rgpolson

I an email with text below to ACR. They have responded that they will have a district rep call. Has not called as of today.

I also set a copy of the complaints and ACR response to local service manager and my salesman letting them know that I know Acura is swapping transmissions for this problem and I expect them to either make the car shift correctly or make me whole on a 2016 model. We'll see, but I can't believe Acura engineering and quality teams would ship this transmission without serious pressure from executive management.

At this point a software fix seems unlikely. I've worked in the embedded software engineering world for many years and if they could fix this in software it would have been done by now. 15-040 at version 4 certainly does not build my confidence.

#FixMyTLX9speed

"I realize these complaints have already been submitted by other customers,
but
wanted voice my concerns about the ZF 9 speed and share the issues I am
seeing.
I have had the car into the dealer for all the lasted software updates, but

issue persists. I have also test driven a 2016 model and these problems
have
been greatly reduced, so I know there must be some solution available.

It is also very disappointing to see the 2015 TLX at #17 on Consumer
Reports
list of least reliable cars:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...ts-reliablity-

20--worst/75275986/

I would think this would be a call to action for Honda/Acura to get a
resolution to the transmission issues with the ZF 9 speed. After owning 10
or
so Honda/Acura cars, this is the first time ever that I have regretted my
purchase. I have been working with my local service department and will be
taking the vehicle back for a drive with a technician. Some of the issues
are
readily reproducible and some are intermittent, but it is clear from my
experience and the experiences of other TLX 9 speed owners that there is
little
they can do without a fix coming from Honda/Acura engineering. Whether that
be
a software update that actually resolves the issues or an update 2016
version
of the transmission for swap-out, I would certainly hope that Honda/Acura
would
stand behind their product. Below is a list of my current issues.

1) Harsh 2-3 up shift. Variable, but very consistent
2) Harsh 1-2 up shift. Occasional, less severe than 2-3 up shift.
3) Variable harshness from stop at stop sign to start. Seems as if i don't
stop
for at least a full second, I push the gas, get a lag and then head-snapped

into head rest.
4) Variable strange down-shifting behavior with occasional surges.
5) Cruising at, say 60 mph, hit gas pedal, 2-3 second lag before
down-shift."

jcroniser

Good question. I have been very persistent over the last 7 months. I took the car in three or four times complaining about the harsh shifting back in the spring. Acura's District Parts and Service Manager ("DPSM") told me at one point that if he thought replacing the transmission would fix the problem, he would authorize it. But at that point, Acura continued to insist it was a software issue.

Even after Acura tried the software update, I continued to complain. When the service bulletins came out, I'd call the dealership next day after reading about them in this thread. When I started sensing the vibrations, I took the car back in (sadly, most of the service department recognizes me at this point and I'm on a first name basis with both the service manager and the Director of Operations). On this last visit (I took the car in on 11/10), I again complained about the shifting issue--but the DO refused to include that issue on the reason for visit form because he said that they had already documented the issue and there was nothing they could do on that issue.

The dealership then gave me a 2016 TLX loaner for the day (I actually had asked to drive a 2016 that morning, so this worked for my purposes). That same day, I saw ATXTLX's invoice on this thread. When the service manager called me the next day to discuss the vibrations issue, I told him that the 2016 TLX shifted radically differently than the 2015, and that I had an invoice from an individual who received a new transmission. I asked him what it would take to get a new transmission and he responded that they had already replaced two transmissions. When I asked him why my transmission hadn't been replaced, as best as I can recall, he said that those were different issues. I then told him that I wanted a face-to-face meeting the following Monday when the DO returned to the dealership so that someone could explain why my transmission did not qualify for replacement. The next morning, the service manager called me back, said he talked to the DPSM after our last conversation, and that the DPSM authorized the replacement.

I'd add that I called the DPSM after talking to the service manager (but before the service manager called me back to inform me about the replacement). The DPSM refused to talk to me--despite previously talking to me several times. He said I needed to go through "the normal procedure" of talking to Acura via the dealership. Did the timing of my calls help my case? Who knows.

