I just bought a new 05 TSX and would like to upgrade the speakers. I've found the speakers sound better (to me) if I turn the treble up +2 and the bass down -1, however the bass then is gone (very similar to my Nissan w/ BOSE which I improved with a sub). I have a Sony amp (50x4 or 150x2 or 50x2 + 150x1) and a smallish 8" Pioneer Premier sub sitting in a box from my Pathfinder. My thought is swap out the door and rear deck speakers then put my amp on the rear deck 6x9s so I can adjust the gains (bring the bass back up). I've read a lot on this site and it looks like an efficient speaker will perform well off the stock amp.

So put an efficient 6 1/2" in the doors, adjust the fader to get the right rear fill, then install a punchy 6x9 to run off my Sony amp? If that doesn't give me enough bass, I could run the amp as a 3 channel and try the sub (the 8 probably may be too small for the trunk but worth a try for now). The custom shop (the one I'd trust the most to do a good job) is willing to install my existing amp, except they really don't want to install after market speakers to a OEM amp. They mainly carry Diamond Audio, JL and Kicker and say the OEM amp just won't drive them well and any gains will be minor for the cost. They said add the amp and sub (preferably a 12") but don't change the front or rear deck speakers unless I'm going to change the amps.

Should I have them install my amp then take the car to CC or BB for the speaker swap or go against their advice and have them do the whole thing (not sure any of their speakers are very effecient) or don't mess with the fronts? Do I need to build a spacer ring for the door speakers or is there an adapter out there that most installers can use to fit a 6 1/2" in the door? I could possible do this all myself, but like the idea of freeing up my weekend by dropping the car off and having someone else deal with it -- how things change when you have kids!

Thanks for your help.

 

 

Yeah, my browser didn't refresh so I reposted. Darn, Safari.

 

yea...i know what you mean

 

I don't mean to sound critical, but what are you asking advice on exactly?

(Besides if Best Buy should touch your car... I'd say NO).

At my shop, we upgrade the speakers on the OEM amp all day long - BUT I wouldn't tell a customer that the OEM amp would keep up with an aftermarket-amp-powered subwoofer - so I agree with your shop on that one.

What's your budget for this? Maybe you can get a 3 or 4 channel amp and new front speakers and ace the R fill (which is a commie frigging plot anyway).

 

Perhaps in my rambling I lost my point. Here is the slightly abridged version --

I want to upgrade the stereo in the car and have an decent amp not being used. I was thinking of replacing the door and rear deck speakers with a better after market versions. Then I running my Sony amp, which has an adjustable bass gain, on just the 6x9s. I'd rather NOT add a sub, but I do have a small 8". I'd rather NOT install everything myself. The custom shops said after market speakers (or at least their's: Diamond Audio, JL, Kicker) wouldn't run well off the OEM amp and unless I'm ready to replace everything, don't bother.

Questions:
1. Will Diamond Audio, JL or Kicker run well off the stock amp?
2. Should I have the custom shop install my amp and their speakers against their recommendations?
3. Does replacing the OEM speakers make a very noticeable difference and if so what brand do you suggest (preferably non-mail order)?
4. If yes to any of the above, does a OEM door speaker spacer need to be constructed or can one be bought?
5. Are most CC or BB installers working the day shift at Lowes?
6. Are installing these speakers SOOO easy I'd be a fool to think of #4... in which case, if it is soo easy why couldn't they do it?

elduderino -- you're going to hate to hear this, but I like a good amount of rear fill. I like the sound to be less localized. So whatever I do to the fronts I want to make sure I don't mess up the current F-R balance. I do have a 2/3/4 channel amp which I can use. I don't have a big budget --around $400 for the amp install ($80) plus 2 sets of speakers installed.

 

To answer some of your questions:

3. Replacing the OEM speakers makes a very noticeable difference. Folks around here have replaced the door speakers with Alpine type S, Polk db, Infinity 6002, and Avincar brand (I'm sure there were others but I just can't recall). I replaced my front door, tweets, and rear 6x9 with elduderino's Avincar brand and I'm really liking the results.

4. Spacers are required. The Avincar speaker kit comes with spacers but you can certainly make your own. A decent audio shop ought to be able to make em without difficulty either.

