That is true. Q50 was released a year earlier and 4th Gen TL last year was 2014. Sales fell off the cliff towards the end of its life cycle. This explains the large gap. Either way, Infiniti is in big trouble and they need to improve a lot as well. Just look at the Q50 sales. You have big problems when you can't sell breand new suv model.

 

I have both the TLX V6 and a Q50S in the household and I can state that your reference to the Q having better fit and finish is completely untrue. The TLX feels like a much better assembled vehicle than the Q. The TLX is also a more refined ride as well, quieter cabin, more comfortable seating, smoother engine and definitely not lacking in power though not as quick as the Q.

I mean, we get it: the TLX is the worst thing in four wheels. Entering its final model year (after six years), I think we can stop beating this dead horse.

 

A few points to clarify that:
1. the sales numbers are inaccurate as the Q50 came before the TLX.
2. it’s true that the Q50 sold more than TLX
3. I have sat and drove both cars, all I felt is the Q50 more powerful.
4. The fit and finish are pretty much equal but I felt the TLX has better seats.

i don’t think the Q50 was bad but not superior than the tlx. I assumed that the Q50 will sell 4 times more than tlx as the price was good (lots of
incentives) and more powerful engine. Yet failed to do so.

 

@Rocketsfan @dmski @F23A4 @Tony Pac
Thanks, all valid points!
Taking out 2014, the Q50 had 13,833 over the TLX, (which isnt much, if the crazy incentives are true, its only natural that people tend to gravitate towards any deal they can get) I dont think I ever down'd a TLX, as I personally love it, Like A Lot!

I just been wishing for a Manual Version, I don't even need a Type S Manual, but boy would I be willing to pay a 10K penalty for a Manual TLX Type S! Some manufactures are getting it, and I think Honda is getting it and testing the market with the 2.0 6spd Accord? That people (such as myself) are willing to go almost anywhere for a manual trans. If Acura's only Manual Trans belong'd to a TLX Type S, I'm game, lets do this dance!

 

Are you sure we are talking about the same Q50 Sport?? I think not...because my Q50 S had beautiful, huge and fixed magnesium paddle shifters, real Japanese Ash wood trim pieces, real cold metal trim pieces everywhere, electric adjustment for the steering wheel, leather wrapped and contrast stitched center console sides, 360 degrees cameras, electronics one generation ahead of the TLX and sharper screen resolution...should I go on?? I forgot, no rattles at all in 4 1/2 years of ownership

I respect your opinion that the TLX has "better" fit and finish but I'm ready to bet that if you ask to 10 random people, the vast majority of them will tell you that the Q50 is the real premium sport sedan between the two...which makes sense since a fully Q50 Sport AWD had a MSRP of almost 56K....

 

...a Q50 Red Sport is not a lot better than a TLX?? Ok, everybody has an opinion.

For the steering, I believe you do not have to get DAS on a top spec Q50 anymore...without DAS, steering feel it's just fine....

 

Can anyone (esp those who own both cars) please post photos of the cars / interior in question. I don’t know what to believe. Is Q50 a sedan or SUV?

 

Yes, a screen resolution so much sharper that one can see it’s reflection on the windshield at night. I guess that’s twice the fun for some. The TLX’s screen may not be as sharp but it’s top screen recessed position was well thought out at least.

I won’t go into how tinny the Q’s doors sound when you shut them versus the solid thunk you get on the TLX. And did Nissan try to put as little cushioning as possible in the center armrest?

But I do agree that paddles are nicer on the Q albeit just as useless given that both cars have fairly lethargic automatic trannys. But while it’s performance is head and shoulders above the TLX, you do pay a steeper penalty when it comes to fuel economy.

Caveat: I’m comparing a well equipped Q50S versus my base 3.5. I would image a TLX Advance is a bit more competitive than my trim in terms of feature content.

Just to be clear, I’m not hating on the Q50 particularly as I generally like the car. While it may not have some of the shortcomings of the TLX, it clearly has its own which are objectively evident before long.

 

 

I do not remember of any tinny sound when shutting my Q50 door.....however my experience of not developing not even a tiny rattle is a testament of how well built it was....my only complain is the very thin paint that would chip easily but I had exactly the same issue with my 4G TL.
Fit and finish in my Q50 was better than a 3 Series or the C Class of that era, I vividly remember that when we cross shopped them.
Infiniti put some effort in calibrating the right amount of "weight" and resistance in the switches and knobs to give it a premium feel.
My take is that Infiniti raised the luxury content of the G37 when introduced the Q50 where Acura de-contented in the move from 4G to TLX...again, IMHO...

