There was a huge demand for them at the time (still is for the Wii), there was a limited supply, yet you didn't see Wal-Mart or EB charging $1-2k for them. Sure people bought them and sold them on Ebay for a huge amount, but the retailers themselves had to sell them for MSRP. Why doesn't that work with cars????

 

It's all about the agreements between the retailers and the manufacturers.

the retialers all agreeed to sell it for the same price.

Not the same for car dealers, unless you are a saturn dealer.

 

Not to mention price elasticity at $500 is MUCH different than at $125k

 

The whole point about the GTR is supercar performance accessible to the masses. It is a much easier car to drive fast than the 911 turbo. Most of us do not have the capabilities to push either of these cars to the limit. But, the layperson can drive the GTR faster than the more challenging 911 turbo.

I'm waiting a couple of years. If the price drops down to MSRP or less, I'll consider buying one.

No matter how you slice it, there really isn't that big of a market for a $70K Nissan. That's why Nissan and Toyota had such a hard time even selling $40K 300ZXTTs and Supra TTs. When the NSX was priced around $70K-$80K, they moved very few units.

Supply will catch up with demand.

 

slightly. heh

 

for those of you asking "...why doesn't Nissan do something about this?!?!" Why should they? The fact that one of their $70k cars is going to be sold for $129k is free publicity... People talk about it (like we are right now) be it positive or negative... it's still FREE publicity, which is the best kind

 

those are i-forged promotion vehicles.

and i thought it was polished (whatever "lightweight forged alloy" that iforge uses), not chrome?

personally i loved polished finish on wheels.

 

Cool. That's fine if that's the way they want to play.

Next time I go spend $ on a car (and it's gonna be $40k), guess what company I'm not buying from?

Fuck Nissan/Infiniti.

 

Dealers are not owned by Nissan. I don't see what corporate has to gain by letting dealers rape the base price and turning consumers off. I also don't understand why they wouldn't build enough to satisfy demand, especially under the Nissan marquee.

 

I don't think Nissan is concerned about whether this car is gonna sell... this is one of the hottest cars to ever hit the market, imo.

 

dude, chill out man... I don't understand why people get all worked up talking about cars... Do you really think they care that YOU won't be buying from them? Have you even seen ONE ad for the GT-R? And yet... it's being sold $50k over sticker?

 

car people get worked up talking about cars because they are passionate about cars...

 

yeah, but I don't understand the hate for Nissan, cuz of what? Because they've designed a car price tag at $70k but to many people worth paying thousands over sticker... They're not holding guns to people's heads and say you must pay thousands and thousands over... I haven't seen any ads for this car on TV, I don't read a lot of magazines, but I haven't seen any ads in there either... They've done nothing wrong, but people hate them for that?

 

Can't believe some stupid article is getting everyone all worked up

You guys believe everything you read. Just some article looking for some attention - yeah, I'm sure there's ONE dealer out there who jokingly mentioned that he might sell the GTR for 60k over sticker......

THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT WILL SELL.

Dealers who want to seriously mark this thing up are already SCREWED. Why? Because some folks already have agreements to buy this car at MSRP. Now that word is starting to spread about some dealers selling this car at MSRP, others are going to be even less willing to pay anything over MSRP.

Visit the NAGTROC (North American GTR Owners Club) forums if your really serious about buying the car....you'll see that there are a few folks on there who are getting the car at MSRP and have even had their dealers sign notarized documents to ensure they stick to their word!

My prediction: there will still be markups, but they will be 5k-8k at most, and even then this practice will subside quickly. This isn't Ferrari, this is Nissan, and they have ways of controlling this kind of practice like they did with the 350Z - in that case, they placed limits on the number of cars the dealer received - and dealers make their money on Altimas and Muranos, not on the occasional GTR.

 

Riiight, because getting performance that others can only match at 3x the price (Gallardo, GT2) is not affordable sportiness

This is a world class supercar for $70k, while others are easily double that at $150k+.
Aside from the Corvette, no other manufacturer is making a car with such performance for the price.

$120k is alleged dealer markup, not MSRP.

 

yea the markup has nothing to do with Nissan as a company... hate for them based on that is unwarranted, I agree..

 

I don't doubt for a second there will be idiots who will pay $120k for this car. Just like when the first EVOs came to America, some turds were asking a $30k markup (there was a post here a few years back) and I certainly don't doubt that will happen with the GT-R.

Think of it this way ... those who get it at MSRP can easily drive it a month then sell it for $20k+ over sticker due to its extremely low production. Supply <<< demand. I have a hard time justifying its MSRP, despite its performance numbers, exclusivity, and its history ... how can I justify a mark-up on top of that?