I've also talked to ACR several times and even sent a letter to Jon Ikeda (FYI -- no response to date and I sent that letter back in September).

Am I an example of the squeaky-wheel-gets-the-grease? I doubt it. The DO said that my TLX shifted much better after the new transmission was installed. For that first night I drove it, I'd agree. The harsh 2-3 shift is not there most of the time, but there are still inconsistencies with the acceleration (ie, push the accelerator down and there's a noticeable delay before you sense the acceleration). But I haven't had a chance to drive the car much this week, so this weekend I'm hoping to spend more time with it.

jeich182

This story is why I'm leaning toward getting rid of mine (and not for another Acura). It's exhausting enough having to educate the dealer on the new TSBs, argue whether they're applicable, and then repeat the process when the issue isn't fixed. Add to that all the calls, meetings, and emails you're having to do to get results and I just don't have the will to go through all of that as Acura continues to collect my money for what is the most expensive car I've purchased to-date (that I don't love). They don't deserve it, and this is coming from a die-hard enthusiast and long-time owner.

1Louder

I just renewed my complaint with ACR - here's what motivated me.

I visited my Acura dealership yesterday to inquire about trading out of my lease. This car was $44,000 when I leased it (SH-AWD Tech with a couple add ons). I've owned it 10 months and 8,600 miles. I was stunned to learn the trade in value was $32,000. I'm a good $4,000 upside down to get out of it. Comparing retail-to-retail, the car has gone from $44K to $36K for cars that I see at my trim level and equivalent miles. Since I'm clearly stuck with the car now, I'm going after them again with renewed energy.

mondster

Considering that a new shawd tech can be had for 36k with all the incentives, 32k is actually not bad. Try bringing it to carmax too, they might offer more. My buddy tried to trade in his 2015 q50 with 6k miles and was only being offered 25k (msrp of 41k). So yeah, 32k is not bad at all. Im sure you can make up that 4k upside down by negotiating on a different car with aggressive incentives, both discount and low money factor.

What replacement were you thinking of when you asked them for the trade in value?

jswift2000

I looked at selling mine (AWD Tech) that I had for 2 months and the value was 33k- I paid 36.5k. Not ready to take that loss yet. I would see if the competition will buy the lease out. You can also try lease trader to see if someone will take it over.

1Louder

I'm a bit disadvantaged because there was about $1500 of options added (which you get nearly zero credit for) in a trade, and we also have a 9% state sales tax to overcome too. $32K might not be bad or an unfair offer, but because of the adds and tax it increases the distance between that and my current payoff of about $36K. I know cars drop off significantly in the first year - I just thought $12K in 10 months was pretty harsh.

As far as a replacement goes, I was actually considering a 2016 RDX Advance. I drove one - its surprisingly very similar to the TLX inside - controls and feel are all the same. It wasn't a totally serious inquiry, I was more interested in getting a read on how far I was a way from getting out of it. I've bought a couple cars from the same Acura dealership and they tend to do better than other dealerships if you are trading in an Acura.

mondster

Correct me if i am wrong but i dont think the sales tax is part of your payoff in a lease unlike a purchase where they charge the tax upfront. In a lease you are paying for a use tax which is calculated monthly.

1Louder

Yes tax is a part of my monthly payment, so it would not have been part of the original cost. I forgot....

Rocketsfan

Well, I thought I'd just go ahead and jinx myself. I had 38 applied after it came out and for the first day or two everything was ok as far as shifts went, but after a couple of days to a week, the rough shifting was back. Although I couldn't tell if it was as bad as before, it was definitely back.

Today I had 40 applied. The shifting, once again, felt pretty awesome. You could tell something was going on during the 2-3 shift, but no "thuds" as it shifted. There was one particular acceleration I did where I felt no shift whatsoever during the entire period of accelerating from 0-50. I almost cried.