 

 

Acura needs the new TLX guys! Honestly, the sales number confirms that.

TLX is catching up with Q50 hahah! Both are tanking. But seems like Infiniti has no plans for the new Q50, as they just updated the infotainment system in all cars, except QX60. So, we should expect the new QX60 and MDX coming out around the same time.

 

Hey, the TLX beat Audi A4 by 10 cars.

 

Not bad

i am actually impressed by the Mdx numbers. 6-7 year old model and still pushes 4K units a month.

 

I had a GX80 rental recently. No Apple Carplay, or Lane Keep Assist. Interior looks like it's 10 years old (because it is). That "wood" wheel is incredibility uncomfortable. I don't see how they can sell these to anyone but rental agencies. I didn't like the car at all.

 

You're being generous saying it only looks 10 years old. I would have said closer to 15 to 20.

 

But it drives very good. V8 5.6 engine is a great power plant.

 

If anyone still thought Nissan was going in the right direction, the financials are proof they are not. It's all bad news.
https://www.fidelity.com/news/articl...1XM0XB-OUSBS_1

I'm impressed with those of you who nailed their problem on the head - from the article:
"Years of heavy discounting and fleet sales, particularly in the United States, has cheapened the automaker's brand image while lowering vehicle resale value and denting profit."

I have no reason to go buy a Nissan or Infiniti. They look nice, but as far as I know, their reliability is inferior to Toyota/Honda and their performance is inferior to Euros. Whether or not that's still true, that's my perception of their legacy, and perception is reality to consumers. People are simply shopping wiser.
"Slowing demand for cars in the United States and China, the world's biggest auto markets, has led to cut-throat competition, and Nissan's slump in first-half sales has knocked operating profit off course from the automaker's full-year target."

 

Exactly!

Nissan/Infiniti needs time to recover from this financial distress. They are going to fall behind at least 2 years. That's why Infiniti keeps saying by 2023 and they also just updated all their infotainment. The QX55 won't make a difference, as they are taking the QX50 and make it a coupe. Good luck with that.
But they will come up with a new QX60 for sure.

 

Does anyone have the sales numbers for November?

 

TLX 2587
BMW 3/4 7921
Audi A3/4 3061
Infiniti Q50/60 2257
Lexus ES 4545

 

 

Consistent but not great! At the point, Acura is just wasting time. Bring the next generation TLX! I know the A-SPEC model is helping the sales number 2K+.


If I had power over Acura, I would have made the appropriate changes to bring the sales number as the following:
New MDX: 60,000 units per year
RDX: 60,000-63,000 units per year
New TLX: 40,000 units per year
New TLX: 22,000-24,000 units per year
Intro CDX: 30,000 units per year.

On average Acura would hit easily 200K unit sales per year. 45-50% of this number is already happening, just need to fix the TLX and ILX issue. In addition, bring the new CDX.

 

 

Not bad again! TLX beat Q50 this year by a few cars 😂
The new TLX will fix the sales issues. Cmon Acura!

 

I'd say that's a good December for the TLX when you look at it in context with the Honda lineup. Civic sales were down and the Accord was drastically down. In fact the Acura lineup did well overall in comparison. 2020 should be interesting.

 

Acura had a decent year overall! But the issue is the sales are stagnant. Acura needs to makes the necessary changes to move the sales to 200,0000 units. The good news is that Acura isn’t far away from 200,000 units. Just needs to fix TLX and ILX ASAP. But to hit the actual 200K, they need to introduce at least one more suv.

 

2019 year end numbers

1. BMW - 324,826
2. Mercedes-Benz - 316,094
3. Lexus - 298,114
4. Audi - 224,111
5. Acura - 157,385

 

Considering Acura only has 2 crossovers/SUVs, that’s not bad.

BMW has 7 crossovers, Mercedes has 6 crossovers and 1 SUV, Lexus has 3 crossovers and 2 SUVs, and Audi has 4 crossovers. Funny how that order is the same as the sales in descending order...

 

They don’t need a new TLX and ILX, they need a new MDX. I’d be willing to bet that the new MDX will easily outsell the new TLX and ILX combined.