Guess I'll just turn on my PS2 and live vicariously through that ... (I can't even justify buying a PS3 ...)

 

^ You're a pharmacist, dammit. Make use of that comfortable salary you got!

 

I tend to agree with IS300eater. If there is a contingent of people who are willing to overspend on the purchase of the GT-R then why shouldn't Nissan sell it as such. The car business is as much about business as it is about cars, if not moreso....profit margin is the name of the game.

 

^ Yep.

Blame the people who are actually buying them at a markup. They the reasons dealers do it.

And if the dealer cant get the markup price they asking then they already know they can sell at sticker.

Guess you wont buy a BMW ever either. Remember how much the E46 M3 was going for when it was first released?

 

How about just wait until the next year or so when all the rich dumbasses have one, then get one at or around MSRP? Plus some if any of the first year kinks get worked out of the car. Don't know if I'd buy a car like the GT-R used....

 

i am just going to wait until i can get one for invoice...

 

Not sure about that. The reason why the price is high is because Nissan isn't building a lot of them.

I am eagerly awaiting the GTR vs. Z06/ZR1 comparison. I think a lot of the import guys that are foaming at the mouth, will be humbled

 

Well, until the first GTR sells, we won't know what it will sell at; and theres no guarantee it'll sell at MSRP. Getting an agreement notarized is fine, but short of "I agree to sell the GTR at [X] price," won't guarantee that they'll get it at the current MSRP of $60k or whatever its at in Japan. And even then there will be whole issue of if the person who signed the notarized document is justified in making a contract for the dealership... yadda yadda. (3rd year law student and contracts/corporations/SEC compliance are my specialized areas).

I mean the GTR might end up on American shore with an MSRP higher than the MSRP released to date in Japan.

So I mean people can post on forums or what not, but at most, it's just conjecture at this point.

Also an intial 50-60k mark up is realistic. Only 1500 units a year in America = very few GTRs. Do I think there are 1500 people who will buy at 120k? No, but I'm sure several hundred will sell; cause for some, they just have to have what the want regardless of the price. (Look at the PS3s selling for triple the cost its first year).

Also, Nissan has been saying "the gtr rivals a Porsche GT, the gtr is better than the Porsche GT..." etc. Getting a Porsche GT rivalry at $60k is a steal: but then again so is getting a Porsche GT rivalry at $90k. We all know that. What other car for $60k comes even close to the GT2? Nothing. Nissan dealers know that, and they're going to mark up this Car "up the wahzoo" during its first year here. The markup will slowly go down, but it all depends on how well it sells, etc... Ultimately, in 3-4 years, a GTR will probably/realistically sell for a little more than what a new NSX cost.

Acura didn't give a crap whether or not their NSXs sold, and neither will Nissan. It's not their money maker, its their Icon Sports car; and just having it in their line up is enough for them to brag as a car maker.

All in all, I know many of us were hopeful for a GTR at $60k, but realistically it was based on speculation and false hope.

So like Derrick, I too will have to settle for living out my dreams in a GTR through my PS3 when Gran Turismo comes out.

 

+1

The folks who can afford a 70K car care about more than just numbers. It has to have snob appeal and the GT-R has none - it's just a Nissan. Well off Joe Bloe at the country club has no idea of the numbers/background of the car and would be hesitant to tell his buddies how much he spent on a lowly Nissan.

The GT-R is great car but may very well follow the Phateon path or at best the NSX path.

 

Check out the wannabe Silvia in the back :gheylaugh:


The white one

 

^ wow, gross. and no i didn't forget the red text.

 

The more I see the car the more I see a Phaeton situation (with better sales to start).

 

Well ... then after the 2009MY car ... the Spec-V will come out and then EVERYONE will want that one.

Not sure about buying a GT-R used, either. However, if it was broken in and maintained correctly, that engine will be indestructible.

Update: after discussions with the wife, it seems I *can* buy one ... IF I can find one at MSRP. Good luck! I also have to invest her money wisely, too before the purchase. I have to thank my buddy Mike to guilt-tripping to her about not buying that low miles 2003 NSX I was eyeing in Michigan when C$1 = US$1.10 ...

But that would also mean I delay my purchase of a G37S. We passed by a Michigan Infiniti dealership today -- there's an athens blue one (6MT) on the lot that's calling out my name. Taking her TSX for service at the dealership ... might as well go next door and see what deal I can get. Sadly, I think if I can get $500 over invoice ... I'll get the G37 and forgo any chance of finding the GT-R unless my lotto tickets hit this weekend's jackpot.

