Twenty years back, Honda created a new auto division - an upscale LUXURY auto brand - the Acura. The Acura brand had only one thing in mind - to be a luxury auto brand, and to compete with the BMW and the MB brands. Luxury it was indeed, with the brand's exclusive use of V6 powerplants and premium vehicle price tags, when the Honda vehicles were all powered by small displacement 4-cylinders.

There were no "Tier-1 luxury", "Tier-2 luxury" at that time. Auto brands were either economy-brand, luxury-brand, or exotic-brand. Acura intended to be a luxury brand right from the start. But the Honda brasses overestimated their Acura products. They tried to undercut BMW's and MB's with only V6 and FWD vehicles. No way in hell at that time did Acura realize that even after 20 years, V6 and FWD could only get them this far - which the brand is being recognized as half way between economy and luxury status.

Honda made a grave mistake then. It wasn't ready to launch a luxury brand. It didn't have the proper hardware (V8 and RWD) to play with the luxury brands. Otherwise, the Acura NSX would have a V8 and the first Acura Legend would have V8 and RWD. Do you think Acura wouldn't release a V8 RWD Legend if it had the hardware at that time ? (Well, even now it still doesn't !) But it ventured out anyway, and this is the final result. There is no magic in it, you put out so much and you get back so much.

Throughout these 20 years, the Acura brand continue to limp along as a luxury-wanna-be brand with mostly V6 and FWD vehicles. It had many chances 10 years ago, or even 5 years ago during the auto-booming period to develop and release V8 powerplants and RWD chassis, but Acura blew them all.

After the Honda brasses suddenly woke up recently and realized that the Acura brand wasn't going anywhere to compete with BMW and MB, it created all these "Tier-1", "non-Tier-1", bullshit talks to try to cover up their failures. The failure to introduce V8 when all other luxury competitors were releasing runaway engines. The failure to introduce RWD when the FWD-chassis-handicaps were very apparent in handling high horsepower, and high horsepower is a MUST for luxury vehicles. The failure to release the NSX replacement while leaving the aging NSX rotting dry with a 15-years-old design.

On the contrary, Lexus was smart from the start. It created the same upscale LUXURY division (just like Acura) the following year after Acura, but with the proper hardware (V8 and RWD) to challenge the luxury auto brands. Coupled with proper exterior styling and powerful engines, Lexus has finally succeeded the task.

It is good that Acura has finally come back to reality and has plans to develop V8 powerplants and RWD chassis. Even better would be to bring back the NSX replacement to boost the much needed image. But this current economy crisis will probably push back all these Acura comeback plans. I sincerely hope that with the money saved from leaving F1, Acura can maintain it's "rebirth" plan without further delays.

 

I STILL don't get all the hand-wringing over a V6 TSX.

Acura is trying to give its buyers a choice, something we've all complained wasn't happening at Acura the last few years. Vehicle choice is part of becoming a Tier 1 luxury purveyor. Once the new RL comes out, hopefully with RWD and a V8 option, the process will continue.

Given the choice between the Acura Aztek (aka TL ) FWD tech and the V6 TSX tech at similar prices, I'd get the TSX any day of the week. It looks better, it will probably handle better, and some tech features the TSX doesn't have compared to the TL can be added aftermarket.

Honestly, the TSX and MDX are the only Acuras I'm excited about right now.

 

^ I think the V6 would've been appreciated in the first gen TSX, when something like the twin turbo'd 3-series wasn't around, or the greatly revamped Infiniti G Series, etc.

It's not a knock on the TSX V6, per se (IMO), it's the price point compared with what the competition now offers. The V6 is barely adequate in this environment. As others have pointed out the Infiniti makes a VERY compelling argument over a tech packaged V6 TSX. As does the Hyundai Genesis...

 

This is exactly why I said "Of course that was just my opinion and I totally understand why some people think otherwise." Just different ways of seeing things.

IMO, Honda purposely didn't make a V8/RWD car when they first introduced Acura. I'm saying this because, Soichiro Honda was still around back then, and he always did things differently. And for the first 10 years or so, Acura wasn't doing badly, and the brand image was pretty good too. If I remember correctly, the Legend wasn't exactly cheap back then (a friend of mine had one and he told me his dad bought it brand it for around $60k CAD). Then they screwed up in 1996.