Oh well, I know I just jinxed myself, but what the hell... maybe the decent shifting will last a week.

rgpolson

Going to drive an Accord Touring model. Feature set looks longer than TLX tech at $35k MSRP. I'm sure trade-in value will be a killer, but if Acura can't own up to the ZF problems and fix via software or are unwilling to do transmission swap, i won't be buying another ZF-based Acura. Maybe if Acura puts the 10spd transmission in 2017 refresh that would be an option.

So disappointing that Acura won't give us some straight answers. Since 2016 is much better they know whats going on. Just not willing to own up to any design or manufacturing flaws.

#FixMyTLX9speed

CaliAtenza

Well after having the idle relearn done and the software update, the transmission is MUCH better. In fact, I drive in Normal mode now, not Sport. Normal mode has become more aggressive, which I like. The jerky shifts are almost 100% gone and in Normal, I can't feel any harsh shifting. I'll keep an eye on things, but so far, so good .

Sam Axe

You are willing to get in again on the 1st year with a new transmission? The Accord Touring has the tried and tested 6AT and yes it has all amenities you could ask for including CarPlay and Android Auto, and the newer Garmin-based Nav. The 19" wheels are also really nice. Of course you'll be giving up slightly better quality materials as well as much better insulation of road noise, but that is a decent trade off. The Touring also has the amplitude reactive dampers from the Acura line, so ride quality should be good despite the low-profile 19" wheels.

1Louder

Keep an eye on it. I experienced the same thing, but after 2 weeks was back to normal.

CPR

UPDATE: ACR Mike Bogan, is calling my Service Manager, to ascertain whether a new Transmission is warranted.I'm bringing in the car on Friday, for an oil change. If the Tech's decide, that nothing more can be done, they'll approve the 2016 Tranny install
Fingers XXXXXXXXXX
When I see it, I'll believe it, although this is the 1st time that anyone from ACR has even hinted at a Tranny replacement.
Mike is very familiar with Acurazine, & the many cases, of Tranny displeasure that have been discussed
Lets hopt it's a Happy thanksgiving weekend!

le^2

Who is Mike's counter part in Canada? We've got nothing but "works as per normal" up here :@

ATXTLX

I have had nothing but love for my car since the transmission was replaced. I have talked my TLX up so much since then. I told my service manager I wanted to buy donuts for lunch for everyone in the service department for putting up with me for 9 grueling months.

I think Acura sees now that the original transmission was not ready yet. The service tech that billed me out for my A1 service that I had done with the transmission replacement said Acura only had 6 months to test the TLX with the 9 speed. She said it wasn't enough time, and that the first buyers got to continue testing.

Well, I hope they reward those that "tested" the tranny for all of these months with either:

1. A new, perfectly shifting transmission
2. Or 9 months of the head of R&D's salary, paid by Acura. It seems fair, since we all got to work in R&D for Acura, unknowingly.

Cheers! Everyone: continue to talk to your Service Manager or equivalent.

Curious3GTL

So as a potential TLX owner I've read a lot of complaints about the hesitation of the one is the 2015. How would you say your 2016 is in that department?

rgpolson

It's a little pathetic of Acura to make early buyers beg to have this made right. They know there was a problem, they know what the fix was and it wasn't software only, and they know how to make it right.

Still waiting for promised call from ACR. But will be very forceful in having them work with dealer for a transmission swap.

#FixMyTLX9speed

rgpolson

I drove a 2016 and did not notice the issues I am having with my 2015. Of course the test drive was not that long, so looking forward to hearing these same details from those that have had the transmission upgrade.

It's a shame to have a car in this class that shifts like a newbie driving a manual transmission for the first time.

kuzdu

I have a question for those with the replaced or new 2016 Transmissions. I understand the shifting is very smooth now but how is how is acceleration? When cruising at 30-40 and going to pass someone does it take forever to find a gear or its instant smooth power? How far do you have to press on the gas pedal now to wake it up? How is it on the highway around 60-70mph. I usually down sift and go along my way. I remember my 2013 TL SHAWD would bang the gear hard almost all the time but the car held up pretty well. I would like to see a comparison of the 2015 and 2016 and see the major differences. The 2016 probably has different Fluid and a better shifting program. I remembered when I got mine updated it was smooth as butter. Just my 2 cents on things.