 

Nissian Muzzles Japanese GT-R

The Tokyo Auto Salon is Japan's version of the annual SEMA show in Las Vegas -- an orgy of high-performance cars and parts tailormade for the hard-core automotive enthusiast.

The buzz at this year's Salon centered around Godzilla's attack on Tokyo; Nissan's GT-R recently went on sale in Japan and has become the talk of auto scribes and tuners worldwide, but some of the recent chatter about the car has been for reasons the company would probably rather not discuss.

Rumors abound that Nissan has effectively castrated the GT-R by restricting the kinds of modifications that can be done to the car, as well as limiting how owners could drive them. How Draconian are Nissan's controls? Word is the company didn't even want to see aftermarket wheels on any of the GT-Rs at the show.

Japanese aftermarket manufacturers are seemingly unfazed by these restrictions and consider this just another obstacle among the many a brand-new car encounters. But many Americans colleagues may have a hard time believing what Nissan Japan has apparently done.

To get the skinny on the GT-R restrictions, we consulted renowned Japanese-tuner Michizo Niikura, president of MINE'S Motor Sports, and his head engineer, Toshikazu Nakayama. MINE'S has the most experience with the new GT-R outside of the engineers involved with the program. MINE'S was rumored to have received the very first production GT-R and presently has two of the beasts in its possession, with a third on order. Here's what it found:

Japanese GT-Rs are speed-limited for the street: As has been widely reported, unless it's driven on a preapproved racetrack, a stock Japanese-spec GT-R is limited to 180 kph (111.8 mph) with the factory settings. GPS sensors in the navigation system track vehicle position and communicate with the ECU. Try to exceed 180 kph, and a warning light will appear on the instrument panel. Only shutting the car off and restarting it will get the light to disappear.

But can be run all-out at the track: Running a GT-R at the track requires scrolling through menus in the on-board computer and selecting the racetrack option that bypasses the speed limiter. Only then can the car be run to its full potential.

Though it'll cost you: Once the track day is over, owners who have run their GT-Rs over the speed limit are required to take them to a preapproved Nissan High Performance Center for a safety check. Failure to perform this $1000 service will void the factory warranty.

As for the wheel and tire rumor: That the factory wheels cannot be removed without sending an error code to the ECU, MINE'S has proven this myth wrong. It's been able to take off wheels, rotate them, and even change to higher-performance, non-run-flat tires. It did have to take the wheels to the Nissan dealership to get the job done at great expense; MINE'S ended up paying about $230 per wheel in labor.

Putting aftermarket rims on a GT-R is different story: Because of a sensor located near the valve stem in each wheel, it isn't possible for the car to run on aftermarket rims without throwing an error code. All blinged-out GT-Rs at Auto Salon got there on stockers and only then were the shoes changed.

Some mild mods are possible: MINE'S has modified the exhaust system and a replacement air-filter element, both of which have reportedly made substantial extra power. It's also upgraded the brake rotors and switched to GT-R's suspension system to a coil-over system with no ECU problems.

But not all: MINE'S has tried replacing the factory air box and intake system with a high-flow cone-style system, but found its car will not run right. Raising the boost pressure on the twin turbos, a common way to increase power, also triggered errors in the extremely sensitive ECU.

There is hope for the hot-rodders: MINE'S is rumored to be the first tuner to crack the GT-R ECU. And though Niikura-san admits his ECU modification is a work in progress, he was able to demonstrate the following during our recent visit. MINE'S gave us a performance demonstration with two GT-Rs, one stock, the other modified by MINE'S. The modified GT-R was able to run at 192.6 mph (310 kph) while the factory spec GT-R was unable to go past 111.8 mph. Niikura-san told us he's in the last stages of overcoming the boost and speed limit as well as making it possible to make adjustments to VTC (variable cam timing system), air/fuel ratio and throttle position. Since our visit, reports have surfaced that MINE'S has just released a version of its VX-ROM product designed to override the ECU's limiter function.

More good news: For all the GT-R's stunning performance, it's hard to understand why any enthusiast in Japan would purchase a GT-R given all the restrictions and headaches. We seem to be in the clear, though; our sources at Nissan USA have told us no such GPS-based speed limiters will be placed on U.S.-spec GT-Rs, though it's unclear where we stand with the rest of the limitations.

Check back with us for more GT-R news as it becomes available.

http://www.motortrend.com/features/a...good_news.html