 

jlukja -- was the Avincar install pretty simple? I like that the kit comes with a spacer. I could easily build one (I use to be a carpenter), but like the idea of not spending a couple hours doing so. Plus, if I need to build a spacer then the door pannel is already off. The hard part of the install is done. What did you think about the down sizing the front drivers? It looks like that kit has a 5"?

elduderino -- why a 5" and not a 6 1/2"? Does that front door speaker kit also work for the rear doors?

I find the OEM system has a pretty muddy mid bass. Could I get more bass off your 6x9s if I put my Sony amp on them? The Sony amp has an adjustable bass gain and an adjustable low or high pass and is (over) rated at 150wpc. What if I would decrease the head unit's bass a couple (to clean up the mid bass), then lower the amp's cross-over point (taking out the upper bass) and increase the amp's bass lower gain? Or am I asking the 6x9 to do something it wasn't designed to do -- become a punchy sounding sub?

 

One more thing, as a point of reference I like punchy bass that hits and falls off rather than a boomy bass that lingers. I'm not a big fan of large subs. The best sounding speaker I've owned was a Energy tower with dual ported 7s when hooked up to my VERY under rated 80wpc Luxman block amp -- sweet neutral sounding highs with bass that plays low but is very tight and controlled. If only that system could have withstood a jolt of lightning. Musically I listen to "adult alternative" (Wilco, Counting Crows, Steve Earle, Dave Matthews, etc) and contemporary Christian (Jars of Clay, Switchfoot, Big Daddy Weave, etc). Thanks for your help.

 

There are different size "6" frames.

There is not a standard for frame width at the backside of the ourter ring.

Some people try to call these different sizes 6.0 and 6.5, or 6-1/2 and 6-3/4, or call the bigger one "oversize 6.5", but there's no industry standard.

Honda sixes are the smaller size. Most of the big six-inch speakers won't fit into a Honda without cutting the metal out. Even with the mating spacers that we use, many big sixes won't fit.

Now the reason these big sixes are made this way is that they have more travel than the shallow-frame sixes, they will support bigger magnets, etc. Otherwise, they'd all be the small version, right?

So when you look at better speakers, you find that MANY of the more expensive big sixes don't fit the Honda speaker holes without mods. Hell, many of their MAGNETS won't fit in the holes. Alpine X-type 6.5s, some Diamonds, DLS M6 (before they go to the neodymium magnet in the top-of-the-line speakers), a/d/s/ 6.5s, Dynaudio MB160, Polk, Boston, whatever - the best 6.5's don't fit.

Now if all other things are equal (which they never are, but anyway), a 5.25 shouldn't play as loud as a 6.5. If they have the same travel, the same cone weight, and the same motor structure, the 6.5 moves more air because it has more area.

But if the 5.25 has a lot more travel than the 6.5, the area difference can be negated (not to mention is more linear in its motion within that travel - i.e., lower distortion)

So we use avincar 5.25s in the kit because:

1) They fit.

2) They sound great - especially as an improvement over the OEM 6", which is our goal.

3) We are not worried about how low they play beyond a certain point, because we have woofers to handle the sub-bass for us - we care about accurate midbass, and we know that the avincar mids play very good midbass in this application, because we've tested them. If we had an avincar 6.5 that did fit, its cone weight would be higher and it then might not sound as accurate as the 5.25 when powered by the OEM wimpo amp.

The avincar kits come with spacers and speaker plugs. I'll let jukjla speak to his installation experience, but you don't need to make anything. If your TSX's tweeter holes under the grille are off center, you might need to mod the tweeter cup with a rasp for a while to get them centered.

As far as wanting to amp the 6x9s: While the 6x9s can handle power very well electrically, when running these speakers as subwoofers, you will get a "poinky" sound out of them on an amp if your overdrive them. I only recommend these on an aftermarket amp if you are filtering out the sub bass and running a woofer, or if you are making the spectacularly bad choice of running them as mids. If you want to amp a set of by-nines, get the Genesis or the MB Quart RCE-269 if you can find any of the latter.