Lexus certainly did well with its V8 RWD LS. But Infiniti was pretty much doing the same thing too, yet it was pretty much a complete failure. They also had powerful engines, etc. Yet they still failed. I mean, how many Q45's do you see on the road, compared to the LS, or how many I30/I35, compared to the ES? Sure, V8 and RWD are essential, but seems to me there are many other factors.

 

Exterior styling is also very important for luxury vehicles when buyers are spending premium prices for them. It was a well known fact that the Q45's "no front grille" styling had turned away many buyers. The car was a technological wonder at that time, but it's exterior styling made the car look inexpensive. Infiniti immediately corrected this styling deficiency in the 2nd generation and following releases, but the model name was ruined. So when sales did pick up afterward, it was no where close to where the Lexus LS was selling.

On the other hand, the Lexus LS400 highly mimicked the MB styling, especially the big rectangular front grille with which everyone was accustom to associate with expensive cars. Hyundai is also taking this approach with the Genesis sedan, even though quality-wise isn't at the same level.

I agree with you that there are many other factors, in addition to V8 and RWD, to allow a luxury-auto-brand candidate to become successful.

V8 and RWD are simply some of the essential elements for a luxury-auto-brand candidate to become successful. Having V8 and RWD does not automatically make the luxury-auto-brand candidate to succeed. But NOT having V8 and RWD guarantees that luxury-auto-brand candidate will FAIL.

 

Biker, who is just waiting for the Korean fanbois to come out of the woodwork on this one.....

 

^ I believe there are 3 now.

 

It seems like we have finally come to an agreement

 

Hyundai is easily better than Acura, Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Bentley and Lamborghini. Why would you buy any of those cars when you could easily afford a Hyundai? [/msl82]

 

I never even knew that Hyundai/Kia had reached the point of having fanboys. I like the Genesis Coupe, but lets not get carried away.

 

A lot of people buy Acura, Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Bentley and Lamborghini just for the brand name and not for the car. Would you prefer a Hyundai or rather have a Mercedes Benz sitting on your driveway ? That's the whole point of luxury brands.

 

Edward, I Go To Costco was being sarcastic, as you can see he was trying to be msl82 but I guess he didn't do it properly (you see [/msl82] at the end of his sentence).

 

Hmmm didn't even know they were going to offer the TSX with a v6, and 280hp

 

It was first-drive reviewed in Autoweek a couple of issues ago-- http://www.autoweek.com/article/2009...IEWS/906059995

0-60 in 7 seconds, per Acura's "conservative estimate," for a 3700 lb. TSX.
The 2G TSX appears to be taking the place of the 3G TL (in Acura marketing's mind, at least).

 

lol, no kidding..I have no idea why they are so conservative when both motortrend and road & track were able to get 0-60mph in 5.9s.

 

http://www.leftlanenews.com/report-a...tml#more-20268

 

So explain to me... with the TSX now offered in V6 trim, why would I ever buy a TL again?

 

I'd buy it. It would be so much easier to put my bike in the back of this thing rather than the sedan, which is extremely tight. And I don't really want an SUV.

 

I don't think he was referring to the wagon, but just the TSX in general with v6.

 

Memo to Honda:

Bring the Euro-Accord Wagon stateside.....call it an Acura if you want....nobody cares.....but do it!!!!........now part 2 of memo: Kill the Crosstour!!!!!!!!

 

^^ Yeah I know, I was talking about the wagon. His post wasn't there when I started typing my reply.

 

ahhhh,

 

Please bring the TSX wagon!

 

^ seriously.

 

If i were to get another Acura I would probably be the v6 TSX. But I'm keeping my 3g TL until the wheels fall of... Ehh the engine falls off or I start making more money.

 

If it will look as good as I can chop it....I might get one too.
...except for the beak

 

I think you just stole those thoughts from my mind.

Big x 2

HAS to have a manual though,........or no dice.

 

The local Honda dealer in Vienna has the Accord Tourer as the loaner car -looks quite good in person -but of course it's not cursed with the Acura beak.

Saab already has dismal sales and their wagon sells like nothing Acura should go for the safety angle and try get the old Volvo D240 (or V70 now) wagon crowd.