 

Interesting list Bear. I also saw today that BMW achieved record sales in 2019. I sometimes consider myself a good litmus test for stuff. My gut feeling on products, companies, news, etc. I'm a typical Midwestern guy, was barcode in college, am a barcode at work, raising a family and living a dream. For the last few years, it seemed to me that Euros are going in the right direction making great looking, high performance vehicles. Meanwhile, Lexus stuck to its selling features, which are luxury and reliability. During this same period, I drove a 1G TLX that I disliked more than any other car I've ever owned. Your list certainly corresponds with MY personal perception of Acura versus the other four. Acura certainly has four targets for which to aim standing directly in front of them if they truly want to release a 2G TLX that can compete.

I have to add something to fiatlux who made a good observation that this applies to all vehicles, not just sedans, and we all know that SUVs are currently king. Offering so many different models and submodels comes with a cost. You have to design, test and maintain all of those. Acura has what, 5 models? MDX, RDX, RLX, TLX and ILX? That covers 80% of potential buyers? So Acura has that going right. As far as company profitability goes, I would say do those and do those really well, and let the other makers compete for the other 20% who want M/R8 performance, S560 luxury, or a specialty or goofy vehicle like eTron/i3/GLE/X6.

 

Over the years as BMW sales increased the brand lots a lot of its cachet that it had years back. Though expensive to buy they are a dime a dozen as far as how many you see everyday. At least in my parts. Not saying Acura has any cachet either now but BMW used to have a lot of it.

 

Acura is offering crazy incentives on the TLX now because of the new model. All the hype is going to be around the new Type S, but I wonder what's really going to move the sales needle for the 2.0T model. We know the interior quality is going to be much better, but what's going to "wow" people on the base engine. I'm just wondering. Obviously great driving dynamics and the ASPEC package should look good. There's so much competition in this class.

 

It'll likely be value again. It'll make more power than the base A4, C300, and 330i while being bigger and cheaper.

 

Would disagree on the cachet.

cachet • \ka-SHAY\ • noun. 1 : a seal used especially as a mark of official approval 2 : a characteristic feature or quality conferring prestige; also : standing or estimation in the eyes of people : prestige

You don't want to mix cachet with rarity. Marketing companies that rate brand logo recognition list the BMW & MB badges high in the auto industry. Agree there are areas where every other car is a BMW. Acura's problem is at least in North Raleigh where once, 3G, you could see 4 or 5 TL's at a traffic light its now 4 or 5 BMW's & no TL's.

The fact that cars like MB, BMW & Audi are expensive but still sell in high numbers suggest people value the brands. Why else would people see something that cost more then a similar item & buy it anyway? Because maybe they think its special?

It might be a backhanded complement but many here want the new TLX to perform as well & with similar power as the M340. When something in peoples minds is a bench mark it by default has cachet.

 

Yeah, I'm not sure how applicable the phrase "dime-a-dozen" applies to a carmaker like BMW. To me, dime-a-dozen means a mass produced, watered down car you can get for cheap and see everywhere. Typical dime-a-dozen cars to me would be Impala or Corolla or Jetta. Or the classic example to me being the 2000s Grand Prix - sort of mass produced garbage. These are the staple midsize sedans for common folk who quite honestly don't care what they drive. BMW increased their sales while, to me, made no sacrifices to their prestige, quality and image.

 

Maybe not "a dime a dozen" in every sense of the phrase. But commonly seen and nothing all that special unless its upper end model I don't view them as a prestigious just because they have the propeller badge on the hood. That being said I have owned a couple.

 

I think many "common folk" care about what they drive, but also don't feel the need to pay for more power or performance they they can reasonablt use in the 95% or so of what is their everyday driving. There is also a significant segment of folks who buy prestige brands for the badge more so than performance or power, perhaps a different class of "common folk". I'd throw in a third group, to which I belong, who look for a balance of form and function, reliability, and price....in essenc the value shoppers.

This little forum community here is, understandably, prone to project their views, needs, and wants onto the much larger population that make car buying decisions using somewhat different parameters.

 

Don't be too excited by BMW's numbers, they are being investigated for "punching" aka sales numbers fraud:

https://www.autonews.com/sales/bmw-f...ales-practices

 

CORRECTION: They definitely need a new TLX and ILX. However, strongest effort needs to made in getting the 4G MDX to market ASAP. With 7 passenger crossovers from mainstream brands such as Hyundai and Kia packing feature content and (subjectively) more appealing style than the current MDX, the bar is seriously raised for the new MDX.