 

I wrote up a review here: https://acurazine.com/forums/audio-video-electronics-navigation-22/avincar-speaker-upgrade-tsx-review-312425/ See post #23 for the full review.

They are very easy to install. The stock door speakers snap in/out, the Avincar speakers you screw in throught the same holes. No drilling. The Avincar speakers come with the Honda speaker plug harness so its plug in/out. Getting the door panels off/on is the bigger job (but easier than I feared). Plus, you don't have to cut wires, worry about soldering or anything like that. Plus, if you want to put the stock speakers back in, you haven't modified anything. If you're looking for a quick/easy install then Avincar is the way to go. The mids are quite good, much better than the stock speakers, despite the "downsize" from 6.5in. to 5.25in.

 

That's what I like about the Avicar 6x9 speakers. They are not boomy. They sound much tighter to me. Your description is better than mine, "They hit and fall rather than linger". If you don't listen at outrages volumes then I think you'd be happy with them. I don't listen to my system too loud so I've never experienced them "poinking". With the windows down and sunroof open I've crancked it up to volume=27 and it sounded great. Got the rear view mirror to shake.

You can, I'm sure, buy better 6x9 speakers. But, if you consider the price vs. performance, especially from the stock amp, then you can't go wrong with them.

 

elduderino, great explaination, thanks. I didn't realize the factory speakers were that small -- actually I was suprised when I read most 6 1/2s would fit (which you've corrected). I agree with your statement on the 5 1/4. I've heard good 4" components sound far better than a 6 1/2" coax and if you aren't using them for bass, there you go.

I believe the amp's high pass filter can be set to filter out the "sub" bass. If I remember correctly on that amp you select the frequency, then select LPF or HPF. If I ran the amp off the speaker leads the highs would be filtered out so I may be able to do this. THEN I could always use the amp in 3 channel mode (50/50/150) and build a small sub box which would be removable for long family trips.

Do the tweaters use the factor grills? and do you sell the door speakers kits separately so i can upgrade the rear doors as well? (don't smack me for wanting rear fill!)

jlukja, nice review, thanks. I also don't listen to music THAT loud. I usually have it between 12-15, but its nice to have clarity when you do want to get loud. Were there any problems you encountered with the door install? I hate taking pannels off expensive cars.

 

Yes, two.

1. I broke three of those snap clips that hold the panel to the door when I was taking the panels off. Actually just portions of the lip on each clip, I rotated the clip and it still holds.

2. It took me a long time to disconnect the drivers side window switch housing, I had to really play with the harness to unsnap it (approx. 10 min.). I was being really carefull.

Otherwise its very straightforward. Print out the instruction pages (Helms manual) from the links that I posted in my review.

 

If you want me to email you the install instructions, PM me your email and you can read them...

 

One of the problems I had in trying to decide what to buy as an upgrade is not wanting to get caught in the situation that the car audio place told you about -- you get aftermarket speakers then find out that they won't play loud enough without an external amp. I had this experience in my previous car.

I also, in my previous car (a Honda), I installed 5.25" speakers. I first tried 6.5s, but took them back as I couldn't get them to fit even after hacking on the plastic "basket" that was in the door. Even with the 5.25s it was tough,and required the largest spacer that was included with the speaker. It's amazing how shallow the stock speakers were. On another Honda, I went with a Kenwood line that had neodym. magnets, and they were unusually shallow. So, in that case, it was the easiest car install I ever did (since I also had all of the necessary adapters).

Here are some of the reasons that the Avincar approach appealed to me:
1) Someone who actually cares about sound quality has evaluated the set of speakers in the exact model and setup. It's not like it's a complete unknown as to what will happen. You may still want to upgrade further, but at least it's not quite so random. Plus, it's optimized for the stock amp, which I would like to try to use.
2) Spacers & connectors included. Usually you can make do, but it's just one thing less to worry about. Oh yeah, I have seen how shops can hack into your car's wires, so with all of the needed components, it'll be easier for me to install myself.
3) Value for the quality? (Maybe I should reserve judgement for when I have them installed! ) I probably paid the same for the speakers on my previous car (just the fronts, years ago), so I'll be very curious to see how they compare.

I'm not looking forward to removing the door panels...