 

do want wagon

 

did you really make that image?

 

Even with the beak, it still looks better than the ZDX, which is based on the Tourer.

 

would the TSX wagon come in both 4 cylinder and V6, 6 speed manual, and maybe AWD?

 

Swap out the Euro front...swap at the euro tails....pretty simple...still says "Accord" in very small letters on the rear...but I did add the TSX plates.

 

If they bring the wagon over, I am going to guess 4 cylinder/auto only to keep things simple since it will have limited sales and to lessen the impact on the RDX.

Then if there is demand and if the V6 sedan sells well, maybe a V6 option. FWD only as I do not believe this generation Accord has AWD available for any market.

 

Acura TSX Wagon Considered - Benz C Class Wagon Off of the Table

Generational biases are nearly impossible to overcome when it comes to cars and image, and what types of cars are hot or not. At least until recently, much of the Baby Boomer generation, which has held most of the new-car buying power, has been decidedly anti-wagon.

My generation, the young side of Gen X plus Gen Y, has liked wagons all along; I can't remember a time when my peers considered them uncool. Whether or not it goes back to the knee-jerk resistance to the Plymouth Voyager minivans and Ford Explorer SUVs that our parents' generation gravitated toward, we really love our sport wagons.

If you're looking for a wagon—especially a sporty wagon—choices have been slim for a long time. The past decade has been full of false starts for the wagon market, as marketers seemed to misunderstand the appeal or pitch products to an older, more affluent audience that wasn't interested (the Lexus IS SportCross was a favorite).

My generation is getting older and fussier and just starting to move toward (and be able to afford) the luxury segment—albeit more cautiously than the older generation. A vehicle like the SportCross would likely have much more success now; and sources inside Toyota have confirmed to TheCarConnection.com that Lexus is reconsidering a wagon body style for its next-generation IS, now under development.

Now Cadillac is about to roll out a CTS Wagon, and according to Car and Driver, Acura is seriously considering bringing a wagon version of its TSX to the U.S.; the model is already sold overseas as the Honda Accord Touring. These models would join two TheCarConnection.com favorites—the 2009 Audi A4 Avant, 2009 BMW 3-Series Sport Wagon. In a more affordable segment of the market, the 2009 Hyundai Elantra Touring is also helping to fill the void.

Any of these are well worth considering; in nearly every case, wagons are more fuel-efficient alternatives to SUVs, with just as much interior space and a better driving experience.

Mercedes-Benz recently announced that it will bring out a wagon version of the E-Class, next summer, but a company spokesperson just confirmed for TheCarConnection.com that it has no plans to bring the C-Class over as a wagon. Mercedes-Benz brought the C-Class wagon to the U.S. from 2002 through 2005, but it was a slow-seller and the latest version never made it.

The past decade has seen several ill-conceived, stodgy wagons that neither appeal to a certain type of Boomers nor to my generation, while at the same time perpetuating a "wagons don't sell" mentality within the ranks. Take the Malibu Maxx, an almost-there design that was saddled with way too much chrome on the outside, given bleak interior trim, and only offered with the V-6 and automatic. A little green appeal or a little sport can go a long way in stoking a wagon's appeal; Ford is missing out tremendously by not offering a Fusion Wagon—especially a Fusion Hybrid Wagon.

There's no denying that a few years from now there will be sport wagons to choose from; tighter fuel-efficiency requirements almost necessitate it. We want sporty and efficient, but we're not willing to sacrifice much practicality.

TheCarConnection.com will keep you posted on new wagon possibilities as they're announced; with some luck they'll pick up steam without sputtering themselves out yet again.

 

Bring over the wagon.

If Honda/Acura has any sense of the target buyers, offer a 6MT.

Unfortunately, the light truck loop hole in the U.S. means crossovers are much easier to make and pass fuel economy standards, meaning no incentive to offer wagons.

 

doesn't bmw offer awd in the 3 series wagon?

the Accord tourer looks way better than the US Accord crosstour or whatever that thing is called.

 

yes. but too bad they wont bring over the 335 wagon

 

TSX Wagon=sex

Dooooo eeeeeet, Acura.

More variety is what Tier 1 makes do.

 

thought you photoshopped the TSX sedan into the wagon