Momyc

I'm curious myself. That long gas pedal travel to get a reaction is a "thrill" killing .

youngTL

Throttle response is sharper in the 2016. Normal mode is a little sharper like Sport used to be, and Sport is sharper throttle response still. Sport+ is fairly extreme but I'm not sure if that's different from before. Gas pedal travel is quite short in Sport and Sport+.

mondster

If this is the case then i will everything i can to get them to change my tranny to the 2016 version. I will test drive a 2016 and compare, then bitch to my dealer about it

kchemist

Ok guys I have a question, now I can see more and more people starting get transmission replaced. How serious is the issue, I have a TLX which had 38 and 40 applied and everytime I start driving for the first 15 min or so I have a slight delay in 2-3 shift ( I can feel the shift 2-3 not harsh but can bare). But after 15 min or so it disappears.) But one day I had a major issue on freeway where I changed the lane and there was a big 18 wheeler speeding up behind me and he doenst have enough distance to slow it down. So I pressed the accelerator and to my surprise it took good 2-3 seconds for car to move. Lucky for me truck was able to slow down by the time I got accelerate, but it was a narrow escape. So my question is those who have hard shift issue does it tend to disappear with 15 min or so driving?

kchemist

I will wait for 2-3 months before I ask them to change my transmission. Because at that time dealers would be more familiar with the repair and I won't have to push them. I hate to do lengthy discussions with different managers. Just my 2 cents.

1Louder

I think you are just experiencing what a lot of us are experiencing. I have these same issues, although mine doesn't get better after 15 min. However I think we're at a state where this is as good as it's going to get, unless Acura a) releases a future SW update that actually fixes it or b) replaces the transmission with the 2016 version.

I think you are on your own pressing your case with the dealership with regard to b. I think Acura will want to replace as few as possible, so you may have to make a lot of noise. But you have to ask yourself if it's worth it. I don't know that I'd describe any of the current behavior as a problem that demands a replacement, but it's a definitely an annoyance, and more to the point far less than what one would expect from a car costing north of $40K.

Since I'm leasing, I've resigned myself to press my case for a replacement as much as I can, but if I lose that battle I drive it for 2 more years and I'm out. Had I bought the car, I'd likely pay it down until the warranty was close, and trade out of it. I like to own my cars 8-10 years, and this is not a tranny I'd spend that kind of time with.

jswift2000

You can also open a case with the NHTSA. I have the same hesitant acceleration issue and I think it poses a large safety issue as described above.

ATXTLX

I agree fully. I purchased mine, and I didn't want the poor shifting transmission to affect trade in value. I am happy they replaced. Now, I can see myself paying this car off.

Before, I was going to do everything I could to get out of it.

kchemist

I agree, I m very good with arguing with companies hack I managed to get $1000 from BMW as the cost I spend it on to repair my bent wheels (it's a long story). But I will try to replicate the issue and see how it goes. In any case I will push this transmission to a replacement but will wait it out for 2 more months. In that 2 months I hope most of you guys would have replaced your transmission and Acura and dealers would be more familiar and hopefully I would have to argue less.

youngTL

The throttle response has nothing to do with the transmission. It's just the programming of how much throttle travel equals how much throttle the electronic throttle control gives it. I wonder if a tuning shop that does software or firmware tweaks could adjust that for you (I have very little experience tuning).

The major fix in the 2016 transmission is that it doesn't have the abrupt 2-3 shift. If you're going from 9th to 4th, the transmission still has to go through TWO dog clutch shifts to get there, which is why there's a bit of a delay when passing on the highway. If you go 8th to 4th, it's not as long. It still shifts faster than I ever could in my 6MT.

Vlke

I've had the K95 update applied on my car few dew weeks now and unfortunately the shifting issue is back. It's a lot less harsh but its still there. So I texted my service manager to ask if there's anything they can do and here's the reply I got..

The transmission in your car is operating as designed, we have been in contact with techline on a continual basis. There are currently no further updates available. Some customers do not like the
shift characteristics of this unit but HCI assures us that there is no issue with the function. Cars such as yours that are driven infrequently are probably going to have a more noticeable shift as the algorithm used to learn shift patterns of the driver will not operate as effectively. If further updates become available they can be downloaded to your vehicle.


Seriously? I'm so frustrated with this whole transmission crap. Looks like I might have to call ACR again...By the way, anyone in Canada had their transmission replaced?

1Louder

Poor design + operating as designed = poor results.

I hate hearing that, as if that somehow explains it. "It operates exactly how it was designed - poorly and with no regard to our customers". OK then.

Vlke

Here's my response and his reply...

All the TLX I've test drove never had any shifting issues. Which is what I expected with mine. The mileage on the cars were less than mine. Also from a bit of researching, it seems like the 2016 models does not have this problem either. The updates and idle learn don't seem to work so is there anything else that can be done outside of software? Along with a bunch of other issues that I have yet to find time to bring it in to get fixed. I've never had so much problem with a new car before. This transmission problem has been ongoing for a long time and I've had to deal with it on a daily basis and I would really like a permanent fix to this soon instead of waiting indefinitely for another update that may or may not fix the shifting.



I can only offer you the information I have, any thing else you will have to address to Honda Canada directly. We have looked at this issue for you multiple times if HCI have a suggestion I will be happy to comply. To date that is the best we can do at the dealer level.

I don't know what else to do. This is so ridiculous. It's like the car has issue and is under warranty but it's not getting fixed.

le^2

Vikes - I get the same treatment here in Vancouver. Dealer just comes back to me with a "working as intended." suck it up, buttercup - attitude.

This is after multiple complaints, calling in and scheduling service, showing new and revised TSB's, printing off invoices showing the replacement transmission.

1Louder

^ They don't know how. That's the problem. I think that is supported by the fact that the 2016 is a different transmission than the 2015, not just a software difference. If were just software, and the 2016's are fine, they could just apply the working software to the 2015's and be done. But something must be mechanically must be different with the 2016's.

"It's operating as designed" is universal car manufacturer language for "We don't know how to fix it and we probably won't".

Vlke

Honestly after all this.. I feel like I should start going to a new dealer to have my car fixed for other stuff. The service manager is probably pissed off about all the issues I brought up with the car. But honestly though, It's not fun for me either. I have to adjust my schedule to bring the car in. The last couple of cars I brought, I never had to bring it back to the dealer for anything in the first couple of years outside of regular maintenance. With the TLX, I'm have a ridiculous number of problems, most of them is not fixed because as per the dealership, everything is working fine.

What annoyed me is the part where my service manager said "Cars such as yours that are driven infrequently are probably going to have a more noticeable shift as the algorithm used to learn shift patterns of the driver will not operate as effectively." So basically he's saying, if you don't drive your car a lot, your going to have shifting problems because that's how Acura designed it. So why do some test drive TLX with less mileage does not have this problem? It's so ridiculous why we have to jump through so many hoops to try to get a permanent fix.

Vlke

I just got off the phone with ACR and basically I was advised they will always backup the dealer's diagnose. If the dealer is saying there's nothing can be done, then there's nothing that can be done. If the dealer says the transmission is operating within normal standard then it is operating within normal standard. The only thing I can do is to bring it to another dealership to have them take a look but if they say the same thing then all I can do is continue to observe the behavior. ACR said he's also going to be calling the service manager to see why he told me to contact Honda for suggestions on how to fix the issue because it's the dealership that controls it.

This is beyond frustrating. If I bring it to another dealer and they are giving me the same run around saying the transmission is working as intended or there's no further updates, what can I possibly do at this point. Is there another department I can contact cause this is ridiculous.

youngTL

You could try going this route:

CAMVAP - Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan

However, you'll need a mountain of evidence and I'd use it as a last resort, because the arbitration is binding and it might not go your way.

Vlke

I'm thinking of sending the general manager an email not just in hopes of getting my transmission fixed but also to make him aware of the horrible experience I've had with his dealership.